Need help understanding something (triads and Vs)

J

jlpanian

New member
Okay, here's a short bio on us, to set the stage for my question.

My wife and I are very interested in polyamory. She brought it up to me, and it couldn't have been a more perfect conversation. We are young and considering moving in this direction while we are still young, so we can build a life together (three of us).

My questions revolves around seeking. It seems plainly obvious that there are so many more people seeking a "third," than "thirds" actually looking for a couple. But I found a lot of information about this unicorn or bisexual female looking to join a couple. I understand that this is what a lot of couples are looking for.

Here's where I need some help.

We are NOT looking for a bisexual female. My wife and I are both heterosexual, and more so looking for a woman as a best friend for both of us. Obviously, my wife and I are not blind to the fact that there would be normal intimacy between me and our new wife. But the primary urge for us is the concept of a bigger better family unit.

Are there any individuals that want this sort of connection? Or is it primarily couples wanting a bisexual member to address a sexual need?
 
jlpanian said:
Are there any individuals that want this sort of connection? Or is it primarily couples wanting a bisexual member to address a sexual need?
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No, you are not unusual. I am in a vee with two men and also have a girlfriend. We are all really close and good friends. I consider them my closest friends, as well as my loves. I know my husband PN's best friend is my bf Mono. Well, sort of best friend... certainly the closest. PN and I searched for a long time and worked hard to make this vision of a big chosen family come true. We are still working on it and always will. It was the goal of our marriage to live with other loves and create a big family to give and get support, and raise kids together. We are slowly doing that.

A couple looking for a bisexual female to satisfy their sexual needs is not necessarily polyamory, if it is all about the sex. Usually unicorn hunters are looking for someone that they would love and be loved by evenly, in a poly-fidelitous situation, whereby the unicorn would be dedicated just to them. Some people start out searching for this and find it. More commonly, it either isn't findable or it doesn't last. It can turn into a V situation, or die out quickly. When I say it doesn't last, I mean that everyone lives happily ever after for years and years. The longest ones I know of have lasted about 4 months. That doesn't mean there are not others lasting somewhat longer.
 
Redpepper, I can do better than that. We met up with a triad who have been together for 4 years and living together for that long. Admittedly it was their second go at it. (I actually got them to join this forum and he posted a post or two, but they are more active locally.) They are older (late thirties to early fifties) and children haven't been an issue. But this is the standard bisexual female relationship with one guy.

jlpanian, there is a partial example of what you're talking about on here. Check out the Blog of a Mono Wife in the Blog section. They have two couples, but it strikes me as a similar situation to what you're talking about.

Generally though, if you aren't dealing with bisexual women, then you're a guy with two "wives," which is polygamy. Or are you going to be fine with it if this hypothetical women has other intimate relationships?
 
The one thing that stood out to me immediately was "new wife." Interesting timing, considering the premiere of Sister Wives this past weekend. Was it a Freudian slip by chance, or are you looking to take a new wife? That point defines whether or not you are seeking polyamory or polygamy.
 
I have to first say that after I posted, I found and read your Glossary. I wish I would have read that first, because although you think you have an idea of what it all is, there are so many different views.

I guess I am completely defined as a "polywog virgin." Being totally new to this whole idea, and never having experienced it personally, it's hard to say what you really want. I think that would develop as you went through it.

We have an ideal vision. It's nothing we've ever acted upon, because we thought it was pretty much unattainable. It's embarrassing, but when we saw the show Sister Wives, we both looked at each other, and realized that there are other people who are actually living a "poly lifestyle." Now, Sister Wives is not our real vision, but it was what prompted us to go out and seek advice and the friendship of other like-minded people.

It's embarrassing, because it shouldn't take a television show to make you act on something. But I guess it is what it is.

To respond to the "wife" comment, I said wife because I don't know how to describe that "other" person in one word. I guess I said wife because I have a wife whom I love, and it would be great to spend time with another woman like that.

Is polygamy frowned upon in an open poly-type community? I ask because I have no idea what the reality of what were looking for is.

If it ever came to fruition, would I be okay with her in a open relationship with others? I cannot answer. I guess those feelings would define if were looking for a polygamy relationship vs a polyamory relationship.

As you can tell, this is all in its infancy for us. I wanted to thank you all for being open and honest, not judgmental or negative! You have all been great, and are paving a very welcoming path for others to follow.

Thank you,
JP
 
Polygamy isn't bad, necessarily. It's when the rights of women and children are not accounted for that it is frowned upon. Also, actual plural marriage is illegal.

Perhaps you are looking for a harem, where you would be the only male, in a "one-penis policy" (OPP) situation.

