New to forum, old to poly, needing desperate help figuring out my sh1t

[WildShroom]

Hello everyone!

Not-so-short descripton of where i come from and where i am now.

I am a queer 36yo guy from greece. I am pansexual but mostly developing sexual relationships with women. I have been poly since my first relationship 17 years ago and mostly identifying with relationship anarchy. Since then, i firmly stood by my poly identity and (mostly) chose parntners who would accept this. My most common patern is to be a hinge between two or three women who whould only ocationaly have other parnters. Having a lot of poly experience in my opinion also means making many mistakes including hurting people and reaching polysaturation and burnout.
Right now, i am in a long relationship of 9 years and in a new relationship of 6 months.
The new one sparkles and inspires me a lot and it is steadily taking more and more space and time. It needs to grow and for a change i really feel i want to be available for that. She does have some second thoughts though about the whole poly thingy even though she comes from a solo poly background.

In the old one there is still a lot of love and care and even sexyness. She has accepted most of my past partners and given some space for the new relationship while dealing with the nre in the air. But now she is standing her ground and demands more time and presence and shared activities and travels.

I feel they both deserve all that. They both dont want anonther partner at the time and they both prioritize me asking for space, time and growth and i feel like shit because i cant be everywhere and do everything good. I am in a tight spot and i desperately want some feedback from poly people because i am considering splitting up with both of them and this really breaks my heart. Is there a way that this can be viable? How do we overcome the power imbalances of the hinge structure? How can this not be antagonistic between my partners if they feel they have to compete for my attention and energy?

 

[Evie]

At first glance this is seeming like a calendar issue...enough time for each partner (and enough time for yourself to also recharge and do personal care things). All this outside of work demands.

Are you really aware of your availability? How much quality time you have to then budget between both people?

The second layer is probably affordability and making sure you have the wherewithal for the choices of activities, because it's not fun being just home watching TV together all the time.

Similar question to above, but with finances.

If you are at the point you feel like a solution is to break up with both of them, you probably have some unrecognised boundaries being crossed. Boundaries are like your hard lines that keep you safe and sane. It sounds like the demands on your time are threatening that inner peace but you haven't been able to quite come to an acceptable compromise with either person over when, where and for how long.

Sometimes, the demands for time from our relationship partners aren't actually for more time, even if that's what they are asking for. It's for *better* time. Being fully present with each other. Phone away. Listening. Sharing. Intimacy on all levels. They're asking for more time, but perhaps they are asking for more intimate presence?

 

[kdt26417]

Greetings WildShroom,
Welcome to our forum.

It sounds like you need to strike a compromise between your two partners; if either of them gets as much of your time as she really wants, the other will get shortchanged. I'm afraid they'll both have to be a little disappointed in that area; you'll just have to divide up your time in a way that is fair; there's not enough hours in a day to attain the ideal. The best you can do to make up for this, is focus on the quality (rather than quantity) of the time you spend with each partner. Of course breaking up with both of them would be fair, but not ideal.

Sincerely,
Kevin T

(There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!)

 

[WildShroom]

Greetings WildShroom,
Welcome to our forum.

It sounds like you need to strike a compromise between your two partners; if either of them gets as much of your time as she really wants, the other will get shortchanged. I'm afraid they'll both have to be a little disappointed in that area; you'll just have to divide up your time in a way that is fair; there's not enough hours in a day to attain the ideal. The best you can do to make up for this, is focus on the quality (rather than quantity) of the time you spend with each partner. Of course breaking up with both of them would be fair, but not ideal.

Sincerely,
Kevin T

(There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!)

Hello and thanks for the greeting and the quality over quantity tip. there is work to be done there for sure.
I know there is supposed to be compromises from all sides, i just cant shake off the feeling of being cornered at the moment. I thought this kind of dealing would get easier after all these years so i am stunned by the opposite. Anyway, i will do some more research also in the posts you suggested.

 

[WildShroom]

At first glance this is seeming like a calendar issue...enough time for each partner (and enough time for yourself to also recharge and do personal care things). All this outside of work demands.

Are you really aware of your availability? How much quality time you have to then budget between both people?

