Unconsciously primary/secondary?

[Valynn]

As you should. Maintaining a healthy skepticism is a good thing.



That's the part I am talking about. You do not stink. It doesn't have to be a shock that people want to date you.

What do you need from you to be ok with that? That you ARE lovable? You have value?

Because your value is an inside job. If you go looking for validation from others around you, like an outside job? You will be left vulnerable to whatever smooth talking smoothie comes along telling your whatever to get in your pants or love bomb you or whatever.

So DO keep a healthy skepticism.

DO remember it's just dating, and in theory, people put their best face out in the early days. This is just 2 months in.

You ARE in the relationship. Participate, speak up. Do the business of dating and getting to know each other. Speak up if people step on your toes. Say "No, thank you. Back up, please!"

Expect people to respect your boundaries. Then step back and see if behavior changes. If they accidentally hurt you once. Alright. They did not know. You make them aware. People are not mind readers. But if they keep ON dinging you after you request they cut it out?

If they keep on dinging you? And this is all they have to offer you for BEST behavior? Pshaw.

Your boundaries are not for them to obey. They are for YOU to obey. And if you have a boundary that says "I don't stick around when people treat me crap" then you know what to do. Here comes some crap? You ask for correction? Still crap? Well... Adios!

Decide from the INSIDE that you deserve to be treated well now, you already clocked your time on bad relationships in the past, and don't feel like doing that again. And YOU decide to walk away.

Don't be all walking on eggshells like "Do I deserve to be in this relationship?" You do not have to "earn" good treatment or "earn" basic polite. It's basics!

DO get therapy when you can afford it to help heal the past abuse stuff.

But for today? Decide you don't need more new shit. If she doesn't meet YOUR personal standard? Shoo.

You can do that. YOU get to decide who is worthy of your valuable time and attention, because you have inherent worth and dignity. You don't have to be shrinking yourself here.

Galagirl

I have alot to go on. TY!

Before we got into this Anglea asked me what I wanted in a relationship, at the time she was contemplating setting me up with a friend of their's.

I said I wanted to be cherished by a stable person (mentally & financially) that understands that I am independent and will not stand for any shit. I refuse to go back to where I was. Been there, done that. I want respect & won't deal with anything less.

I just have to remind Angela of that fact. And shake the NRE's out of my head.

 

[FallenAngelina]

My own insecurities make me question everything in a romantic relationship. We have only been a triad for going on 2 months. I plan on having a conversation on this so it will hopefully not be an issue in the future.

A conversation doesn't make insecurities go away, much as we worship at the alter of the almighty Communication around here. Feeling insecure is something that only you can do something about. Asking for security and better treatment is a band aid. Try it. The effects might give you a rush of security, but they won't be enduring. Emotional security and feeling respected ALWAYS come from within.

 

[Valynn]

A conversation doesn't make insecurities go away, much as we worship at the alter of the almighty Communication around here. Feeling insecure is something that only you can do something about. Asking for security and better treatment is a band aid. Try it. The effects might give you a rush of security, but they won't be enduring. Emotional security and feeling respected ALWAYS come from within.

Ok, I will have the conversation and work on myself too. So at least on my part things can change for the better, hopefully.

 

[FallenAngelina]

So at least on my part things can change for the better, hopefully.

It's my life's devotion to emulate and spread the word that we can always change in huge ways to create a life that we love. Nobody is beyond the ability to make changes that lead to a really, really good life, BUT it must be the individual who does the work. Our relationships are reflections of our insides. They show us what we've got going on in there, they can never change it. The only way to change our experience with others is to work on changing our inner lives. Communication with others is just more of the same claptrap unless it comes from new places within us.

 

[Valynn]

It's my life's devotion to emulate and spread the word that we can always change in huge ways to create a life that we love. Nobody is beyond the ability to make changes that lead to a really, really good life, BUT it must be the individual who does the work. Our relationships are reflections of our insides. They show us what we've got going on in there, they can never change it. The only way to change our experience with others is to work on changing our inner lives. Communication with others is just more of the same claptrap unless it comes from new places within us.

TY for your council. I will keep it in mind every time a conversation arises, whether it be in my poly relationships or any other relationships.

 

[GalaGirl]

I said I wanted to be cherished by a stable person (mentally & financially) that understands that I am independent and will not stand for any shit. I refuse to go back to where I was. Been there, done that. I want respect & won't deal with anything less.

