Life in a Vee

[inavee]

I'm writing this blog because I need help. I can't find anyone in the same position as me and I have found even fewer examples of it working out. Maybe this blog might help someone, maybe it might find someone to help find me. But I think it's important I do this.

So, where to start? I guess background is important. I'm Brai, I'm 29. I have a professional job and recently married Chello. She is 33 and also has a professional job. We met in 2014 and married in 2022.

We have an amazing life. We've travelled the world, achieved our life goals and had some super sexy times in the bed room. This blog is not safe for work. I'm sure you understand. So I'm happy to list some of the stuff we've done. Started with your normal missionary, always a good start and a classic to get going. We then branched into all the positions, of course, added in a couple vibrating toys, a pinch of restraints and kink then a light touch of candle wax fun. This then progressed, some might say weirdly, into her playing with my ass, we did a little toy, then a dildo. Before I knew it all I wanted in the world was for her to peg me. And she said yes! Wow. Amazing sex. Amazing life. Amazing woman.

One holiday, about 2019, we are having sex and I work up the courage to ask her about a fantasy idea I have been having for a couple months. After watching my favourite porn of gangbangs and threesomes I stumbled onto a new genre, hotwifing/cuckolding. So, there she is, riding me like a pro cowgirl and I pose it.

Brai: "I have a fantasy I want to do with you."
Chello: "Oh yeah? What is it?"
B: "I want a threesome with you."
C: "Hmmm... I don't want a girl in the bedroom with us."
B: "No, with another man. I want to see you pleasured and having fun with another man. I want to watch or join in."
C: "Hmm, I'll think about it."

And that was it for about 3 years. Soon after getting married I posed the question again. At first she was against it. I totally understand. Then I asked her to talk to me about fucking another man as we had sex. This persisted until finally we entered the lifestyle.

We listened to a few podcasts, (Big up Bedhoppers on Spotify), read a couple of blogs and finally met with some pretty awesome men. Some good meets, some bad. But overall very very enjoyable for all of us.

Then, dynamics started to change. I started to find a bisexual side of me I have previously never known about. We met with a brilliant man. Let's call him Jupiter. Chello and I had some really sexy meets together with him. We got on really well and Chello then started to allow me to see him solo. As of yet, the meet hasn't actually happened, but I'm sure (and hope) it will.

Concurrently though, around February (I'm now writing this in July), Chello had a meet with a man called Saturn. Now, Saturn is the subject of this blog. For all intent and purposes, Chello and Saturn and I are now in what's called a Vee relationship.

Just to clarify, in case I'm rambling.
Brai (me, male 29) is married to Chello (female, 33)
Chello is in a new loving relationship with Saturn (male lover, 33)
I have never met or am likely at this point to meet Saturn.

On top of this:
I am talking to and meeting, only for sex, no feelings, Jupiter (bi friend, 30).
And
Saturn is married to Heather (unknowing wife, 20-something), with a kid on the way. She doesn't know about any of this.

Fucking heavy, right?

I'll be writing from now on about my feelings about this relationship.

As far as I know, they had a meet in February time, which I fully endorsed and knew about. After a little chatting on Fab Swingers, then some more privately on Snapchat, they went to a park for a chat and to get to know each other better. This turned into Chello giving him head. Again, I fully knew about this and loved it.

So they chatted more and more throughout the weeks and months. And we were both quite happy. Then, one day Chello opens up that she really fancies Saturn. Now, important bit here: all she said was 'FANCY.' This got me worried. It was my one fear getting into the lifestyle. I have really bad self esteem. I wanted Chello to enjoy herself, but not to the point where she questions our relationship. I get upset, understandably, and Chello says she'll stop texting Saturn.

Fast forward a couple weeks. I see Chello is maybe missing Saturn and the chats she had with him, so I feel guilty at how I acted. I say, 'OK, fine. Talk to him again. I'm going away with work for a week. Go meet him again.'