The second layer is probably affordability and making sure you have the wherewithal for the choices of activities, because it's not fun being just home watching TV together all the time.

Similar question to above, but with finances.

If you are at the point you feel like a solution is to break up with both of them, you probably have some unrecognised boundaries being crossed. Boundaries are like your hard lines that keep you safe and sane. It sounds like the demands on your time are threatening that inner peace but you haven't been able to quite come to an acceptable compromise with either person over when, where and for how long.

Sometimes, the demands for time from our relationship partners aren't actually for more time, even if that's what they are asking for. It's for *better* time. Being fully present with each other. Phone away. Listening. Sharing. Intimacy on all levels. They're asking for more time, but perhaps they are asking for more intimate presence?

You have good points about the availability, energy, and time budgets.
But it is so hard for me to accept that maybe i cant support having two partners. And i try to understand if there are things to try before that conclusion.

There is truth also in the fact that the choice of activities shared is super important.
There are options and possibilities there with both relationships..

I have some serious concerns though about the hinge structure that i seem to fall in consistently.
Like how can the power dynamic between me and my partners ever be healthy. For example, when they are both centering me in their lives they are time-wise mostly always more available than me. So most of the time i am the one dictating the amount of time we share and that is unfair.

In terms of intimacy and presence i think i am doing ok, though there are many ways to be intimate and present.. My less strong part is making bigger plans and taking initiative to imagine shared futures. I seem to prefer to be invited to stuff, which is easier and very privilleged and keep partners who can't or won't compete for my time and attention dissatisfied. Hard pattern to break but feels increasingly important.

I have also come to notice a contradiction, especially with my recent new relationship. I have a fear of going deeper and exploring new ways to connect and to share more because of the imbalance that it will bring to the relational situation with my older partner. How do i overcome this? Like, from the fear of creating some kind of hierarchy, i deny or put a limit to the deepening of some relationship. But this is a form of hierarchy no?
I wonder if there are colectively safer, more conscious and full hearted ways to venture in these waters..

 

[Magdlyn]

Hi WildShroom,

Do you go foraging for wild mushrooms in Greece? I wonder what kind you find.

Right now, i am in a long relationship of 9 years and in a new relationship of 6 months.
The new one sparkles and inspires me a lot and it is steadily taking more and more space and time. It needs to grow and for a change i really feel i want to be available for that.

"For a change?" Were your former relationships kept in a small "secondary" box until now, to please your established partner?

She does have some second thoughts though about the whole poly thingy, even though she comes from a solo poly background.

Is she not really polyamorous, but kind of playing the field until she finds "The One," just calling herself poly? Is that what you mean?

In the old one there is still a lot of love and care and even sexyness. She has accepted most of my past partners and given some space for the new relationship while dealing with the NRE in the air. But now she is standing her ground and demands more time and presence and shared activities and travels.

I think it's uncomfortable for you to be dating a jealous envious mono person who wants a mono partner. That's how it looks from here.

I feel they both deserve all that. They both don't want another partner at the time and they both prioritize me asking for space, time and growth, and i feel like shit because i cant be everywhere and do everything good.

Of course you feel bad! You're just one person, being pulled at, stretching to the breaking point. People who date poly people need to be pretty independent, with lots of friends to do things with, with interesting hobbies and so on. Compelling jobs, maybe kids to take care of, a love of independent travel, perhaps. If they depend on poly you to be their committed, almost always available activity partner, they are going to be disappointed.

I am in a tight spot and i desperately want some feedback from poly people, because i am considering splitting up with both of them, and this really breaks my heart. Is there a way that this can be viable? How do we overcome the power imbalances of the hinge structure? How can this not be antagonistic between my partners if they feel they have to compete for my attention and energy?

I'm afraid it's going to continue to be antagonistic unless they change a lot. And no one should try to change their partner, or expect them to change to make our lives easier. Accept them for who they are. Start to think about the fact that you are incompatible.

Creating a space for more independence is key. This short to the point article explains how to detangle:

https://polyamory.com/threads/most-skipped-step-full-article.157088/

 

[Tinwen]

What were your agreements with you "old" partner regarding the other relationships? Did you ever talk about the possibility of someone rising to co-primary status? Did she accept your other relationships under the condition that they remain less important and entangled? Now that someone wants to become as important as her, you both know that was never the deal'?