I just have to remind Angela of that fact. And shake the NRE's out of my head.

There you go. You know what to do. Speak your truth. Honor and respect YOUR values and what YOU want from this relationship / from Life.

You only get the one Life. It's not a dress rehearsal.

Shake the NRE's out of your head and honest with Angela if/when she is stepping on your toes. Engage. Participate in this relationship. DO the business of dating. Stop being all... hanging back wallflower whatever.

If she cannot take honest communication from you? Maybe you guys just aren't the right fit. It happens.

You guys will either pan out or not pan out. Some people don't make the cut to "initially compatible." And from those, they won't all make the cut to "deeply compatible."

Such is life. Not everyone you date is going to be a long haul runner!

But don't make the dating process harder than it needs to be by not engaging and not being honest. Speak your truth. If even at a whisper.

Galagirl

 

[Valynn]

Update: Some good, some bad. Long read, sorry.

The good

Ok, I was finally able to sit down with Angela and voice my issues with the way she talks and how she will demand things be done. She tells me that it's her anxiety & jealousy getting the best of her. She kept saying that:

"I know I shouldn't be feeling as jealous as I am, but I can't seem to help it."

I told her my Nana had a great saying for feelings like this "Feelings are neither right nor wrong. They are just there." I take that as there is nothing to be done but feel feelings. No more, no less.
She also tells me that she doesn't feel like she is truly polyamorous. In her relationship experience she had threesomes with her parters cause they wanted it, not that she did. She feels more like a monogamous bi woman. And she was afraid to tell me this cause she didn't want me to break things off cause she felt that she had lied by allowing JR & myself to keep thinking she was poly.

She also suggested I ask JR for a key to their apartment. So if I was going to a meeting with my medieval group at night she could lock the apartment door and not worry about me getting in, as JR works weeknights.

She loves both JR & I, but not to the same degree. I told her that is understandable due to her history with JR. I also said that her & I have quite some transformation to do, if ever. From close friendship into a sexual, loving relationship can be a difficult transition. And one that won't happen overnight. No matter how much we might like it to do so.
And while we were snuggling together with JR later in that day she began to cry saying that she needs to know that we are all committed to one another. And I asked her if she was asking for a closed triad & a promise to be committed to one another she looked relieved an said yes. I had even mentioned having a handfasting ceremony as a spiritual and social commitment for all of us, in the future. She thought it was a wonderful idea.

The bad
Angela hasn't gotten the green light to resume regular relations with JR after her surgery. And JR & I have very high sex drives. So this weekend (smack dab bewtween JR & my birthdays) we were all about all three of us playing & having fun. On Saturday evening after saying she was not feeling well and still had projects to finish (we all had to be up early to pack to go to a Mother's day pop up shop her & I were vending at. I make & sell soap, she handpaints clothing & makes jewelry). But she had told us that we (JR & I) should go to bed and have fun but not have sex. JR & I got each other off (I am loud when I orgasm) but we did not have sex. Her definition of having sex is different than JR's & mine. So she had a reason to be upset. And yes we both know it's all sex whether we are having oral or penetrative sex. We were not arguing semantics about it.

As we are lying there in the afterglow Angela knocks on the door and tells us that even though she is not feeling well she still felt jealous & left out. She then drops a doozy on us.

She doesn't want us to have sex at all without her being there.

Even after all these breakthroughs and understanding on my part, she is still making demands and trying to control us! I felt like she had just punched me in the solar plexus. Trying to work through this and not make it worse I asked her where was this coming from. She then told us that she couldn't understand why we wanted to have sex so many times. And that every time we did it would cut into the time she had alloted for product making. Making her feel we didn't want or need her there in the first place. Which we told her was not our intention at all. We both agreed as we felt we really had no other choice in the matter. Angela had decided and that was it.

So now what?

I am at a loss to try and work through this. She continues to do things that that hurt me. And I have already explained to her why they hurt. She wants us all to be equal in the committed closed triad then if/when she gets hurt or her anxiety gets too much she will become jealous and impose unfair demands on JR & I.
I love her and want this to work, but I can't if she continues this way. All I can do is keep telling how much she hurts me with her demands on my relationship with JR. And if it continues then we will become a V instead of the triad she so wants.

