The most unusual thing...

Knightshade said:
One of my favorite character quotes: Han Solo, "Never tell me the odds." The odds on this situation existing are already at the lottery level. I've not read one single anecdotal experience that even reasonably compares. As for moving her in, it would be more disruptive not to in my opinion, and it is what she wants in her life.

I don't feel comfortable speaking for my wife in regards to how she feels about her loves. I can say that when we met, dated, and married if that was settling it was the most bizarre form of settling I've ever witnessed. The culmination of our marriage took a lot of work and effort. Not something I'd really see someone doing if they were just settling.

If you mean will I be ok no longer being her only partner? Absolutely. I would have kept my big mouth shut if for any reason it bothered me. She never brought this up to me in any sort of fashion until after we'd discussed it over literal years, with me being the person who broached the subject. I know my shortcomings in several areas, and I saw needs that I wasn't meeting, that in theory someone else might meet. I saw something she had been holding onto for a long while and told her I would be ok with her figuring it out. It wouldn't be love if I did anything else, it'd be some sort of twisted slavery and I'm not into that.

If you meant hierarchy, there is no real reason for that. We plan on being a breeding pair, we have no plans to part or disrupt our union. OF will flow into the place she's meant to be in, however that materializes isn't for me to say.

If it was 'right' to me we would be co-equal in my wife's heart, that's the ideal. That's for her to feel and know and do though. I just get to experience it.
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(BOLD added = my emphasis).

Beautiful.
Thank you.
So much love and acceptance in these concepts.

JaneQ
 
Thank You for modeling the necessary attitude

as I know without any doubt it is possible for a couple to find a third and have it work out. Usually I am one to rail against those who claim you can't plan a "triad" but in Natja's business defense, I think they are only trying to warn you to be flexible, because most often one of the three people is not

and that does end in a lot of emotional pain

However, the only thing it takes is all parties understanding that feelings will not be exactly what they had imagined, and if everyone is understanding of that, it really isn't a problem.

Typically one person has trouble accepting the reality of how everything ends up once a "shift" happens, but seriously, all it really takes is understanding that it won't be the perfect ideal hot bi-babe situation, but honestly who would really want that? but for those who do, and want the third to love them both equally, agree with every philosophical outlook on life or political ideology, and not "see" anybody but the original couple, AND be so obnoxiously rigid that that is the only way the third will be accepted and it's take it or leave it,

yes, of course that doesn't work

but that wouldn't be love anyways so who cares

I would be careful about the need to assigns labels to your dynamic, as all it does it give others a target to shoot at. While I personally found that hierarchies will work, I know they do not if anyone is ever treated as if they don't matter or their opinion carries no weight.

HOWEVER

without the label, when their opinion and feelings do matter, it is perfectly OK for them to not have an opinion on specific matters, leaving said specific decisions up to whoever does care which side the decision falls on. And when they do care it can't be for reasons that are inconsiderate to anyone involved

It's tough to put it into words, except for just saying that when people genuinely care about their partners well being and happiness in life, and that concern is reciprocated, and everyone is considerate and respectful enough to speak up and when they realize they have made a mistake to come back and admit it, everything will work out OK

of course there are people who understand this and are capable of treating others in this manner, but because of discrepancies in what they want out of life and the type of life they want to live, won't be happy with each other as an intimate partner for life sort of role

But that is the beauty of the people you start a family with, unlike the family you are physically born into and you have no choice, it's the perfect lesson to first learn what it takes to be able to love and accept those who don't view life as you do, but you love them anyway because they are family

the beauty lies in the fact that we are free to start families with whomever we choose, and it really is a shame that the world does not respect that choice -- which is each of ours and ours alone to decide who we desire to offer ourselves, to share our lives -- along with those who need to also choose US, an accept the offer as part of their chosen family.

I don't know, but my view of the world makes enough sense to me, and hopefully that means I will have enough respect for others' decisions to be choices that should remain theirs and theirs alone to make without my influence unless asked


So thank you for appearing to present the attitude that it takes to make two person established relationship to become three.

I always found it hard to put into words, what it means or how one would go about life in at least one way to truly love others in a way that love is not confused or mistaken to be something love is not.

