Can you help me see this rationally?

M

Meg

New member
Hi, I am super new here and make big apologies for the possible length of this post. I am currently having a minor meltdown and need advice as I don't think I am seeing stuff very clearly.

I am in a relationship with a male partner for the last six months (known each other a year), I don't have doubts about the strength of this relationship or our compatibility that's quite solid and set. I have much guilt right now, My partner from the start told me he needed variety and would want another gf at some stage, this was hard for him to speak about due to his seeing this as a flaw. I never have seen this as a flaw I thought long and hard and decided that what he offered as a partner meant I could give him this 'outlet' as he called it.

Things went along and about three months in he suggests we get a girlfriend together. I struggled but was also quite excited, a part of me was keen on the exploration and adventure. We went on couple of dates and nothing eventuated and I lost interest, apparently I am a little fussy in my tastes.
So it's now 6 months and he tells me he wants another relationship separate to me because we have had no luck together and he feels I didn't engage enough in the process.

His terms are hard and fast he wants another gf that he sees alone but I can't see anyone else, I only can have him. I have pushed this but he says I need to think about the fact my having other relationships will destabilise us, in essence he has suggested I could not handle it and would drift away (I may have accidentally at one stage slightly threatened this in a massive bad moment of high fear and insecurity). I have tried to explain to him I feel it's unfair he will have extra needs met and be able to care and nurture with someone else, basically get double of everything but I may have to subsist on less, he states I just need to trust him and he will guide us through this. That he will care for and protect me.

I am terrified I am losing him but I think this is normal and I feel like I could cope and handle the fear and jealousy better if I also was allowed to explore. I am scared to be completely reliant on one person in this situation, and despite what he says I am afraid I will feel neglected and alone. Yet he has made it very clear if I seek extra partners he will not feel so strongly for me and will not be able to hold me and protect me, especially if I drift he will not feel loyal to me :(

Hence I am scared of losing my partner and admit I am very insecure by nature and need to be reassured via touch alot. I have what I think are valid fears about being forgotten, neglected and cared for less if he meets someone new, but also know I can probably work through these with his help.

My problem is I love him deeply and know that he gives me so much intellectually and emotionally we are completely compatible we fit into each other just right.

So I either give him exactly what he wants or walk away, I can't deny him what will make him feel whole and content if I tell him not to do this I stifle him (I can't do that) but I am also not convinced I will ever feels safe under his model of this relationship and feeling unvalued, uncared for and unsafe is already creeping in, it's totally destabilising me and to be honest it's making me physically ill. I have told him this and he says to trust him, I will be scared at first but will soon see he can prove to me how safe I am.

Apologies for this length, I just don't know how to proceed, do I blindly follow and trust him to be there ( I could maybe do this but he needs to start working on this now and then to reassure me and remind me I am loved). Do I push him to allow me to explore knowing he won't be so committed and loyal to me, or do I ask again when he is happily ensconced with a new gf?
Or do I let him go to be free and happy and find the women he desires, do I protect myself from all this confusion and pain? Are we not compatible? He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore. I don't think I lied or manipulated, I always wanted to give him what would make him feel whole and content, it's just harder than I thought and it's not feeling as safe as I thought it would or looking the way I imagined it in my head.

Advice - recommendations - nice thoughts - bad thoughts - pretty much anything you have to give I would absolutely love to hear..........Thank you for reading my extra long story :)

Meg
 
Meg,

I'm sorry you're having a difficult time. The good news here is that you seem to have a very rational picture of the situation but it makes you sad when you consider your options.

Meg said:
he suggests we get a girlfriend together.
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It's not unusual that this failed. If you read around, you'll find that it is very difficult to find a partner for a triad. However, it's unfortunate that he seems to blame you for it.

Meg said:
His terms are hard and fast he wants another gf that he sees alone but I can't see anyone else, I only can have him.
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For me, this is a complete non-starter. He's given you an ultimatum. And his position is very selfish with no real rational basis.