 

[GalaGirl]

I mean this kindly, ok?

This is a lot of drama for only 1 month in. It's supposed to be the NRE lalas time where all is bliss. If there is THIS much hassle? Maybe it's not worth it? Esp when there's been a lack of fundamental honesty from the start.

"I know I shouldn't be feeling as jealous as I am, but I can't seem to help it."

To me feelings ensue after behavior. She's monogamous, but does stuff she doesn't really want in relationships (group sex, poly things, etc). So then she feels bad as a result of doing those behaviors (jealousy, upset, etc)

To stop feeling crap? She could change her behaviors. STOP floating along in life and live more authentic to her values. See if BETTER feelings ensue.

I do not know why she does not do that. But YOU have choices here in light of new information.

She also tells me that she doesn't feel like she is truly polyamorous. In her relationship experience she had threesomes with her parters cause they wanted it, not that she did. She feels more like a monogamous bi woman. And she was afraid to tell me this cause she didn't want me to break things off cause she felt that she had lied by allowing JR & myself to keep thinking she was poly.

She DID lie. She was floating along with stuff rather than speaking HER truth and honoring what SHE values.

• She does group sex/this triad thing even though she doesn't want that.
  
• She lied about being poly because... she didn't want JR to dump her?
  
• And now watching JR be all NRE lala about you makes her feel left out? Devalued? Something?

Is that about it? Then she's responsible for herself. Could have told JR "I am monogamous. JR, if you want to poly now, I cannot stop you. But I'm not going there. I don't want that for myself. So we must part ways."

And now you all are in a mess now because all the people weren't laying their cards on the table PLAIN and being honest. Sigh.

You got offered (poly triad) when really it was more like (wonky and not really triad). Now that you know what the offer on the table REALLY is? You do not have to continue to accept this dating offer.

She also suggested I ask JR for a key to their apartment. So if I was going to a meeting with my medieval group at night she could lock the apartment door and not worry about me getting in, as JR works weeknights.

I would politely decline that at this time. You might want space to think rather than rush to get MORE entangled with this wonky sounding couple.

She loves both JR & I, but not to the same degree. I told her that is understandable due to her history with JR. I also said that her & I have quite some transformation to do, if ever. From close friendship into a sexual, loving relationship can be a difficult transition. And one that won't happen overnight. No matter how much we might like it to do so.

Or won't happen EVER. If she just doesn't like poly things? She only wants to be in monogamous shape relationships that have only 2 people in it?

What are you all doing in a 3 people thing? I don't know why she can't keep herself from being in shapes that don't actually suit her.

But YOU know it now. Which means you and her are NOT going to work out in a poly thing. She doesn't want or like poly shape things. She wants monogamous shape things.

So YOU could end it so all of you can quit banging heads on wall and the suffering can end. Sometimes that is the most loving thing one can do.

And I asked her if she was asking for a closed triad & a promise to be committed to one another she looked relieved an said yes.

Do YOU want this? Does J? Or is this more "propping her emotions up" stuff so she stops having meltdowns? (Closed triad) is not (monogamy). Rushing into triad ceremonies won't fix rushing into a triad when one of the people really wants to be monogamous.

Solve the real problems. Not just slap bandaids on to hide it.

As we are lying there in the afterglow Angela knocks on the door and tells us that even though she is not feeling well she still felt jealous & left out. She then drops a doozy on us.

She doesn't want us to have sex at all without her being there.

And you can say "No, thank you. Will not be honoring that request" and move on to talking about the bigger picture problem.

I could be wrong. But you keep getting stuck on not seeing the forest for the trees.

Why is she the body police? You cannot masturbate unless she's there with you? You cannot share sex with hinge unless she's there with you? You cannot take a poo unless she's there with you? What does patrolling your body solve for her? Can it be solved another way? NO. I don't think so if ultimately she wants to be in a monogamous thing. She doesn't WANT to share JR as a lover. That's the bigger picture problem.

Could stop talking about her controlling your body (trees) and ACTUALLY have the bigger picture conversation you skipped having at the beginning about her being monogamous and not actually ok with participating in poly. (forest).

I think you guys could end this triad thing NOW. Then decide what it is. Is it (them continuing monogamous) or (you and JR continuing in a poly thing) or (everyone single now) or what?

