A little advice please-- going from threesomes to polyamory

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Newtoexplore24

New member
I'm/we're finding ourselves in what is or might be, as in we are very early in, a poly relationship. It is wonderful and frightening and I'd like a little advice please.
A little background. We've been together for 10 years and married for 1. We are very much in love, more than ever. And I feel confident we are both secure in that. Although current shifts have led me to feeling less secure, not in the love we share, but just within the relationship. This might make more sense as I continue. We've never considered poly, but have had a loosely open relationship on occasions. My wife, prior to marriage, had occasional hookups with men. This was fully consensual on both parts, occasionally we'd do this together, other times she'd venture out alone, only ever for an evening. We have also visited a club twice. Jealousy was never a problem, and it was shared and exciting and liberating and a journey of self discovery for us both. But we have not done this for 4 years and and talked about it before the wedding and it wasn't in our plans as we wanted the focus to be us.
About 4 months ago I said that her being with someone again was in my mind at times. She listened, but said she wasn't really thinking like that still but we had a gentle and open conversation. A few days later she sais she'd been thinking about it more and didn't want to persue this with men, but had always had thoughts of exploring with another woman, and would like to try that. A few days later she joined a lesbian dating app and began to tentatively explore, being quite open that she was looking for casual hookups. An early match discussed that their was a mutual interest from their photos but was looking for something very different. They were 200 miles away, so casual meets seemed unlikely, and they were also following health and relationship issues not looking for anything romantic or sexual, but for a travel buddy who might hopefully become a friend too. Not a match in terms of what each was looking for. But they continued to chat. Chats became friendly, there was a spark, shared humour, it felt like an online friendship. So they discussed at least meeting. That led to mild flirtation and a plan to meet. It seemed like both were changing what they were perhaps looking for. After about 2 months of messages they met for a 5 day break about halfway. Easy for one or both to leave if not right, though that never seemed likely. They connected. It's not fair for me to try and discuss that, as I'm not part of that dynamic. My wife has been very open about the 5 days, I trust what she has said implicitly. She was also totally honest about me/us, that she's married, in love, secure, but wanting to explore.
Though it's not for me to analyse, I think my wife's openess about our relationship made her friend able to be more available than she expected to be, as they were able to open up to something whilst clearly not wanting a relationship themselve. As that was not being offered or asked for, things could happen out in the open. For my wife, she could also be freer, knowing that a relationship was not being sought. They had a wonderful 5 days and clearly hoped they would see each other again. They had both found a new friend. And sexually, something new had also opened up for each of them. My wife learnt much about a part of herself she had always left hidden, her friend rediscovered elements of herself she had put aside, thinking she'd done so for good.
There was a potential to meet again 4 or 5 weeks later. At this point I said I was ok with that, but would like to meet them first. This was different from the initial plan to meet someone casually and explore. This was quite an intense 5 days, soon to be repeated. Distance made it tricky but not impossible. So a second weekend was arranged only 10 days after the first meet, where they had 2 nights together before I went to join them for a meal. I found the first 5 day visit very hard. Harder than I expected. I found the second easier, it was shorter, and I was partially included. But also harder as it was an unseen development. But we had a lovely 4 hours all together. I liked them a lot, felt easy.
That was 3 weeks ago, currently my wife is abroad for 3 nights again.
I must say there are difficulties, but there is also excitement. We don't know exactly what this is or might become. They only actually met 5 weeks ago. But they are getting closer. We are both going to stay for 2 nights in 2 weeks to spend time all together. She is gay, my wife is bi, this is not about nor never will be about threesomes. There is a deep love between my wife and I, there is a growing closeness between my wife and her friend. There are different pressures and insecurities being felt by all of us. We are also spending a week together in the summer as 3 people. We are working out how that might look and what shape or shapes it may take.
But I would like some advice on how to handle partially sharing the person I love. There is potential friendship and care between the 2 of us on the edges, we share some attributes, we both understand the other's feelings, we are mutually respectful. But the dynamic is very much an us and a them, not a 3. And I have fears and insecurities in this. I miss my wife when she's away, there is jealousy, though not really sexually; it is the micro-intimacies that I find harder. It is very important to stress that everything that has happened has been totally open, I've been, and felt, included. There has been no truckery or infidelity. This makes some, but not all, of this easier. As there is still confusion about feelings. And there is contradiction between logic and feeling, between the intellect and emotion, between the head and heart. And my wife has listened to my thoughts and feelings, and our friend has also listend, a little to me, but I've not wanted to crowd, and to what my wife says about us and me. And has shown care and respect. Any thoughts welcome, sorry about the length.
 
