Wife fell in love with her friend. Now we're talking about making a triad.

[SquishyHusk]

Today, Friend had a tough day taking care of Kid, so she asked me for a hug. Well, I'd had a tough day at work, and I could use a nice hug myself. That hug turned into a bit of a makeout session. I feel bad that it happened because my wife was not home, but I had told them that they were free to explore their relationship without me, so wouldn't that imply that it's okay for me and friend to explore our relationship? After all, I wasn't there for the first kiss between wife and friend, and I haven't been asking what they have been doing up in friend's room. I guess I feel bad that I didn't get clear permission first. Or I feel bad to be with someone who is not my wife. I don't want to hurt my wife's feelings. The only reason I'm involved with this woman is because my wife loves her.

 

[Magdlyn]

Last night after the kid went to bed, I was sitting on the couch with Wife watching TV. Normally Friend would cuddle with Wife, but Wife was doing stuff on a laptop, so Friend snuggled up to me. I have to say, it felt great. Wife said watching us snuggling together made her feel happy.
When Friend got up to go to bed, wife gave her a peck on the lips. Friend turned to kiss me and I gave her a deep, long kiss.

And there you go. You went for it.

She then went back to give Wife a deep kiss. I told them I'm giving you space to explore and went to bed. Wife came to bed a minute or two later. I asked her if she is happy with what is happening and she said she is happy.

It sounds like when you're not there, the women share a bed, but when you're home, you and Wife share a bed and the women don't. Many triads AND Vs take turns who gets to spend the night with whom. Some even have a written schedule. Of course, some triads share a bed every night, but it's actually better if everyone has their own bed to retreat to when they want some alone time, for whatever reason.

Today, Friend had a tough day taking care of Kid, so she asked me for a hug. Well, I'd had a tough day at work, and I could use a nice hug myself. That hug turned into a bit of a makeout session. I feel bad that it happened because my wife was not home, but I had told them that they were free to explore their relationship without me, so wouldn't that imply that it's okay for me and friend to explore our relationship?

Just to be sure, you should ask your Wife point blank: "Do you consent to me exploring sex with Friend when you're not here, and not involved?" It's too risky to make any assumptions at this point. Communicate fully, openly, honestly. No gray areas.

Of course, in a triad, each dyad deserves space to develop at its own pace, friendship-wise (shared interests, dates outside the home), emotionally, romantically, sexually and also the explorations of kinks, if any. No couple should insist that all sex with the unicorn be threeways, while the original couple can still have sex one-on-one whenever they want.

This is covered in the book you're waiting for, but you're forging ahead with the making out (which I consider to be sex). Before you know it you'll be grabbing her boobs and she'll be touching your cock. And the women haven't even had sex yet.

Wife isn't sure she'll enjoy FF sex, so she hasn't tried it (as far as you know). But you know damn well you're into women and hot for Friend!

After all, I wasn't there for the first kiss between wife and friend, and I haven't been asking what they have been doing up in friend's room. I guess I feel bad that I didn't get clear permission first.

Yeah, it was flaky and unethical of both of you. Friend is younger than you and is going to follow your lead.

Or I feel bad to be with someone who is not my wife. I don't want to hurt my wife's feelings. The only reason I'm involved with this woman is because my wife loves her.

Yup. I think it all started when the women started sleeping in the same bed. Imagine if you were single and had a nanny helping you with your daughter, and you and she started sharing a bed "for support." What would that lead to? Proximity is everything. Even sharing a cup of coffee every morning, and eating delicious meals, and watching TV in the evening, could lead to emotional intimacy. Never mind sharing a bed. Did Wife tell you when she and Friend started sharing a bed every night that you weren't there? How did you feel about that, knowing Friend was gay/bi?

 

[SquishyHusk]

It sounds like when you're not there, the women share a bed, but when you're home, you and Wife share a bed and the women don't.

Correct, but they spend the majority of their waking hours together.

but you're forging ahead with the making out (which I consider to be sex). Before you know it you'll be grabbing her boobs and she'll be touching your cock. And the women haven't even had sex yet.

I didn't mean for it to happen, and I didn't expect it to happen. And I agree that kissing is sex - which is why I felt it was cheating when they started without me.

Wife isn't sure she'll enjoy FF sex, so she hasn't tried it (as far as you know). But you know damn well you're into women and hot for Friend!
Yeah, it was flaky and unethical of both of you. Friend is younger than you and is going to follow your lead.