Even after all these breakthroughs and understanding on my part, she is still making demands and trying to control us! I felt like she had just punched me in the solar plexus.

She's TOLD you she is monogamous. You see her trying to bend herself into pretzels and struggling. If she doesn't have the sense to come in out of the rain?

Could be YOU. Call it what it is (NOT WORKING) and quit banging heads on wall. End it.

Trying to work through this and not make it worse I asked her where was this coming from. She then told us that she couldn't understand why we wanted to have sex so many times. And that every time we did it would cut into the time she had alloted for product making. Making her feel we didn't want or need her there in the first place.Which we told her was not our intention at all. We both agreed as we felt we really had no other choice in the matter. Angela had decided and that was it.

So now what?

Her feelings are HER responsibility. Not yours. If you guys really COULD "make her feel things" you could wave a magic wand and POOF! There. You made her happy. Problems over.

You have to stop letting her emotional struggles dictate your choices. Make your OWN choices.

YOU could decide to come in out of the rain and address the elephant in the room once and for all. This triad thing is not gonna work because she is monogamous. She wasn't honest about that at the start, it's clearly starting to implode now because she's struggling big time and acting out at the others, and letting her go on and on like that is not kind.

So it's a deal breaker. Break up the triad. Decide where the chips land now.

I am at a loss to try and work through this. She continues to do things that that hurt me. And I have already explained to her why they hurt. She wants us all to be equal in the committed closed triad then if/when she gets hurt or her anxiety gets too much she will become jealous and impose unfair demands on JR & I.

Behavior has to change here somewhere in order for new results to have a chance to happen. Otherwise it is just same ol' song, different day.

You have explained. She continues to ding and flap about. Now you know why -- she really doesn't want to be doing this.

So STOP doing the triad.

I love her and want this to work, but I can't if she continues this way.

Love alone is not enough for deep compatibility. There has to be other things in a relationship to keep it healthy and sustainable.

If you love her? See her struggle? Do the loving thing and end it.

Sort out if it is everyone single or they will continue as a couple monogamously or you and JR will continue doing poly or what. Stop doing THIS. The wonky triad thing is not working.

All I can do is keep telling how much she hurts me with her demands on my relationship with JR. And if it continues then we will become a V instead of the triad she so wants.

No. Not all you can do.

I believe in second chances. But it's not going to be 20, 200, 2000, 20,000 of them right? You only get the one life!

And sometimes it's a not a runner from the start. There's 0 chances. If she is monogamous? Then that is a fundamental incompatibility. It's not something to compromise on. It's a basic foundational values thing.

She doesn't sound both WILLING and ABLE to triad because she actually wants monogamy.

Hinge might be WILLING to triad, but not entirely ABLE if one of his partners wants monogamy.

And you might be WILLING to triad.... but if you keep letting this slide? You know she's monogamous and doesn't have the sense to stop? Continuing it is YOU being cruel.

If it is just same old song different day? They are willing to carry on wonky like this? YOU don't have to be. You may have to simply walk away in order for better feelings to ensue at least for just YOU. Endless banging head on wall? I do not suggest doing that.

I can imagine this is difficult to feel and process. But if the kite just won't fly? Stop trying to fly it.

There is nothing wrong with either wanting monogamy or wanting polyamory. There IS something wrong with trying to be something you are not and not being honest with partners from the beginning.

If you got offered (poly triad) when really it was more like (wonky and not really triad)? YOU can decide you deserve a way better offer and walk away from this mess.


Galagirl

 

[Valynn]

I mean this kindly, ok?

This is a lot of drama for only 1 month in. It's supposed to be the NRE lalas time where all is bliss. If there is THIS much hassle? Maybe it's not worth it? Esp when there's been a lack of fundamental honesty from the start:



She DID lie. She was floating along with stuff rather than speaking HER truth and honoring what SHE values.

• She does group sex in her relationships even though she doesn't want it.
  
• She is floating along with this triad thing even though she doesn't want that.
  
• She lied about being poly because... she didn't want JR to dump her?
  
• And now watching JR be all NRE lala about you makes her feel left out?

Is that about it? Then she's responsible for herself. Could have told JR "I am monogamous. JR, if you want to poly now, I cannot stop you. But I'm not going there. I don't want that for myself. So we must part ways."

