Feeling Stuck

[Jadebluesyn]

Hello everyone, looking for some insight.'

I'm currently in an 18-year relationship. We have been married for 10 years. We have talked causally about "opening" our relationship before, but only in the context of a threesome. Late last year, we decided to explore polyamory together. My partner wanted us to find a "third" and explore that connection. I was initially excited because I thought we would eventually explore other options, but as we progressed, I realized that he was only interested in specific scenarios.

We have explored some connections, but they have been brief and primarily online. I was very hands-off at first because I wasn't fully invested in the scenarios my partner wanted. I wanted to explore connections solo, and it would shut down quickly whenever I brought it up.

A month ago, I connected with someone with a strong connection, I told my partner about it, and he felt betrayed. We tried finding a solution that we are both comfortable with, but he would prefer disconnecting from this person entirely and working on us. He feels like my crush is a phase. We have been talking about this issue for over 10 days. We entered Poly so unprepared. I want to still hold on to my crush, not hurt my partner, and respect his feelings.

 

[kdt26417]

Hello Jadebluesyn,

You said you wanted to hold onto your crush, plus not hurt your partner, plus respect his feelings. Alas, I doubt you can accomplish all three of those goals. You've been discussing the issue for ten days, and so far are unable to come to an agreement. It feels (to me) like you guys have run up against a fundamental incompatibility. If you want to keep this crush, you can, but that's going to hurt your partner. You could break up but that would hurt all around. You could respect your partner's feelings, but he might feel disrespected unless you neglect your own feelings. The only way I see of things improving with your partner, is to let the crush go like he wants you to, and just work on you and him. But that might lead to you resenting him.

I don't blame you for feeling stuck.
Sympathetically,
Kevin T.

 

[Evie]

"We entered Poly so unprepared."

Sadly, this is very common. And it reads like you also initially went the way of 'unicorn hunting' - and then found this wasn't your cup of tea either.

Now you've found another potential partner, currently a crush, but it's no longer the 'team sport' and One Penis Policy or situation that in some other way centers your partner in the way that he imagined. He's now pushing back because he's feeling threatened by this new person, even in principle. He never agreed to you exploring solo, he was quite firm about that from the earliest discussions. You thought he might change his mind, grow I to at least being able to discuss it. He didn't. You met someone anyway.

Am I close?

I'm going to make a couple of sweeping statements now, do with them what you will.

He never wanted egalitarian polyamory.

He wanted a person for fun and games, sex, a fantasy fulfilment. Or perhaps he had even been browsing social media that showed harem style relationships and wanted to build that. Regardless, he wanted to be in control of the entire way it unfolded.

So, you have not just met someone else, you've totally undermined the vision he had in his head, one in which he was probably beginning to form a narrative of an identity around. Whether or not this vision was healthy, it was certainly real for him in his perception of what he wanted from this foray into "polyamory" and he doesn't sound like he was ever in a position to deconstruct this, and certainly not now while it's happening.

So, since with him it will quite possibly be his way or the highway, what do you want from the rest of your life? You don't have to keep driving down his highway, but if you do, it's probably (extremely likely) going to keep going in the same direction it is now.

 

[Jadebluesyn]

"We entered Poly so unprepared."

Sadly, this is very common. And it reads like you also initially went the way of 'unicorn hunting' - and then found this wasn't your cup of tea either.

Now you've found another potential partner, currently a crush, but it's no longer the 'team sport' and One Penis Policy or situation that in some other way centers your partner in the way that he imagined. He's now pushing back because he's feeling threatened by this new person, even in principle. He never agreed to you exploring solo, he was quite firm about that from the earliest discussions. You thought he might change his mind, grow I to at least being able to discuss it. He didn't. You met someone anyway.

Am I close?

I'm going to make a couple of sweeping statements now, do with them what you will.

He never wanted egalitarian polyamory.

He wanted a person for fun and games, sex, a fantasy fulfilment. Or perhaps he had even been browsing social media that showed harem style relationships and wanted to build that. Regardless, he wanted to be in control of the entire way it unfolded.

So, you have not just met someone else, you've totally undermined the vision he had in his head, one in which he was probably beginning to form a narrative of an identity around. Whether or not this vision was healthy, it was certainly real for him in his perception of what he wanted from this foray into "polyamory" and he doesn't sound like he was ever in a position to deconstruct this, and certainly not now while it's happening.

So, since with him it will quite possibly be his way or the highway, what do you want from the rest of your life? You don't have to keep driving down his highway, but if you do, it's probably (extremely likely) going to keep going in the same direction it is now.

To provide more context, we were searching for a unicorn partner, I'm 36, and my partner is 50. Although we're both open to exploring our bisexuality, finding a male partner is challenging due to certain factors on my partner's side.

Initially, my partner agreed to my crush, but setting boundaries became a communication breakdown. I realized my partner only agreed due to fear of losing me, and he had strict rules to limit the intimacy between my crush and me and protect our relationship. He's okay with me having sex with other partners but not developing relationships or emotional intimacy.

I've come to understand that we have different desires in polyamory, and finding a healthy middle ground is uncertain. Unicorn hunting feels limiting to me, but my partner values our special bond and doesn't want to lose it.