Which I have no doubt there is more than one to do so
 
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Thats a really great attitude Hans :D
.... and it will serve you well in this, however we're not talking about your piloting skills navigating an asteroid field. Two thirds of this complex situation (see gala's poly math) is outside of your control. Fast reflexes or quick reaction times might not help you much with dealing with 2 hormonal females except maybe if you need to duck something flying at you :D

she had a lesbian relationship that lasted about a year. She ended it at the time because of the pressures of society and family perception.

I could tell whenever she talked about this person there was a silent longing there.
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Sorry this is where I got the idea of settling.

If you mean will I be ok no longer being her only partner? Absolutely.
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No I didn't mean not being her only partner I meant being a co -primary or a secondary partner. Not to long ago (maybe 6 months ) a guy in a simliar situation as your came here to discuss his dislike of sharing his wife. His username is Matt. His Bi wife had a lesbain lover for 10-15 yrs ...they tried to cohabitant.....he and his wife had kids ....he even tried to have a physical relationship with the gf ...all in the name of making it work. However he said he felt like the sperm donor of a lesbain couple ...he ended up being the secondary partner. So have you thought about how much change in your dynamic you will be willing to accept.
 
dingedheart said:
Thats a really great attitude Hans :D
.... and it will serve you well in this, however we're not talking about your piloting skills navigating an asteroid field. Two thirds of this complex situation (see gala's poly math) is outside of your control. Fast reflexes or quick reaction times might not help you much with dealing with 2 hormonal females except maybe if you need to duck something flying at you :D



Sorry this is where I got the idea of settling.



No I didn't mean not being her only partner I meant being a co -primary or a secondary partner. Not to long ago (maybe 6 months ) a guy in a simliar situation as your came here to discuss his dislike of sharing his wife. His username is Matt. His Bi wife had a lesbain lover for 10-15 yrs ...they tried to cohabitant.....he and his wife had kids ....he even tried to have a physical relationship with the gf ...all in the name of making it work. However he said he felt like the sperm donor of a lesbain couple ...he ended up being the secondary partner. So have you thought about how much change in your dynamic you will be willing to accept.
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Well in the words of my wife, she's 99% straight, but for OF. She's said as much to both of us. I don't feel comfortable speculating on just how it will go because to me that would be either setting myself up for disappointment or to appear controlling, and I want neither. My wife is better for where we are going, and I think it is where I want to be too.

I'm not really mired in the ethos of 'mine.' I never really have been. My whole life I've shared nearly everything I have with all manner of relatives and friends. I'm the oldest child in a largish family. I actually had trouble when I lived on my own cooking for just me, because it was simply something I'd never really done outside of like a grilled cheese. Hell right now I have several thousands of dollars worth of tools loaned to a good friend, because I had them and he could use them. Its just how I roll, how I've always rolled.

I also believe that if I had tried to 'make' my relationship with my wife mono forever, she'd have lived a less fulfilled life. If I am open enough to help her why shouldn't I? If I can sublimate myself for other trivial things, why not the most serious thing? It felt right when I said it, the very first time to her before we ever married. It feels right now.
 
let's not forget

that what happened to the poster whom you described, dinged heart, he wasn't exactly being fair to his wife and the girlfriend. As even going as far as having sex a person may seem like he was really trying to make it work, but not being honest about his feelings for so many years had a lot to do with making him feel like a sperm donor for a lesbian couple.

As I did not get the impression that that was the situation, at least not from what was shared here.

I don't want to knock on him, because he definitely seems genuine in his attempts to be understanding and loving and allowing his wife to pursue love as she wanted. I know he went through hell, but I can't help feeling what the world would be like if everyone had the courage to persevere like Matt did, but also the knowledge of knowing that not being able to speak about what you are really feeling, will fester and destroy any relationship
 
OP, logistically, you seem to have it covered. As with anything, you never know how it will go until you are in the middle of a situation. It is not possible to plan for every single thing that could happen. Feelings change. People change. NRE is a pain and something I personally do not believe in. My advice: expect the unexpected and just go with it. Create a schedule and chores list as soon as this person moves in. Make sure to discuss needs and ways to meet and or get them met. If you have children or are planning to have children, discuss what role OF will play in their lives. I have no idea if you plan on being out, but discuss all the ramifications. If job security is a risk, it is probably not wise to be out. If you are going to be out, discuss to what extent. I know you said she is fine with the shared bedroom deal, but it will be an adjustment to go from possibly living by herself to with three other people and no longer having something that is just her own. Plus, she is moving quite a distance. Expect an adjustment period of sorts to try to mesh. We tried cohabitating, and it was a fail because personalities clashed and styles of living just did not click. I am a neat freak and really particular. My husband understands that and tries to work with me. My ex liked chaotic clutter. Her system worked in her place, but in my home, oh no. Outside of that, I am sure you will be fine. Either way, good luck and welcome to the forum! :D