And now you all are in a mess now because all the people weren't laying their cards on the table PLAIN and being honest. Sigh.

I know you mean this all kindly. And you have gotten everything spot on as usual.

I would politely decline that at this time. You might want space to think rather than rush to get MORE entangled with this wonky sounding couple.

What I hadn't known is they had been having problems for 2yrs before this even began. They both have been telling me that I "Brought a positive light into the relationship."

Or won't happen EVER. If she just doesn't like poly things? She only wants to be in monogamous shape relationships that have only 2 people in it? What are you all doing in a 3 people thing? I don't know why she can't keep herself from being in shapes that don't actually suit her.

Not sure. And I am not sure even Angela knows herself

But YOU know it now. Which means you and her are NOT going to work out in a poly thing. She doesn't want or like poly shape things. She wants monogamous shape things.

So YOU could end it so all of you can quit banging heads on wall and the suffering can end. Sometimes that is the most loving thing one can do.

Do YOU want this? Does J? Or is this more "propping her emotions up" stuff so she stops having meltdowns? She is looking for monogamy, hon. (Closed triad) is not (monogamy). Rushing into triad ceremonies won't fix rushing into a triad when one of the people really wants to be monogamous.

Solve the real problems. Not just slap bandaids on to hide it.

Should I end it all completely? Go back to being friends with Angela? Or configure it into a V with JR as hinge and Angela as my friend & metamour?
I know I am polyamorous, JR feels as I do, but he is brand new to poly. I have no clue how he will be in the future. But for now, JR & I are committed to our side of the relationship. And he accepts that I have a lover independent of US currently & possibly will have more in the future.

And you can say "No, thank you. Will not be honoring that request" and move on to talking about the bigger picture problem.

She seemed to wait until it was very early in the morning to bring up her anxiety & jealousy. Almost knowing that since we all needed rest before the event that we'd try to come to a quick conclusion. In which we caved to her demands. I think once she is able to reconnect romantically & sexually with JR alone. Things will get better, or not, I don't know.

I could be wrong.

Why is she the body police? You cannot masturbate unless she's there with you? You cannot share sex with hinge unless she's there with you? You cannot take a poo unless she's there with you? What does patrolling your body solve for her? Can it be solved another way? NO. I don't think so if ultimately she wants to be in a monogamous thing. She doesn't WANT to share JR as a lover. That's the bigger picture problem.

Could stop talking about her controlling your body (trees) and ACTUALLY have the bigger picture conversation you skipped having at the beginning about her being monogamous and not actually ok with participating in poly. (forest).

I think you guys could end this triad thing NOW. Then decide what it is. Is it (them continuing monogamous) or (you and JR continuing in a poly thing) or (everyone single now) or what?

I seriously doubt you are wrong. LMCAO! I think she wants to control our sex life cause it makes her feel safe.

She's TOLD you she is monogamous. She's trying to bend herself into pretzels and struggling. If she doesn't have the sense to come in out of the rain?

Someone has to call it what it is - NOT compatible. Could be YOU. Call it what it is and quit banging heads on wall.
Her feelings are HER responsibility. Not yours. If you guys really COULD "make her feel things" you could wave a magic wand and POOF! There. You made her happy. Problems over.

You have to stop letting her emotional struggles dictate your choices. Make your OWN choices.

YOU could decide to come in out of the rain and address the elephant in the room once and for all. This triad thing is not gonna work because she is monogamous. She wasn't honest about that at the start, it's clearing imploding now, letting her go on like that is not kind. So it's a deal breaker. Be done.

What I don't want is her to feel like she pushed me away. But lying to me, even by omission, is hurtful. I know she has trust issues but I thought our friendship would make it easier for her to trust me & my actions. Over her own anxiety of what I might do.

You have explained. She continues to ding and flap about. So it's now on YOU to get out of the line of fire so if she flaps some more? You are undingable.

Behavior has to change here somewhere in order for new results to have a chance to happen. Otherwise it is just same ol' song, different day.

Love alone is not enough for deep compatibility. There has to be other things in a relationship to keep it healthy and sustainable.

If you love her? See her struggle? Do the loving thing and end it.

Sort out if it is everyone single or they will continue as a couple monogamously or you and JR will continue doing poly or what. Stop doing THIS. The wonky triad thing is not working.

