Being squeezed out by a new relationship

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davinci

New member
Hey folks. New to the forum but I consider myself quite experienced with poly relationships. I've never felt jealously or struggled with the concept of Poly. The whole thing makes perfect sense and it has always been very natural to me. The predicament I am facing is when other people in the relationship lose interest in polyamory. I've recently run into some trouble and am looking for advice.

Just over five years ago I began a relationship with with a single partner (Frankie) but we both decided to keep it open. Despite our openness, neither of us ended up engaging with additional partners for the next three years. About two years ago I introduced my partner to an old friend of mine (Iris). Frankie clearly liked Iris romantically and I encouraged them to start hanging out more. I had no romantic interest in Iris but was more than happy at the prospect of them dating Frankie. Eventually the two began dating (making Frankie a 'hinge') and it was great. Although I wasn't dating Iris the three of us hung out often and had a wonderful time together.

After about a year problems started to emerge sadly. Iris began struggling with feelings of jealously towards me. Frankie began feeling guilty when hanging out with me because they knew it made Iris uncomfortable. I didn't feel any jealousy and had faith in the relationship. I provided emotional support for Frankie and Iris. It has now reached the point where Iris has admitted they can no longer engage in a polyamorous relationship.

Forcing Frankie to choose is a horrible thing and I don't want to put them through that but Iris has been encouraging them to break it off with me so they can be monoamous together.

One of the huge appeals to polyamory for me is that no one should ever feel trapped or stuck but Frankie is now in this situation. From my point of view, Iris should step away from the relationship if they no longer feel comfortable with it, but I do not see this happening based on their actions so far. I never want to make Frankie 'choose a favourite' so the only option I see now is to be the bigger person and step away from a 5 year relationship so they can pursue a monoamous relationship. This is really hard, especially as I was the reason they started dating and I was so supportive of their relationship at first. If I had known when they first met that Iris was not going to be comfortable with polyamory, I wouldn't have encouraged the relationship. It feels like I am going to lose Frankie as a direct result of being supportive.

Sorry for the long post. Any advice would be great, but it's also nice to just write this stuff down. Most of my friends dont really understand 'poly problems' so it's difficult to explain it to them. To most monoamous people this tale is just evidence of why polyamory doesnt work, but I know that it can work. Frankie and I were so happy together for three years before Iris and for a year with Iris. It seems harsh that we might lose that despite the fact that we still love each other and still want to be together. Gah. Help!
 
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I think you might want to reframe this. You aren't going to lose your partner because you were supportive. If your partner chooses to end things with you, that's a decision they have made. They are quite capable of telling your old friend that they choose to be polyamorous and that they hope that your old friend will choose to continue with them.

We don't make decisions for other people. If you think that your actions cause this, you are removing your partner's agency. They are the one who is making that decision, if they choose to pursue a closed, monoamorous relationship with your old friend. They are not stuck making a choice between two partners; they are making choices about their individual boundaries, wants, and needs- then you and their other partner can make your decisions from there.

So I would not step back from the relationship. This isn't about you at all. Allow your partner the space to determine what they want, and go from there.

By the way, I see why this forum encourages using names, because man my post looks awfully awkward without them!
 
Vicki82 said:
I think you might want to reframe this. You aren't going to lose your partner because you were supportive.
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You are quite right. I carefully chose the word 'feels' as I know rationally this isn't the case. I'm feeling quite emotional at the moment but I'm trying to keep a level head and tackle this objectively. I do understand that if our relationship ends it will not be because I was supportive of their relationship, I'm just being emotional :s

Vicki82 said:
They are not stuck making a choice between two partners; they are making choices about their individual boundaries, wants, and needs- then you and their other partner can make your decisions from there.
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Your insights are really useful. Thanks for laying it out the way you have.

Also I will add some proxy names :)
 
I'm sorry you struggle.

FWIW? From what I read?

Iris can no longer deal with poly. Iris has done the right thing. They made you all aware that they are at limit. So bowing out. Stated their wish that Frankie also get off the Poly Bus. Maybe go off to be with Iris.

  • Alright. Fair enough. Iris is in charge of Iris. They can stop doing poly if they aren't into it any more.
  • Alright. Fair enough. Iris can wish things. So can anyone else.

So what? You don't have to get upset by that. Iris wishing things doesn't automatically make it so.

Iris picks where Iris goes.

Now Frankie gets to pick what Frankie wants to do.

Forcing Frankie to choose is a horrible thing and I don't want to put them through that but Iris has been encouraging them to break it off with me so they can be monoamous together.
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Iris wants to get off the Poly Bus. I don't see it as "forcing" Frankie do do anything.

