I'm at a loss about what to do.

[FlowerForest]

Hello, I am new here and still consider myself very new to polyamory. Having some extreme difficulties, so thought I'd try getting some advice.

This is probably going to end up longer than I want it to, but I will try as hard as I can to condense things.

This is a throwaway account, even though none of us have used this forum before. Just want to try to keep this private. Will be changing some info around of course. I know I might get flamed for some of my decisions throughout this, but I am human and I am trying to do the right thing.

I met this guy, Justin, online, by chance. Was not looking and not expecting this. I was instantly drawn to him and we hung out a few times. He let me know he was married (call her Molly). We continued to be friends and hang out a lot, but nothing romantic happened and I kept my strong feelings to myself. I felt we were really close, had a strong connection, and our friendship meant a great, great deal to me. Another old female friend (call her Ashley) of his came into the picture and I started feeling very jealous. I know, I suck. It's not my place or right at all, but feerings. As time went on, I noticed their flirtatious behavior that I got to witness a few times, and increasingly feeling like I was third wheel and interrupting something. And I knew that Molly didn't care for Justin and mine's friendship and was very nice and welcoming with Ashley. I was so confused and hurt. It took a while, because I felt very attached, but I finally decided I needed to leave the friendship because I felt so heartbroken and guilty. I shouldn't have let him know how I felt, but I did end up having to explain (preemptively. I wanted to send a letter but things were slipping through the cracks and he finally asked me straight up).

After some difficulties and conversations, he let me know that his wife had recently decided to explore a new kind of flirtatious thing with other women. Obviously, I knew who that person was even though we didn't talk about it directly for quite some time. They offered to try a similar exploration with me.

Before this I had never really considered poly type stuff, or non-monogamy. I'd briefly thought about it and just automatically assumed it wasn't for me. That it'd be too stressful. However I am also open to knew ideas and different perspectives, adventure and trying new things. I also knew how in love I felt with this guy and he and his wife talked about how it might be a good thing for me to be able to explore and express how I felt after holding things in for so long. I agreed to try it out. It was presented in a "this is an experiment" type of light. I knew things could likely go poorly, but I decided to give it a try.

The rush and excitement of the beginning was intoxicating, it felt amazing. Things went from flirtatious and sexy to expressing love and a more 'official poly' type relationship. We were all new to this, and I felt nervous and strange, and couldn't believe I was trying something like this. I was in that NRE high, hardcore.

Molly of course started to not enjoy this very much. Stuff wasn't very smooth with that, and I feel bad. There was residual tension, as we are both quite shy and introverted and opening up was hard after it not starting out great, but we both tried here and there. I consider myself bi-curious, but not experienced in any real way with women like that. Again, we tried sometimes, but clearly my romantic feelings were for Justin. I craved time to just have with him. It was awkward at times, and still is a little. NRE was cut short (on my end at least) and I was feeling extremely frustrated and already having issues within the first few months.

We almost broke up at that period at Molly's behest. Of course I was heartbroken and cried and tried to express a lot of feelings as I was saying goodbye. I think he wasn't expecting this and has also never had a real break up in his life. They talked again, we continued the relationship.

Things have been really up and down throughout the past two-ish years. My jealousy issues are up and down, but always come up once again. So do Molly's. We almost always spend time as a group (a lot of the time just Ashley, Justin and I). I think Ashley and Molly are wonderful people, and I understand why Justin loves them. I just feel so frustrated, jealous, and guilty all the damn time and it's eating away at my already poor mental health. We've tried more open communication, tried reassurances and grace and kindness, and after all of it I know I am the problem. I want my own partner to have time to be with just us. We've tried scheduling a night, but it's inconsistent and often interrupted or stressful because I feel like I'm doing something wrong. My sexual desire/drive is non-existent (was extremely high in the beginning), so even when we now maybe get a passing chance to do something, I'm not interested. He's my only partner, and I've thought maybe adding a new main for me would help. Finding someone feels impossible, though, and I just don't see waiting around for that to happen as something that's going to work.

I'm losing my mind and we're getting in so many arguments. I feel like I've suppressed jealousy and guilt over and over again and now I'm done with it, and it's causing drama that I don't want to cause.