I understand. In other words "Shit or get off the pot." I can't have both. It will hurt all of us in the long run.

I believe in second chances. But it's not going to be 20, 200, 2000, 20,000 of them right? You only get the one life!
And sometimes it's a not a runner from the start. There's 0 chances. If she is monogamous? Then that is fundamental incompatibility. It's not something to compromise on. It's a basic foundation thing.

She doesn't sound both WILLING and ABLE to triad because she actually wants monogamy.

Hinge might be WILLING to triad, but not entirely ABLE if of his partners wants monogamy.

And you might be WILLING to triad.... but if you keep letting this slide? You know she's monogamous and doesn't have the sense to stop? Continuing it is YOU being cruel.

If it is just same old song different day? They are willing to carry on wonky like this? YOU don't have to be. You may have to simply walk away in order for better feelings to ensue at least for just YOU.

Endless banging head on wall? I do not suggest doing that.

I can imagine this is difficult to feel and process. But if the kite just won't fly? Stop trying to fly it.

Galagirl

Exactly.
I gave my ex husband too many chances to change his behavior & I got nothing but pain in return. I learned a lot from that. I will use that experience to strengthen my own mental & emotional walls. This will hurt but if in the future everyone is on the same page we can continue.

 

[GalaGirl]

Sorry... we were cross posting a bit.

What I hadn't known is they had been having problems for 2yrs before this even began. They both have been telling me that I "Brought a positive light into the relationship."*

Sounds like “Relationship broken, add more people.”

You were supposed to be their bandaid so they could avoid breaking up? Or avoid dealing with their problems? Ugh. Doesn't sound like emotional honesty ranks high with these people.

Should I end it all completely? Go back to being friends with Angela? Or configure it into a V with JR as hinge and Angela as my friend & metamour?

I know I am polyamorous, JR feels as I do, but he is brand new to poly. I have no clue how he will be in the future. But for now, JR & I are committed to our side of the relationship. And he accepts that I have a lover independent of US currently & possibly will have more in the future.

Up to you.

To me that sounds like you break up with Angela, and figure out if you and her can be (good exes and friends) or (just exes.)

Then you decide how you feel about JR.

• If he ends it with her? Then I guess you keep on poly dating him.

• If he keeps ON poly dating her even after he knows she's monogamous and not really into poly? He lets her keep on hurting herself like that?
  
  • Can you respect him being cruel to her like that and keep on dating him while still trying to be her good ex and friend?
    
    • If yes, date him.
      
    • If no, end it.

What I don't want is her to feel like she pushed me away. But lying to me, even by omission, is hurtful. I know she has trust issues but I thought our friendship would make it easier for her to trust me & my actions. Over her own anxiety of what I might do

You could say “I appreciate the honesty. I wish you had told me sooner. If you are monogamous, then us poly dating each other is not going to work. I am not pushing you away. I'm willing to go back to being friends. But this is not compatible for us to date each other if you want one kind of relationship model and I want another.”

Speak plain. Stop pussy footing

How she chooses to take things is her thinking and her deal. Not yours. It's like you not wanting her to be in charge of your body. Accept you are not in charge of her emotions or her thinking.

If you tell her you are not pushing her away? But she chooses to believe that you are lying and ARE pushing her away? Because SHE lies as she moves in the world and maybe cannot imagine others not moving in the same way? That's all her baggage. Not yours.

You can still speak your truth. She can take it however she wants.

I understand. In other words "Shit or get off the pot." I can't have both. It will hurt all of us in the long run.

So? It's already hurting now. PICK your hard. Between (never ending stink hard) and (hard, but might resolve)? I'd pick the latter.

Lean IN and sort what needs sorting. Not wimp out with more emotional weenie stuff! (Sorry I can't think of a better way to phrase that this late at night. )

There's been enough of that going on from them -- not being fully honest with you from the start. Her not being honest about prefering monogamy. Them not being honest about their relationship having problems before you arrived. Saying there is no heirarchy but really... there is. All sorts of weird.

Play ball, already! If you step up to bat and they are still wimping out? I think you could walk away from both in good conscience. You tried to relate up front, direct, and honest. They did not.

They are a mess offering you wonky poly, and you don't have to accept that kind of dating offer if it fails to meet your personal standards.