Hello Newtoexplore24,

There's not much to partially sharing the person you love, other than how to be okay with it and that just takes time. You are doing a mix of all three of you and of just your wife and this other woman. That is probably a good approach. This woman is long-distance, so there are limits on how much your wife can be with her. Just allow it to happen, and look for things to occupy yourself with when they're away. And give yourself time to get used to this.

Kind regards,
Kevin T.
 
It's not the same, but you could remind yourself you already share your wife with other people. She loves her friends, relatives and so on.

They only actually met 5 weeks ago. But they are getting closer. We are both going to stay for 2 nights in 2 weeks to spend time all together. She is gay, my wife is bi, this is not about nor never will be about threesomes.
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We are also spending a week together in the summer as 3 people. We are working out how that might look and what shape or shapes it may take.
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Why are you even doing this 2-day trip to hang out with all 3, and then for a week later in summer? What's wrong with slowing down, doing parallel poly for a while, with the hinge seeing you separately? Or just doing a short friendly video call to put a face to the name and leave it at that for a time?

Over time, you and the Friend might be willing to do garden party poly -- like you and the Friend go to a fancy restaurant for Wife's bday. A 1-2 hour dinner together is not a big deal, especially if it's just once a year or so.

Over more time, you might develop into a kitchen-table poly dynamic, if people get along well enough for that, where once a year you might do a week's vacation together with at least two hotel rooms on different floors, and Wife splits her time between the two, if not 3 separate rooms. And other times you might have a movie and pizza night, or board games, or something.

But neither garden-party poly or KTP poly are requirements.

Are you and Wife kinda rushing KTP just because it's the easiest way to imagine? "Just like us before, but with 3 friends together instead!"

You might read poly hell together.

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for
www.kathylabriola.com www.kathylabriola.com

While this sound new and a little uncomfortable, it doesn't sound terrible.

It was just easier when it was a casual sex hook up, because it was "one and done" -- nothing really had to change about your life or the you + Wife dyad. But if this is going to become a steady poly GF, that's different, and it DOES impact your schedule with your Wife, habits and routines.

Galagirl
 
GalaGirl said:
Not the same, but could remind yourself you already share your wife with other people. She loves her friends, relatives and so on.





Why are you even doing this 2 day trip to hang out all 3? And then for a week later in summer?

What's wrong with slowing down, doing parallel poly for a while and hinge sees you separate? Or just doing a short friendly video call to put face to the name and leave it at that for a time?

Over time, you and Lady might be willing to do garden party poly -- like you and the GF go to Fancy Restuarant for wife's bday. 1-2 hour dinner together is not a big deal. Esp if it's once a year or so.

Over more time you might develop into kitchen table poly dynamic if people get along well enough for that. Where once a year you might do a week's vacation together with at least two hotel rooms on different floors, and wife splits her time between the two. If not 3 separate rooms. And other times you might have movie and pizza night or board games or something.

But neither garden party poly or KTP poly are requirements.

Are you and wife kinda rushing KTP just because it's the easiest way to imagine? "Just like us before but with 3 friends together instead!"

Might read poly hell together.

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for
www.kathylabriola.com www.kathylabriola.com

While this sound new and a little uncomfortable, it doesn't sound terrible.

It was just easier when it was a casual sex hook up because it was "one and done" -- nothing really had to change about your life or the you + wife dyad. But if this is going to become a steady poly GF? That's different and DOES impact your schedule with your wife, habits routines.

Galagirl
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Thank you. I think in hindsight there is an element of rush. Partly a reaction to a few days of feeling more settled and therefore trying to 'normalise' things. Partly an attempt to get to know, and so 'demystify' the other.
I agree, it's not terrible. It has already had benefits, and I see the potential for more. Change can be positive yet still painful to negotiate.
However, it is thar parallel poly that I'm finding tricky. I think the sence of loss in those times. Again, 3 weekends out of 6 is perhaps rushing. But this is due to distance and difficulty in longer term availability and the excitement of the new. The article you suggested was very helpful. Thank you.
 
