How can I work past this?

Hi JAG,

Hmmm. Ok, I'll be honest here. What I'm hearing is that these guidelines aren't actually working. Tweaking them to have more clarity is a really good thing. However, I'm concerned that when the time comes, it won't matter that they exist. Guidelines based on insecurities (i.e. discounting safe sex / pregnancy / practical commitments) protect you no more than monogamy does.

Essentially, the situation you are in is this:

Your relationship model has now changed.

Your partner does not currently feel that she should put your needs and wishes above everything else.

If she did feel this way, she would have ended or restrained her relationship with new guy based on your ongoing discomfort.

However, this does not necessarily mean that she is more compatible with new guy than she is with you; or that she doesn't want to marry and spend her life with you. She could be absolutely, entirely, utterly crazy about you. She may love you more than she has ever loved anyone, for the rest of her life. However, what you're offering her is the chance to have that *and* have the new guy. She's obviously going to take that option.

So, what options do you have?

Either you and your partner agree that the primary relationship comes above everything else and that following this paradigm will make you both happiest. If you choose this path, you have to be really clear on what that means, and where vetoes come in.

If you choose that option and don't want to veto the new guy, you will need to forgive and forget, work on your insecurities and self-esteem, trust her not to break guidelines again, put yourself in new guy's shoes and work on compassion/empathy towards his needs as your metamour, remove blame, do a lot of poly reading, and so forth. Maybe even get to know new guy yourself.

This might work for you. Your partner may prove that she can stick to clearer guidelines and that alone might help you to become more comfortable with new guy.

However, I have to say that I don't think this will work. The model you are using has already proven to be flawed and I think it would be a mistake to go back to it. It's flawed because: 1) your partner has already proven that she can function quite happily without having to tell you what she's going to do with a partner before she does it; and 2) your own dating life is hindered by this model and as a result, you become a bit more needy and intrusive, because you can only look to one woman for romantic attention.

Therefore, wouldn't it make more logical sense to consider a different model on a trial basis and see how that feels for both of you? A model that allows greater freedom for both of you and is less restrictive? More autonomy and respect for one another's choices?
 
let see if I get this. You are contemplating getting married to a woman who wants a poly relationship where there are no rules for her, and if there are she breaks them, but there are rules for you. You are struggling, have no other partners, and she is doing whatever she wants to.

And you are seriously thinking of getting married before this all sorts itself out???? i can't figure out what in the world you would want to do that for, but if it makes you happy go for it.
 
I should add that it appears to me that in at least part of your mind, what you'd really like to do is to tell her that she has to break up with the problem boyfriend. In your opinion, would she break up with him if you told her to? If she would, what would the costs and benefits be? If she wouldn't, how would you respond?

I am concerned to learn that she is nixing your prospective girlfriends while you are allowing her to proceed with her boyfriends. This seems to me like an abuse of the rules on her part and a good reason to make a new rule that neither of you can nix each other's prospective boyfriends or girlfriends. Instead of having arbitrary powers of command over each other, perhaps you could have regular sit-downs where you can express your concerns, about whatever boyfriend or girlfriend seems like a problem. But, giving each other veto power to nix a boyfriend or girlfriend entirely may not be a healthy setup.

The rules you have seem to be designed primarily to shore up a lack of trust for each other, and the recent problems you've been experiencing seem to be centered around that lack of trust. Without trust, your relationship will probably continue to be fraught with increasing problems. If you have a wedding date set I would put that on hold, and get some couple's counseling (with a poly-friendly counselor).

That aside, you have a choice to make: Will you tell her to stop seeing the problem boyfriend? If you won't, will you resolve to stop resenting that boyfriend? Finally, what assurance (if any) do you have that she'll stop nixing all your prospective girlfriends?

The rules and the mistrust seem to me like an inherently problematic combination. But if clarifying the rules fixes the problems you're experiencing, then you can probably just about disregard my whole post here. I've been wrong in the past, and I wouldn't mind being wrong in this post (thread?) too.

F'reals,
Kevin T.
 
I wonder if you wouldn't find it easier to refocus your issues where they belong (on her and you) instead of him, if you talked to him?

I know some people don't have poly dynamics like that-but some do.
So I ask.

Because-I know for me; that helped me a lot. When I was able to explain to E that my distrust and hurt was due to Maca making all sorts of restrictions and then throwing them out the window when it was "his opportunity"; She completely understood. It didn't change her feelings for him, but it did change her feelings toward the situation. She knew SHE would have been feeling the same way I did.
She went back to him and told him herself that she wasn't ok with playing that kind of game where she got used in a way that allowed him to hurt me. They didn't break up-she just reiterated for him that she expects a high level of ethics in the relationship and wasn't going to tolerate being the vessel of b.s.
That action alone completely altered my feelings towards her. Which were never about her in truth-but about his treatment of me.

