Which way to turn?

Maybe the overnight in your appartment was too much too fast. Watching them snuggle on the couch while watching a movie is different than them sleeping together just down the hall. I do think the fact that Karma breached your trust by sharing your personal/confidential e-mail with the g/f compounded the problem and brought back your insecurites about the situation. If this is not part of your boudaries that you already have in place, it should be. Your e-mails and their contents, are non of her business nor is any other personal information you share with Karma.
 
SNeacail said:
Maybe the overnight in your appartment was too much too fast. Watching them snuggle on the couch while watching a movie is different than them sleeping together just down the hall. I do think the fact that Karma breached your trust by sharing your personal/confidential e-mail with the g/f compounded the problem and brought back your insecurites about the situation. If this is not part of your boudaries that you already have in place, it should be. Your e-mails and their contents, are non of her business nor is any other personal information you share with Karma.
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They've been having over nights here for awhile. I prefer it that way, since 1 she has no car and we are poor college students, that's a lot of back and forth for a weekend visit (she's about a half hr away). 2 at least if he's not in my bed, I know he's only down the hall.

Honestly after having a few months to figure my head out. I think I let the whole thing move to fast, but at the time I did what I thought I needed to do. Now I wish I had asked they take a break so he and I could work on us, or at least me and her not be around eachother for awhile. But the past is the past and now we deal with the rest.


He knew not to say anything but forgot. Honestly I'm an open book, I have nothing to hide from anyone and few things I find too personal to share. But as far a confidences friends have in me, that's different. Karma only found out on accident. I hide nothing from my husband and the only reason I didn't tell him straight out was b/c the friend asked me not to and it didn't effect Karma at all. So yeah, a bit of a boundry break. Hopefully it is all cleared up now.
 
I think I may have figured out where the pain is coming from. I have a huge long blog but I wanna talk to Karma about it before I post it. But basicaly she gets a side of him I've always longed for and never knew existed. I've done everything but beg and she just gets it.

I know that isn't giving much, but I made him a promise, to go over any major blogs before posting them so it'll have to wait.

But I think I've made a somewhat major breakthrough.

The blessings of 24 hrs with no sleep. caffeine. cigarettes. and emotion.
 
Mohegan said:
I think I may have figured out where the pain is coming from. I have a huge long blog but I wanna talk to Karma about it before I post it. But basicaly she gets a side of him I've always longed for and never knew existed. I've done everything but beg and she just gets it.

But I think I've made a somewhat major breakthrough.
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Good for you. I hope that the conversation is a constructive one and I'll be waiting to see what the outcome is.
 
After some sleep and talking and reading and trying to understand the other. Karma and I are once again on track. More pain from the past, on both sides, was revealed. We found that are a lot of things we are both doing that aren't seen. Kind of like a few weeks ago when I was making progress and Karma didn't see it because he didn't know where I had started. They were internal, emotion changes that the other couldn't see. Karmas actions haven't so much changed as the reason behind them.

He's done a lot of changing that I thought he had done for himself, and found out tonight he did them for me. I've never asked him to change for me. I never thought that was what he was doing.

Even something as simple as asking how I'm feeling when we wake up. I thought it was because he wanted to know how it would effect his day. In reality, he has started doing it out of concern for me. I had no idea. He's left some things behind in his past for me. I knew it was because I asked but I thought it was because he wanted to live a new better life, I didn't know it was only because I asked.

He does all these little romantic things for g/f that he doesn't for me. Little notes on facebook. He calls her (he never called me when were dating) just to see how she is doing, how was her day, tells her he misses her. I don't get that. This is what I was refering to earlier. I asked for years for little romantic gestures, I just thought that wasn't a part of who he was. But she seems to get it so easily, so effortlessly. Why don't I?

Well I got my answers. He does so much for me. He's made all these internal changes, but never told me. How am I to know he's doing these things for me if he doesn't tell me? He thought I was secure that I was loved, so why do I need those things.

It was a good educational talk. We're back on the same page. I don't know that it was a complete answer to why it hurts to see them together, but I think it is helpful. It gives me something to hold onto. A little something to move forward with.

I don't know if any of that makes sense. My pain pills are kicking in. It makes sense in my head. I still don't like sharing him and am not sure why, but I guess it's more for me to work on and figure out.
 
We all like to know our loved ones are thinking of us during the day. It hurts to know they can take the time to talk/text to someone else during the day, but you don't get the same consideration.

My hubby stopped calling me about 5 years into our marriage and I tried to get him to start again many times. He always used the excuss that he was too busy, "If you weren't texting/calling ____ 20 times a day, you would have sometime to give me some encouragement during the day too". Of course he tried to deny it, but the cell phone bill backed me up. Now after being married 19 years he has finally started again. It truely makes my day to get even just one text knowing that he was thinking of me. His payoff, I am usually in a much better mood for sex.