Meg said:
I am also not convinced I will ever feels safe under his model of this relationship and feeling unvalued, uncared for and unsafe is already creeping in, it's totally destabilising me and to be honest it's making me physically ill.
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And that should tell you what you need to do. It's your decision but this is not a relationship that I would stay in.

Dean
 
I'm sorry, but in my mind, it is COMPLETELY unfair that he wants other partners but isn't willing to allow you the same. To me, it sounds like he wants to be the one in control here. If you having other partners would "destabilize" the relationship, then him having other partners would too. If him having other partners wouldn't destabilize the relationship, neither will you having other partners.

You're an adult. You have the right to make your own decisions. It isn't his right to "allow" you to do anything. Maybe he will end the relationship if you decide to see other people, but honestly, to me that seems like a far better option than giving in to his control and demands. He is manipulating and emotionally blackmailing you, and that is NEVER acceptable behavior.

You've only been in the relationship for six months. That doesn't seem to me like enough time to warrant him having veto power over your life, unless there's some power exchange dynamic involved. This is going to sound harsh, but I don't think you'd be losing anything if he didn't stay with you, and you might gain some self-esteem and confidence when you don't have someone else telling you how things have to be.
 
Hello Meg,
and welcome.

Warning: sometimes on this forum you get reflected exactly what you send out, i.e. if you write about fear you will get your fear validated although it may be irrational. It has happened to me.

But. Based on what you have written, I think you should leave this man.
You experience feeling "unvalued, uncared for and unsafe", destabilized and guilty, and on top of that you've been accused of lying and manipulating.
You're asked to accept a double standard, accept his terms and trust him to "guide you through this".
Based on this single offer, he does not seem trustworthy at all. In fact it seem he's the one manipulating you into total (and non-consensual) submission.

It would be no shame to pack your stuff and block his phone number right now and call it a bullet dodged.

If, for any reason, you decide to stay, you should at the very least take some alone time to think and decide on your limits. Take a weekend for selfcare. Don't accept his terms blindly. There is indeed only one person you can always rely on, and that person, that's you.

As a side note, to me it seems you might be able to live polyamorously (can't tell, but at least beliefs match), but your notions of "finding a gf together" etc. seem a little naive. That's not a fault, just an area where you could use some reading and thinking before you actually try - so please give yourself time to do that. The forum is a good resource, with links to great ones :)

I'm sorry all of this is hard to read. Best of luck to you.
 
I think NRE is clouding your judgement a little...okay, a lot. That is where your doubts are coming from.

This is a bad deal and you know that. Trust that.
 
Meg said:
He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore.
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Trying something new and discovering you don't like it doesn't mean you lied when you agreed to give it a try; it just means you had incomplete information.
 
So, HE can handle successfully navigating two relationships but YOU can't.

He's infantilizing you and patronizing you. I'd say run while you can.
 
I can't deny him what will make him feel whole and content.
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What about you? You want to deny what makes YOU happy, whole, and content? Don't you count too?

I have pushed this but he says I need to think about the fact my having other relationships will destabilise us, in essence he has suggested I could not handle it and would drift away
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Translation: If you date other people, they will tell you how weird I am and to dump me and then I will lose control over you. Right now I have you were you want to please me and do whatever I say even if it doesn't feel so good to you. That's great for me!

if I tell him not to do this I stifle him (I can't do that)
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No you don't. If you tell him you prefer he not do this, and he prefers to do it? You guys break up due to incompatibility. That happens in dating. Bummer, but not the end of the world.

And nobody is stifling anybody. He is free TO go do whatever, and you are free FROM it.

I am also not convinced I will ever feels safe under his model of this relationship and feeling unvalued, uncared for and unsafe is already creeping in, it's totally destabilising me and to be honest it's making me physically ill.
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Well, if he's pushing his agenda? It's sounding like a one-sided relationship. I think you are right to think something is hinky here because IT IS. Basically he's saying "We do it my way, so it is Open for me and not for you. And you are ok with it or else I will withdraw emotionally from you and withdraw support."

