Insight on new poly relationships?

[mountaingirl]

Hello everyone!

Someone helped me out on my last post by giving names to the people I mention, so I'll use those. We'll say my partner's name is Joe and our friend's name is John. I posted on here awhile ago about my situation, but briefly Joe and I have been together for 2+ years and around the same time (~3 months after) we started hanging out we met our friend John. Recently John and I realized we both had strong feelings towards each other and had sex once we talked to Joe and he consented (granted, he wasn't ecstatic about it but was open to working through whatever feelings came up). We are all far from each other rn (literally in different corners of the US), so this past weekend we met up and it was the first chance for us to all hang out alone together after the events. It went really well! There was lots of love and openness between all three of us which felt great. They both love each other so much, and have been communicating a lot which puts me more at ease about the whole thing.
We thought about having a threesome, and then backed out at the last second because Joe was uncomfortable. Joe had initially suggested it as a way for him to have a better idea of what me and John being intimate looks like and to be more accepting of it. Afterwards he asked if John and I could please keep from having sex for now and I said yes that's fine, whatever makes him feel more comfortable. I guess I am wondering if anyone has experience with their partner wanting to walk things back but still being accepting... just needing more time? I'm also aware of all the feelings he must be experiencing right now and am wondering how best to be there for him. He often goes back and forth (the threesome thing is an example of that) on what he's okay with and how to handle the situation, which is totally understandable--all of us are trying to figure out our roles in this and how to be there for each other, so I can relate to being confused about how to feel. He has a very solution-based way of dealing with things, but to me this seems like something that is going to feel weird at times until we figure out what works for us, which requires TIME spent together (which cannot happen now since we're living apart for another few months). In general I am unsure of what to expect rn, and am wondering if anyone on here is familiar with this 'stage' where the partner you used to be monogamous with is okay with the idea of you being with someone else, but needs more time to process. I naively thought this would be like ripping a bandaid off... that once I hooked up with John/told Joe about my feelings for him everything would come out at once and eventually be okay, but I'm learning that it's more like a pendulum (duh). To me, I think the hardest part to work through if I were in Joe's shoes would be the fact that someone I love is in love with someone else, so I'm confused that Joe knows that but only has issues with me expressing that love physically with another person. And actually not even physically, but just sexually (he's cool with us cuddling in front of him, gazing into each other's eyes, etc. since that stuff has been happening for awhile now). I just feel like a hinge between them right now and am trying to make things easier. Also I apologize that this thread is kinda sex heavy? That is definitely not the focus of my relationship with either of them, just the topic we're struggling to work through currently. I'm stuck between wanting to try new things almost to desensitize us to how new all this is and wanting to just walk everything wayyy back with John to reflect on how our relationship has changed.

 

[GalaGirl]

This weekend you all got together for a visit and It went really well. There was lots of love and openness between all three which felt great. They both love each other so much, and have been communicating a lot which puts me more at ease about the whole thing. Did not force a threesome when Joe backed out. Also good -- double checking on consent and respecting people's limits.

You know that group sex is not a requirement in poly, right? You don't have to do it at all. So why try to do it?

You sound like you have it pretty good all things considered. So WHERE is the problem, really? I don't get it. It almost sounds like you are tripping your own self up with anxiety over.... nothing?

You seem to understand that the "old normal" is gone, and getting used to the "new normal" is just going to take some time. Then you ask how to best support him.

Well... give him some time!

When you visit all together? Spend time together in trio, time alone with John, time alone with Joe, and let them have their time alone as friends doing whatever.

And in the meanwhile, get on with your LDR life with each BF.

To me, I think the hardest part to work through if I were in Joe's shoes would be the fact that someone I love is in love with someone else, so I'm confused that Joe knows that but only has issues with me expressing that love physically with another person. And actually not even physically, but just sexually

Let me repeat back in my own words so I know I got it how you mean it. Correct me ok? Are you saying something like...

