Is it too late?

F

FLgirl79

New member
I am new to this situation and need some advice.

I was raised in a very old-fashioned home. I have tried my whole married life to make my husband happy. I have also always been very adventurous sexually.

About a year and a half ago my husband approached me with the suggestion that we invite a friend of ours to join us for sex. I was very excited about the idea and agreed. The experience was wonderful and I enjoyed it.

This friend was getting out of another relationship and trying to finish college. She needed a place to stay. So we invited her to stay at our house for as long as she needed.

At first it was wonderful. We hardly came out of the bedroom. One day I passed the computer and found an IM that they had been talking on. I know I shouldn't have snooped, but I was curious. He told her how much he loved her and how happy he was to have her in his life now. I felt sick. It was one thing to be having fun in the bedroom, but a whole different thing for him to be in love with her.

All the insecurities I have felt my entire life came bubbling to the surface. Why wasn't I good enough for him? What did I do wrong?

I made the mistake of agreeing to things that made me unhappy just because I thought they would make him happy. Then when it would happen I would have a meltdown and freak out on him.

I am jealous of the time they spent together. I compare everything he does for her to what he's done for me. It's awful. I feel so inadequate.

My husband has tried to be honest right from the beginning. He told me that he would never have a sexual relationship with someone he didn't have feelings for. He tried to go slow. He tried to get me to talk. I hid my feelings until I was at the freak-out point.

The thing is, I love them both. I want this to work and for everyone to be happy. I just don't know how to get past my own self doubts.

I don't want it to be too late to save either relationship. My husband doesn't know what to do with me anymore. He doesn't trust my new look at things because of my past actions. He has stopped being loving and close to me.

I would love your advice. Thanks for listening.
 
I don't think it's too late. I think you need to sit down and have a frank and open conversation with both of them about everything. Communication is key. I really hope you can talk to them and get them to see how you are feeling. You might be surprised how it goes. Good luck!
 
It is hard going from the cultural frame of reference you grew up with into a new perspective. There is no reason it can not work out. Everyone should be able to be happy in the end, since there is a lot of love to go around.

It sounds like a big part of it is dealing with your feelings of jealousy. That is one of the most common topics in polyamory. I have heard lots about it.

Everyone feels it differently. The main concept is to not try to stop feeling jealous. It is a feeling that tells us a lot about what is going on. In your case, you compare what he does for her with what he does for you, showing that you are feeling a little insecure in your relationship.

Treat jealousy as a symptom. The goal is to deal with the insecurity, then the jealousy should diminish. You can do this by asking him why he wants to be with you. How he feels about her does not make him love you any less.

Polyamory is not a game in which one person wins the other person away from an established relationship. If the established relationship fails, it is because the people don't want to be together anymore.

Sunshinegrl is right. Communication is key. If you talk about how you are feeling, you won't reach the breaking point. Keep the lines of communication open. Be willing to say that you are feeling a little needy and want some extra loving time. Let the other woman know how you feel and what you want.

Just remember that because he loves her, he doesn't you any less (and vice versa). It is analogous to a parent having more than one child. They don't love the first child any less for having another.
 
It's never too late, until you give up on yourself.

Quath and Sunshinegrl seem to have covered off most of it. Communication, some frank, honest discussion between all parties is what's needed.

Some things you might try to keep in mind-- old-fashioned or not, marriage, and relationships in general, are a two-way street. Doing things to keep your spouse happy is fine and dandy, but there has to be some reciprocation. You need to make sure your needs are being met too.

It sounds like you have an awesome thing going on, something you all enjoyed, and could again. You also have the self awareness to have started identifying the reasons that you've been reacting the way you have. If you can discover the root causes, then as a couple, or a group, you should be able to find a solution. It sounds like everything else you need is already there, including the desire to keep everyone together.

Since you asked for advice I will offer this. As Quath said, treat jealousy as a symptom and dig down deep for the root of the insecurities. While you are doing so, try to stop yourself from making comparisons. I generally find it to be a waste of time, and a distraction from finding the root. You'll need to stop hiding your feelings, open up and be honest about them, both to your husband, your lover, and most importantly, yourself.

I'm curious... do you have a relationship with the friend yourself, distinct from that you have with her through your husband?

As for your husband being withdrawn, I would suspect he'd be a little gun shy at this point. The cycle of holding back and smiling, followed by 'freaking out' does nothing to build the trust you need in each other. There are ways of discussing things that don't need to involve tears and heartache.

The Ethical Slut is an oft-recommended book, and does speak to several techniques, but any book on communication, particularly on contentious issues, would provide the tools you can use, should you not possess them already.