That's kinda bullying. So go ahead and let him go. You don't have to agree to this. It may be a relief for him to go away and withdraw his "support.". Because right now? He hurts you, undervalues you, destabilizes you, and you are getting ill.

If you feel THIS bad? You could LISTEN to your feelings and get out. Relationships don't have to be this hard.

I have told him this and he says to trust him, I will be scared at first but will soon see he can prove to me how safe I am.
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How exactly will he prove this? When he makes you feel unsafe NOW? Or does he mean "I am going to bully you so you feel bad, and then when you give me my way, I will stop being a bully so you feel better. You will learn to accept this as "happiness" when really it is "a break from bullying until I want something else."

A break from bullying/head games is not being "safe." It's just a pause until the next round.

Or do I let him go to be free and happy and find the women he desires, do I protect myself from all this confusion and pain?
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I would do this option. Set him free to do whatever he wants. Over THERE away from you.

And you bow out and protect yourself so you are free FROM all this hurt he is bringing you. None of this is kind or loving behavior.

do I blindly follow and trust him to be there
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He is not being there for you NOW.

So why would you blindly follow him and trust him to be there for you LATER? :confused:

Are we not compatible? He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore.
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(Accepting someone is poly) does not go hand in hand with (accepting being someone's door mat.) He's playing head games to keep you off balance. You are not compatible.

If he actually thinks that you are manipulative and don't cope well -- what's he want you around for then? :confused: He could just dump you and move on like he wants.

That's why I think he's gaslighting you. Keeping you off balance and unsure of yourself. He's pushing different buttons with you to see which one works. YOU are the one being manipulated.

I don't think I lied or manipulated, I always wanted to give him what would make him feel whole and content, it's just harder than I thought and it's not feeling as safe as I thought it would or looking the way I imagined it in my head.
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Because it's all about him and what he gets. Screw you. He won't come to compromise with you and reassure... instead he's threatening to take emotional support away. Basically bullying.

I think you see that plain enough. Just not happy about it and perhaps in a bit of shock now that the rose colored glasses are off and you see him in his true colors.

If that is the offer on the table? His way or the highway? You are free to decline and say "No, thank you. I'll take highway."

In fact, AGREE with him if it gets him to shoo faster! "You are right. I cannot cope with it. Best you move on to a more compatible partner. I am not it."

Are you able to see that he is the one causing you upset and pain? Makes things feel unsafe? Then says he will stop behaving like that after you agree to (Open for him and not for you)? That's bullying to get his way.

That's like me punching you in the face. Then promising when you give me all your money, I'll stop punching and you will feel better. Really? You are going to trust me like that? What if I take your money and keep on punching?

I would not trust him. I say cut this one loose and YOU protect yourself.

Galagirl
 
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I understand well the feeling that here is someone who makes you feel great to be around, I have been in love with people who don't end up being as compatible as I thought. It is very hard to think of giving up the good feelings you get from being with someone and you feel willing to do whatever to keep those feelings going.

I only have this to add - watch that he does not suck you in by saying he will be monogamous for a time for you to get feeling better as that can easily turn into an attitude of "I sacrificed for you so now you owe me" rather than "I will be glad to wait until we work something out". His "safe and cared for" in this context seems to have a tinge of "only if you do just as I say"

Take care of yourself,
Leetah
 
Everything GalaGirl said. It really sounds like this guy is gaslighting you. There are so many phrases that suggest an abusive dynamic is emerging between you. How he is treating you *now* is going to be the best indicator of how we will treat you in the future. And at the moment, what he is *doing* in this relationship isn't agreeing with what he's saying he'll do.