I don't understand Joe. If I were him, I'd have a hard time with my partner loving someone else too. He's fine with that. He's also fine with PDA like me cuddling John around him and gazing in John's eyes and all that.

He is not comfortable with the idea of me sharing sex with John again and asked us to hold off. I agreed. Now I changed my mind. (<-- is that the problem????) I want to share sex with John how I want. Like what difference does it make? I already shared sex with him before. I'm torn between wanting to rip the bandaid off and just get on with life so we all get used to it. And wanting to walk my relationship with John way back so I can help Joe process his decision to participate in a poly V and reflect on how this has changed the (me+Joe) relationship.

Is that the problem?

Galagirl

 

[mountaingirl]

This weekend you all got together for a visit and It went really well. There was lots of love and openness between all three which felt great. They both love each other so much, and have been communicating a lot which puts me more at ease about the whole thing. Did not force a threesome when Joe backed out. Also good -- double checking on consent and respecting people's limits.

You know that group sex is not a requirement in poly, right? You don't have to do it at all. So why try to do it?

You sound like you have it pretty good all things considered. So WHERE is the problem, really? I don't get it. It almost sounds like you are tripping your own self up with anxiety over.... nothing?

You seem to understand that the "old normal" is gone, and getting used to the "new normal" is just going to take some time. Then you ask how to best support him.

Well... give him some time!

When you visit all together? Spend time together in trio, time alone with John, time alone with Joe, and let them have their time alone as friends doing whatever.

And in the meanwhile, get on with your LDR life with each BF.



Let me repeat back in my own words so I know I got it how you mean it. Correct me ok? Are you saying something like...

I don't understand Joe. If I were him, I'd have a hard time with my partner loving someone else too. He's fine with that. He's also fine with PDA like me cuddling John around him and gazing in John's eyes and all that.

He is not comfortable with the idea of me sharing sex with John again and asked us to hold off. I agreed. Now I changed my mind. (<-- is that the problem????) I want to share sex with John how I want. Like what difference does it make? I already shared sex with him before. I'm torn between wanting to rip the bandaid off and just get on with life so we all get used to it. And wanting to walk my relationship with John way back so I can help Joe process his decision to participate in a poly V and reflect on how this has changed the (me+Joe) relationship.

Is that the problem?

Galagirl

Thanks for the reply! I'm SO fine without hooking up with both of them at the same time. Really just mentioned it as an example of all of us trying to figure out how our dynamic has changed because of this and it actually hasn't much which is cool. I enjoyed just being around them as friends. And yeah my situation is great! Everyone is communicating which is really all I can ask for at this point. Honestly this whole thing makes me nervous sometimes because I don't know anyone in a similar situation or even someone in an open relationship to ask for advice or talk about this with except for them, and sometimes it seems like our convos have been so heavy lately because of it. I like that you said "hang with each of them alone, both of them together and give them time apart" when we're all together... I get a little psyched out thinking about the logistics of us all living together again after this. Joe had asked me how that would work out and I have no idea, but I imagine it would be a seamless as when we're just hanging out for the weekend. If anything it would be even easier since everyone will have work/school/etc and other friends to hang with. I haven't changed my mind about not wanting to have sex with John right now, mostly out of respect for Joe but also because I'm trying to figure out how me and John's** relationship has changed after this (but honestly, it gives me more time to think about how me and Joe's relationship has changed as well, so good point). I think it's like: I am fine with not hooking up with John since that was a clear request from Joe, but because of that I am hesitant to express my love for John (non sexually) in front of Joe, because to me, if he cares about sex then he must care about snuggles n stuff. Joe said "I wish you wouldn't feel like you can't show John how you feel in front of me" and I can see where he's coming from because that makes it seem like something has changed/John and I are hiding something from him. Giving Joe time makes sense lol, I get caught up thinking about the future and how long it will take, not because I want to be able to do whatever but because I want everyone to feel like things are normal again. I did tell him before I left that I would work harder to listen and be there for him, I think right now that's what he's concerned about because I'm giving attention to a new person.