I don't think any of use are totally secure in our relationships without constant reminders and that goes both ways. It's nice to know that one little text could bring him some relief on an otherwise stressful day.
 
That would be a great idea, if Mohegan ever charged her damn cell phone!! :)

Honestly, I need to stop assuming that my wife automatically knows why I'm doing things. She's not psychic (on most days :D), and I guess I've been expecting her to read my mind. I thought she knew why I've been doing certain things, making certain life changes, ect. Turns out she had no clue.

And here I was, thinking that all this stuff I've been working on for her, and the concern I show for her didn't mean anything to her, which really hurt. As it turns out, it's not that she didn't care, she didn't know it was for her......

Women should come with instruction manuals, dammit. ;)
 
I want cry. I really hate this constant mess. I enjoy those rare times when it seems to be going right.

Karma and g/f were e-mailing back and forth and she said she had talked with her other boyfriend and he was having issues sharing her as well. That she had a better understanding of where I was coming from now. That she felt like he was only letting her date Karma because he had no other choice.

That isn't it! I have a choice. I can pack my shit up and move back to Ohio. I can tell him to break it off and try to rebuild us without a whole other relationship being involved. I have plenty of options. I don't want them. All I could think reading what she wrote, was she's gonna get scared and break up with Karma. She's gonna think she's causing to much pain and end things. Partialy cuz I think she has no balls to stand her ground and fight for what she wants, and partialy cuz she thinks it's the right thing to do. Well it's not damn it! Breaking my husbands heart is no the right fucking thing to do.

Yes seeing them together hurts me. But thinking of him heart broken, going through the pain of having your relationship end becauase there is nothing you can do...that will destroy me. I cannot see him go through that.

That is why I suck it up. That is why I am trying to find a way to do this without hurting. I don't see them ending things as an option. I see me dealing with and working through pain and issues as the only option. Because I love my husband. And I don't want to just be okay with this, I want to embrace it.

I was thinking on things this morning and another part of the pain. Part of the sharing issue I guess. Is that there are two seperate relationships. When my wife was staying with us, that was how I envisioned our little family. We could all cuddle together and feel comfort and love. Karma would leave for school and she and I would snuggle down in bed together as he kissed us both good bye. And I felt nothing but love. Nothing but contentment. There was no issue if he sat with her on the couch, or me on the couch, or both of us, or me and her. It was all the same.

I wanted that with whoever else we brought into our family. I wanted us to build something together. And if it didn't work as a triad, that's fine, but there would still be the emotional connection of a deep friendship. The M-F'ing compersion. I don't have that with g/f. Her well being matters because she matters to Karma. Not because I give a damn about her. I guess I give A damn, but that's about all. She's like a distant relation, I'm supposed to like her and get along with her and care for her because she's family. And I just don't. There's an aquaintence there and that is all. I've said over and over if I met her in a different way, she isn't someone I would want to continue a friendship with. We just don't relate.

So there is no connection between us. If Karma left and she and I were here in the house it would be filled with silence or random small talk to fill said silence. There's no comfort there. We've both tried and I just don't feel it.

So to see my husband hold, kiss, touch, fall asleep with, someone I have no feelings towards, it hurts. Because we don't all share something. She's like this foreign object that my husband wants to spend time with, and I don't know why, so it hurts me. I know why he wants to spend time with my wife, so I'm okay with it. I can see what he sees in her. I don't see what draws him to g/f.

And maybe I'm not supposed to. Maybe I never will. But he loves her and I need to figure out how to accept that without it hurting. I need to know why he wants to spend time with her instead of me. it's not so much why does he want to spend time with another woman, as much as it is, why her.

Wow break throughs for breakfast. Yum.
 
Mohegan said:
She's gonna think she's causing to much pain and end things. Partialy cuz I think she has no balls to stand her ground and fight for what she wants, and partialy cuz she thinks it's the right thing to do. Well it's not damn it!
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This is an interesting and not foreign concept. I have felt it too although I don't think it has anything to do with not having the balls to fight for what you want. If she is like me she is concerned for your primary relationship. I have the same thoughts sometimes but eventually you have to trust in what people are telling you unless there is an obvious discrepenciy in what they are saying and what you are feeling. Then you have to step up and do what is right...of course "what is right" is subjective.

It's such a rollercoaster for those trying to determine if they are a positive or negative in the lives of those you love. It's also a struggle in trying to figure out if they would be better or worse off without you. Work, work, work...but it's worth it :)
 
Mono- Did you ever feel like PN didn't want to get to know you? How did you two work through things in the begining?
 