Hi, welcome to polyamory and the board.

Maybe you could pick nicknames for both your wife and the gf. I am also not sure what pronoun your Wife's new Friend uses, or if she even fully IDs as female. You've used both "she" and "they." Does Friend use she or they, or both?

You and Wife are moving from an open relationship that was basically swinging, to polyamory. Don't feel alone. This happens quite a bit. Sex and love more often go hand-in-hand. I see you yourself enjoyed the MFM sexual threesome experiences. You got used to that. You also were comfortable with Wife having casual sex with men, as long as she came home at the end of the night and told you all about it.

You decided to Close the relationship after marriage. You actually closed it 4 years before the marriage. But just 4 months into marriage, you personally found yourself longing for MFM threesomes, or just the thrill of knowing Wife was sharing her body sexually. Monogamy is not really for you.

Wife had changed in this time, it seems. She no longer wanted (at least exclusively) casual sex with men, either with you as a threesome, or on her own. Her heart had opened to exploring women. She thought she still wanted casual sex, but it turns out she wanted more, much more.

Now, she is in NRE (new relationship energy), infatuated with this Friend, a lesbian. No more sharing sexual experiences with you. She's independent. She wants to disentangle. It does sound like she's still telling you lots of details about her interactions with Jo. That used to be part of the thrill for you, right? You'd get turned on hearing about her sex with other men. But now, when she tells you about emotional intimacies with her Friend, you get jealous (maybe envious). And this leaves you feeling left out. (Is the Friend okay with Wife telling you everything about their dates and intimacies? Sometimes people want some privacy in their dyad.)

Now, it seems Wife needs to travel to a whole different country to see her Friend, and she wants to do this often. No more coming home at the end of the evening. You went along once and plan to do more group visits. You're used to doing this as a shared couple activity. If everyone is fine with this, that could be okay. But keep in mind that Wife and Friend will want alone time, as pretty much all couples do during NRE.

This does change your life, your habits, routines. You might feel lonely when Wife goes away for days at a time. You decided five days was too many, and maybe she should only go for two days, unless you tag along...

But you do need to fill your time. Maybe you want to find a gf of your own?

Please take a look at the resources we list at the top of this section.


You could start by reading Opening Up, as it discusses the differences between swinging and polyamory. That might clear things up for you quite a bit, give you coping skills, and show you how to avoid mistakes, or heal from those you do make.
 
Thank you, some helpful thoughts, but let me clear up a couple of misunderstandings or lack of clarity. The use of they was linguistic, not based on identy, she idetifies as she, is gay and not bi, and within the Masc/fem spectrum would identify as androgynous. Not my place to put labels on to someone else but elements of masc-presenting with some masc energy, but also some femininity.
The open element to our relationship was very occasional. Enjoyed by both, but far from essential. But yes, sexual monogomy maybe isn't entirely for me. But equally, not essential and I'd happily not need it. It was never making up for anything, just an occasional added spark.
Timeline is a little unclear. Openness was occasional, stopped naturally 3 years before we married, and before engagement, we decided to keep it like that. Didn't discuss this again until a year, not 4 months, after our wedding.
Yes, we might be moving in this instance towards polyamory, but this is more complex. My wife has found a connection that is a mix of female friendship, attraction, emotional and sexual connection. We both feel this would be different with a male, she has never found this confusion, and I would not begin to be comfortable with anything emotional between her and a man, nor would she. Separation is easier in the FM or FMF dynamic. And if this became confused, our commitment to each other would cause this to end. She didn't so much venture into this 'wanting more' as you say. But yes, found more, and we both understand the strength and importance of this.
I would say there is some NRE, but I wouldn't say there was infatuation, fascination perhaps, but that is as much with the experience of self discovery and the role thie other person has played in this. Something we both recognise has positives for her, me and us.
She doesn't have to travel to another country, we are 200 miles apart, so there is distance and travel that necessitates some overnights if the meeting is to be worthwhile. The trip abroad is just a shared opportunity that came up for this 3rd meeting.
And we don't really know how often she wants to meet, we haven't found that rhythm yet. It's been quite a lot quite quickly for various practicalities around schedules, all of ours. Including the chance for me to meet and spend time getting used to each other.
The key thing to respond to is the suggestion of me getting a gf. This not an option, my wife has always been explicit she could not cope with and would not want that. This is something I fully understand, respect, and dont actually nor have ever wanted. This is not part of the dynamic for me.
Thanks for your thoughts, definitely some things to consider.
 
