Can Open Relationships Strengthen Rocky Marriages?

To +1 Galagirl's orginal response, yes, going poly exposed all of the problems and cracks in my monogamous relationship. We spent 3-4 years hating each other. I can say this now because 10 years on we are far stronger and more honest than we ever were. We got there because we have communicated more deeply and consistently and openly.

What's the counterfactual? If we hadn't gone poly, would we still be this strong? I don't know.

But I wouldn't prescribe poly as a cure for relationship problems. Wind the clock back and, at times at least, we were maybe a 1/4 chance of getting through, and a 3/4 chance of never speaking to each other again.

I suspect couples counselling may have a somewhat better strike rate.

Sentinel
 
Last edited:
Magdlyn said:
His needs are to tell his date what a shitty wife you are? First of all, he's giving her a bad, untrue, idea of what polyamory is. Second, if he goes on a date just to come home and gloat about how he told date person how much you suck, that's not ethical. Polyamory is not something you resort to, to meet the needs of one partner. Polyamory is loving more that one, with the consent of all involved. Do you consent to him dating others just to tell them what a shitty wife you are? If he thinks you're so shitty, you might as well leave right now. This is NOT polyamory.
Click to expand...

I may have not communicated that properly... He said " I told her our situation" and I interpreted that to mean... "I told her you were a shitty wife" he didn't say he said that...he actually just meant he told her we are opening up our marriage.
 
Sentinel said:
To +1 Galagirl's orginal response, yes, going poly exposed all of the problems and cracks in my monogamous relationship. We spent 3-4 years hating each other. I can say this now because 10 years on we are far stronger and more honest than we ever were. We got there because we have communicated more deeply and consistently and openly.

What's the counterfactual? If we hadn't gone poly, would we still be this strong? I don't know.

But I wouldn't prescribe poly as a cure for relationship problems. Wind the clock back and, at times at least, we were maybe a 1/4 chance of getting through, and a 3/4 chance of never speaking to each other again.

I suspect couples counselling may have a somewhat better strike rate.

Sentinel
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing.
 
Openandintimate said:
I may have not communicated that properly. He said, "I told her our situation," and I interpreted that to mean: "I told her you were a shitty wife." He didn't say he said that... he actually just meant he told her we are opening up our marriage.
Click to expand...

Oh wow. So you internalised him telling his date that you (plural) were "opening our relationship," as, "my wife is shitty." That came from your own self bully voice.

Or maybe not just from your own self bully voice. He has told you you are a "terrible wife," correct? Many times over the years, and especially since his affair? That it is not lack of sex, or bad sex, that is the problem, but your trouble being emotionally intimate?

So. He told his date, perhaps, that since you are emotionally unavailable, he needs another partner... There is no way of really knowing what he told her. And maybe you don't need to know everything he told her about you. But you can request he not share very intimate things about you, with others.

There are things my nesting partner has asked me not to tell my other significant others, about her. Not many, but a few. And your husband's new date person has the right to request him not tell you certain intimate things about her.

For example, most poly people do not read text conversations their nesting partner has with the other partner(s). There do need to be boundaries of which intimate details can be told, and which can't. That is where letting go of being overly controlling, and micro-managing comes in.

But I guess the thing is, you fear him telling his new date person (or future others), that, "My wife sucks, and that is why I need another partner."

Actually, I wouldn't date a poly person who continually ran down their nesting partner to me! It's not my place to heal their marriage. And it would show me that my new partner was disrespectful, disloyal, and had emotional lack of energy, or fears, lack of communication skills, or sluggishness. Lack of maturity, in other words. Lack of good moral character.

If you can't or don't trust your husband not to run you down and mock you, when he's on a date, you shouldn't attempt poly. You should break up so that what he does or says doesn't concern you or cause you anxiety anymore.

You need to learn to love yourself and trust yourself, before you can really love or trust another. You need to heal. You need to identify, and then explore your emotions, the good pleasurable ones, as well as the bad, unpleasant, even horrible terrible ones. Adding in poly, and fears of what your husband is telling his new dates about you, just compounds your work, seemingly beyond what you can bear. And so you fall apart and say bad things, scream and tantrum, and act in ways you regret and feel shame for later.

How nice it would be to break out of this cycle.
 
Last edited:
After posting that, I wanted to add something about identifying and feeling emotions, and then learning how to express them verbally, and act on them appropriately.

In our culture, the patriarchy at large, most men are taught from an early age to bury their emotions. Even as babies and toddlers. Don't cry, don't be tender, don't be sensitive.