As far as my situation, Dirtclusit, in counselling Matt admitted to feeling like my bitch and my secondary. I addressed it in my blog. His words. He did not deserve any of what I dished out. I was a nightmare. He should have left me, and if I had not gotten pregnant in late 2011, I do believe he would have. The comment about our children stemmed from him feeling undermined as a parent. Turns out his concerns were right on the mark. She has since confirmed everything, and I was a fool. The very things he tried to warn me about were the things I needed to hear but took as him trying to change me and control me. When I did listen, I downplayed his concerns and dismissed them as him overreacting because what he was saying did not fit my pretty little portrait of having three co-parents and two co-primaries. I made him think he was crazy. I wish he would have said no to me continuing to express that former side of myself. He was too understanding and accommodating because he loved me. I took advantage of that. He gave me too many chances and made too many excuses for my piss poor conduct. He did what he was supposed to do. I failed, though. These are my crosses to bear.
 
Thanks Ry ....that saves me a lot of typing :D


Hey, maybe you could link Matt's thread. Or tell me what month and what section it was in I can find it.
 
FullofLove1052 said:
OP, logistically, you seem to have it covered. As with anything, you never know how it will go until you are in the middle of a situation. It is not possible to plan for every single thing that could happen. Feelings change. People change. NRE is a pain and something I personally do not believe in. My advice: expect the unexpected and just go with it. Create a schedule and chores list as soon as this person moves in. Make sure to discuss needs and ways to meet and or get them met. If you have children or are planning to have children, discuss what role OF will play in their lives. I have no idea if you plan on being out, but discuss all the ramifications. If job security is a risk, it is probably not wise to be out. If you are going to be out, discuss to what extent. I know you said she is fine with the shared bedroom deal, but it will be an adjustment to go from possibly living by herself to with three other people and no longer having something that is just her own. Plus, she is moving quite a distance. Expect an adjustment period of sorts to try to mesh. We tried cohabitating, and it was a fail because personalities clashed and styles of living just did not click. I am a neat freak and really particular. My husband understands that and tries to work with me. My ex liked chaotic clutter. Her system worked in her place, but in my home, oh no. Outside of that, I am sure you will be fine. Either way, good luck and welcome to the forum! :D

As far as my situation, Dirtclusit, in counselling Matt admitted to feeling like my bitch and my secondary. I addressed it in my blog. His words. He did not deserve any of what I dished out. I was a nightmare. He should have left me, and if I had not gotten pregnant in late 2011, I do believe he would have. The comment about our children stemmed from him feeling undermined as a parent. Turns out his concerns were right on the mark. She has since confirmed everything, and I was a fool. The very things he tried to warn me about were the things I needed to hear but took as him trying to change me and control me. When I did listen, I downplayed his concerns and dismissed them as him overreacting because what he was saying did not fit my pretty little portrait of having three co-parents and two co-primaries. I made him think he was crazy. I wish he would have said no to me continuing to express that former side of myself. He was too understanding and accommodating because he loved me. I took advantage of that. He gave me too many chances and made too many excuses for my piss poor conduct. He did what he was supposed to do. I failed, though. These are my crosses to bear.
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Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that your revelation as an actual member a 'failed' triad others were citing as an example was so different than what they were saying about your situation. I think that is a bit of where this hurts all of us in the anonymous dept. We only get to see what is shown, like the blind men and the elephant joke I guess. I'm sorry you lost one relationship, but I am glad you were able to retain the other.

As for children, we (my wife and I) do want kids, we've talked about it a bit with OF, she's not kid averse but since we currently have zero at a bare min we'd be looking at 9 months+ before we got to 1. So we have time to work out the dynamics.

One thing that is hard so far, is communicating what you want to say vs what people are hearing you say. Emotions do not always translate to words effectively, and the more wordy you are, the harder it can be to 'get to the point.' I've always been a source of this type of problem though, because as my wife (and exes) have asserted, I should have ovaries as much as I talk about my feelings.