Agree.

Yup. I think it all started when the women started sleeping in the same bed. Imagine if you were single and had a nanny helping you with your daughter, and you and she started sharing a bed "for support." What would that lead to? Proximity is everything. Even sharing a cup of coffee every morning, and eating delicious meals, and watching TV in the evening, could lead to emotional intimacy. Never mind sharing a bed.

Agree.

Did Wife tell you when she and Friend started sharing a bed every night that you weren't there? How did you feel about that, knowing Friend was gay/bi?

She did tell me they slept together. I told her it made me uncomfortable, but what she told me was that they were just friends and female friendships are different. I foolishly trusted her. I didn't think that my wife would ever be with a woman. I don't think she thought so either, until the feelings developed. Maybe it would have happened even if they hadn't been sleeping together - maybe the co-parenting and the mutual support would have still drawn them together.

 

[JaneQSmythe]

Female friendships are often seen as "different" in our society - we are "allowed" to touch each other, hug, and sleep in the same bed without it necessarily being seen as sexual in ways that men are not. Deep (open-mouth) kisisng seems to be a boundary-crossing activity, as well as touching breasts or genitals. Having strong emotions may or may not lead to romantic or sexual relationships depending on the beliefs and orientations of the women involved.

My first FF experience and my first sexual encounter with MrS, was a threesome with MrS and his ex-girlfriend (already ex at the time)...due to my concerns regarding HER potential jealousy I set the ground-rule that I would not be involved in any penis interactions. (I like men too, but I am really selective about my penis-interactions). BUT we were in our late teens and no complicating circumstances like kids, commitments, or marriage. Yes, MrS has always considered himself "lucky" that he had the opportunity to have these experiences when he was young, but the potential fall-out then was minimal.

 

[SquishyHusk]

I feel strange watching my wife passionately kissing someone else. Is it a bad feeling? Maybe a little bit, but not really. I wouldn't say it's a good feeling either, though I am happy that she is happy. Mostly is just strange. I get turned on by the sighs, moans, and gasps - but until recently, I was the only one causing her to make those noises. I enjoy kissing her friend passionately, but every now and then I get this sudden feeling that what I'm doing is wrong - even though my wife is sitting right there holding my hand, saying it's okay. I'm not sure she's being honest, because lately she has been complaining that I'm always paying attention to her friend and not to her. That is true when the three of us are together - but that's because after we three cuddle and make out, the friend goes to her room alone while the wife and I go to our room where my wife gets my full attention. And it's not like my wife isn't spending plenty of time kissing her friend. There was one night when the two of them kissed each other while I kissed their necks. I was a little upset that I didn't get "my turn", but I know things will never be exactly "equal"
Anyway, I'm guessing that because my wife is complaining that "you always turn to her" means that she is not really alright with the whole thing?
I'm going to stop making out with her friend and only make out with her for the time being to see if that makes things better. Honestly, the snuggling is like 80% of it for me, so I can be fine with less kissing. Though I might still struggle with watching my wife get so excited kissing another person.
One thing that both girls had mentioned to me was that my wife was the unknown here: Friend knows she likes men and women, I know I like women, my wife knows she likes men - but does not yet know if she can be with a woman. She appears to really enjoy kissing her friend, but who knows if she'll enjoy sex acts beyond that. Sometimes I wonder why she even suggested this at all? I'd never have started even thinking about her friend if my wife hadn't brought up the idea of us all getting together. I thought her friend only slept with women.
So, for now, I think I'll take a step back and let the girls go on a bit without me. It's best if I wait until my wife is more sure. I'm starting to wish she had never brought this up.
Am I making any sense?

 

[SlowPoly]

Anyway, I'm guessing that because my wife is complaining that "you always turn to her" means that she is not really alright with the whole thing?

You seem kinda “all or nothing” in your thinking/planning. I could be wrong here. But it sounds like she saying she wants more attention when you’re all together. Not that she wants zero attention paid to Friend. You are absolutely right that striving for balance is a fool’s errand. But for sure try to give space and time for comfortable relating in all relevant configurations.

You might try sharing attention with whomever is present and wants attention, and asking and giving generously when you aren’t sure. Sometimes that might mean two of you lavishing attention on one. Sometimes that might mean someone doing their own thing on the side. As long as everyone feels welcome and cared for, there are no wrong answers.