Frankie now gets to decide how to deal with Iris leaving. If they want to get off the Poly Bus or keep on with it with you.

It's just part of dating life. Dealing with the things that come up. If Frankie doesn't want to deal in dating stuff? Why does Frankie choose to date then? :confused:

That's not YOU doing things to Frankie.

It's Frankie accepting that dating people comes with a certain amount of dating STUFF to deal with. You could let Frankie deal with Frankie's dating stuff.

One of the huge appeals to polyamory for me is that no one should ever feel trapped or stuck but Frankie is now in this situation.
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HOW is Frankie trapped? :confused:

I get that Frankie might feel sad that Iris is ending the V. But that's not trapping Frankie any.

That's Frankie having to deal with Frankie's Dating Life. Which presumably Frankie is ok dealing with because Frankie dates.

I am going to guess. I might guess wrong.

  • Are you not comfortable watching Frankie upset? Does watching it make you anxious?

  • Are you trying to solve your anxiousness by solving Frankie's problem for them, so you don't have to see Frankie upset, so you don't have to feel anxious seeing it? Like not really about Frankie's upset. More like trying to solve your anxiety "from the back door?"

Do you do behaviors to solve your anxiety more "head on?"

  • Like leaving the room and not being there when Frankie is talking to Iris? Giving her some space?

  • Asking Frankie NOT to tell you stuff from the other side of the V because it stresses you out. You are IN the system, and it's better if Frankie talks to people NOT inside the system?

  • Telling Iris not to tell you their problems with Frankie? Because while you are friends, in this area, you are the other dating partner so it puts you in an awkward position. So be a friend and go talk to someone else about it.

  • Doing your own self care and not cranking your anxiety up what iffing this and that?

From my point of view, Iris should step away from the relationship if they no longer feel comfortable with it, but I do not see this happening based on their actions so far.
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And in my mind? They HAVE stepped away. Basically said "I cannot do poly any more." And waiting to see where the chips fall.

And naturally, they want Frankie to come with.

So... maybe pestering Frankie to hurry up and decide. Maybe being a PITA.

It's on Frankie to tell them to cut that behavior out and not rush Frankie.

That isn't your problem. You are not dating Iris.

I assume Iris has the sense not to talk like in that in front of you. If not, tell her to cut it out.

If FRANKIE is oversharing this data with you, YOU could say to Frankie "Frankie, I feel bad you deal in this, but I cannot be an objective listener when I'm one of the people in the system and I'm friends with Iris. Hella awkward.

I would like you to choose what you want. While I hope it is with me, I will respect what you pick.

At the same time, I need you to respect that I cannot be the listener on this because it hits too close to home on many levels and listening to it makes me anxious. So please talk to other people.

I'm not the sounding board for this one. Please don't put me in that awkward spot. "

You could exercise your personal boundaries. And maybe call it lesson learned -- not to date each other's close friends because it can lead to weird.

I never want to make Frankie 'choose a favourite' so the only option I see now is to be the bigger person and step away from a 5 year relationship so they can pursue a monoamous relationship.
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You don't SOUND like you want to dump Frankie. So why would you? :confused:

You could do NOTHING. And simply wait for Frankie to tell you what Frankie has decided before making your next choices.

Or you could state your hope that you and Frankie can continue together, but will respect whatever Frankie decides and that you are sorry they are in a hard spot right now.

But don't jump the gun when you don't really sound like you want to dump Frankie. It's also not really being "the bigger person" -- it's behaving like Frankie can't make their own choices so you are just gonna up and choose "what is best" for them. Frankie is not your child. Why presume and overstep like that?

This is really hard, especially as I was the reason they started dating and I was so supportive of their relationship at first. If I had known when they first met that Iris was not going to be comfortable with polyamory, I wouldn't have encouraged the relationship.
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You are not a mind reader. You cannot know things ahead of time.

This is not a useful path to think on. So I suggest you not think down that path in your mind. That kind of thinking behavior seems to ADD to your stress rather than TAKE AWAY.

I suggest being in the PRESENT moment, and not chasing "what if I had done this or that in the past" thoughts.

I get that you are upset, and unsure of what might happen next. But you are not responsible for the Iris + Frankie relationship and how it does and does not unfold.

I think you could "back off" and NOT take that responsibility on board for yourself. Not your job.

It feels like I am going to lose Frankie as a direct result of being supportive.
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Now you are jumping to future. When you feel emotional and your mind is jumping around being all "Aaaaahhh!" and upsetting you further? Try to step back from doom thinking. Be PRESENT in the PRESENT moment. Not going back into the past to what if that, not leaping to the future to what if that.

Let things with you + Frankie unfold as they will, and don't jump the gun breaking up with Frankie from nerves or whatever.