As for having or not having guidelines of xyz limitation on each other; I'm not going to get into the discussion beyond saying that we maintain guidelines and agreements for how quickly a person can "join" our group (there are already three of us so it's a family agreement). It works for us and that's how it's going to stay for the foreseeable future.
 
london said:
My cynical side agrees that this is a calculated method of ensuring she's poly whilst you're not.
Click to expand...

Or it's unintentional. She may have believed with the "security" of veto power, she could permit the OP to be poly. Obviously, that has not been the case. Either way, she needs to put on her big girl panties and quit allowing herself partners that she denies to her bf. Frankly if I were his gf, I'd be embarrassed to go out with yet another guy while consistently denying him the same pleasure.
 
I am sorry you struggle. :( Really only you can figure this out. But in the event it helps, I'll ask some questions and sum up what I think I see. Correct me if I am wrong.

  • Do you wish to continue in relationship with her? Yes.
  • Are you willing to risk rebuilding trust in her word? Willing, but not clear on ABLE.
  • Are you able to risk trusting her to stick to her agreements at this point in time so you can see she is making good? Not sure/not clear.
  • Are the agreements unrealistic/unable to stick to? Do agreements need to change so they become keep-able? Haven't done this yet.
  • Are you giving her opportunity to do so and find out? No. New agreements not yet made.
  • Has she apologized? Yes, seems contrite.
  • What behaviors would she need to do or not do in order to make amends? Doesn't sound like you have asked her to do specific behaviors yet. But thinking about asking her to dump the guy? Doesn't sound like she has suggested any making amends behaviors yet.
  • What behaviors do YOU need to do or not do after that to promote healing? Not articulated yet.
  • What is your desired outcome for your happiness? Not clear. All about what makes her happy so far. And expressed a desire to "be ok with this" and "be free of unhappy."

She has been very contrite, and has said she will stay within the approved boundaries, and I choose to believe her. But they are still dating. I want to be OK with this, because he makes her happy, )but I am really unhappy about it. I actively want them to stop seeing each other. I know it isn't fair to the relationship they share, but I do. Thinking about them screwing around while I was blithely assuming that she was following the agreed on rules makes my blood run cold.
Click to expand...

What makes YOU happy? :confused:

You have inner conflict -- because you can't keep thinking about them sharing sex in the recent past and breaking agreements. That does not support your want to "become ok with this in the present day." It causes you upset.

If she cheated on agreements, does any of this come into play here for you? http://felislunae.org/relationships-love/coming-clean/

It's ok to have a hard limit on cheating. But you have to be the one to decide if this is a dealbreaker or something you are willing to work out once. I am guessing you don't want this to be chronic behavior!

Was he even aware that there were agreements she was breaking? If so, would you like apology from him also? Do you want to ask him if he's willing to help her keep her new agreements moving forward?

Are you wanting her to break up with him permanently? Or do you want to ask them not to see each other for X weeks so you and her can work out the communication problems? Risk trusting them with a "small" like that to see if you want to risk trusting them again with a "big?" Cuz if you are sticking around in the poly network, it's not just building trust with her. It's building trust with him.

What's them NOT being together solve for you? What would you be doing with that time with her? Are you able to ask for the time to do that directly?

Is there's poly hell here? Jealousy? Or more jealousy?


Don't be in a rush to get married -- certainly not if you plan to poly post marriage and she's still not able to handle herself without breaking agreements.

As I see it, these are your options:


1) You break up with her because of the cheating. You have no desire to deal with her and rebuilding trust here or second chances.

2) You ask her to break up with him as a consequence of the cheating start. (<-- you seem to lean toward this one, but seem to fear actually saying so. Is that it?)
  • She does. You and her deal with rebuilding trust, with or without counseling.
  • She does not. She breaks up with you instead.
  • She does not. You break up with her then.
  • She does not. You choose to stay, do NOT do the work of trust building. (<-- I do not suggest this one. )

3) You choose to continue with them in a poly network. You choose to make new agreements ALL can keep the consequence of the cheating start. You ALL try to do the work of rebuilding trust and healing from that cheating, with or without counseling. They have to be willing to apologize, make amends. You have to be willing to give time/space for them to DO the amends IN, and once done, let it GO. Clean slate for all.
​

Hang in there.
Galagirl
 
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