Men are taught there are about 3 things they are allowed to feel. Happy, angry or horny.

And they may feel happy because they just got sex, or they just ate, or their sports team just won, or they got rewarded somehow at work (success on a project, a raise, a promotion). They may feel happy when a child is born, since it proves they are virile and fertile. They may feel happy on their wedding day, since it proves they were masculine enough to win a wife (a possession that gives them status with other males, or in the family).

They can feel horny and expect to have that feeling relieved by a woman, or by using porn as much as they want. They are allowed to have a mistress, or use a sex worker, or go for a lap dance. They may misidentify other uncomfortable emotions as a need for more or better sex (as seems to have been both your and my husband's issue.)

But when anything gets in the way of success in getting sex, job problems, sports team losing, lack of fertility or potency, unruly children, low income making them a bad provider, etc., anger is the only resort. (Sometimes drugs or alcohol are needed to numb the feelings.)

Fear is never allowed. Dependence or tenderness is never allowed. Insecurity, compassion, empathy, feeling submissive, feeling indecisive, self doubt, feeling shame or guilt, fearing loss (of a spouse, of a job, of a parent or child, etc.), is not allowed.

Even being overwhelmed by love is frowned upon. Yes, sometimes loving itself is discouraged. It makes one too vulnerable.

I am not sure what emotions you have a hard time identifying, acknowledging or acting upon. You seem to hide your fear behind anger. You don't sit with the fear. You act out as soon as possible, by tantruming.

You are a woman, obviously, not a man, but you were taught to bury or misidentify emotions as men traditionally have been (in the partriarchy). That's usually what a man goes through, but it seems to have been your lot.
 
Last edited:
Magdlyn said:
I am not sure what emotions you have a hard time identifying, acknowledging or acting upon. You seem to hide your fear behind anger. You don't sit with the fear. You act out as soon as possible, by tantruming.

You are a woman, obviously, not a man, but you were taught to bury or misidentify emotions as men traditionally have been (in the partriarchy). That's usually what a man goes through, but it seems to have been your lot.
Click to expand...

This is very true...I often say that I am the "man" in this relationship ( stereo typically speaking. Is it possible to change this after 42 years of conditioning and living this way? I am really struggling...
 
Magdlyn said:
Oh wow. So you internalised him telling his date that you (plural) were "opening our relationship," as, "my wife is shitty." That came from your own self bully voice.

Or maybe not just from your own self bully voice. He has told you you are a "terrible wife," correct? Many times over the years, and especially since his affair? That it is not lack of sex, or bad sex, that is the problem, but your trouble being emotionally intimate?
Click to expand...

It did come from my own self bully voice...but he has told me what a terrible wife I have been in the past. It is all about the lack of emotional intimacy. He is not interested in sex if there is no emotional intimacy first.


Magdlyn said:
You need to learn to love yourself and trust yourself, before you can really love or trust another. You need to heal. You need to identify, and then explore your emotions, the good pleasurable ones, as well as the bad, unpleasant, even horrible terrible ones. Adding in poly, and fears of what your husband is telling his new dates about you, just compounds your work, seemingly beyond what you can bear. And so you fall apart and say bad things, scream and tantrum, and act in ways you regret and feel shame for later.

How nice it would be to break out of this cycle.
Click to expand...

Since I have last posted...it has gotten really awful. I have thrown emotional tantrums.. I would swing from: talk to her (you need this!! I want you to be happy.).... I can't handle this (don't talk to her!!).... I checked his phone and read something flirty he texted her and totally lost it. Now he has cut everything off with her because he is scared for his life...he never knows what he is going to get with me, and he is very scared. He doesn't believe a word I say.

I am looking in to counselling... I feel hopeless.
 
Re:
"Now he has cut everything off with her because he is scared for his life ..."
Click to expand...

Scared for his life? Seriously?
 
If he's that afraid of you, why's he keep provoking? He had a hand in the situation making.

You tried to talk to him about your concerns before he did this date (that he claimed he was reluctant to do) and he blew you off. I know he wants you to be Wonder Woman and be "over the top" at everything but you don't have to be. Stop expecting that of yourself. You are not Wonder Woman. Neither are you hopeless Shit Wife.

The situation of trying to continue with him in a rocky marriage might be hopeless. But you are not hopeless nor helpless.

Be ok with him cutting things off with the woman. It's too much stress right now. Reduce the stress load. Stop acting like it failed because it is all your fault. It is not. Accept it as too stressful a situation rather than heaping all blame on your head. You are NOT in charge of everything/responsible for everything.