However, it is the parallel poly that I'm finding tricky. I think there is a sense of loss in those times.
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You could unpack that.

It is normal for transition to be weird. The "old normal" is gone. The "new normal" isn't quite there yet. So things in transition feel weird or odd. That is to be expected.

There's also the sense of loss. You and Wife broke up on purpose. You ended the old model in order to do this new model. You both are still here. But you may feel all the break-up feelings anyway, miss the "old normal" and need to grieve that.

Again, 3 weekends out of 6 is perhaps rushing. But this is due to distance and difficulty in longer-term availability and the excitement of the new.
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But isn't all that your Wife's stuff and not really yours? You aren't dating her Friend. The distance doesn't have to be your problem or your difficulty. The Friend being available or not for calls or online dates or in-person trip dates -- that's not your thing. It's Wife's thing.

Where Wife's things bump into your things -- at that juncture it partly becomes your issue to deal with, like, if she's going on a trip to see Friend, and now you have to deal with the house/kids/chores/pets/elders/whatever on your own for a few days. But in general, most of this is not your thing. Not everything in the marriage is "our stuff." Some of it is "wife stuff" and her stuff alone. Her responsibility. Some of it is "your stuff" and your stuff alone, your responsibility. And then some of it is "our shared stuff" where it is shared responsibility.

(You + Wife) are no longer the only dyad or couple in the system. There is now (Wife + Friend). So you and Wife may have to detangle some.

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The Most Skipped Step When Opening a Relationship

You’ve had hundreds of hours of discussions on what your open relationship will look like? Check!
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The Other Skipped Step in Opening Up — MAKING POLYAMORY WORK

Transcript Why is it that some monogamous couples who open up their relationship end up blowing everything apart while others don't are the people who make it work just better. People immune to jealousy at one, with the abundance of love while the people who end up bitter and broken, just aren't
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It's not necessarily a bad thing, but it is another change to deal with.

At this time, both you and Wife are comfortable with her exploring having a poly GF. But neither of you is comfortable with Wife having a poly BF. Also, Wife doesn't want you having a poly GF. So, it's a bit one-sided. That's fine if you both are ok with that. But over time, that might pinch and you might want to poly date as well. Or it might not pinch, and you two might stick to a "mixed marriage," where it is open on your side for casual sex like it always has been, and on her side she does both open with whatever gender and poly GFs only.

This is still unfolding. But I think you could talk about how to renegotiate if, later down the line, bisexual Wife DOES want to have a BF, or you DO want to poly date people. I think you could talk about the dealbreakers, and not that you want it... but if it has to happen, how would you and Wife peacefully divorce? People don't want the boat to sink or the plane to crash. Yet they still pack life preservers and parachutes. Smack in the middle of crisis is not the time to start talking about emergency plans and shopping for supplies, right? So talk it out. What if you two did have to part ways? Then you have your emergency plan in place.

Galagirl
 
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Thanks. At present, and for our entire relationship, I have never wanted involvement with others, casual or poly. Of course, feelings change, but I am clear in this, and so it isn't one-sided in that way, just that her feelings and mine on that happen to concur.

I think much of what is troubling me is the new, and the change, yes. I think the other element that is difficult is that the poly element is kind of accidental. Possibly foreseeable with hindsight, if that's not an oxymoron (I think you know what I mean), but not what was sought. Yes, I think I am missing the old normal, or at least the security of it, despite me feeling totally secure in our connection and love. But yes, there is nonetheless fundamentally different rhythms and that brings some grief.

And the detangling is possibly necessary, but also hard. That's when questions arise. Do I want to detangle? If not, do I want this? Then these are followed by conflict, but I respect my wife's desire to explore another part of herself. I understand intellectually that this side of her is separate and something I cannot provide for, and that isn't a threat. But emotionally it feels threatening.