Meets happen. They're having fun and I'm none the wiser what they're saying to each other or how their relationship is morphing (maybe she would say blossoming), until one day on a beach in Mallorca, after seeing Chello texting on her phone a lot, I get suspicious and check her messages.

Maybe it needs to be said, or maybe it doesn't. I've never checked through her phone before in our 9 years together and I never wanted to before, but something seemed off. Something was wrong.

So I go through and I click on a WhatsApp chat between her and a bull from Fab. In it, he asks:
Bull: "how's your secret lover?"
Wow! What!? Oh god. I knew straightaway who he meant. Am I a fool? Is she going to leave me? What the fuck is happening? So I confront her.

Brai: "You love Saturn, don't you ?"
Chello: "Yeah, I do. I really like him. It could be love. But I love you both. I can love more than one man. I've realised that now."
B: "Do you still want to be with me?"
C: "I love you! I love what we have and I never want to leave you. He just gives me butterflies every time we talk and I really fancy him."

We argue for the whole evening. I think about divorce, I blame myself, I feel inadequate, a loser, and can't understand how she loves us both.

And that's where we are right now, the start of July 2023. I am kind of accepting that I am now in a semi-non-consensual Vee relationship with my beautiful wife and her new boyfriend.

In my head, there are two options:
1. I stay with Chello and accept this relationship.
2. I tell her to stop texting Saturn. This will cause unrepairable resentment and we end up splitting.

 

[inavee]

So another few nights of arguing and talking, crying and saying sorry to each other.

My thought process is still the same. If I tell her to call it off she will grieve and then resent me, ultimately ending our marriage. If I carry this on and allow it to happen, then she's happy. We may keep our marriage and I get my sexual gratification I like out of it... But she may leave me for him, sooner or later.

This is the first night, as I write this, that she ever mentioned it. Finally admitting to me, and herself, I guess, there IS A CHANCE she could leave me for him. Fucking hell, that's scary, and heart wrenching.

We had a little chat on the positives of this relationship we've found ourselves in. I mean seriously, we have to find some positives, or what's the point?

My positives:
1. Her sexual fantasies are fulfilled with a good looking, big dicked, funny, outgoing man. Happy wife, happy life... right?
2. My sexual fantasies are fulfilled. I love seeing my wife being fucked by other men. I get a kick out of it. I don't like being belittled, or embarrassed about it. I'm not a cuck. (Or am I? I'll talk about that later.) But I enjoy seeing it!
3. I know she's looked after when I'm away for weeks, sometimes months at a time, with my work.
4. Our sex has become super hot and amazing lately. She wants to please both of us and she always does/has.

Her positive points:
1. Probably the same as my number one, I'm sure.
2. She said she gets butterflies in her stomach when he texts. He makes her happy! She's got a spark with him! I can see it in the texts. Texting each other all day, laughing, making calls. It's new and so so exciting for her.
3. She gets to please me by sending me pictures and videos of them fucking. In the most recent one they're fucking in a park. Then they up and moved to have sex in some changing rooms in a TK MAXX. I mean, not classy maybe, but how fucking fun and exciting is that!?
4. She has the capacity to and clearly is able to love two people equally. So why not let her?

I love my wife. But this hurts. I feel dragged into something I was terrified might happen. OK, I've changed a lot in the last 9 years with her. Maybe I can change about this, as well. But away from the sex and videos and dirty talk I tell myself a home truth:

"My wife loves another man."

And that physically makes my heart go tight and my eyes start to well up. How do I get over a visceral and destroying feeling like that so easily?
It's been a week since I found the text which started this. I feel more comfortable with the idea than I did last week. That has to count for something. right?