I sincerely hope you are able to resolve these things for yourself. It sounds like you're only a short step away from something awesome. Read about Sunshinegrl's and Redpepper's relationships, and the little victories they enjoy. The rewards of resolving your self doubts will be well worth the effort.

Cheers.
 
You mentioned constantly comparing what he does for you vs what he does for her. What you might want to do is think about specifically what needs you need to have met. If your needs are being met, you're likely to feel more loved and secure, and therefore less likely to have the need to compare "me vs her".

It helps to be able to ask for what you need before the heat of the moment. For example, I need to feel like I'm special for being me, and not just a housekeeper/child raiser. To achieve this, we spend an hour a night together (when we are both home and don't have visitors over) without the TV or computers on, just to talk about our days, or whatever else there is to talk about. This helps me to feel connected to my husband. Then I worry much less about the time he spends with others. I don't feel like I'm at risk of being replaced.

Everyone's needs are different. It's important to figure out why you feel how you feel, and to voice it so that your needs can be met.
 
Thanks for all the comments and advice. :) It helps so much to be able to talk to people who understand!

I know that my jealousy issues stem from my own low self-esteem and insecurity. It is a problem I have struggled with my whole adult life.

My friend and I are very different people. I am a homebody, while she prefers to be out doing stuff. I have two children, she doesn't have any. She is outgoing and says what's on her mind. I am shy and let people walk all over me. She helps my husband to feel care-free again. In the back of my mind, that's what I'm afraid of-- living a life of very few responsibilities vs. two kids and a mortgage. My husband has reassured me that this will not happen. He enjoys different things with each of us.

To answer a question from above, this woman was my best friend for a couple of years before we became lovers. It is very comfortable for me to be in a relationship with her. We enjoy our time together very much. When the three of us are together, it is awesome. It's the time my husband spends alone with her that I have a hard time handling.

Again, thanks for listening.
 
FLgirl79 said:
One day I passed the computer and found an IM that they had been talking on. I know I shouldn't have snooped, but I was curious. He told her how much he loved her and how happy he was to have her in his life now.

My husband has tried to be honest right from the beginning. He told me that he would never have a sexual relationship with someone he didn't have feelings for. He tried to go slow. He tried to get me to talk. I hid my feelings until I was at the freak-out point.
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I am going to beg to differ with you on a certain point here. (I was telling Redpepper about this thread and she agrees with what I am thinking.)

If your husband had been completely honest with you, he would have told you right away that he was falling in love with your mutual friend, and there would have been no surprise IM. There is no excuse for "trying" to tell you things. He just had to say them. So don't blame yourself for not being aware of how things were developing. Also, I am a little surprised that your female friend would not say anything to you herself. You are being too hard on yourself. There are three people involved here, three parts to the equation. Two were quite clear on what was happening, one was not.

I hope you all work everything out and find what you need to be happy. But I hope more than anything you stop viewing yourself as the proverbial "bad guy" in this. There was a clear lack of openness from your husband and your friend in this; otherwise you would not have been caught off guard. Hopefully they have taken ownership of this and not put it on you. Best wishes. Take care.

Mono
 
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FLgirl79 said:
Living a life of very few responsibilities vs. two kids and a mortgage. My husband has reassured me that this will not happen. He enjoys different things with each of us.
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This is one of my wife's concerns also. This is very similar to that "weekend dad" issue, where the mother takes care of the kid, but dad takes them to the zoo and the movies and all that fun stuff. However, ask a kid where they feel most comfortable and they will most likely say they want to be with their mother. (This is just a stereotypical example. I am not implying that you can't have "weekend moms," as well.)

It sounds like he is getting something different from each of you. You are offering him something that he is not getting from his relationship with her. She is also giving you something that he is not giving you.
 
Grrr

If I were you, I would feel very threatened, and would probably react similarly. Not many people can pull off poly, and your guy isn't doing the best job of it at the moment. Neither is your friend. If I found out that my husband had deeper feelings for one of our others that he didn't tell me about or discuss with me, I would flip!

I expect him to tell me everything. That doesn't mean he always knows what is going on for him, but he knows if he is feeling something, and therefore I expect him to say, "Look, I feel different somehow. I just want you to know that something is coming up for me around this. I will fill you in as I figure it out." That is everyone's duty in poly, or it just doesn't work, in my opinion. I would feel like he were cheating emotionally.

Sex can be just a physical fun thing, and can be a good time all the way. But if he had more than feelings of lust, and so did she, and they didn't tell you, that wouldn't be poly, in my book, just someone cheating on his wife with her friend.

Good luck, my friend. I am angry for you. I have a really hard time with dishonesty, not facing fears, and justifying behaviour for one's own gain. Not cool!
 
One more thing-- if you are feeling inadequate and comparing yourself, I would suggest that you get out there and find your life for YOU, not relying on anyone else's agenda.