Galagirl

 

[Valynn]

Sounds like “Relationship broken, add more people.”

You were supposed to be their bandaid so they could avoid breaking up? Or avoid dealing with their problems? Ugh. Doesn't sound like emotional honesty ranks high with these people.

They asked me to join them after JR told Angela that he had fantasized about me. He had asked me out back in 2011, way before he and Angela began dating. I have regretted saying no to him, but I was working at a retail store that had me under contract not to date my fellow employees or customers.

Up to you.

To me that sounds like you break up with Angela, and figure out if you and her can be (good exes and friends) or (just exes.)

Then you decide how you feel about JR.

• If he ends it with her? Then I guess you keep on poly dating him.

If he keeps ON dating her even after he knows she's monogamous and not really into poly? He lets her keep on hurting herself like that? Can you respect him being cruel to her like that and keep on dating him while still trying to be her good ex and friend?

• If yes, date him.
  
• If no, end it.

Ugh, this is my problem. I know I am still very loopy with NRE's for JR. But him and I seem to have a deep connection I have never felt before. The only person that was even close was my ex husband. And I contribute that to him getting me pregnant.
I do not want to loose Angela either. But she has been able to become friends with her exes in the past.

You could say “I appreciate the honesty. I wish you had told me sooner. If you are monogamous, then us poly dating each other is not going to work. I am not pushing you away. I'm willing to go back to being friends. But this is not compatible for us to date each other if you want one kind of relationship model and I want another.”

Speak plain. Stop pussy footing.

I hope to be strong enough to say this to her.

So? It's already hurting now. PICK your hard. Between (never ending stink hard) and (hard, but might resolve)? I'd pick the latter.

Lean IN and sort what needs sorting. Not wimp out with more emotional weenie stuff! (Sorry I can't think of a better way to phrase that this late at night. )

There's been enough of that going on from them -- not being fully honest with you from the start. Her not being honest about prefering monogamy. Them not being honest about their relationship having problems before you arrived.

Play ball, already! If you step up to bat and they are still wimping out? I think you could walk away from both in good conscience. You tried. They did not.

Galagirl

True. If I keep true to myself & my emotional well being by ending it. It will make them see what they need to change for their relationship, themselves & their own well being.
They could become stronger and willing to make it work or they could implode. But either way, that will be on them. Not any ultimatum from me.

And baseball analogies work every time

 

[GalaGirl]

You sound like you have a plan.

I hope you sleep well and hopefully... you can be honest with these people and stand back and let the chips fall where they may.

GL!
Galagirl

 

[vinsanity0]

What GalaGirl sees as drama, I see as Angela working through her feelings. And I do think negative feelings should be sorted through and not just felt. Jealousy is a symptom. She is insecure. She is worried that you and JR will ride off into the sunset together. That inot going to change over night.

Yes, it may take 20 chances. I suppose you could treat every relationship as Ride or Die right off the bat, but that wouldn't be very fruitful. At least she is showing signs of working through her feelings. A step backwards needn't be a catastrophe.

 

[GalaGirl]

I would agree with you if Angela wanted to be doing poly, and is struggling with poly newbie stuff right now. Sometimes the adjustment period does take a while and giving it more time to stop "storming" and more time to settle into the "new normal" might be ok. Growth happens at the edges of the comfort zone. It's ok to be uncomfortable while in transition.

But when it turns out Angela is monogamous, wasn't honest about that, and doesn't actually want to be doing poly? She just been "going along with it" when she doesn't really want to be doing it? That doesn't sound like a temporary setback and needing more time to work it out to me.

To me that sounds like someone trying to be something they are just not. I keep wondering why Angela would even do such a thing. It's not healthy for her, and it's not being honest with others. Only thing I can think of is maybe she wasn't ready to be honest with herself? Or going along with whatever from fear of being alone?

Galagirl

 

[kittyxuchiha11]

I'm with Vinsanity0 on this one actually. when Josie and I first got with Ash, Josie had this huge freak out that she wasn't poly and was only going along with it to make me happy and was worried she was mono. The way to combat this is she would test run it and after a few months if she wasn't feeling anything then she would call it off and not be involved. So it turns out, it was just her anxiety and her jealousy getting the better of her, and in fact her and Ash seem to be really really close and in love now.