Going back to the cuck comment. That's something we also talked about. Chello absolutely does not want me to ever meet Saturn. In any way. Ever. She wants to love him and spend days and nights with him without having to think about me. And vice versa-- live her family life and not think about him. So we talked about a previous bull Chello had met up with. Normally I wanted to be involved with everything sex-wise, but for some reason... really unsure why, apart from I knew Chello fancied this man, I wanted to be cucked by him. I wanted to leave the house, he comes over, fucks her throughout the night and dumps his load inside her, then leave. Nothing else to do with him.
So, is this a Vee or a cuckolding relationship I've been put into?

Remember, I'm finding my bi side now. I do, like really do, want Saturn to take her somewhere nice whilst I'm at work, fuck her bareback and cum inside her gorgeous pussy. Then we both come home together and I get to lick her out. Tasting both their cum.

She's happy sexually. Saturn is happy sexually. I'm happy sexually. All good, right?

It's just this one sentence plays in my head constantly:

"My wife loves another man."

 

[kdt26417]

Hello inavee,

I do see a bit of a problem here, with Heather not knowing what is going on. This could lead to bigger problems in the future, especially if Heather discovers the truth the hard way, and that's likely to be what will happen.

Don't know if you're aware of this, but it's possible for a person to be in love with two different people at the same time. Chello could fancy Saturn without putting your relationship with Chello in danger. Just sayin'.

I'm not sure what terminology to use for your situation, it does sound like a Vee (with very separate legs -- parallel poly). I don't know whether it counts as cuckolding because, for one thing, you do not feel that you are a cuck.

Sure, your wife loves another man, but she loves you too. I mean, I can't guarantee that she wouldn't leave you for him, but that would be a monogamous type of move. In (ethical) nonmonogamy (and polyamory), nobody has to leave anyone for anyone.

Methinks you are letting your monogamous conditioning get to you. We all have monogamous conditioning, society is steeped in it all around the world. You have been taught to believe that in any "triangle" situation, it's got to be you or him. But really, that's not true. There's no reason it can't be you *and* him, unless she lets her monogamous conditioning get to her too.

Just some thoughts,
Kevin T.

 

[Magdlyn]

Hi, welcome to the board.

[mod hat] We recommend you use nicknames for your partners, instead of initials, for clarity's sake. Since your wife is C, would you like to pick out a nickname starting with C? It could be Carol, Cathy, Colette, whatever. Likewise, for S, it could be Steve, Stan, Simon, etc. The same goes for J and H. That will help your readers.

If you pick some names, I can go ahead and edit your first posts with the names.

You're having fantasies about another man ejaculating in C's vagina has me worried about whether you have all decided to have safer sex. Most people in open relationships are extremely scrupulous about frequent STD testing and the use of condoms. And the use of another birth control method would be wise if C is young enough to be fertile.

I am disturbed that S's wife is unaware that he is seeing C. He is cheating. That is not polyamory.

That said, there are plenty of poly resources out there. It seems you two got into this very unprepared. At the very least, start by reading the book Opening Up, in order to fix the mistakes you're making, avoid others, and learn more about how a person can be in love with more than one person at a time.

It's not great that you searched her phone. No one should be reading anyone else's texts without explicit permission. If I were her I'd password protect my phone. It's a courtesy to her other partner(s) as well. They deserve privacy.

I hear that you're experiencing a rollercoaster of emotions. That is real common when you are new to poly. It's exciting and fun and sexy, but also causes fear and confusion.

 

[Magdlyn]

One more thing I will comment on. Chello could leave you. You could leave her. Anyone's marriage can end in separation or divorce though, whether you're poly, mono or cheating, right? Half of all marriages end in divorce. Life is long, and sometimes we grow apart.

It's a bit paternalistic/misogynistic to dwell on the idea that Chello might leave you "for another man," though, as if she has no mind or independence, and can only be passed from the ownership of one man to another.

That's a general thought.

The other issue us, Saturn is cheating. His poor wife is even pregnant! It is really unethical of him to be cheating on his wife Heather when she is in such a vulnerable position. I'd bring this up with Chello.