 

[dingedheart]

YOU aware the hinge between the 2 and granted it’s might be nice or demonstrates good intentions to try to make things easier but I would simply suggest concentrating on NOT letting NRE make things HARDER and let the boys figure these things out for themselves.

I would put a time limit or time limits on any kind of withholding of intimate contact because at the end of what’s going to be different i a week or a month or a yr. SO IN THAT regard maybe ripping the bandaid off is actually a good thing. Saves everyone a slow prolonged painful entry.

Has anyone suggested making a sex tape? He wants to watch and see but is afraid he’ll crack or freak. That could take the lots of the pressure off.

 

[mountaingirl]

YOU aware the hinge between the 2 and granted it’s might be nice or demonstrates good intentions to try to make things easier but I would simply suggest concentrating on NOT letting NRE make things HARDER and let the boys figure these things out for themselves.

I would put a time limit or time limits on any kind of withholding of intimate contact because at the end of what’s going to be different i a week or a month or a yr. SO IN THAT regard maybe ripping the bandaid off is actually a good thing. Saves everyone a slow prolonged painful entry.

Has anyone suggested making a sex tape? He wants to watch and see but is afraid he’ll crack or freak. That could take the lots of the pressure off.

As silly as this sounds, I think their version of "figuring things out" would be to, like, wrestle? And not even in a bad way, boys can just be dumb lol. I can see how me trying*** to make things better for them isn't really going to work. I just want to enter this with no one feeling like any decisions were made without them being considered... like no one is being left behind/left out. The sex tape suggestion is an interesting idea, I do think he's more worried about his reaction in front of us than the actual thing happening. Not something for now but maybe whenever we are all okay w/it that can be how the concept is introduced. The band aid thing is how I am feeling and does make sense, but I don't want Joe to get "I'm doing this whether you are okay with it or not" vibes. Also ngl, I don't think I can even be intimate with John if I know it's hurting Joe. The first time even after we had his consent I still had a panic attack during

 

[GalaGirl]

I would not do a sex tape. If things go wahoonie and you all break up? Don't need to deal in "revenge porn."

I just want to enter this with no one feeling like any decisions were made without them being considered... like no one is being left behind/left out.

So when consent to enter a poly V was obtained from each... didn't you all already agree nobody is going to make unilateral decisions? If not, have the conversation and make the agreement that nobody is going to make unilateral decisions.

Really just mentioned it as an example of all of us trying to figure out how our dynamic has changed because of this and it actually hasn't much which is cool.

Maybe you can write some of these positive things down to read and reassure your own self if you start to get anxious or wiggy? Again... I'm not seeing the problem apart from your own anxiousness.

Everyone wants to be here. The last visit went well. Dynamics haven't really changed much. People are getting along and are being polite, etc.

I get a little psyched out thinking about the logistics of us all living together again after this.

So stop thinking about it too far ahead of time. Put off living together and don't rush into it. If/when it comes to pass? Figure on a place with 3 bedrooms -- one for each so everyone has space and privacy. And honestly, if things go wahoonie and you break up with one or both of them? It would suck to be stuck living with your exes for a time on the couch if you don't have the funds to just move out and because you didn't plan ahead to have your own bedroom in the first place.

I am fine with not hooking up with John since that was a clear request from Joe, but because of that I am hesitant to express my love for John (non sexually) in front of Joe, because to me, if he cares about sex then he must care about snuggles n stuff.

That's the thing. TO YOU. What's Joe himself say?

Joe said "I wish you wouldn't feel like you can't show John how you feel in front of me" and I can see where he's coming from because that makes it seem like something has changed/John and I are hiding something from him.

See? Even Joe himself is telling you to get over it. The one making it weird for you might be YOU with all the overthinking.