Be ok expressing your feelings. You normally bottle them up. It may not be graceful, but it is real. It's how you feel right now. You have been pushed to the edge. Please do not hurt yourself or others, but don't try to sit on the powder keg.

If he's scared for his life? Literally? Break up with him. No point in hanging around each other if he's that afraid of you. He could break up with you himself too instead of you always being in charge of everything. He claims the marriage was shit all this time? Alright. Shoo then. Don't be married any more. There. Sets you BOTH free.

I could be wrong, but I think it's a new tactic -- he starts acting "scared" so you start bending over backwards again trying to "prove" how not scary you are. Do a bunch of stuff for him. Do NOT bend over backwards. This pattern has to stop.

Swinging from extremes has to stop. Both in his expectations of you and in your expectations of you. You are not super great like Wonder Woman. That is ok. You are not super awful like the "shit wife." That is ok. Learn to be ok being an ordinary, average person. Average is great! Average is even keel! Way better than up and downy.

You wanted to try one more time with NVC, but perhaps it is not meant to be and it is more efficient for BOTH your healing to part ways. Be ok letting that last hope go too. He not cooperating. Instead he's pushing buttons til you pop.

It did come from my own self bully voice...but he has told me what a terrible wife I have been in the past.
Click to expand...

The inner critic voice(s) in your head... is it just from him bullying you and then you repeating his bullying words to yourself -- so now you being your own bully? Anyone else from your past? Mom, Dad, another relative who was vey critical of you? And you've internalized their "old record albums?"

I hope with a therapist's help you can find your OWN voice and lay these inner critic voices to rest. You've had enough abuse from others without you joining the choir too.

It is all about the lack of emotional intimacy. He is not interested in sex if there is no emotional intimacy first.
Click to expand...

I think it will be hard to be emotionally and sexually intimate with someone who bullies you, blow you off, and witholds love/affection unless you are "consistently over the top." Or uses whatever her learns and turns it against you later. It is not safe to share feelings or sex with him for all that he claims to want it. And you don't have to provide the sex like that. Your body belongs to YOU. You are not a toaster that dispenses toast (sex) any time he wants some.

If he wants emotional intimacy? He has to stop being a bully, provoking you, and then acting like he's the victim when you snap. He cannot light the match, and then act all surprised "poor lil ol me" when the bomb went "boom."

Casting you as the "crazy unstable one" is mean.

Again, if he thinks you are that unstable/crazy and he fears for his life? The whole marriage has stunk? Why's he still here then? He can LEAVE so you can have peace.

Is husband willing to work on his share of the problems? Learn NVC? Take an honest assessment of that. Be ok feeling sad if the answer is "No, not likely to work with him. Same old song with him is what is most likely."

Because you cannot live all cranked up like this. If he's not willing to do his fair share of the work and STOP being provocative? YOU have to leave so you can have peace. You might be better off splitting up so you cannot be provoked by him any more. Esp if he keeps on rattling your cage. You might not be at final acceptance on that yet. Might be feeling sad starting to contemplate it. Be ok feeling those feelings too. It's not glam, or fun but it is real.

You've been living emotionally numb for a long time.

Any closer to finding a therapist? I really think you could use extra support right now in real life. You can do the NVC part separately later on. Right now I think it is more important to get you safer. All this stress us not good. :(

You count too. You are human too. You have needs too. You have inherent worth, value, and dignity. You deserve to be treated well. If husband cannot treat you well in this marriage? That's all you ever will get here and you already clocked 20 years? You want something else for the second half of your life?

You can quit working at this Marriage Company. It's ok to do that. You have to take good care of you.

Hang in there.

Galagirl
 
Last edited:
Is it possible to change this after 42 years of conditioning and living this way? I am really struggling...
Click to expand...

PS: Yes it is possible. It will take work, but it is possible to decide to learn something new at any age.

If this were a car accident or something and you lost some fingers? You would learn to adapt and change your ways in light of this new thing. Might take some reading and some physical therapy and other work. Yet it can be done.

So if you find your previous way of going no longer works? Living emotionally numb feels lonely/isolating and you want to stop living like that? It might take some reading and some therapy and other work. Yet it can be done.

It is ok to struggle right now. I don't know if it helps you any... but at times of my life where things all fall apart I like to think about this quote.

“For a seed to achieve its greatest expression, it must come completely undone. The shell cracks, its insides come out and everything changes. To someone who doesn't understand growth, it would look like complete destruction.”
― Cynthia Occelli

You can see one picture version here:

https://craigsquotes.wordpress.com/...est-expression-it-must-come-completely-undone

Galagirl
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top