If wife and Friend seem to exclude you (your perception), you can speak your specific wants in the moment or your general needs at another time. Or you can choose to find something else to do and give them some time to focus on each other, leaving them the space if you’d rather not experience the sounds and sights from the “outside.”

Talk about this. Talk about expectations around sharing time together and saving time and space for each dyad and each individual.

Assuming no malicious intent, I would think that together you could work out how to meet everyone’s needs. Be generous. Question your reactions. Interrogate your own concerns. Express your feelings and needs. Accept what others tell you about their own needs and perceptions. Try new hacks, and see what seems to work.

 

[Magdlyn]

I feel strange watching Wife passionately kissing someone else. Is it a bad feeling? Maybe a little bit, but not really. I wouldn't say it's a good feeling either, though I am happy that she is happy. Mostly it's just strange.

Yes, it is "strange" because 1) it's new, strange by definition, and 2) your boundaries and expectations for sexual interactions are far from clear!

I get turned on by the sighs, moans, and gasps - but until recently, I was the only one causing Wife to make those noises. I enjoy kissing Friend passionately, but every now and then I get this sudden feeling that what I'm doing is wrong - even though Wife is sitting right there holding my hand, saying it's okay.

I'm not sure she's being honest, because lately she has been complaining that I'm always paying attention to her friend and not to her.

So Wife is saying it's OK (in front of friend) and also saying it's not OK (when you two are alone). This is confusion that needs to be cleared up.

That is true when the three of us are together - but that's because after we three cuddle and make out, Friend goes to her room alone while Wife and I go to our room, where Wife gets my full attention.

So the only action so far are these pre-bedtime cuddles and make-out sessions. Then there's the ensuing arousal but you all "go back to your corners," you and Wife to your bedroom and Friend to hers. How long will this go on before you get to the next base? You seem to be in limbo. Are you talking about taking things further or just feeling stuck because no one is trying to step on anyone's toes?

And then Wife complains you're doing it wrong when you go to your bedroom!

And it's not like Wife isn't spending plenty of time kissing Friend.

Tit for tat, eh?

There was one night when the two of them kissed each other while I kissed their necks. I was a little upset that I didn't get "my turn", but I know things will never be exactly "equal."

You were waiting for a written invitation?

You are under no requirement to watch them kiss, you know. Nor is Wife required to watch you kiss Friend. There ARE other options that would give everyone more privacy in their explorations.

Anyway, I'm guessing that because my wife is complaining that "you always turn to her" means that she is not really alright with the whole thing.

Why guess? Why not talk it over?

I'm going to stop making out with Friend and only make out with Wife for the time being, to see if that makes things better.

Will you tell them that you're doing that, and why? What if Friend grabs you? That might happen if you don't tell her you've decided to stop kissing her because Wife is getting jealous.

Tell them both that there's a problem with envy, jealousy, territoriality, and that the married people sitting there watching each other kiss the shared Friend really doesn't seem that fun or good right now, for you or for Wife. Maybe Friend isn't really enjoying it either. Everyone is waiting for someone else to take it to the next level (or maybe call the whole thing off...).

Honestly, the snuggling is like 80% of it for me, so I can be fine with less kissing, though I might still struggle with watching my wife get so excited kissing another person.

Yup. Maybe you all could cuddle for a while (since that seems OK all around) and then the ladies can go to Friend's bedroom to do more kissing (or proceed to the next level, or at least privately talk about moving to the next level). You'd have to give your consent and blessing to that.

One thing that both girls had mentioned to me was that Wife was the unknown here: Friend knows she likes men and women, I know I like women, Wife knows she likes men, but does not yet know if she can be with a woman.

Yeah. It seems to be all hanging on that.

She appears to really enjoy kissing Friend, but who knows if she'll enjoy sex acts beyond that? Sometimes I wonder why she even suggested this at all.

Pressure from helpful, indispensable, "savior," beautiful, seductive Friend.

I'd never have started even thinking about Friend if Wife hadn't brought up the idea of us all getting together. I thought Friend only slept with women.

So, for now, I think I'll take a step back and let the girls go on a bit without me.

You don't get to just "let" them go on a bit. You need to discuss the problems with doing things the way you're all doing it now, and tell them it's a struggle for you, and apparently for Wife, and fully hear them out, (using Active Listening skills) and then brainstorm on solutions. In other words, less brainless kissing, more talking.