So maybe there is stuff for my wife to deal with, but as you say, the difficulty, and pain, arises when her stuff bumps into mine. The article you suggested makes sense if some of this.

Thanks for your reflections.
 
I'm glad it helps you think things out some.

Do I want to detangle? If not, do I want this?
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Is the enmeshment/entanglement that is sometimes encouraged in monogamy actually HEALTHY?

Detangling some doesn't mean you don't love your spouse. It means you know not all the things are "our stuff." You aren't joined at the hip like some CoupleBlob and you aren't subsuming yourselves to the relationship. You retain your individual selves, your own friends, even though you might ALSO sometimes be a couple doing couple things, have shared friends as a couple, etc.

You can love and care about your spouse, and still maintain emotional boundaries and not get sucked up in their stuff. You can still expect them to sort out their things themselves when it is not a shared responsibility thing. It's not your job to jump in and fix everything for them.

I think you might talk about information management. You might need to hear a lot less about her other relationship. In your posts it sounds like you hear every little detail of it. Do you even want that much data?

Even if you were used to "sharing everything" when you two were the only couple in the system, was that actually a good thing? Do you have to be "sharing everything" now? Is there an expectation of privacy where (you + Wife) stuff is just for you and Wife. She doesn't tell Friend private things about you or (you + her). And (Wife + Friend) stuff is just for (Wife + Friend). She doesn't tell you private things about Friend or (Wife + Friend).

Then these are followed by conflict, but I respect my wife's desire to explore another part of herself. I understand intellectually that this side of her is separate and something I cannot provide for, and that isn't a threat. But emotionally it feels threatening.
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What conflict? Could you elaborate?

You could unpack why it feels threatening emotionally if (Wife + Friend) is its own separate dyad that you only know the basics about. You actually only need to know where it bumps into your life -- calendar, sex health. Past that, you don't really have to deal in Jo at all.

You might WANT to know more details about their relationship, but it's not "need to know."

You could think about a poly counselor so you get extra support in this transition. You don't have to go at it alone. YMMV, but you could try seeking one here:

Polyamory-Friendly Professionals Directory

Polyamory-Friendly Professionals Directory
www.polyfriendly.org

Maybe you and Wife want to do couple's counseling with a poly-friendly counselor.

So maybe there is stuff for my wife to deal with, but as you say, the difficulty, and pain, arises when her stuff bumps into mine. The article you suggested makes sense if some of this.
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You and Wife could have a conversation about those "bumps." What is her stuff, what is your stuff, and what is our stuff? And how to reduce bumping. You could plan for the usual bumps that crop up. But you don't have to over-plan either. It might be enough to agree on conflict-resolution methods. Or think about doing RADAR check-ins.

www.multiamory.com

RADAR — Multiamory

www.multiamory.com www.multiamory.com

There's no such thing as a "bump-free" life. And because she's new to it, she's going to make newbie mistakes. Just like people learning to ride a bike might sometimes bump into stuff or fall off and get scrapes. Some wobble is to be expected, right?

For you, it will be easier to navigate bumps and wobbles if Wife's not getting obnoxious with her NRE for Friend, and gushing all over the place, not oversharing TMI details in either direction, and not treating you like the free relationship coach/free therapist.

Basically, you both have to have strong emotional boundaries. And since you worry about emotional danger, maybe emotional loss/grief, the stages of emotional change, and other things, you really do need your emotional boundaries in place.

Galagirl
 
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Thank you. Some valid points that I need to reflect on. I will reply. Your thoughts are helpful. But I need time. I think ultimately this was arrived at accidentally. It isn't what we started. So there's a little shock mixed with the grief.

There's conflict in the 'knowing'! The more I know, the less I feel outside, excluded. But I think you're right, there is too much too. Thanks, I'll reflect more.
 
"For you it will be easier to navigate bumps and wobbles if Wife's not getting obnoxious with her NRE for Friend and gushing all over the place, not oversharing TMI details in either direction, and not treating you like the free relationship coach/free therapist."

True, I do feel some NRE. I have mentioned this, but not in those terms, as we're new to all this and a lot of the terminology is new too.

But it is important that I make clear none of the above fits how it's been. She's been beautifully respectful and understanding of my sensitivities, as has her friend.
 
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