How about you BELIEVE him? And just get on with your life rather than anxiety spinning? Not like fucking on the kitchen table, but just regular ol PDA cuddling watching a movie or whatever. Rip the bandaid off your OWN discomfort and stop projecting it on Joe. Stop trying to keep Joe in a padded bubble. Stop trying to "premanage" his feelings FOR him. He's an adult.

And put a time limit on the "no sex" thing because it eventually will pinch. Like you might be fine holding off for a week, two weeks, a month. But you aren't going to hold off for a year, two years, 5 years, right?

I get caught up thinking about the future and how long it will take, not because I want to be able to do whatever but because I want everyone to feel like things are normal again.

How about accepting that everyone is being "normal enough, in fact, pretty good, for newbies right now" and let this worry go?

And you move on to being more in the PRESENT MOMENT and let future take care of itself?

Because if you keep holding back because you are anxious or worried about Joe might react or respond later? You aren't ever going to get started. So how's the future ever supposed to arrive like that? You are not giving Joe opportunity to experience "life with Mountaingirl and her new BF John who is also my friend." He seems willing to go there. He consented.

I did tell him before I left that I would work harder to listen and be there for him, I think right now that's what he's concerned about because I'm giving attention to a new person.

So you and Joe are living in the same space? And John is LDR somewhere else?

Again... instead of you guessing and trying to pre-manage things for him guessing? ASK him directly what he's concerned about. Then BELIEVE him when he says.

I don't want Joe to get "I'm doing this whether you are okay with it or not" vibes.

Well, you aren't doing that. You all talked, you are all working things out. Do you lie to people?

Do you think Joe and John lie? Don't tell the truth about where they stand? And that's why you don't believe each of them?

If you need reassurance that he doesn't feel like that? ASK HIM DIRECTLY. "Joe, you know I want everyone's voice to be heard in the things that concern them right? It's not like I'm doing this whether you are ok with it or not. I want to know how you really are. Can you reassure me that you would tell me?"

Also ngl, I don't think I can even be intimate with John if I know it's hurting Joe. The first time even after we had his consent I still had a panic attack during

You sharing sex with John is NOT hurting Joe. He knows, he consents to be in a poly V. Whatever "getting used to it discomfort?" Joe's willing to undertake it because he consented to be here.

So how about letting your sex life with John unfold at the speed YOU AND JOHN are ok with. And if it is that you need to go slow so YOU can relax about it and get used to having two partners? Go slow then.

Galagirl

 

[kdt26417]

Hi mountain girl,

I read somewhere (possibly in "Sex at Dawn") that in (straight) nonmonogamy, men tend to struggle with the idea of their partner having physical sex with another man, while women tend to struggle with the idea of their partner having emotional involvement with another woman. If that's true, then Joe is actually having a normal reaction for a man. He is fine with you and John being emotionally involved with each other; it is the physical sex between you and John that freaks Joe out. I think it's like you said, Joe needs time to get used to this unconventional arrangement. But do get an idea from Joe about how much time he needs. One month of no sex with John is probably okay with you; five years of no sex with John is probably too much. So find out from Joe how much time he needs. Get all three of you on the same page in that area.

LDR's are notoriously difficult and often go up in spectacular flames. I am not trying to scare you, I'm just suggesting that the anxiety you feel, about the poly aspect of this situation, probably isn't much about poly per se but rather about living, as you said, in different corners of the country. I think your main goal right now should be for the three of you to move to a spot where you're all in the same city or similarly where you all (three) live close to each other. Actually living together (in the same domicile) can come later, first just concentrate on eliminating the LDR part of this dynamic. Then (after the three of you do live close to each other) on getting used to polyness. Then maybe on living together, if that's what you ultimately want. Anyway that's the order I would recommend for tackling things.

Honestly, things do seem to be going well so far.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.