It's best if I wait until Wife is more sure. I'm starting to wish she had never brought this up. Am I making any sense?

Yes, you wish this had never happened. You can even tell the women this. That it's becoming complicated, not fun, and you're not sure what the best next step should be, but something has to change, as doing it this way isn't working. You're not happy, Wife isn't happy. And how does Friend feel? You have no idea. You better find out. (And make sure she's not lying or fudging the truth, because she does have motivation to do so...)

 

[Magdlyn]

Besides the option of Wife going to Friend's room after the general cuddle/kiss session (or, hell, skip the threeway shit and just the women go off to bed), there is the option of actually all three of you going to the biggest bed, getting naked and going for it. In a threeway with FMF, or MFM, or even FFF/MMM, there doesn't need to be full on contact between all three people. You and Friend could both focus on Wife. Friend and Wife could kiss, maybe Wife would touch friend lightly, but if it's OK with Wife, Friend could give her oral. If it's OK with Wife, you could give Friend oral or actually fuck her. You could definitely fuck Wife while she and Friend kissed. Maybe Friend could kiss Wife's breasts while you fuck Wife.

Any of these activities shouldn't breach any boundaries Wife has around actually "doing gay stuff" TO friend. She could be more passive if she felt best that way. You should discuss all this ideally, beforehand, or at least during sex. Every new act needs everyone's consent.

(In private)
You: Wife, can we talk about sex with Friend? is it OK with you if I fuck Friend?
Wife: Yes (or no).

(In the evening, to Friend)
Could we talk about taking this further? Would you be OK having sex with me? Even if Wife isn't sure how far she wants to go with you, what are you comfortable doing with ME?

 

[SquishyHusk]

Besides the option of Wife going to Friend's room after the general cuddle/kiss session (or, hell, skip the threeway shit and just the women go off to bed)

I have told them they are free to explore without me, and they might the next time I'm away on business. I said that's fine, just make me feel valued when I get back home.

Any of these activities shouldn't breach any boundaries Wife has around actually "doing gay stuff" TO friend. She could be more passive if she felt best that way. You should discuss all this ideally, beforehand, or at least during sex. Every new act needs everyone's consent.

I have told her this. I mentioned a few examples, such as they can kiss and fondle each other while I perform oral on them both.
She to wants to start by seeing how far she can go with her friend while I just watch.

(In private)
You: Wife, can we talk about sex with Friend? is it OK with you if I fuck Friend?
Wife: Yes (or no).

Wife was the one that started this conversation - while we were having sex. She asked me if I wanted to fuck her friend and said it was okay to admit I wanted to, but that it would take time and we would go slow. I said there where a lot of things that we could do that did not involve me penetrating her friend. I said that I would really enjoy giving her friend oral - this moved the conversation to the two women giving each other oral which she is unsure of how she would feel doing, but looked excited to try. I was feeling uncomfortable having this talk in the middle of having sex, but I had been wanting her to open up, and if this is when she felt like sharing, so be it. She seemed to really like the idea of having me cum in one of them and then having the other lick it out and wasn't sure which way she'd like better. Frankly this is a side of my wife I'd never seen. Our sex life has been great, and we have tried a lot of stuff, but it's always been heteronormative, couple stuff. I never thought I'd hear her say she was thinking about licking my cum out of her friend. I was a bit shocked.

(In the evening, to Friend)
Could we talk about taking this further? Would you be OK having sex with me? Even if Wife isn't sure how far she wants to go with you, what are you comfortable doing with ME?

She has said she really wants to go all the way with me, but we will only more forward at the speed wife sets. Wife said Friend has told Wife that I'd have to be gentle because she hasn't been with a man in a long time, so they have talked about it also.

Tonight I think I'm going to go to bed early and tell the women that they are free to do whatever. I've been very open to them with what I think and feel. I need a break from overthinking it. They can have tonight to themselves.

 

[Magdlyn]

Sounds good. As for Wife eating your cum out of Friend: I would think you'd be using condoms with Friend. She probably isn't on hormonal birth control, having mostly been with women. Has she been tested for STDs? Have you have had a vasectomy, perhaps?

I hope you can trust that she's being 100% loyal and committed to Wife (or you). Otherwise, condoms will be necessary even if pregnancy isn't an issue.