I have tried to break up probably 3 times, I've tried to take a break many times, but the resistance from both him and his wife makes it feel incredibly difficult to stick to. Especially given that it's not as though I don't still have love or feelings for him. Also because all of our lives have become so intwined and I am a part of so much of what they do everyday now. He wants us to meet before any of this comes to pass, and I sort of get that. Maybe it'd help, or at least put things into perspective.

A few days ago was the most recent time I tried to end the relationship, but instead it ended up as us creating goals together for life/mental health improvements, and for us all to read up on polyamory more (which we never did, I know, that's not great), for better communication again. So, I just couldn't stick to my guns.

The thing is, I don't want him or anyone to change what makes them happy just because of my desires and needs. That's not it, I am trying to express that this isn't compatible, that I want privacy and time to be alone and intimate with one lover at a time. It's not working, and I'm trying to do the right thing. But I'm met with what seems like insurmountable resistance. I am so sad and so tired, and I feel like I've done something horrible, evil and unforgivable. It kills me.
Thanks if you read this.

 

[kdt26417]

Hello FlowerForest,

That's odd that Molly approved of Ashley but not so much of you? I take it Molly decided to explore a new kind of flirtatious thing with another woman, and that woman then offered to explore the same kind of thing with you. Correct me if I got that messed up! or, do you mean that Molly wanted to explore things with women, and then Molly and Justin offered to date you as a couple? I know, I probably messed up what you were trying to say.

Okay, you were (at this point) definitely dating Justin and Molly as a couple. But things didn't go as smoothly with Molly as you had hoped, and you were drawn more and more just to Justin. That part at least I think I got right.

You seem to be struggling with polyamory itself, it makes you feel guilty and jealous. You have strong feelings for Justin and maybe on some level you wish he would leave Molly and Ashley and just be with you. Also your libido has taken a nosedive and I can't tell how much that relates to your struggles with polyamory. It could be a separate issue.

You keep trying to break up with them, but somehow (not the least because of your strong feelings for Justin) the attempts always get turned around so that the three (four including Ashley) of you end up being more united instead of separated.

Right now I am mostly gathering information, and making sure I understand what you've posted here so far. Hopefully I will have more in the way of advice for you as this thread continues. For now, the two things I can think of are that yes, reading more about polyamory will probably help you (and reading/posting on this forum is a part of that). And secondly, that you should try to be more firm about needing more one-on-one time with Justin. So far you all seem to be very group-oriented, and while that sounds nice in theory it doesn't always work in practice.

I can't tell whether polyamory is right for you, or whether it is even something you will eventually be able to endure. Some people are not cut out for polyamory, and that is okay. There is nothing wrong with monogamy. But let's give this thing with Justin and Molly a little more time before making that decision.

Sympathetically,
Kevin T.

 

[FlowerForest]

Hello, thanks for your reply.

Hello FlowerForest,

That's odd that Molly approved of Ashley but not so much of you? I take it Molly decided to explore a new kind of flirtatious thing with another woman, and that woman then offered to explore the same kind of thing with you. Correct me if I got that messed up! or, do you mean that Molly wanted to explore things with women, and then Molly and Justin offered to date you as a couple? I know, I probably messed up what you were trying to say.

So Justin and Molly reignited a friendship with Ashley, they've been friends a long time. What seems like happened is that Ashley told them both she was interested in them, it was probably a mutual sort of thing. They both were having a flirtatious relationship with her to start out, exploring. I started to catch on, at least to Justin and Ashley's new dynamic, which is when I decided I didn't want to be around for that because it hurt, and I didn't know the whole story. When I came clean about my feelings is when Justin and Molly invited me to try something like the same thing. But Molly had had jealousy about me when Justin and I were just friends for a while. I'm also not 100% really bi, and things were awkward. Ashley and I are friends because we spend so much time together, but there's no flirtatious aspect to it. So this couple is basically with her, and then his wife and I are trying to become better friends and to see what kind of relationship we can build, be it just friends or eventually something different, and I am Justin's girlfriend.

Okay, you were (at this point) definitely dating Justin and Molly as a couple. But things didn't go as smoothly with Molly as you had hoped, and you were drawn more and more just to Justin. That part at least I think I got right.

Kind of, though initially I was really drawn to Justin and communicated how I felt about that.

You seem to be struggling with polyamory itself, it makes you feel guilty and jealous. You have strong feelings for Justin and maybe on some level you wish he would leave Molly and Ashley and just be with you. Also your libido has taken a nosedive and I can't tell how much that relates to your struggles with polyamory. It could be a separate issue.