 

[mountaingirl]

Hi mountain girl,

I read somewhere (possibly in "Sex at Dawn") that in (straight) nonmonogamy, men tend to struggle with the idea of their partner having physical sex with another man, while women tend to struggle with the idea of their partner having emotional involvement with another woman. If that's true, then Joe is actually having a normal reaction for a man. He is fine with you and John being emotionally involved with each other; it is the physical sex between you and John that freaks Joe out. I think it's like you said, Joe needs time to get used to this unconventional arrangement. But do get an idea from Joe about how much time he needs. One month of no sex with John is probably okay with you; five years of no sex with John is probably too much. So find out from Joe how much time he needs. Get all three of you on the same page in that area.

LDR's are notoriously difficult and often go up in spectacular flames. I am not trying to scare you, I'm just suggesting that the anxiety you feel, about the poly aspect of this situation, probably isn't much about poly per se but rather about living, as you said, in different corners of the country. I think your main goal right now should be for the three of you to move to a spot where you're all in the same city or similarly where you all (three) live close to each other. Actually living together (in the same domicile) can come later, first just concentrate on eliminating the LDR part of this dynamic. Then (after the three of you do live close to each other) on getting used to polyness. Then maybe on living together, if that's what you ultimately want. Anyway that's the order I would recommend for tackling things.

Honestly, things do seem to be going well so far.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.

That's a really good point; Joe and I have been in an LDR on and off since we started dating so for us it's a non issue (really just an annoyance at this point), but involving John has changed things. I definitely share your thoughts on the order of importance as far as the future; we are all committed to living near each other next August and Joe and John will actually be living together this summer (which I'm excited for, I think them being around each other without me will be good for both of them). I have been talking to Joe about how much time he thinks he will need, but because we all live apart for now he says it's hard to put any kind of time stamp on this, which I understand. Definitely frustrating that we are all apart; it's as if everything is paused in the interim and then when we meet up all of these emotions and thoughts come out that were hard to express over facetime, text, calling, etc. I'm just trying to exercise patience in many different ways, some days easier than others. Thanks for the reply

 

[mountaingirl]

I would not do a sex tape. If things go wahoonie and you all break up? Don't need to deal in "revenge porn."

I just want to enter this with no one feeling like any decisions were made without them being considered... like no one is being left behind/left out.

So when consent to enter a poly V was obtained from each... didn't you all already agree nobody is going to make unilateral decisions? If not, have the conversation and make the agreement that nobody is going to make unilateral decisions.

Really just mentioned it as an example of all of us trying to figure out how our dynamic has changed because of this and it actually hasn't much which is cool.

Maybe you can write some of these positive things down to read and reassure your own self if you start to get anxious or wiggy? Again... I'm not seeing the problem apart from your own anxiousness.

Everyone wants to be here. The last visit went well. Dynamics haven't really changed much. People are getting along and are being polite, etc.

I get a little psyched out thinking about the logistics of us all living together again after this.

So stop thinking about it too far ahead of time. Put off living together and don't rush into it. If/when it comes to pass? Figure on a place with 3 bedrooms -- one for each so everyone has space and privacy. And honestly, if things go wahoonie and you break up with one or both of them? It would suck to be stuck living with your exes for a time on the couch if you don't have the funds to just move out and because you didn't plan ahead to have your own bedroom in the first place.

I am fine with not hooking up with John since that was a clear request from Joe, but because of that I am hesitant to express my love for John (non sexually) in front of Joe, because to me, if he cares about sex then he must care about snuggles n stuff.

That's the thing. TO YOU. What's Joe himself say?

Joe said "I wish you wouldn't feel like you can't show John how you feel in front of me" and I can see where he's coming from because that makes it seem like something has changed/John and I are hiding something from him.

See? Even Joe himself is telling you to get over it. The one making it weird for you might be YOU with all the overthinking.

How about you BELIEVE him? And just get on with your life rather than anxiety spinning? Not like fucking on the kitchen table, but just regular ol PDA cuddling watching a movie or whatever. Rip the bandaid off your OWN discomfort and stop projecting it on Joe. Stop trying to keep Joe in a padded bubble. Stop trying to "premanage" his feelings FOR him. He's an adult.