Yes, if Angela really is monogamous and is only doing this to keep people happy and continues to feel like that then i completely agree with the points above, however, growth and acceptance does happen, and she really might just be needing time to adjust.

just my two cents on things

 

[GalaGirl]

I guess only time will tell what's going on with Angela then.

Galagirl

 

[vinsanity0]

I agree time will tell. Angela seemed to like the idea of a closed triad, which I think probably appeals to her monogamous instincts.

 

[Valynn]

Thank you all for your input. I was talking to JR about what Angela had said and he thinks it's her anxiety as well. We are still pretty new and are all working through stuff. I could be a bit sensitive to her words.
He told me for almost a year into their relationship she would say she was not "relationship material" & "that he should just leave her to find someone better."
Less than 24hrs after her surgery she had a full blown panic attack, in which she wanted to walk 7 blocks to her job, she kept saying that JR & I were much better for one another (blah, blah, blah). JR was still asleep, so I tried to talk her through it while walking backwards down a busy street.

 

[GalaGirl]

He told me for almost a year into their relationship she would say she was not "relationship material" & "that he should just leave her to find someone better."

That's a turn off to me. If a person is going around saying that? I'll believe them and just not get involved. I want to share a healthy relationship with someone. Not be their chronic "prop them up" person.

Less than 24hrs after her surgery she had a full blown panic attack, in which she wanted to walk 7 blocks to her job, she kept saying that JR & I were much better for one another (blah, blah, blah). JR was still asleep, so I tried to talk her through it while walking backwards down a busy street.

That to me is also a turn off. She's not going to rest after surgery? She's going to prep products for a mother's day pop up sale event? Then argue with the triad partners about when and how they share sex with each other?

I don't mind being there for a partner, but this would be way more labor than I want to be doing 1 month in to a relationship. Too weird for me. I don't want to sign up to be someone's "free therapist," their "emotional dumpster," or their "caretaker."

I think you may have to figure out how much of this YOU want to keep doing. I am not you. Your tolerance for this stuff might be at a different place.

But if it's hurting you to participate here? Like over and over? It's ok to decide to STOP participating so you can be free from that hurt.

You are not obligated to throw your OWN well being under the bus to just keep on propping up Angela. So I guess you could do some soul searching?

Galagirl

 

[Magdlyn]

Valynn, do you live with Angela and JR?

I'm hoping you don't. You say you're solo poly, and have another partner, so I assume you live alone and host that other partner at your place?

I hear that you and Angela both are entrepreneurs with handmade products, and you set up at events together to sell your wares. You and JR were attracted to each other 8 years ago, but couldn't date because of work rules.

Now, you're good friends and more or less business partners with Angela. And all of a sudden you get more deeply involved with both. Not just friends, not just business partners, but lovers.

And yet, Angela has reproductive surgery and can't have sex for a while, but you and JR (being in a long awaited place of finally able to have sex) go ahead and have frequent sex while Angela is out of commission.

Angela may be a nice person, and you may get along great. But maybe you two relate well because you BOTH have low self esteem and weak boundaries. She has told JR she's not worthy of a relationship with HIM. And now she's going along with a so-called triad because she still feels unworthy of love from anyone, so goes against her own desires of monogamy, to keep JR, and have you as a sex partner too.

And you, to avoid "making" her feel bad, semi go along with her wishes (have sex but don't make love), or only do oral or digital sex when you know full well she meant any kind of sex, not just PIV, was "not allowed." And then she yells at you both after the fact, and she's in pain, and it's late, and you two have a big business event the next morning... and you and JR feel you have to bow to her wishes just so everyone can get some sleep. But you don't really agree in your hearts that she has the right to control the sex life you share with JR.

If I were you, I'd step back a bit. I HOPE you haven't moved in with them. Do your business with Angela. If you're going to keep dating JR, let him come to your place... if he's "allowed." If he isn't "allowed," it's on him as a hinge to work things out with Angela.

That's the least you can do.

The most you can do is what GG recommends. Step away from the wonky. These people are not good poly dating prospects. Don't attempt to placate Angela by accepting a key, and discussing handfasting! Yikes! She is doing a push pull. Take a key! Let's be planning handfasting! But you can't fuck or "make love" with "my" man. And I'm gonna have panic attacks and fits every times I feel insecure!

This does not sound like a runner here. Sorry.