(I do have a lot of sympathy for all of you.)

 

[WildShroom]

What were your agreements with you "old" partner regarding the other relationships? Did you ever talk about the possibility of someone rising to co-primary status? Did she accept your other relationships under the condition that they remain less important and entangled? Now that someone wants to become as important as her, you both know that was never the deal'?

(I do have a lot of sympathy for all of you.)

Ah thank you for you sympathy..

It is interesting what you say because we never officially had a primary relationship. I identify with relationship anarchy. My old partner came into poly when she met me. She accepted it, talked openly about and met some of my other partners in the years that followed. She has generally had loving and friendly but also some antagonistic relationships with her metamours. I can admit though that through these 9 years i have given her a lot of priority, sometimes to the expense of other relationships. This is something i have received as feedback from them and something i have also processed with her. In theory there is acknowledgment but in practice there is resistance when things start to threaten her position.

 

[WildShroom]

Do you go foraging for wild mushrooms in Greece? I wonder what kind you find.

I love foraging for mushrooms in the greek automn mountains! My favourites taste wise are lacrtarius but the whole fungus queendom is just so magical to explore.

"For a change?" Were your former relationships kept in a small "secondary" box until now, to please your established partner?

Hmm not entirely.. by that i mean that i have felt polysaturated in the past and this has blocked and closed me up a lot after a point. And for the last years i couldn't commit with the other people i was connecting eroticaly. So in a sense i did keep them in a smaller box. Not by her demand but probably also not by accident.

Is she not really polyamorous, but kind of playing the field until she finds "The One," just calling herself poly? Is that what you mean?

I think it's uncomfortable for you to be dating a jealous envious mono person who wants a mono partner. That's how it looks from here.

I dont think she is monogamous. She has had other partners and fooled around with people in the past. This is not her priority now though.. now she just wants me. Just like my new partner. Maybe things have shifted and we need to reevaluate.

Also it wouldnt be fair to call her a jealous and envious mono. I have shared with her other stories and troubles through most of my poly life and she has listened and stood by me and gave good advice as a true friend even when sentimentaly involved. I think she does have some hierarchical residues that need work and i think we are in a complicated situation that brings them to the surface.

Of course you feel bad! You're just one person, being pulled at, stretching to the breaking point. People who date poly people need to be pretty independent, with lots of friends to do things with, with interesting hobbies and so on. Compelling jobs, maybe kids to take care of, a love of independent travel, perhaps. If they depend on poly you to be their committed, almost always available activity partner, they are going to be disappointed.

I'm afraid it's going to continue to be antagonistic unless they change a lot. And no one should try to change their partner, or expect them to change to make our lives easier. Accept them for who they are. Start to think about the fact that you are incompatible.

For this i am afraid you are right.. there is some good level of independence required. And they are doing what they can i guess. Incompatibility in this moment is a thing that i am considering with both my partners.. but the fact that i love two people very much and they both love me too and that i am considering i should maybe break up with both drives me crazy.

I will check out the article you suggest. Thanks for engaging!

 

[Tinwen]

Ah thank you for you sympathy..

It is interesting what you say because we never officially had a primary relationship. I identify with relationship anarchy. My old partner came into poly when she met me. She accepted it, talked openly about and met some of my other partners in the years that followed. She has generally had loving and friendly but also some antagonistic relationships with her metamours. I can admit though that through these 9 years i have given her a lot of priority, sometimes to the expense of other relationships. This is something i have received as feedback from them and something i have also processed with her. In theory there is acknowledgment but in practice there is resistance when things start to threaten her position.

Then you should talk to her upfront about wanting to elevate your newer relationship to co-primary (although, after 6 months, it's a little early), if that's what you want to do. She might have some grieving to do. Then set firmer boundaries about allocating YOUR time. It's a bit mean, but they will have to deal with it, and maybe if you can improve both quality and predictability, it will make up somewhat for lower availability.
Alternatively, also make some adjustments in other areas of your life. My partner (who's also a hinge to two monogamish-oriented women) has homeoffice, I think it helps a lot.