My husband had a hard time until he realized that his jealousy and discomfort stemmed from him not getting on with his private life and staying connected with himself. He has come leaps and bounds since then. He is confident, self assured and has the ability to love himself first, before anyone else.

Perhaps reassessing your own life and where you want to be going with it will be beneficial. Nothing like a little "three's a crowd" action to make me look at my stuff and get my act together, get connected to myself and get moving again.

Maybe it's time for her to leave your house so you can get back on track and pull your family back together, before moving forward with her in your lives? Your family should always come first, as far as I am concerned. If your kids are negatively feeling the affects of this, that isn't fair to them. Their comfort is the most important thing, and that directly comes from the two of you.
 
I feel a similar way as you right now, that my reactions to my jealousy have served to drive my bf away. I fear that by me wanting to control our relationship and his relationships with other people, I cause these cycles of get jealous>freak out>argue with him and accuse him>feel guilty and powerless>apologize and get over it, only to have it happen again all over a week or two later. I feel like every time I do it, I have failed. I fail him, I fail myself.

It's not true, though. And you have not failed. You will only have failed if you give up!
 
So much good advice here, FLgirl. I don't disagree with anybody's input that you've received thus far; it is all terrific.

Regarding you, however, obviously there are issues that have gone on for a long time in your life. Was your adventurous sexuality in your past a way of coping for other issues?

Now it looks like you've crossed over from an open marriage with free sex to what appears to be the possibility of a good poly life for all 3 of you. Poly is so different, in that we have to accept that there can be love, in addition to the great sex involved. The emotion messes a lot of people up, not just you. Go ask my wife, she still wrestles with it almost daily.

I'm not so sure anyone is to blame here. Just see if you 3 can work out a happy, mutually fulfilling poly life. It may be the greatest thing that's ever happened to the 3 of you.
 
I wish I had some insight. I seem to have the opposite issue from many of the other forum members. The emotion has never been an issue for me. I always seem to have a problem with the sexual aspect. I'm happy to share people, including my love(s), emotionally with anyone they feel strongly for. But the sex makes things difficult for me. I'd hate to have anything like an open marriage or a fuck buddy without the love there. Am I alone on this one?
 
XYZ123 said:
The emotion has never been an issue for me. I always seem to have a problem with the sexual aspect. I'm happy to share people, including my love(s), emotionally with anyone they feel strongly for. But the sex makes things difficult for me. I'd hate to have anything like an open marriage or a fuck buddy without the love there. Am I alone on this one?
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You are absolutely not alone! That's me in a nutshell. Have all the deep friendships you want. Sex is the dealbreaker for me too. In my case, it's not about Redpepper having sex with her husband or her other current male lover, it's about her seeing (having sex with) yet another male.

Although people and attitudes may change over time, the person I am today is not prepared to share Redpepper with more men and be able to sustain the depth of relationship we have right now. I would not even attempt to flat out say "you can't," because that is not reality. But every choice we make impacts both of us, so it's a matter of actions, reactions, and changing dynamics. Her having sex with women is not an issue for me, because I simply can't provide that.

An open relationship, or one that involves fuck buddies, is not going to happen.

Now I will sit back and take the usual "mono straight men insecurity, need for possession" flack that I always do. So be it. I am who I am. I am proud of it. I'm done debating the issue.
 
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No debate here, Mono. My wife would agree with you 100%. She's ok with all PDAs, kissing, any signs of affection around the house with my other life love. She's even ok with the emotional side of it. But she still struggles with the sex side of it. I understand her issue, but am clearly not wired the same way she is, or you are, even though for my whole life I believed and behaved like I was.
 
Yes, Mark, your wife and Mono feel that way. But neither identify as polyamorous while I do. I don't think it's conditioning on my part, not societal, anyway, more like extremely bad experiences. I know I can be at the center of a V (done). I know I can even handle an N (done). A triad might be possible with the right woman, if we were both deeply in love with her, and I felt comfortable enough (was willing but it didn't happen). And I'd never deny my husband a male partner if he ever chose to seek one (doubtful). However, they would all have to be based on deep emotional connections and a form of polyfidelity.

The dealbreaker with P ended up being: 1) her male partner was not a love connection (on his part), but a fuck buddy; 2) he began having promiscuous sex, and P would neither stop seeing him, nor ask him to stop, despite it hurting her and causing concern for me (risk of STDs, P being emotionally devastated, his refusal to get to know me and N, etc.). I never had an issue with enough love to go around. But the sexual aspect was difficult, and still is.
 
XYZ123, it just seems like this wasn't the right combination (of people) for you, with the right set of respected boundaries. I wish you luck in finding what you want with whom you want. Don't give up!
 
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