It seems g/f still feels I have made my mind up about her. No matter how many time I say that is just not in my character. People are dynamic not static, we are always changing. But she seems to think I have decided to not like her and am just waiting for her to screw things up.

Karma says I think there is nothing in common b/c she is affraid to open up and I don't feel like I should be the one to offer the olive branch.

Add into the complication of fibromyalgia. She doesn't know me well enough to know the things it effects. Like when I am in a lot of pain I tend to shut off. I get short with people b/c the energy it takes to answer them, takes away from the energy I am using to combat the pain. The energy it takes to interact is just more than I have. My patience is usualy pretty thin when I am in a lot of pain.

When she and Karma came home Sat night that was where I was. I had told him earlier in the day I felt like I had been hit by a truck, and I did. I had the muscle ache from working out, the flu like ache from the fibro, I had no energy, I had no balance, and it honestly hurt just to breath, it hurt to eat.

I sent them to a going away party without me, for one of our adopted "kids". The younger sister to one of the guys we do darkon with. She is leaving for college and it was her last weekend to spend with us. Our "kids" mean the world to me. We do more than mentor them in foam fighting, we mentor them in their real lives as well. So the fact that I was in that much pain that I wasn't going, I thought clued him into the level of pain.

Hit by truck/ not going to see a friend off to college/didn't even have the energy to get dressed.

Yup sounds like a pretty bad day.

So they came home and I was snippy from the get go. Just saying hi took more than I had and I was pissy that I had to extend that energy. Not their fault, not a trait I'm proud of. But that's where I was and what they walked into.

Karma wanted to watch The Crow. His favorite movie. G/f has never seen it. I was annoyed again for several reasons: I was asked to move so he could cuddle us both, it wasn't the cuddling that bothered me, it was the moving. I had found a spot I could tolerate sitting in and now I have to move to accomodate them. Again he didn't know, not really their fault, and on any other day it wouldn't have mattered. But right then, I didn't want to.
Two:I HATE watching a move more than once. Seems like a waste of time. I will go years and years before I can tolerate watching a movie again. The Crow, being Karmas favorite, I have seen more times than I can count. So I'm in pain, I'm irritated and I have zero desire to watch this move AGAIN.

So I went to the bedroom to read my book. Up until now, seeing them cuddle didn't bother me. When they got there she sat on the floor in front of where he was on the couch and I didn't care. The kissed and I didn't care.

I'm guessing my patience was dead by the time I came out to get an ash tray b/c they were curled up in the chair watching the movie in the dark. Seeing that hurt. Like arrow to the heart. Then later he came into the kitchen while I was getting dinner and gave me a hug and was covered in her scent.

Again a two prong issue- I am very sensitive to scents and I don't like what she uses. They make me ill. And then there's the fact that my husband smells of another woman and is hugging and kissing me.

That was it. I was done. He asked what was wrong. All I could articulate was I was hurting seeing them and smelling her. He got pissed I got defensive and that my friends is how we got this last string of blogs.

Karma and talked for a bit tonight and there was some irritation on both parts, but I think we get things a little more.

He thinks I'm shutting her out and not wanting to get to know her. That am only tolerating her. I think I've been trying to get to know her, to hold conversation, and I feel like I am talking to myself. So I don't feel like it's my branch to extend anymore.

I don't know how to make her feel comfortable. I don't know how to make her feel like I want to get to know her. I don't know what I'm supposed to be doing.

I want compersion. I want to feel joy knowing they are happy. I want the comfort that is there with my wife. And it just doesn't seem to be happening.
 
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Something else I have been thinking about- Remember that 5 page letter I wrote her? Took all that time to get my thoughts accross just right. I ended it by saying, if she wanted to try and make things work, then I would be looking forward to her response.

She said she was working on one. That she was taking her time to get it right.


I'm still waiting. I kinda feel like it got pushed aside.

So I took all this time explaining things to you. Putting things out there. Hoping for the same, and some answers in return. That was my first attempt to extend that olive branch.

And it seems to have been ignored.

So I still don't know how she deals with things, learns, processes, communicates.

And she wants to know why I don't seem to want to get to know? BECAUSE I AM STILL WAITING FOR HER TO TELL ME HOW!

Just wanted to get that out there. :D
 
So Karma came home to get something and g/f was in the car. He said she wanted to give me my space. But that she had something to ask me but wanted to ask me in person. He was all giddy and seemed to think it was a good idea. Then he read my posts and said that she I definitaly needed to talk.

I really don't want to see her, but now my mind is spinning with what on earth she would want to say.

Should prove interesting.
 