It depends on what you think would be okay with you in regards to "your" women seeking out other lovers. Would you be okay that or not? Would you insist on them not finding and creating other relationships? Or would you work on how that would affect you? What does your wife want and need out of all this? What's in it for her?

Lots of questions for the two of you. Keep asking and talking honestly and respectfully. You've made a good first step, it seems.
 
Breathes is my primary. Possibility is my secondary, and I'm his tertiary. Breathes and Possibility, as well as the rest of Possibility's family, get along wonderfully. I get along great with his family, as well.

When we started our polyamorous relationship, Breathes and I had a vision of what it would be like. We were typical unicorn hunters. We wanted a bisexual female who would be submissive to both of us, could deal with my having kids, still have our own residences, etc., etc. But we are a very long way from where we thought we would be by this time five years ago.

The one thing I've learned is that you shouldn't be super set on what you're seeking. Be flexible with it. Something which is more suited for you might just pass you by because you were so fixated on what you thought was your ideal.

I've learned something else, as well-- you can never really have too much communication.
 
Breathesgirl,

Thank you for your reply. I think I can understand what you're saying. I know that I have this picture of a great family that works fabulously and everyone is happy together, etc. The real world usually has a couple of hiccups along the way, and I can imagine polyamory does too.

I think your advice about keeping an open mind, and not being completely fixated on one outcome is very useful.

We will be telling our parents (mostly very conservative people), about our desire to move forward with this type of family change. We hope it goes well, but are preparing for the worst. It's important for us to include our family in this process, because they mean so much to us. Their input and feelings will have value, so wish us luck!

Thanks,
JP
 
Have you read any of the posts about people coming out as poly, Jlpanian? I'm all for doing so, but it can be a rough ride. Might help to read up a bit first.

It will probably help that it's still theoretical. You're asking them to deal with a concept, not a concept + a person.

I have no experience coming out myself (yet!), but I do have lots of expertise dealing with angry people around other subjects, especially family members! For me, the key things to remember are to make a big effort to stay calm when attacked; to wait silently to respond until there is quiet, no matter how long it takes, then to quietly state that I'm here to talk about something, not to be attacked. I rinse and repeat as necessary, and stay prepared to leave if the attacks keep coming, or if I'm in danger of losing my cool completely. Words have much more weight if the speaker stays in control.

Hmm, I guess that was unsolicited advice... not to mention that just because it's what works for me, doesn't mean it will work for you.
 
That is exactly what and why we did it now. Because these people are so important to us, it was important to try and gauge their feelings on the concept level, instead of breaking the news of a real person addition.

I must say it went very well. The outcome was basically that they loved us either way, and that if this would make us happy, they would do everything they could to accept it for what it is.

They gave some advice, everything we have already been thinking about, like communication, going slow, etc.

I must say it was a huge relief to bring my parents into the fold. I have always known that my parents were huge fans of us kids, and it's pretty apparent that they will support and love us no matter what. I hope this is the groundwork for a great series of events to come.

Thanks for all your support here on the boards, and great advice.
 
Anotherbo, I know! I was so relieved to hear my parents' support of the idea. It's one less thing to worry about.

Thanks again for the support. It means a lot.
 
What exactly did you tell them, that you are looking for a harem and going to have a one-penis policy? Geez, they are accepting! :p
 
redpepper said:
What exactly did you tell them, that you are looking for a harem and going to have a one-penis policy? Geez, they are accepting! :p
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Ha! Redpepper, I enjoy your feedback. I did not say those exact words, but the summarization of them pretty closely. My mother was mostly concerned with my wife. At first she assumed that I was the one spearheading the initiative. My mother was very concerned to make sure that my wife was not getting taken advantage of. It took some reassuring, but in the end she felt comfortable that it was something we both were looking for.

It's funny because everyone that I've talked to assumes that because I am the male, that it must be me brainwashing my wife into wanting something like this. Most don't believe that my wife is the one who came to me with the idea. I guess some woman (like most of us) are wired differently than others. Probably why this forum exists.
 
So you are looking into a relationship in which you would be polyamorous, and your wives would all be monogamous, is that it? While it can definitely work, there is the chance that the women you would meet in our circles would be poly too, and not willing to be mono. Or mono, but already with someone (which brought them here in the first place). Still, good luck in your quest :)

I think the main difference between polyamory and polygamy is the law. Polyamory is only about the relationships; polygamy is about marriages. From that, you're dealing with some legal problems, as it's illegal. In your case, it would be polygyny, which is even more frowned upon, as people assume the women are forced into it. There are cults where underage girls are forced into plural marriage and pregnancy against their will.

