astrosneddy
Member
I do want to be poly.
I didn't make it clear what my consent means, and what the boundaries of it are.
I don't know if I want to reconnect with my wife
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I didn't make it clear what my consent means, and what the boundaries of it are.
Bobbi
Well-known member
So you want to be poly, but you don’t want her to date, and you aren’t feeling it with her physically yourself?
How do you envision this going? What exactly do you want it to look like?
astrosneddy
Member
I know that's kind of confusing, and it's not exactly what I mean. But I get why it looks that way. When we first talked about reopening, what I consented to us doing isn't what we currently are doing. When she's sought my "approval/blessing/support" to do things, I've not felt like I'm able to say no. When I've tried to express or discuss that things are not moving or proceeding in a direction I believe we arranged or agreed to, I feel threatened; that if I change or attempt to alter anything, she's going to be done; that will be it for her; no more poly, maybe no more us.
I'm feeling pressured, whether intentionally or not, regardless of if it's implicit or explicit. Due to my insecurity, I think I must always be wrong, and I act upon that. I looked up lots of things to try understand this. The consensus from all those articles and materials is that I did not give free consent and I'm not in a position of power or equality in my relationship to do so.
I'm unsure how to process this. It's not intentional. This person would not do that. But they have been modelled abusive and manipulative behaviours from their parents. They could unintentionally do so, especially in a flight-or-fight, survival response. And while I'm here saying all this stuff, she's going through it too.
As much as a lot of it feels insulting, my view is that, despite the way of handling it, she's gotten EVERYTHING she wanted. So it's insulting that this is "just as hard for her." But it's objectively true. Hence the questions about consent. I can understand why she would think she's operating with my consent with this particular person. But I have, on more than one occasion, stated, "I don't feel like I can say no. I know you're going to do this, no matter what I say." I didn't realise it then, but that's not actually free consent.
Bobbi
Well-known member
It’s just getting more difficult to give you advice, as you don’t seem to be able to articulate to us what you want, so I’m wondering if you are able to articulate that to a partner.
I recognize consent is a big part of the problem, as you do not feel you have consented to whatever it is that you aren’t liking her doing. But if you cannot articulate what the original agreement was, what it changed to, and what you are okay with, then consent cannot be found, because neither one is understanding the other and what’s being communicated.
Do you want to go back to swinging and not do poly? That’s what I think I’m getting from this. I think you are having issues with jealousy. Maybe you think her not being so close to a partner is less threatening?
Your withholding from her, to “take back control” of your relationship, is confusing, as this distances you from her. Is that the result you are looking for? Or do you feel she controls everything and this is the only way you feel like you have control? If so, is this a great way to separate yourself from the relationship, to ensure she breaks up with you, so you don’t have to?
There’s so much going on here. I think your therapist could better help you with this relationship dynamic and help you figure out what you want and how to go about it. Communication, emotional identification and regulation, and partner dynamics all need some work if you two are to have a healthy dynamic where you both feel heard and like full participants in the way the relationship works.
astrosneddy
Member
We should be hearing from a therapist on Monday. I think you're correct. I'm having trouble articulating how I feel and what I want. I feel pressured to understand all my emotions quickly. I think trying to avoid engaging with these things until we can get therapy is best. We're both exhausted from it.
I want to enjoy our time together, but it feels like I'm being disrespectful or disingenuous to both of us, to relax into the other parts of us while there is such a wound. I want to. We did it before recently and it was great. But I know it was time limited, that she was going to see this guy again. So I did what I could to make the most of our time and I loved it. But as the event free cost it all felt false and pretend. I don't want to treat her that way and I want to respect myself, as well.
Hi astrosneddy,
It sounds to me like she does not have your consent. She only has your forced consent, which is not really consent, and as a result she is "cheating out in the open." Does she think she has your consent? Maybe she doesn't realize what she's doing.