I think it's very normal to be kind of poly-friendly yet wanting to be first/ primary/ not wanting to lose one's position. She had that priviledge for quite some time. It's hard to give it up.
Meta had to do it from an even worse position, because their arrangements were kinda hierarchical on paper, so when I fell in love with Idealist and subsequently he with me, and the relationship made it past two years or so, eventually she had to accept that things are not what she imagined. For that reason, we're not a showcase of ethical polyamory.

And it's also not like people are immune to "wanting more" in relationships, even if those relationships do have clear parameters That goes for both of your girls - and maybe, in some ways, also for yourself. Maybe you want more time with your newer partner (since NRE is going strong at 6 months), but are not really able to fit that time into your schedule.
I've been going through similar feeling with my secondary/kink partners, and it's hard.

For this i am afraid you are right.. there is some good level of independence required. And they are doing what they can i guess. Incompatibility in this moment is a thing that i am considering with both my partners.. but the fact that i love two people very much and they both love me too and that i am considering i should maybe break up with both drives me crazy.

Why do you consider incompatibility? With both? Just because they both want more of you?
What do you really want?
Co-primary? To keep your level of commitment with your first partner, therefore restricting the other relationship? To immerse yourself in the new relationship and actually break up/detangle from old partner? Or is it just to get some rest? Because, if overwhelm is the only reason, wanting to break up with both sounds somewhat like an escape.

 

[GalaGirl]

I don't know if this helps you any.

I think you could be clear about the time you can give to a partner. It doesn't have to be these exact days, and it could mix up every quarter or semester. But it could be--

• Mon - Time for yourself to rest, be alone, be with friends or family, etc.
• Tues -- Date with Apple
• Wed-- Date with Banana
• Thurs -- Time for yourself to rest, be alone, be with friends or family, etc.
• Fri-- Date with Apple
• Sat -- Date with Banana
• Sun-- Time for yourself at home to rest, do chores, and set up for the week.

Basically, 2 dates a week for each partner, and 3 days for you, because you need rest.

But now she is standing her ground and demands more time and presence and shared activities and travels.

You are clear that can do 2 days a week, and then travel depends on how many vacation days you get from work.

If you get three weeks? That's a week for traveling with Apple, a week for traveling with Banana, and a week for you alone or with your friends/family.

You could get good at saying, "No, I am not able to do that. I'm sorry to disappoint you," and letting the partner have whatever feelings they have about that honest statement. They may not love hearing this, but they can trust you are a person of your word.

They both don't want another partner at this time.

That's their business. They each have the option to date other people besides you. When they choose to exercise that option is up to each of them.

and they both prioritize me asking for space, time and growth

They have to ask. They can't be mind readers. But it's on you to be clear about what time you actually can give. Be honest and don't overbook yourself.

I know there is supposed to be compromises from all sides,

No. Reasonable compromise is for popsicle problems, low level stuff. Like, there's one left in the box, and we both want it, so we agree to split it. Neither of us gets the whole thing, even though that's what we want. But we can get a new box later at the store, and then we'd each get a whole popsicle. So splitting this one doesn't have to be a big deal.

You do not compromise on your values, your need for rest, your healths, etc. Some things are not negotiable, and it's not your job as hinge to run around tending to people while burning your own self out. You count as a person too. Tend to your own self first. You cannot pour from an empty cup.

But it is so hard for me to accept that maybe I can't support having two partners.

Not necessarily. You might be fine supporting two partners, just not these two. Personalities and wants/needs are going to vary person to person. It affects compatibility.

How are you supporting and prioritizing your own self? Your own well-being? Do you think about your own wellness? Not like being selfish. But actually doing your own self care?

the fact that I love two people very much, and they both love me too, and that I am considering I should maybe break up with both drives me crazy.

Love alone is not enough. There have to be other compatibilities for a sustainable relationship. Love is certainly an ingredient, but it isn't the only one needed.

Take some time to think this out. Make sure you count yourself and your well-being in the mix, as well. Do not self-abandon in service to others.

Whatever you ultimately decide, I hope things get better for you.

Galagirl