In my case, if I said I had two "husbands," people would be less likely to assume I was forcing them (especially when they both happen to be 6'6" :p). Then, if they talked with me more, they'd learn that my partners were polyamorous too, so while they're only in a relationship with me currently, the door is open to them having other partners, as well.

Ideally, we will all live together at some point, although these things can be tricky, of course.

I think because your situation is so close to the type that often takes advantage of women, especially very young ones (i.e., children), it would be a bit harder for you. People would be more judgmental, and there are even legal risks. I hear even being married to just one person makes it illegal to live with another one as your spouse, even without a legal union.

But I also think shows like Sister Wives actually can show people that this type of situation exists between loving, consensual adults. And the more you hide, the less people will know it exists.

Either way, I wish you a lot of luck.
 
I hear you on that front, which is why it's hard for me to even associate what were looking for with that frowned-upon lifestyle. It's not about religion, it's not about getting hooked up with young women/underage girls, it's not even about the sex.

It's hard to say, but since I know you guys know what it's like to want to share yourselves with more than one person, you understand that part. To answer why my wife wants to share me with another woman, but does not want that herself, I do not know. I just know that it was a new idea to me, and I find solace in talking to others that can at least understand where these feelings are coming from.

Thanks for the luck. I'm sure we'll need it.
 
jlpanian, I wonder if you've been reading at polygamy forums. Also, has your wife read anything here? Perhaps she would also find it interesting. Besides, I would love to hear what she has to say about it all. I find it difficult to understand what she would see as the advantage, knowing my husband's struggles to have enough time with me.
 
redpepper said:
I wonder if you've been reading at polygamy forums. Also, has your wife read anything here? Perhaps she would also find it interesting. Besides, I would love to hear what she has to say about it all. I find it difficult to understand what she would see as the advantage, knowing my husband's struggles to have enough time with me.
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I have read a lot of different posts on here. I am not sure if they are the ones you reference now. I did take you up and research a little on the OPP. I will try and see if I can click on your name and see all your posts to find them. Are these posts here, or on other sites?

My wife has read some of these posts, but has not created her own account.

I wish could spend 10 minutes inside my wife's head; it would be unbelievable. I think she likes the idea of community, something like, "It takes a village to raise a child" concept, that we would all be better served emotionally, physically, etc., having a bigger family. I know my wife wants more children, but does not want to deliver anymore herself. She has such a huge heart, and I know without a doubt the capacity to emotionally love more. We have also discussed that another woman with similar caring/nurturing characteristics would fit in well with what we have already. It's hard to explain, but something like 1+1+1 = 4, the sum of the parts together exceeding the sum of the parts individually.

On a more sexual note, my wife has expressed that she feels more connected to me sexually when she thinks about me with another woman. This I cannot explain, as it would have the opposite effect on me (in reverse). But I appreciate her honesty and trust her feelings as true. It's also nice to see that we are even more connected now (and were only researching the idea).
 
I don't mean polyamory sites, like this one. I mean polygamy sites. I was wondering if you had done any reading on them, if there even are any.

jlpanian said:
We have also discussed that another woman with similar caring/nurturing characteristics would fit in well with what we have already.
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I would be very careful how you view this. This woman wouldn't be coming in to your relationship and fitting in. She would be her own woman and would change everything you know about your wife, yourself and the relationship you have right now. It will all change. It will be a relationship of the three of you, not two. In this way, a triad is created around emotions and needs and general everyday life stuff. Be careful that you don't see this new woman as a puppy dog that you will train, and have expectations of, and assumptions about how she should be. She won't be what you want her to be, she will be herself, and will struggle to make the transition, as you both will. You will all experience "growing pains."

It sounds like you have kids. I am going to assume that you have more than one. She will be like bringing an adopted adult home, only she will be free to come and go and do as she pleases. There is no control, no way that she will sit on the couch and just be.

I think this is where more reading about unicorns might be helpful. Quite often couples seem to get stuck on the idea that a new person in their life will create a mind meld between everyone. Actually, more people added creates more independent thought, because it is virtually impossible to have a mind meld with more than two for any length of time. People who are mind melded and looking for another can't seem to grasp sometimes that they will be forced to become independent from one another, or end the relationship(s) if its too uncomfortable.

Some people love the mind-meld thing. Quite often they are are monogamous. Go monogamy. It's a great feeling to mind meld during NRE, but that doesn't really last in polyamory. In mono relationships it can last a lifetime.
 
What you are looking for does not have to be "polygamy," depending on the spiritual commitment and relationship dynamics of everyone involved.

One question which comes to mind-- would you be open to a girlfriend who would also have the option of having another lover, other than yourself?
 
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