When in doubt, pay far more attention to his actions (or lack of actions) than his words. I would seriously get out of this while you can.

http://www.sheknows.com/love-and-sex/articles/1075333/what-is-gaslighting
 
If your situation isn't one in which a power exchange dynamic exists (i.e. D/s) so that you've agreed to do as your partner says, I'm afraid that his behaviour appears to closely resemble the early stages of malignant narcissism, or at the very least, that of an insecure control freak. (Insecure, because those who seeks to control the minds and movements of others are invariably lacking in self esteem themselves.)

Meg said:
My partner from the start told me he needed variety and would want another gf at some stage, this was hard for him to speak about due to his seeing this as a flaw. I never have seen this as a flaw I thought long and hard and decided that what he offered as a partner meant I could give him this 'outlet' as he called it.
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I don't believe he sees this as a "flaw" at all. Judging from the rest of your posts, I believe that was just some kind of subtle reverse psychology aimed at lulling you into thinking he has some kind of weakness or vulnerability, when it fact he was positioning himself as the one in control/power from the get-go.

Also, another girlfriend is not an "outlet" - this would be a relationship akin to that which you and your partner share. Once again, his word-choice is an attempt to minimise any potential threat or "soften the poly blow" before he knew if you'd be amenable to the reality of that situation.

Things went along and about three months in he suggests we get a girlfriend together. I struggled but was also quite excited, a part of me was keen on the exploration and adventure. We went on couple of dates and nothing eventuated and I lost interest, apparently I am a little fussy in my tastes.So it's now 6 months and he tells me he wants another relationship separate to me because we have had no luck together and he feels I didn't engage enough in the process.

His terms are hard and fast he wants another gf that he sees alone but I can't see anyone else, I only can have him. I have pushed this but he says I need to think about the fact my having other relationships will destabilise us, in essence he has suggested I could not handle it

I have tried to explain to him I feel it's unfair he will have extra needs met and be able to care and nurture with someone else, basically get double of everything but I may have to subsist on less

he states I just need to trust him and he will guide us through this. That he will care for and protect me.

He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore.

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HE suggests... HE wants... HIS terms... but HE says... trust HIM... HE will guide...

Look at the language you use: it is ALL about HIM and his wants/needs/desires.

Not only that, but when you tell your partner how you feel, or if your wants/needs don't match his exactly, he makes it into some kind of personal failing on YOUR part. ("apparently I'm a little fussy in my tastes"... "he has suggested I could not handle it"... "he feels I lied and manipulated him")

If we're getting the full picture from your account, I can assure you, meg, it's not YOU who is doing the manipulation here.

And if there is one thing almost guaranteed to make me DIStrust someone it is having them insist I "just trust (them)", without them offering any valid reason or demonstrable proof of their trustworthiness as it pertains to the situation at hand. (In my experience, almost everyone who says this does so because they know they can't back up their argument any other way.)

he has made it very clear if I seek extra partners he will not feel so strongly for me and will not be able to hold me and protect me, especially if I drift he will not feel loyal to me :(
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Why not?

Ask him to provide a valid explanation for why YOU finding another partner would automatically lessen his attachment/attraction to you (considering extraneous relationships are something he is expressly seeking for HIMSELF, yet he expects you to simply accept that situation).


So I either give him exactly what he wants or walk away, I can't deny him what will make him feel whole and content if I tell him not to do this I stifle him
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Do you honestly feel he will remain with you long term IF you don't permit him to conduct outside relationships? If he is truly poly, and has expressed his desire for more than one partner from the start, he will likely go there in some form at some stage, regardless. (Not necessarily, but it's highly unlikely he will be content to stay in an exclusive relationship of only six months' duration for another six months or two years if he's not content. Already, he has issued several veiled threats in regards to leaving if you don't comply with his wishes.)

That said, you do NOT have to agree to, or participate in ANY activity or relationship arrangement that you are intrinsically uncomfortable with.

Even IF your current relationship dynamic is less controlling than it reads on paper, please know that you have every right to refuse to simply cede to your boyfriend's every wish if it's not something YOU also desire, or you believe a situation is innately unfair/unbalanced. To do so will only breed further insecurity, resentment and probably accelerate the end of your relationship.