Mohegan said:
Mono- Did you ever feel like PN didn't want to get to know you? How did you two work through things in the begining?
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Me and PN talked to each other right away once I met him. We went for coffee and I told him exaclty where I was coming from and he told me where he was coming from. We had a few moments where it was clear he needed his space from me but it was never open animosity. Me and PN are very similar in one very important way...we care about each other. There is no him and RP and Me and RP, there is us.

I came into this relationship respecting and having full compersion for what they had before I even heard the term. He is simply a very understanding and kind person. If one of us was unbalanced as a "taker" we may have had a rockier start. For all intended purposes, we've had a text book start between me and him.
 
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So it seems we are at a stand still once again. G/f doesn't know how to approach me, I don't know how to approach her. Kind of stuck.

I dunno what to do. I'm not sure what to say or do or how to approach anything. She hasn't told me yet, but Karma told me what she wanted to say to me. She wants to know what I look for in a friend. I kind of feel like I shouldn't say anything. Like it'll make things between us less. Almost affraid it'll change how she acts, either to appease or the opposite.

Does she want to play the compatibilty game?

Grrr. I hate not knowing how to react to things. And really, aside from honesty, someone with balls enough to stand up for themselves, someone secure in who they are, somewhat of the same outlook on things or at least and open enough mind to discuss the differences, I don't really have a list of criteria for friends. So when she does ask. I have no idea what to say.

Something to sleep on I guess.
 
Mohegan said:
So it seems we are at a stand still once again. G/f doesn't know how to approach me, I don't know how to approach her. Kind of stuck.

.
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Why put yourself in a pressure cooker? Why not pick a public place to have coffee with activity around you and just set a date to visit for a while. PN and I went for a walk and coffe to sit by the sea the first time we really talked. That atmosphere was safe for me because when I decide to talk it is usually easy for me and I wanted privacy to open up to him. It has definitely gotten better over time and now we don't care who listens when we talk (we talk loud, just ask RP)...you just have to open your mouth and say something that you are genuinely interested in and the rest seems to follow.

You could be very upfront and tell her that you worry the meeting will be awkward and that you are unsure what the aim will be...but again, this leads to conversation which is a good thing.

Just my thoughts...take the leap
Mono
 
Meet her to talk on your terms, where and how you feel comfortable. Let her know that if your fibro is acting up that you might cancel on her last minute. Karma (quite naturally) is going to want for the 2 of you to be friends. Unfortunately friendship can't be forced and if you're anything like me I mentally shut down when I feel like I'm being forced into something. Get to know her, find out if you have some common ground. Maybe you will be friends and maybe you won't. But just learning more about her and what Karma loves about her might go a long way to developing compersion for them.

-Derby
 
Sounds so simple to hear you both say it, yet I am filled with dread thinking of the awkward forced conversations we've had so far. It's always been easy for me to find something in common with anyone. Working in the food industry you almost have to. I kept Karma up for hrs trying to figure out where this block comes from.

Have I not forgiven her? Do I feel threatend in some subconcious way?

I thought when we went to the carnival, things went pretty well. Conversation still felt strained and forced but it was there. Karma says even then it seemed like I was shut down and not interested in interacting with her.

I'm scared, because there is aparently quite a bit of myself I am just not feeling, or acknowledging or aware of. I don't understand why.

I feel like this is so much harder than it should be. Yet I have no idea how to make it easier. Going somewhere neutral, without Karma, seems like a death sentance. All I see is us sitting there staring at eachother. Waiting for the other to come up with same way to transition into a conversation.

I've also decided to give her the address for the forum, so she can start reading them. I kind of feel like it's a way for her to see what I am thinking. But Karma wasn't supposed to tell me what she wanted to ask me, so he wants me to wait, since I mentioned it last night.

I am so frustrated. So emotional yet emotionaly disconnected. I'm not sleeping again. I'm in a ton of pain again. Glad I enjoyed last week while I could.
 
I'm proud of you for working on the "whys" of not being all together comfortable just sitting down and chatting to her. Chances are you wouldn't just stare at each other for hours and if it does start to happen you can always ask her how the telepathy is working for her :D.

I have to say that I was quite the evil bitch when I met my husband's gf for the first time. I had agreed to pick her up from the airport and the plan was for me to take her to her other bf's house. Well she asked my husband if she could stay for the afternoon and then asked if she could stay overnight and I couldn't just say no to the afternoon part because it seemed really reasonable. But I didn't want her there that fast. I was prepared to pick her up and drop her off and spend about 45 minutes with her. I felt trapped and forced into something I wasn't ready for.

I've since become a much nicer person to her. I don't consider her a friend, rather an aquaintance. Her other boyfriend I do consider a friend though. I might not get it but I don't have to. Try not to put so much pressure on yourself to like her. Take it easy and get to know her. And keep questioning the "whys" the more you understand why you are feeling a certain way the more able you are to deal with those feelings.

-Derby
 
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