Is Saturn really likely to abandon his pregnant wife and take up monogamously with Chello? I highly doubt it. And it would be a shit move if he did, wouldn't it?

This mess bears discussion.

 

[inavee]

Hi, welcome to the board.

[mod hat] We recommend you use nicknames for your partners, instead of initials, for clarity's sake. Since your wife is C, would you like to pick out a nickname starting with C? It could be Carol, Cathy, Colette, whatever. Likewise, for S, it could be Steve, Stan, Simon, etc. The same goes for J and H. That will help your readers.

If you pick some names, I can go ahead and edit your first posts with the names.

You're having fantasies about another man ejaculating in C's vagina has me worried about whether you have all decided to have safer sex. Most people in open relationships are extremely scrupulous about frequent STD testing and the use of condoms. And the use of another birth control method would be wise if C is young enough to be fertile.

I am disturbed that S's wife is unaware that he is seeing C. He is cheating. That is not polyamory.

That said, there are plenty of poly resources out there. It seems you two got into this very unprepared. At the very least, start by reading the book Opening Up, in order to fix the mistakes you're making, avoid others, and learn more about how a person can be in love with more than one person at a time.

It's not great that you searched her phone. No one should be reading anyone else's texts without explicit permission. If I were her I'd password protect my phone. It's a courtesy to her other partner(s) as well. They deserve privacy.

I hear that you're experiencing a rollercoaster of emotions. That is real common when you are new to poly. It's exciting and fun and sexy, but also causes fear and confusion.

Thankyou for offering to change the names. If you think that will help that's very kind of you.

B - Brai
C - Chello
S - Saturn
H - Heather
J - Jupiter

We all regular test for std. Actually we did one today as well so we aren't worried about that. But it's a very very fair comment.

Thankyou for recommending the Opening Up book. It also led me to a lot of other helpful books and sites.

As for the phone. You're right. I shouldn't of. However if I didn't I wouldn't of known. She'd be having essentially an affair as I would see it and we wouldn't be able to progress in any direction. Ignorance is bliss sometimes. And I don't want to be a husband that does that type of thing. But I'm hurting, I don't trust her now too well about S (saturn) and I'm scared. We've agreed to me checking her phone in the same way she checks mine. However I'm still seeing deleted messages between them two before I check. Is this not suspicious? I deserve some full open honesty as a husband. Which I'm still not getting.

 

[inavee]

One more thing I will comment on. Your wife could leave you. You could leave her. Anyone's marriage can end in separation or divorce though, whether you're poly, mono or cheating, right? Half of all marriages end in divorce. Life is long, and sometimes we grow apart.

It's a bit paternalistic/misogynistic to dwell on the idea that C might leave you "for another man," though, as if she has no mind or independence, and can only be passed from the ownership of one man to another.

That's a general thought.

The other issue us, S is cheating. His poor wife is even pregnant! It is really unethical of him to be cheating on his wife H when she is in such a vulnerable position. I'd bring this up with C.

Is S really likely to abandon his pregnant wife and take up monogamously with C? I highly doubt it. And it would be a shit move if he did, wouldn't it?

This mess bears discussion.

About S (saturn) and his cheating. Fully agree. Absolutely. I think his actions are scummy and really horrible. After recently seeing what my wife went through during child birth only 7 months a go, I think he's a total prick (to put it bluntly)...but...Chello loves him. How can I convince her otherwise ? Is it my place to ?

Allow me to make mistakes with this lifestyle and how I'm acting. Yes, I'm scared, angry, confused but i love my wife and family. And don't want to lose them.

Your points are really helpful, Chello and I have just read it together and will definitely talk them through. Thankyou for your comments.

 

[Evie]

Merged Thread: 7 July 2023

I've had the parents around last night and today. Made a real good go at happy families. However, I still physically hurt when I think of the situation I'm in. I check her phone regularly to dispel any fears she's about to leave me and I still don't quite trust her with what she says.