As far as being out, we semi-already are to trusted friends with zero rejections. I am 'out' to my family as a pagan and have been for over a decade, so the fallout from that with the deeply religious in my family is long settled. I detest hiding anything about my life, especially about those I care about. However I am practical. This won't be a work discussion topic, ever. I've seen the bigotry asserted in the workplace against transgendered people, and have no desire to be on those folks radar.
 
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Knightshade said:
Thanks for the insight. It is interesting that your revelation as an actual member a 'failed' triad others were citing as an example was so different than what they were saying about your situation. I think that is a bit of where this hurts all of us in the anonymous dept. We only get to see what is shown, like the blind men and the elephant joke I guess. I'm sorry you lost one relationship, but I am glad you were able to retain the other.
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My situation is my situation and no one can speak on it like me. I know it intimately because it has been my reality for 23 weeks. No one can recall it like those in it. I do not mind people bringing it up. I do hope that people learn from my mistakes and try to avoid them.

IMO and our therapist's opinion, the triad played a non-existent role in what went wrong. The groundwork had already been laid and plenty of damage had been done by that point.

My only advice regarding triads seems to be the same advice others give; if you have it, let go of the expectation of equality. When or if it happens, focus on what you need and not so much what so and so is getting or did. I read so many threads where people want the girlfriend to love them equally and split her time between them equally, and that equal expectation and/or the tit for tat mentality is where so many problems occur. "Our girlfriend spends every other weekend with him and has weekly dates. I only get a date per month with her. He and I have not had a date in four months." I have read this exact scenario, and my only questions to that person were what did she need from their girlfriend and her boyfriend in order to get her needs met, and why was she not telling them?

I do not have anything against triads. I encourage people to do what makes them happy. Swinging, FWBs, single, solo poly, anarchist poly, monogamy, groups, triads, quads, or whatever. Love is supposed to be love, so how people attain it, is shrug worthy to me.

As for children, we (my wife and I) do want kids, we've talked about it a bit with OF, she's not kid averse but since we currently have zero at a bare min we'd be looking at 9 months+ before we got to 1. So we have time to work out the dynamics.
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As someone who messed up terribly in this department, I would implore you to discuss the dynamics well in advance, make sure you are in agreement, and be open to reconfiguring boundaries if necessary.

One thing that is hard so far, is communicating what you want to say vs what people are hearing you say. Emotions do not always translate to words effectively, and the more wordy you are, the harder it can be to 'get to the point.' I've always been a source of this type of problem though, because as my wife (and exes) have asserted, I should have ovaries as much as I talk about my feelings.
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I agree. What has helped me is writing out what I feel needs to be discussed before we talk. I ask him to do the same. I focus on my feelings and thoughts regarding whatever is on the table. I know my emotions will not translate effectively, so my goals are to always make sure that there is no room for assumption and that clarity and total understanding are paramount. Since we know what points we both want to touch on, it prevents us from going off track and enables us to focus on what the other is saying. Now that we are communicating in this manner, we have not had a single argument, as there is no room for miscommunication or assumptions. It has helped me tremendously to understand what was being said, able to follow it with ease, being able to discuss it in a fraction of the time, and being able to walk away knowing that there was a mutual understanding.

As far as being out, we semi-already are to trusted friends with zero rejections. I am 'out' to my family as a pagan and have been for over a decade, so the fallout from that with the deeply religious in my family is long settled. I detest hiding anything about my life, especially about those I care about. However I am practical. This won't be a work discussion topic, ever. I've seen the bigotry asserted in the workplace against transgendered people, and have no desire to be on those folks radar.
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That is good. I always thought it would be hard to be closeted. I have since changed my beliefs and believe it might be easier than being out.

How unfortunate about transgendered employees at your workplace. That is a shame.
 
Greetings Knightshade,

I'm very late to this conversation as I've been out of town, but I just wanted to add my welcome to the forum. You seem like a very generous person and very willing to share to make your wife happy. It sounds like helping others is a source of happiness to you, so I am all for the plans that you have and wish you the best.

I hope you're finding Polyamory.com to be helpful even if there's some glitches from time to time. By and large I think you'll find the people here to be supportive.

Good to have you onboard.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
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