Save your energy.

If you and Frankie practice poly, it stands to reason you will date other people.

And sometimes those people won't pan out. So either you or Frankie will be dealing with break ups. You can't let EVERY potential break up put you a tizzy, right? Whether you are the one breaking up or Frankie is the one breaking up. It's part of dating.

Maybe because in those 3 years you didn't date other people, this first time around feels extra stressy? Try to keep perspective.

Frankie and I were so happy together for three years before Iris and for a year with Iris. It seems harsh that we might lose that despite the fact that we still love each other and still want to be together.
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If you and Frankie still love each other and still want to be together? And Iris doesn't want to do poly any more? Where exactly is the problem? :confused:

Trust Frankie will choose to stay with you and will deal with finishing parting ways with Iris themselves.

Again... what's going on with their side of the V is NOT your job to manage.

Give Frankie some space to deal with it. "Back off" that way.

Frankie is their own person and can make their own choices based on this new information coming to light.

I encourage you take a deep breath, sit tight, and let this finish unfolding before you make any rash decisions of your own that just adds to the stress pile.

Trust Frankie will inform you what they decided, and you can make your next choices from there. From ACTUAL information, not "what if this and that" stress.

If it turns out that Frankie ALSO wants to get off the Poly Bus? Deal with that at THAT point in time, if it even comes.

But don't be biting your nails on it right this minute predicting future doom that may or may not actually happen!

What iffing things doesn't help your stress. :(

Galagirl
 
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Sometimes falling on your sword is simply falling on your sword and does no one any actual good.

Iris needs the attitude adjustment and Frankie as hinge should be the one to give it to her. And stop telling you about Iris' demands for a break up with you. However, with the "old friend" aspect of your and Iris' history, you could also talk with her about how unfriendly her behaviour is being.

However, Iris has clearly stated her capability (not being poly) and as much as it sucks, sometimes that means that the hinge, in this case Frankie, has to say - well, I am and will continue to be so all the best, have a lovely life, bye (you get the idea, however blunt this is for writing purposes).

Frankie does have to choose - not between the two of you per se, but between poly and mono.
 
Evie said:
Iris needs the attitude adjustment and Frankie as hinge should be the one to give it to her.
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What attitude needs adjusting? Seems that Iris has been pretty clear about what Iris wants.

davinci said:
Frankie began feeling guilty when hanging out with me because they knew it made Iris uncomfortable.
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Guilt is always an inside job - nobody can make anyone else feel guilty or pressured. If Frankie feels guilty or pressured, then that is Frankie's ball of yarn to untangle, not Iris's and not davinci's. If Frankie is trying to massage Iris's upset over this poly situation so that things can remain status quo, then Frankie has got the adjusting to do. Frankie has some decisions to make, not Iris. Iris has made Iris's position clear.
 
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Hello davinci,

I'm sorry to hear that this is happening to you. I wonder, if I were in your shoes, if I wouldn't feel betrayed by Iris. You were very gracious in your allowing Frankie to develop a relationship with Iris, even encouraging them to do so. Open/poly is a radical notion in mainstream society, and Iris would not normally get such gracious support from someone's partner. I think Iris owes you a huge thanks; instead, Iris repays you with jealousy, and with forcing Frankie to choose. This makes Iris, in my mind, not a good friend. :mad:

Forcing Frankie to choose, is something that Iris is doing, it is not something you are doing. It is entirely possible that in this position, Frankie would rather be with you and would not choose Iris. If you break up with Frankie, it will take away their ability to choose, they will have to choose Iris. That could worsen the situation, so I suggest that you don't do it. If Frankie tells you they want to break up with you, then you could do that. Iris has taken away Frankie's freedom to choose both of you. Don't also take away their freedom to choose which one of you.

Unless, is it possible, that just by thinking about choosing Iris, that Frankie is doing you wrong? Maybe on some level, you're starting to realize that Frankie isn't a good partner for you. Iris has made a dick move, and now Frankie is thinking about rewarding them for it? Maybe they deserve each other. Or, maybe you feel like poly itself has betrayed you, that if you hadn't trusted poly in the first place, you wouldn't now be in a position where *you* have to choose. You have to make a terrible choice. :(

Sorry this is happening to you.
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 
Evie said:
Yes, badly so..
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I still don't get it. Iris is now clear that she wants monogamy. What's the attitude problem?



kdt26417 said:
Forcing Frankie to choose, is something that Iris is doing, it is not something you are doing.
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It's actually something that nobody is doing. Nobody can force anyone to choose. Iris can be clear about her boundaries, which she now is, and Frankie can make choices based on that new information. When someone develops clarity about what she wants, other people are not then "forced" to do anything in response. Other people may feel forced, but that would be because the other people would not have a firm hold on their own needs and boundaries. Frankie has some decisions to make - no force involved.
 