"On some level"... I don't know, maybe there's some underlying thing like that, but ultimately I don't want to hurt people. At this point, I would either rather find a partner that can offer the things I need and have that be my primary, or just end things and find a single, mono guy.

You keep trying to break up with them, but somehow (not the least because of your strong feelings for Justin) the attempts always get turned around so that the three (four including Ashley) of you end up being more united instead of separated.

Right now I am mostly gathering information, and making sure I understand what you've posted here so far. Hopefully I will have more in the way of advice for you as this thread continues. For now, the two things I can think of are that yes, reading more about polyamory will probably help you (and reading/posting on this forum is a part of that). And secondly, that you should try to be more firm about needing more one-on-one time with Justin. So far you all seem to be very group-oriented, and while that sounds nice in theory it doesn't always work in practice.

I can't tell whether polyamory is right for you, or whether it is even something you will eventually be able to endure. Some people are not cut out for polyamory, and that is okay. There is nothing wrong with monogamy. But let's give this thing with Justin and Molly a little more time before making that decision.

Sympathetically,
Kevin T.

Thanks again for your reply. Just feeling like I keep trying and I'm struggling with a lot of other things like sadness and depression, making this all seem too overwhelming to overcome.

 

[kdt26417]

Hi FlowerForest,

It sounds like Ashley is now romantically connected to both Justin and Molly. So that happened first, and then Justin and Molly invited you too to be romantically connected to both of them. In the meantime, you are just platonic friends with Ashley.

I don't think you want to hurt anyone, it's just that you may have a subconscious wish that Ashley and Molly could somehow be removed from the picture without hurting them. Right now, you are trying to be polyamorous with them, but it is very difficult.

The situation is hurting you, and because it is hurting you, you are thinking you should leave it and then find a monogamous guy, or at least a polyamorous guy who won't hurt you and will meet your needs. These are reasonable things to want. No one wants to be hurt all the time.

I don't think you should give up on this (four-person) situation just yet, but I do think you should be more firm about your needs. Right now you need more one-on-one time with Justin. You are Justin's girlfriend, and one-on-one time with him should be part of that.

I hear you when you say you are also struggling with things like sadness and depression. Is there any chance you could start seeing a therapist for help with those kinds of things? You may even be able to take a prescription med that would help with that -- if you aren't opposed to the idea of taking prescription meds.

Anyway those are my latest thoughts.
Regards,
Kevin T.

 

[GalaGirl]

I mean this kindly ok? You sound like you want to break up and end it all.

Could let go of the idea of a "nice and mutual" break up. It only takes one person to end it. Other people do not have to like it. Your consent to participate in things or not belongs to YOU. So end it. Block their numbers, email, social media, all of it so they cannot contact you and suck you back in.

Do not JADE. (Justify, argue, defend, or explain.)

Just be done. Stand firm.

If you allowed your life to revolve around this group, and neglected old connections you might be lonely for a bit.

Reconnect with old friends and make new. Touch base with family, ask a coworker to lunch.

Remind yourself you can connect with OTHER people.

this isn't compatible, that I want privacy and time to be alone and intimate with one lover at a time. It's not working, and I'm trying to do the right thing.

This doesn't sound like it was healthy poly. Every dyad needs time on its own. It's ok to have grown tired of this dynamic.

So do what is best for you. Create some space away from them so you can have privacy, time alone, and date who you want to date when you are healed.

But I'm met with what seems like insurmountable resistance. I am so sad and so tired, and I feel like I've done something horrible, evil and unforgivable. It kills me.

So what? They are your exes.

You are not obligated to comfort them through their break up grief. Then you aren't being an ex.

It is NOT appropriate for them to expect the ex to do this emotional labor. You have your OWN break up grief to process.

If they are doing the "Nooooo! Say it isn't sooooo!" resistance because they struggle to accept a break up? They are in denial stage of grief? That's their thing to manage. Not yours.

You don't throw your OWN well being back under the bus just to comfort them. They can comfort each other, turn to other friends, seek a counselor, etc.

Taking care of your own well being is NOT you doing anything horrible, evil, or unforgivable.

These exes or soon to be exes not being able to handle a break up is NOT your doing or responsible.

Why do you have to responsible for other people's emotional management?

 

[SEASONEDpolyAgain]

Why did you try and have a sexual/romantic relationship with Molly? Who thought that was a good idea?