I am also not convinced I will ever feels safe under his model of this relationship and feeling unvalued, uncared for and unsafe is already creeping in

it's totally destabilising me and to be honest it's making me physically ill.

He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore. I don't think I lied or manipulated, I always wanted to give him what would make him feel whole and content, it's just harder than I thought and it's not feeling as safe as I thought it would or looking the way I imagined it in my head.
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Heed your own words, above. You are already on an emotional knife edge; feeling unsafe and undervalued. I posit that your partner's implied threats of withdrawing his affections, as well as his tendency to disingenuously "re-interpret" your words and find fault with your thinking, are what is responsible for your present feelings of unease.

You may choose to stay with him despite all the negatives, but realise he is unlikely to value you any MORE than he does now if/when he takes up with another lover and his focus and time is divided.
 
We can't help you see this rationally because it is not rational. I am sure there are more things in the relationship that make you feel uncomfortable but you might be choosing to ignore them. Look for them and then you will see what all of us are seeing.

It might feel like we are attacking you, or "we only know half the story" etc. If you feel like this, than you might be more deep in danger than you think. This man sounds like a manipulator. You really need to run and not look back. It might take time, we can help you with it.
Take care of yourself please!
 
My advice lose the boyfriend he is being a sef centered hypocrite.l
 
Yeah...no. All kinds of red flags here. He's definitely manipulating you. Listen to your gut and run for the hills.
 
Listen to the other posters here.

Stand your ground. He has the right to do as he chooses, he does not have the right to dictate how you live your life.

Think about this... he wants you to trust him to lead you through all the fear and insecurity, but his words and actions are already doing the exact opposite.
 
Hello Meg,

It sounds like your partner is hitting you with an ultimatum and a double standard. If you are okay with not seeing anyone except him, then I guess you can technically let him prove (if he will) that you can trust him, and ride this thing out. But then, who says he even knows what he's doing? He may just be flattering himself when he says he can guide you through this.

He must have some good points that we haven't heard about yet, I'm assuming you were venting here for the most part. So please, tell us, what do you love about him? What makes you want to stay? I ask mainly for my own perspective, I think I'm not hearing the whole story.

Sympathetically,
Kevin T.
 
I haven't even read the other posts yet as I'm sure he's already gotten lambasted. If he gets to do poly, so do you.

There is nothing less trust-inducing than someone saying "trust me." If he's already failing to meet your needs for security and comfort just in the planning stages, how can you possibly trust him to be skilled enough to meet them when the rubber hits the road and he's wrapped up in a new relationship? Puh-leeeze!

I mean shucks, he can't even reassure and offer compassion to one partner, and he thinks you're the one who's going to destabilise the relationship when more people are introduced? Yikes.

He says he feels I lied and manipulated him into thinking I accepted him as I don't seem like I am coping or okay with it anymore. I don't think I lied or manipulated, I always wanted to give him what would make him feel whole and content, it's just harder than I thought and it's not feeling as safe as I thought it would or looking the way I imagined it in my head.
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I'm going to use a weird analogy, bear with me. Say you meet someone and when you're still in the consideration phase, he says he's really into anal sex. You say you're willing to give it a try, but that you've never done it before and you'll need lots of time and to go slowly and carefully. Then when you have vaginal sex together for the first time, he barely does any foreplay before and then he's all over you, taking what he wants with no consideration for your needs, even though you told him you needed more foreplay. So then you tell him you have reservations about the anal because you're concerned your needs won't be met and you'll get hurt. Does it really seem like an appropriate response for him to then accuse you of manipulating him into thinking you were cool with trying anal? Or is it more like he showed his true colours and proved he's not worth of being an anal partner for you...?

Seinneann said:
How he is treating you *now* is going to be the best indicator of how we will treat you in the future.
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Worse, this is how he's treating her in the early stages when it's still supposed to be butterflies and roses. If this is the honeymoon phase???