It sounds like you and she are perfect for each other in every way, other than this one little thing. Consent. Such a little thing, yet so important. Am I right? Maybe you need to have a talk with her, in which you explain that she is cheating. In any case, you absolutely must not break up with her, you love her and care about her too much for that.
The fact that she is putting you in the exact same place she was in when she treated you wrong in that position, and now you are treating her right in the same position, that is hypocritical on her part. She should show more appreciation for you making the sacrifices she was not willing to make.
I'm glad you'll hear from a therapist soon.
It sounds to me like she does not have your consent. She only has your forced consent, which is not really consent, and as a result she is "cheating out in the open." Does she think she has your consent? Maybe she doesn't realize what she's doing.
It sounds like you and she are perfect for each other in every way, other than this one little thing. Consent. Such a little thing, yet so important. Am I right? Maybe you need to have a talk with her, in which you explain that she is cheating. In any case, you absolutely must not break up with her, you love her and care about her too much for that.
The fact that she is putting you in the exact same place she was in when she treated you wrong in that position, and now you are treating her right in the same position, that is hypocritical on her part. She should show more appreciation for you making the sacrifices she was not willing to make.
I'm glad you'll hear from a therapist soon.
I hope the therapist is able to help you.
I hope you are able to realize that while sometimes you might be wrong and make mistakes, like any other regular human would, it's not ALWAYS you. You are not the world's scapegoat.
Whether or not she's having a hard time, or abusing/manipulating you on purpose or unintentionally, you do not deserve abuse. Nobody does.
People can aspire to healthy relationships.
If she's gonna do whatever she wants, whether you say "yes" or say "no," you may as well say "no" then, so you are at least speaking your truth, even if it scares you that she might give up on poly or break up with you. At least, that's what I think.
If you are being abused and it is not actually safe for you to say "No," you might have bigger things to deal with than her dating some dude. You could talk to helpers, and process the abuse that is happening here and what you want to do about it.
National Domestic Violence Hotline
24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365 days a year, the National Domestic Violence Hotline provides essential tools and support to help survivors of domestic violence so they can live their lives free of abuse.
www.thehotline.org
You could agree not to talk about this until your therapy appointment, so you aren't arguing or fighting at home all the time. Do not be cuddly, or "pretend" that all is well. Just be "neutral" until the appointment arrives.
I hope things get better for you, one way or another.
Galagirl
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astrosneddy
Member
I think that's right. We need to sort out consent. I've tried discussing it with her, but it's tricky to say, or for someone to accept. She did not see it that way. She thought she did have it. I mean, I cut her hair for her the night before, and things. I've given her mixed messages implicitly, as well as having given her explicit ones, so I understand why she had that view.
It's hard that she won't or didn't seem to be willing/comfortable to say she sees it from my point of view. That would probably be because it would put a real taint on one of the only nice experiences in her life right now. So I get it.
I'm pretty sure I'm going to hug her when she gets home soon, and try to be physically present with her, even if it's only that, and not sexual. I miss contact and I don't think it's provided any real help besides my holding tightly to what little control I feel I have. She should hopefully have some contact from the therapist, and we should possibly have something there to work towards.
She decided she didn't want to talk about this stuff anymore until therapy, stating similar things to me-- she feels unsafe, abused etc. I hate that she feels that way. I'm annoyed, because this happens a lot between us. We both feel the same way, that we veto one another's actions or words the same way. When I share that, because I'm trying to be open and honest, it's hard to have those feels and thoughts come back at me. It's not that I think she does it purposefully, but that is a difference we obviously have. She doesn't share like I do.
We've grown and changed so much. In the past, I could easily guess/presume on her behalf, resulting in that cute kind of empathizing telepathy, but now it's all wrong. We're both acting on what we should (in the past) be able to believe we're doing. But we're wrong now. And she's tired of it.
I'm trying to focus on my own new connections, and not worry about this one as much as I am. It feels disrespectful to her to be building new connections while this one is so raw. But everyone here has really helped me feel valid, human, heard and cared for. Thanks for that.