 

[MeeraReed]

Hi OP, I am sorry you have experienced all these ups and downs and stresses.

Unfortunately, I think your answer is clear: you need to break up with these people and move on with your life.

You can surely find a guy who does not require that you also date his wife when you are not even (100%) bi.

Most experienced poly people do not actually need to date as a couple. A married poly man can have a girlfriend (or even two or more girlfriends or boyfriends, etc) without the girlfriend needing to be involved with his wife at all. My partner has several other partners and his relationships are totally separate; his partners do not need to interact with me at all, much less hang out all the time, much less also have sex with me (which would be super awkward because like you, I am not bi!)

It sounds really annoying at best and deeply problematic at worst that you have to hang out with either/both his wife and his other girlfriend all the time and have no time for just you & the guy. Most healthy poly people spend plenty of one-on-one time with each of their partners.

You sound unhappy and it is clearly not working. You have clearly tried and it is still clearly not working.

The fact that they won't "let" you break up with them is gross to me. You don't need his or their permission. Text him that it's over, that you've tried repeatedly to end things and now your decision is final. Then block them both (or all three of them with the other woman too).

Think how happy you will be when you don't have to deal with any of this anymore.

You can meet an emotionally healthy person who loves you.

 

[Evie]

If you've tried to extricate yourself at least three times from this relationship, have you considered just saying, "it's over" and then blocking their numbers? Give yourself space to release those feelings you have for Justin?

Or go almost parallel poly? Get together with the other partners only for special occasions. Only spend time with him (since this sounds like a significant part of what you want, and in most poly relationships would be an absolute given). Would a regularly scheduled night for 1-1 time once a week be enough, or would you chafe at his inability to be spontaneous? If you were spending regular but limited time with him, could you see yourself dating someone else, too? Would you eventually find that you'd been using Justin as a "filler" before becoming monogamous with an as yet unknown partner? Or could you be a hinge partner (who doesn't rely on continual group activities)?

But overall, it sounds like you're done. Like, really done.

 

[Magdlyn]

You jumped into this attempt at "polyamory" without educating yourself in the least about it. That is really the only "bad" thing, or mistake, you made. If you had read up even a little, you would have found out that these kinds of attempts at being a shared gf of an established couple rarely, almost never, work out.

You and Molly's hearts weren't in it, right from the beginning. You both love Justin and he wants multiple female partners, so you both thought the only way to be his objects of affection was to do threeway sex, to please him. Neither of you are bisexual. At best, you were slightly bi-curious. Now that time has gone by, you (singular) have found threeway sex, and even constant threeway dating, to be so repugnant and dissatisfying, that your entire libido has shut down!

Listen to your own heart, listen to your body. You can suppress feelings, but they will come out in physical ways.

You and Molly are not compatible as sex partners. You are kinda friends, but not really. You're just doing all of this to be able spend time with Justin. That is going against your true nature.

You deserve better. You deserve a man who wants to spend time with you one-on-one. Why are you being unkind to yourself? I could not agree more with GG, break up, short and clean. You're done. Go no contact. If they want to flounder on with Ashley, they can do that. It's not your business.

We are only given one life. This isn't a dress rehearsal. Be good to yourself, respect yourself. Don't worry about "hurting" them. You're hurting yourself by staying in this painful configuration. Stop it. Move on and find something better.

If you do want to explore polyamory, keep reading here. But even better, get the book Opening Up. It covers all kinds of open relationships, including swinging and polyamory.

 

[Inaniel]

I know you said it’s a burner account so I just want to make you aware that on this website you do not have autonomy over your own content like most other sites. So you cannot burn your account. You are not allowed to edit your content after a period of time has passed.

Please keep that in mind as you continue to post here.

As for your situation, if the conversation never seems to go the way you intend it to go in person you can try writing a letter that contains exactly what you want to say.

It sounds like this situation is toxic for you. I hope you are able to find a way to communicate that effectively to everyone involved.

 

[FlowerForest]

Why did you try and have a sexual/romantic relationship with Molly? Who thought that was a good idea?

That was kind of the terms at the beginning. We could explore feelings and stuff and sex, but it would be his wife and I becoming closer and trying to have fun with the three of us. I was so excited and it seemed like something I could explore at the time.

 

[FlowerForest]

Hi OP, I am sorry you have experienced all these ups and downs and stresses.

Unfortunately, I think your answer is clear: you need to break up with these people and move on with your life.