And put a time limit on the "no sex" thing because it eventually will pinch. Like you might be fine holding off for a week, two weeks, a month. But you aren't going to hold off for a year, two years, 5 years, right?

I get caught up thinking about the future and how long it will take, not because I want to be able to do whatever but because I want everyone to feel like things are normal again.

How about accepting that everyone is being "normal enough, in fact, pretty good, for newbies right now" and let this worry go?

And you move on to being more in the PRESENT MOMENT and let future take care of itself?

Because if you keep holding back because you are anxious or worried about Joe might react or respond later? You aren't ever going to get started. So how's the future ever supposed to arrive like that? You are not giving Joe opportunity to experience "life with Mountaingirl and her new BF John who is also my friend." He seems willing to go there. He consented.

I did tell him before I left that I would work harder to listen and be there for him, I think right now that's what he's concerned about because I'm giving attention to a new person.

So you and Joe are living in the same space? And John is LDR somewhere else?

Again... instead of you guessing and trying to pre-manage things for him guessing? ASK him directly what he's concerned about. Then BELIEVE him when he says.

I don't want Joe to get "I'm doing this whether you are okay with it or not" vibes.

Well, you aren't doing that. You all talked, you are all working things out. Do you lie to people?

Do you think Joe and John lie? Don't tell the truth about where they stand? And that's why you don't believe each of them?

If you need reassurance that he doesn't feel like that? ASK HIM DIRECTLY. "Joe, you know I want everyone's voice to be heard in the things that concern them right? It's not like I'm doing this whether you are ok with it or not. I want to know how you really are. Can you reassure me that you would tell me?"

Also ngl, I don't think I can even be intimate with John if I know it's hurting Joe. The first time even after we had his consent I still had a panic attack during

You sharing sex with John is NOT hurting Joe. He knows, he consents to be in a poly V. Whatever "getting used to it discomfort?" Joe's willing to undertake it because he consented to be here.

So how about letting your sex life with John unfold at the speed YOU AND JOHN are ok with. And if it is that you need to go slow so YOU can relax about it and get used to having two partners? Go slow then.

Galagirl

No, Joe and I are also LDR but we talk pretty frequently and he visits when he can. Since I posted this I talked to Joe and John about where a lot of my anxiety is coming from.. I originally focused a lot on Joe's feelings as reasons why I would be worried, but if he says everything is okay then what is the problem? Realized that a lot of it has to do with me wanting to maintain control in sexual situations because of past experiences. Not getting into it here! But it took a lot to trust Joe when we first started being intimate, and now extending that trust to John is taking some time. For now I'm satisfied with the 'regular PDA' you mentioned above with John, just taking things slow enough so that all of us can feel comfy. I recognize that this would probably be an issue with John even if I didn't have Joe in my life, since it's really unrelated to the whole polyamory concept. I definitely have trouble identifying what thoughts are related to polyamory vs. LDR vs. just starting a new relationship... still working that out lol

 

[GalaGirl]

Since I posted this I talked to Joe and John about where a lot of my anxiety is coming from.. I originally focused a lot on Joe's feelings as reasons why I would be worried, but if he says everything is okay then what is the problem? Realized that a lot of it has to do with me wanting to maintain control in sexual situations because of past experiences.

Glad you figured that out.

It's ok for each "leg" of the V to go at it's own pace.

I definitely have trouble identifying what thoughts are related to polyamory vs. LDR vs. just starting a new relationship... still working that out lol

Hopefully it will come in time. Like I said... try not to overthink too much and be more in the present moment. Let things unfold naturally. There's no race or hurry or emergency. Nobody here is upset or anything.

Could accept everyone is being "normal enough, in fact, pretty good, for newbies right now" and try to live into it and through it with less anxiety spinning.

Sometimes easier said than done, but if you can do things to mitigate your own anxiety, you might enjoy the unfolding a little more.

GL!
Galagirl