Brai: Have you spoken to S today?
Chello: "No, we aren't talking at all over this weekend while your parents are here."
Brai: "OK, that's really nice of you to do"

I check her phone when she's in the shower and she texted him first thing this morning after I had gone to work. But she did remind him to not text when my parents arrived.....so is she lying or just bending the truth slightly? I don't know what to think.

I asked for a cheesecake for pudding. Not that I demand stuff from her. It was just I made it clear that would be really nice. She made a key lime pie....why ? Because Saturn was making one and they were doing it together. So, in my house, our house, I guess I should say, she's only thinking about him. Fuck. I'm rambling and I feel I'm about to cry. About fucking cheesecake! Maybe I need to rest and try write this later.

 

[inavee]

09july2023

After more arguments we've finally made a decision. Chello is going to split up with Saturn. I'm so happy about it but now I see her grieve over him and it gives me such conflicting feelings. My wife is upset, so so upset and I hate to see that. But also, she's upset because she has to break up with someone who isn't her loving husband who's stood by her side through so much. What is he really?...to me, he's a cheat. He's a lying, cheating, family breaking, narcissistic prick who gets to waltz back to his loving wife like nothing has happened whilst Chello and I pick up the fucking pieces of our marriage.

We've also decided we 100% both want and need marriage counselling. I'm looking forward to it personally. I feel devoid of feeling right now and I need a expert to help me find the words.

We had a chat about managing expectations in bed this morning. Do I think she will text him again...yes. Do I think she needs to see him in person again to get some closure...yes. do I think we will be back to normal again after this....no. But I just hope we learn and progress into something much better.

 

[Magdlyn]

9 July, 2023

After more arguments we've finally made a decision. Chello is going to split up with Saturn. I'm so happy about it, but now I see her grieve over him and it gives me such conflicting feelings.

She broke up with him because he's cheating on Heather, I assume?

I'm sorry you're feeling numb. It can be hard to feel your feelings, especially for men. And you might actually be in a bit of shock over the whole overwhelming thing. It's a lot. Your mind may be protecting itself and taking a break from the rollercoaster, and that's OK.

I don't think this needs to be the end of exploring poly, or cucking, or the end of you exploring your bisexual feelings. Chello made the mistake of becoming infatuated with a cheater. (In my opinion, there's a difference between "fancying" someone, being infatuated, butterflies, NRE-- and real deep love that comes with time and trust and true compatibility.) Hopefully if you two spend some time healing and then move forward, you (plural) can get involved with men who are also ethical and not lying cheaters.

Chello is upset, so so upset, and I hate to see that. But also, she's upset because she has to break up with someone who isn't her loving husband who's stood by her side through so much. What is he really?... To me, he's a cheat. He's a lying, cheating, family breaking, narcissistic prick who gets to waltz back to his loving wife like nothing has happened, whilst Chello and I pick up the fucking pieces of our marriage.

Yeah, well, it's OK to be pissed at him, but eventually his role, his life, his marriage will be meaningless to you. It will just be a life lesson (for both of you, and for those who read this thread) about making better choices about to whom you give your heart and trust and vulnerability.

We've also decided we 100% both want and need marriage counselling. I'm looking forward to it personally. I feel devoid of feeling right now and I need a expert to help me find the words.

Good.

We had a chat about managing expectations. Do I think she will text him again?...yes. Do I think she needs to see him in person again to get some closure?...yes.

She doesn't necessarily "need" to chat with him again, in text or in person, to get closure. If he is on the narcissistic side, he might try to reel her back in, causing more trauma. (This happened to me once, and it was ugly and even scary, with a possibility of actual physical harm to me. I felt lucky to have escaped that's guy's narc rage. ... Just a heads-up.)

Do I think we will be back to normal again after this?....no. But I just hope we learn and progress into something much better.

Right. There's no closing the barn door after the horse is out. I trust you two will find a rich and rewarding "new normal" eventually!