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FallenAngelina said:
I still don't get it. Iris is now clear that she wants monogamy. What's the attitude problem?
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She is betraying her friend davinci by trying to cowgirl Frankie away from davinci. That's kind of rude. Feelings are feelings, but betraying a friend like that is a dick move. Yes, she can request it, but it's still rude and ungrateful, and makes things very awkward for everyone.

It's actually something that nobody is doing. Nobody can force anyone to choose. Iris can be clear about her boundaries, which she now is, and Frankie can make choices based on that new information. When someone develops clarity about what she wants, other people are not then "forced" to do anything in response. Other people may feel forced, but that would be because the other people would not have a firm hold on their own needs and boundaries. Frankie has some decisions to make - no force involved.
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Yeah, Frankie isn't being forced, but they do have a hard choice to make, since Iris has decided she want's davinci's partner all to herself. Some friend.
 
Magdlyn said:
She is betraying her friend davinci by trying to cowgirl Frankie away from davinci.
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I don't see how cowgirling is even possible. If someone wants to leave a poly relationship for a mono relationship, they leave. Nobody can make that happen if the partners aren't willing. I don't intend this at you personally, Mags, but "cowgirl" is just yet one more term we have for the demonization of women's sexuality, which I know you don't go in for. There is no male equivalent. "Cowgirl" speaks to the imaginary power of a woman's sexuality to "steal" someone away from his rightful partner. In truth, no woman has such a power, but the term cowgirl foments the fear that it can be done.
 
FallenAngelina said:
I don't see how cowgirling is even possible. If someone wants to leave a poly relationship for a mono relationship, they leave. Nobody can make that happen if the partners aren't willing. I don't intend this at you personally, Mags, but "cowgirl" is just yet one more term we have for the demonization of women's sexuality, which I know you don't go in for. There is no male equivalent. "Cowgirl" speaks to the imaginary power of a woman's sexuality to "steal" someone away from his rightful partner. In truth, no woman has such a power, but the term cowgirl foments the fear that it can be done.
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Nah, I'm equal opportunity. There are cowboys too.
 
FallenAngelina said:
I don't see how cowgirling is even possible. If someone wants to leave a poly relationship for a mono relationship, they leave. Nobody can make that happen if the partners aren't willing. I don't intend this at you personally, Mags, but "cowgirl" is just yet one more term we have for the demonization of women's sexuality, which I know you don't go in for. There is no male equivalent. "Cowgirl" speaks to the imaginary power of a woman's sexuality to "steal" someone away from his rightful partner. In truth, no woman has such a power, but the term cowgirl foments the fear that it can be done.
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I've honestly never heard the term outside of the literal meaning and the sex position. I'm still not up on all the various lingo.
 
Magdlyn said:
Nah, I'm equal opportunity. There are cowboys too.
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Then nobody but you ever uses that term in reference to a man. All the same, nobody can "steal" away a poly partner and turn them mono. People get into poly, then realize it's not for them - happens all the time. Doesn't mean anyone is betraying anyone or stealing anyone. It's all about information, experience, choices and boundaries. There's no such thing as a cowgirl who can rope a poly man into going mono with her using her deviously powerful magical pussy.
 
Magdlyn said:
LOL

I do get your point though. I still think Iris is being rude.
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Agreed. It's not that I don't understand her position or respect her feelings. I do, they're valid. But the way she's expressing it and the way her actions are manifesting seem to be very unhealthy.
 
SenatorBinks27 said:
the way she's expressing it and the way her actions are manifesting seem to be very unhealthy.
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What about this is unhealthy? Aren't people allowed to try out poly relationships and then decide that poly is not for them? Confessing to feelings of jealousy and choosing monogamy isn't unhealthy, it's communication. Iris is being honest. Frankie's guilt is not Iris' shortcoming, nor anyone else's to manage. Lots of people give poly a good, sincere try and then realize it's not for them. That's not a betrayal or dysfunctional, it's simply an honest communication. Is everyone supposed to commit to lifelong polyamory just because they chose to be in a poly relationship for awhile?

davinci said:
Eventually the two began dating (making Frankie a 'hinge') and it was great......After about a year problems started to emerge sadly. Iris began struggling with feelings of jealously towards me. Frankie began feeling guilty when hanging out with me because they knew it made Iris uncomfortable. I didn't feel any jealousy and had faith in the relationship. I provided emotional support for Frankie and Iris. It has now reached the point where Iris has admitted they can no longer engage in a polyamorous relationship.
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