KC43 said:
You've only been in the relationship for six months. That doesn't seem to me like enough time to warrant him having veto power over your life, unless there's some power exchange dynamic involved.
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Even then, everything is negotiable. My husband and I recently introduced D/s into our 11-year relationship, and veto power is definitely a hard limit.

lunabunny said:
If your situation isn't Even if your situation is one in which a power exchange dynamic exists (i.e. D/s) so that you've agreed to do as your partner says within the previously negotiated limits, I'm afraid that his behaviour appears to closely resemble the early stages of malignant narcissism, or at the very least, that of an insecure control freak.
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FTFY. Not so much because of the "I can do it but you can't," which is a fair aspect of some power exchange relationships after being agreed upon, but because of the way he's giving her so much valid cause for concern. A good Dominant would focus on their submissive's needs and fears first, and put their own sexual desires secondary to taking care of the person they've taken responsibility for.
 
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Meg, it's been a few days, how are you doing now? I understand the unisono you get here can be quite frightening.
 
Firstly thank you for all the comments I have taken it all on board and some has given me insight, worries and more concerns lol

My biggest worry is if my partner thought this was how his behaviour is being interpreted I think he would crumble. I says he is worried he is hurting me. He often asks if he takes good care of me. Maybe a part of the issue is that I am not the best communicator and always defer to ‘yes everything is fine’, when it may not be.

Forgive me as I am yet to master the quote thingy but I see that many believe this is a highly manipulative situation and my partner himself admits he can be somewhat of a bulldozer in his way of getting what he wants and I have also told him he manipulative, he does not disagree.

I do not disagree with these concerns that I am being emotionally manipulated and bullied at times, but I am not a walk in the park or an easy person to be with, I am possibly more insecure than I elaborated on but also full of fear and anxiety about being close to anyone, I do not always treat my partner with love I can be very distant, cold and hard to reach. On top of that I can’t make a decision I am not assertive in any situations and this is highly frustrating for him, I can’t even commit to a dinner time let alone what we are going to eat.

I promise you all I am not at all blameless for the fact I feel uncared for unvalued and unsafe, in some ways I created that by pulling further and further back. He reassures me I am safe, but I blatantly ignore his words.
I am also scared as some of you mentioned gaslighting (once again apologise for not referring to individual posts I will have to practice the quote thingy), This is concerning so is the overwhelming comments that I should leave as this is abusive. I think there are some elements that definitely appear abusive and I sometimes have concerns that our two personalities are incompatible I am so passive and he is very dominant by nature. Sadly it sometimes works and I feel safe in that. I also wonder if our problems stem from the fact I won’t fully give in, if I don’t give in I fight at the confines if that makes sense? Which somehow makes me more frightened.

So at this point we have reached a compromise that as someone suggested might mean he states I owe him, but it means we can tread water for a little bit. All I did maybe was buy myself time to get hurt a little more  I need time to get my head straight. I don’t think I will be happy not being allowed some freedom to explore. This may be the make or break at some point soon, but I admit I don’t know what I want. I am totally confused and keep changing my mind.

Kevin you asked whether you were hearing the full story and that he must have good points and that is the reality. He does and has made me feel very safe, I truly believe he is committed and loyal, I know he values me but I need reminding that I am more than what I can offer him in regards to his relationship preferences. This has felt unsteady of late, not as solid but when I asked him he says he thought there was zero problems. I just wish he could understand to get what he wants it is going to also require effort on his end. I am not just going to magically except everything he wants no questions asked, I am scared as he is not outlining any plans I feel like I am being led around blindfolded and it is scary. I need him to keep telling me it’s okay, that it is safe, that I am cared for, and this is what is happening and it means I am not worth less. I wonder too if he is smart enough to realise how lucky he is, I would probably give a lot for little outlay, it’s quite simple when I commit I commit fully and am very loyal he just needs to reassure me. So maybe the problem is me not him? Maybe I am too insecure/passive for this relationship right now?
 
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