How to ask his wife?

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dani11

New member
It has been several years since I have visited these forums. I always lurked, never joined. I read some good things, and have once again! Now I need some advice, and I hope the good people here can help.

My hubby Tony and I have an open marriage, and have for some time. (It is easier than explaining polyamory, which we actually are.) We have been married for 11 years, together for 12, opened the marriage 8-9 years ago. We have guidelines and all of that. His friends have known for the same amount of time. Though he has had a couple of short-term girlfriends (it did not work out when they met me?) I have never had any sexual or emotional relationships.

Recently I found out that Tony's best friend Zach wants to have a sexual relationship with me. This threw me for a loop, because I have known Zach for the same amount of time as Tony. We have always flirted and joked around with each other, but silly me, I did not know he was serious! A couple of months ago, he said he and his wife had decided to have an open marriage. Then he started hitting on me hot and heavy. That was when Tony informed me that Zach was serious, and had been attracted to me for almost as long as he had known me!

I am not totally against the idea, but some things worry me. This is Zach's third marriage. He has never cheated on any of them. The other two wives did not go for his open marriage idea. He has only been married to the current one, Maria, for about two years. I do not know her very well. I have only actually met her a handful of times. The last 1 1/2 years we have mostly kept in touch through Facebook.

The last two times I met her, once before I found out Zach wanted to have sex with me, and once after, she has said very little to me, picked a fight with Zach, and took off to her room.

That is problem #1. I don't think she is totally on board with his idea, or maybe she is just for herself, as Zach keeps mentioning this guy she wants to see.

#2 He uses several words interchangeably-- open marriage, swinging, swapping partners, girlfriends, boyfriends, dating. I am not totally sure how they want to go, or what they have in mind.

#3 I don't want this to in any way cause problems between Tony and Zach, or me and Zach. I don't really know Maria that well, so I cant say it would destroy our friendship, I don't want it to cause problems between Zach and Maria. (Tony is all for the idea, said he had been hinting around about it for years too. So it would not really cause problems with them unless things went horribly wrong.)

#4 Tony says the best course of action is to get Maria alone and talk to her. I tend to agree with this, but am really not sure how to go about bringing it up. I also tend to believe what people tell me, so if she says 'fine,' and I take it as 'fine,' then she really might not mean that! I would not know where to start or how much I could take at face value.

#5 Tony and I have ground rules. I think it works better if you tend to have some. (Open, honest communication, both having to agree, etc.) Could I ask about their rules? What if they don't have any?

Sorry this is so long, but I have been thinking about this for weeks now, and have no idea how to proceed. Any advice will be welcome!
 
I can see why you'd wonder if your understanding of things matches Maria's. Have you had any indication from her that she's ok with you and Zach being together?

One person you might talk to about who to approach Maria would be Zach. I didn't see any part of your story that mentioned talking to him. Whether you talk to him with or without Tony is up to you, but you may get a better read, one way or the other.
 
The reason not to ask Zach is that I already know how he feels about it. If Maria says she is fine with it, he would take it at face value, just because it is what he wants. He has always been a pretty impulsive person, and somewhat self-destructive in the relationship department.

Tony said to wait a couple of days until he is off work, then he will go and talk to Maria alone. He is fairly good at reading people, for the most part. He also does not settle for 'Fine.'
 
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dani11 said:
The reason not to ask Zach would be that I already know how he feels about it. If Maria says she is fine with it, he would take it at face value, just because it is what he wants. He has always been a pretty impulsive person, and somewhat self-destructive in the relationship department.

Tony said to wait a couple of days until he is off work, then he will go and talk to Maria alone. He is fairly good at reading people. He also does not settle for 'Fine.'
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These things tend to go much more smoothly if you can also learn to communicate directly with the person you need to talk to. Think about it right now-- Tony is going to talk to his best friend's wife about you getting involved with her husband. That's getting to be a messy game of telephone!

I know that if someone who wanted to be with one of my partners sent their partner over to talk to me, I'd wonder why they weren't doing their own dirty work, as it were. I would certainly feel less inclined to trust them, because they have now shown an unwillingness or inability to communicate directly with me. (Remember, she doesn't know your motivations for having Tony talk to her.)

Half of poly is multiple ethical romantic relationships. The other half is really awkward conversations. :D
 
Dani11's idea might be a reasonable start. If Maria is unsure, hearing from Tony that it's okay with him might help her see that they're being open, and it might reassure her that spouses can accept such things.
 
sagency said:
Dani11's idea might be a reasonable start. If Maria is unsure, hearing from Tony that it's okay with him might help her see that they're being open, and it might reassure her that spouses can accept such things.
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True, if it's to get the ball rolling, or talk about things from his perspective. But I had the impression from Dani's post where she said that Tony wouldn't settle for 'fine' (sorry, multiquote is a pain in the ass on my phone) that he was actually ferreting out the wife's feelings for her.
 
TruckerPete, I read it as Tony would open the conversation and get a feel for things. You are correct that the ladies should chat at some point, sooner rather than later.
 
If this were me, I would invite them all over for a night of togetherness. And I would bring it up, saying: "Hey, Zach says he wants to get to know me better. What do you all say to that?" and see what happens.

If anyone leaves the room due to not being able to talk about it, I would put everything on hold.

If, when asked, Zach and Maria don't have the faintest idea of what they actually want, then I would put it all on hold until they figure it out.

If Maria blows up and storms out, it goes on hold.

If they say, "Yeah, Zach wants to get to know you better, and here is how, and this is what we have talked about. What do you think?" then it's time to talk about boundaries, to set a time to go on an actual date, to see where it might go, and whether or not it is going to work.
 