You can surely find a guy who does not require that you also date his wife when you are not even (100%) bi.

Most experienced poly people do not actually need to date as a couple. A married poly man can have a girlfriend (or even two or more girlfriends or boyfriends, etc) without the girlfriend needing to be involved with his wife at all. My partner has several other partners and his relationships are totally separate; his partners do not need to interact with me at all, much less hang out all the time, much less also have sex with me (which would be super awkward because like you, I am not bi!)

It sounds really annoying at best and deeply problematic at worst that you have to hang out with either/both his wife and his other girlfriend all the time and have no time for just you & the guy. Most healthy poly people spend plenty of one-on-one time with each of their partners.

You sound unhappy and it is clearly not working. You have clearly tried and it is still clearly not working.

The fact that they won't "let" you break up with them is gross to me. You don't need his or their permission. Text him that it's over, that you've tried repeatedly to end things and now your decision is final. Then block them both (or all three of them with the other woman too).

Think how happy you will be when you don't have to deal with any of this anymore.

You can meet an emotionally healthy person who loves you.

Thank you so much for your kind and supportive reply. I'm realizing more and more that I am just done.

 

[FlowerForest]

If you've tried to extricate yourself at least three times from this relationship, have you considered just saying, "it's over" and then blocking their numbers? Give yourself space to release those feelings you have for Justin?

Or go almost parallel poly? Get together with the other partners only for special occasions. Only spend time with him (since this sounds like a significant part of what you want, and in most poly relationships would be an absolute given). Would a regularly scheduled night for 1-1 time once a week be enough, or would you chafe at his inability to be spontaneous? If you were spending regular but limited time with him, could you see yourself dating someone else, too? Would you eventually find that you'd been using Justin as a "filler" before becoming monogamous with an as yet unknown partner? Or could you be a hinge partner (who doesn't rely on continual group activities)?

But overall, it sounds like you're done. Like, really done.

Parallel poly isn't something that is going to fly with Molly. So I tried compromise, still hanging out almost every day with the group and having one day where I just spend time with him. But like I said, that has been inconsistent and interrupted and always has some kind of problem surrounding it. So much so that I now feel guilty and don't enjoy myself.

So I think I am just done.

 

[FlowerForest]

You jumped into this attempt at "polyamory" without educating yourself in the least about it. That is really the only "bad" thing, or mistake, you made. If you had read up even a little, you would have found out that these kinds of attempts at being a shared gf of an established couple rarely, almost never, work out.

You and Molly's hearts weren't in it, right from the beginning. You both love Justin and he wants multiple female partners, so you both thought the only way to be his objects of affection was to do threeway sex, to please him. Neither of you are bisexual. At best, you were slightly bi-curious. Now that time has gone by, you (singular) have found threeway sex, and even constant threeway dating, to be so repugnant and dissatisfying, that your entire libido has shut down!

Listen to your own heart, listen to your body. You can suppress feelings, but they will come out in physical ways.

You and Molly are not compatible as sex partners. You are kinda friends, but not really. You're just doing all of this to be able spend time with Justin. That is going against your true nature.

You deserve better. You deserve a man who wants to spend time with you one-on-one. Why are you being unkind to yourself? I could not agree more with GG, break up, short and clean. You're done. Go no contact. If they want to flounder on with Ashley, they can do that. It's not your business.

We are only given one life. This isn't a dress rehearsal. Be good to yourself, respect yourself. Don't worry about "hurting" them. You're hurting yourself by staying in this painful configuration. Stop it. Move on and find something better.

If you do want to explore polyamory, keep reading here. But even better, get the book Opening Up. It covers all kinds of open relationships, including swinging and polyamory.

Thank you for your reply. You are right about all of this. I do want to check out that book, still.

 

[FlowerForest]

I know you said it’s a burner account so I just want to make you aware that on this website you do not have autonomy over your own content like most other sites. So you cannot burn your account. You are not allowed to edit your content after a period of time has passed.

Please keep that in mind as you continue to post here.

As for your situation, if the conversation never seems to go the way you intend it to go in person you can try writing a letter that contains exactly what you want to say.

It sounds like this situation is toxic for you. I hope you are able to find a way to communicate that effectively to everyone involved.

I initially wrote this for reddit, so I just kept that part in and changed the wording. I doubt anyone involved will visit this site, so that's fine. Thank you for your response!