Well, one thing's for certain, the old philosophy hasn't changed here by using new labels (polyamory, etc.). The risk is still there to affect the friendships, because if things turn ugly, Zach may be forced into a position that he has to choose between his wife or his best friend(s). So it's good to keep that on the horizon, and decide if the risk is worth the potential gain-- a possible romantic relationship for you and Zach.

If it were me, I'd also want to get more info direct from the horse's mouth (Maria). You might arrange a meeting with her, go shopping, do lunch, etc., and just open with:

"Tony tells me you guys decided to open your marriage too. We've been open for years and find it helps our own relationship a lot."

From there, you could ask Maria about what their guidelines are, so far, such as-- are existing friends excluded as dating partners because of possible complications? If she's not sure, because she and Zach haven't addressed that topic yet, you can use yourself as an example, i.e., "What if Zach wanted to hook up with me?"

You should be able to get a lot of feedback from such a conversation. Things can then proceed accordingly.
 
Hi there. I thought I'd point out that nowhere in your post do you say that getting together with this guy is something you're really excited about. So my question is: do you want to-- like, really want to?

dani11 said:
Recently I found out his best friend wants to have a sexual relationship with me. I am not totally against the idea.
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Being "not totally against" it, and then listing all the reasons why you are hesitant, just doesn't seem like a whole lot of enthusiasm to me.

Furthermore, you also state that since you opened your marriage quite a number of years ago, you "Never had any sexual or emotional relationships," so I wonder if your first should be with someone you're not all that thrilled about hooking up with. Sure, he might be a good, close friend, and Tony likes the idea, probably for voyeuristic reasons, and/or because Zach is well known to him. But do you really think it would be worth it for someone with whom having sex is something you're "not totally against?" Even if it would simply be recreational sex and okay with you, why not wait until there's an opportunity to be with someone with whom the prospect of such a liaison really knocks your socks off? Why settle for lukewarm when you can have hot? :D
 
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My first instinct is to talk to Maria directly. I am a fairly honest open person. I like hearing from someone directly.

Tony and I have talked about several ways to go about it. I take Maria out and talk to her. Tony and I talk to her. Tony talks to her. We all four talk together.

Tony and me talking to her seems to me like we would be ganging up on her.

Me talking to her, or Tony talking to her-- I think Maria would be more comfortable talking with Tony. She knows him better than me. Tony has gone over to their house, helped fix their computer, hung out, while I stayed home with our kids.

They used to live further away and have recently moved closer.

I have only met Maria about 5 times. We talked and got along okay the first couple of times. The last time we went over there was after they had decided to have an open marriage. She did not talk to me at all! She was too busy fighting with Zach. She left and went to her room.

I am, for the most part, a total stranger to her. Tony is not. I just felt she would be more comfortable talking to him than me. I still want to talk to her though. So if Tony were to talk to her, and say, 'Okay, green light,' I would talk to her.

Part of the problem could be they are living with another older couple who are not okay with non-monogamy of any sort. Maria could just be uncomfortable around them.

I have told Zach that they should both come over sometime. I figured we could all talk then. In fact, thinking it over, that would be best. Tony could still be there as a lie-detector type, and he would also not let Zach influence her, if it was seeming like she was not on board. It might even be good for both Zach and Maria. I don't think they have talked about this very much, at all.

I don't know how long it would be until they could come over, though. Zach just started a new job. They have just moved. Most of their stuff is still in boxes. They have two kids, and a car that is broken down at the moment.

This is just a crazy situation. Maybe I should start a blog for all of the background! :oops:
 
Never thought about it

nycindie said:
I thought I'd point out that nowhere in your post do you say that getting together with this guy is something you're really excited about. So, my question is: do you want to-- like, really want to?

Neing "not totally against" it and then listing all the reasons why you are hesitant, just doesn't seem like a whole lot of enthusiasm to me.

Furthermore, you also state that since you opened your marriage quite a number of years ago, you "never had any sexual or emotional relationships," so I wonder if your first should be with someone you're not all that thrilled about hooking up with. Sure, he might be a good, close friend, and Tony likes the idea... but do you really think it would be worth it for someone with whom having sex is something you're "not totally against?" Even if it would simply be recreational sex, why not wait until there's an opportunity to be with someone with whom the prospect of such a liaison really knocks your socks off? Why settle for lukewarm when you can have hot?
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I have tried to not think about it, really. From my point of view, he was just flirting around, never serious. Also his other wives were NEVER ok with this. Why get all worked up, not to mention making the relationship uncomfortable, over something that was never going to happen? I still don't want to get too worked up over something that might not happen.

If I did not want to, I would not be in this situation now. I would have just said no. The only reason I am hesitant now is because I don't know how Maria feels.

It could possibly get hot, and knock my socks off, if I let it. I won't let it until I know it is OK. Yes, I really do have that much control. Not to mention I don't want to destroy Zach's marriage. He is a good guy with bad luck, some of which he brings on himself. I don't want to be the cause of anything going wrong, giving him an excuse to destroy his relationship with his wife.

When I found out he was serious, I did go on a rant-- 'Why did he not start this before he got married again?' It would have been so much simpler!

The reason for not having any relationships until now is that I am a stay-at-home mom to three kids (10, 6, 4), and have been for some time. Tony works evenings. We have no one to watch the kiddos. So unless I just happen to run into someone at the grocery store, it is not going to happen.

Tony does not have voyeuristic ideas unless I decide to be with another female. I am the one with voyeuristic problems, though they don't have to even be sexual. Just him giving someone a kiss, or rubbing a leg or back, gets me all hot and bothered!
 
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