 

[Jadebluesyn]

Hello Jadebluesyn,

You said you wanted to hold onto your crush, plus not hurt your partner, plus respect his feelings. Alas, I doubt you can accomplish all three of those goals. You've been discussing the issue for ten days, and so far are unable to come to an agreement. It feels (to me) like you guys have run up against a fundamental incompatibility. If you want to keep this crush, you can, but that's going to hurt your partner. You could break up but that would hurt all around. You could respect your partner's feelings, but he might feel disrespected unless you neglect your own feelings. The only way I see of things improving with your partner, is to let the crush go like he wants you to, and just work on you and him. But that might lead to you resenting him.

I don't blame you for feeling stuck.
Sympathetically,
Kevin T.

Thank you Kevin
I understand that my wishes are not achievable given the current circumstances. I just hope that if we educate ourselves and work together, we can find a compromise that works for both of us. Right now, my partner is feeling insecure, and I am experiencing NRE.

 

[GalaGirl]

I'm sorry you struggle.

Initially, my partner agreed to my crush, but setting boundaries became a communication breakdown. I realized my partner only agreed due to fear of losing me, and he had strict rules to limit the intimacy between my crush and me and protect our relationship. He's okay with me having sex with other partners but not developing relationships or emotional intimacy.

Then partner doesn't want polyamory. That means sharing both love and maybe sex with other dating partners. Sounds like he was looking for casual sex threesomes or at most, a regular FWB person who'd be up for casual group sex.

Partner is also not being HONEST with you. How can you work with incomplete or erroneous data?

I've come to understand that we have different desires in polyamory, and finding a healthy middle ground is uncertain. Unicorn hunting feels limiting to me, but my partner values our special bond and doesn't want to lose it.

So be honest.

Could tell partner you don't want to do unicorn hunting or date together.

To provide more context, we were searching for a unicorn partner, I'm 36, and my partner is 50. Although we're both open to exploring our bisexuality, finding a male partner is challenging due to certain factors on my partner's side.

That's fine but why do you have to explore your bisexuality in a threesome context? Can't y'all fine your own partners to explore that with? Group sex is NOT a requirement in open or poly.

I was initially excited because I thought we would eventually explore other options, but as we progressed, I realized that he was only interested in specific scenarios.

Could be honest about that. You initially agreed because you though eventually you could both date separate.


Jumping in blind without enough communication or preparation has led to this kind of mess.

You could tell spouse that you would like to start over and this time be super honest with each other and put all cards on the table plain. And actually do the work.

I just hope that if we educate ourselves and work together, we can find a compromise that works for both of us. Right now, my partner is feeling insecure, and I am experiencing NRE.

I suppose you could ask partner if he's willing to see a poly counselor, read some books and catch up the work you both skipped. He'd have to work on his insecure feelings. Like... what's gonna happen with you dating people on your own that could not happen before in monogamy? Cuz even in monogamy people grow apart and break up. So... what's going on here?

Anything from these articles hitting here?

The Most Skipped Step When Opening a Relationship

You’ve had hundreds of hours of discussions on what your open relationship will look like? Check!

medium.com

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for

www.kathylabriola.com

kathylabriola.com - UNMASKING THE GREEN-EYED MONSTER: MANAGING JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS

By Kathy Labriola, Counselor/Nurse JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS In my counseling practice, I work with many people who have chosen to have open relationships--to have more than one intimate sexual relationship. The biggest obstacle to creating successful and satisfying open relationships is

www.kathylabriola.com

I guess you could ask crush if they are willing to limit it to online dates or what. They might not want to. It's not their fault if you jumped the gun or jumped in blind with your marriage. They may prefer to tell you "Work out your stuff at home and look me up later if you actually become able to poly date."

I get that's disappointing, but you have to figure out what your priorities are.

I think you could drop the crush. And then tell husband that you will no longer agree to unicorn hunt or do nonmonogamy like "group project." You want to renegotiate terms. And then go from there.

Galagirl

 

[Magdlyn]

I'm currently in an 18-year relationship. We have been married for 10 years. We have talked causally about "opening" our relationship before, but only in the context of a threesome. Late last year, we decided to explore polyamory together. My husband Ben wanted us to find a "third."

He's your husband, right? We usually recommend people use nicknames for partners, for clarity. Let's call him Ben.

What do you mean by a "third"? A play partner, or a sister wife, or something in between? Was it always a requirement that you do FF play with this hypothetical person? Or were you allowed to have your own feelings and attractions? Just because you're bisexual doesn't mean you and Ben will be attracted to the same woman, or that she will be equally attracted to both of you, for more than a few encounters, if that.

Either way, you are finding out that fantasy, no matter how many years you've fantasized, or how much it spiced up your sex life with Ben, does not equal reality.

I was initially excited because I thought we would eventually explore other options

Did Ben know this hope, or did you keep it to yourself?

But as we progressed, I realized that he was only interested in specific scenarios.

And did you tell him your desires differed?

We have explored some connections, but they have been brief and primarily online. I was very hands-off at first because I wasn't fully invested in the scenarios my partner wanted. I wanted to explore connections solo, and it would shut down quickly whenever I brought it up.

It would shut down? You mean Ben would just shut you down, and not respectfully honor your actual desire?

A month ago, I made a strong connection

With, let's say, Tony.

I told Ben about it, and he felt betrayed. We tried finding a solution that we are both comfortable with, but he would prefer I disconnect from Tony entirely and work on us. He feels like my crush is a phase.

That's pretty disrespectful. He's acting like you're a teenager and he's your dad? I ask that because of your age gap, and his words, as well.

Is Tony a woman or a guy?

We have been talking about this issue for over 10 days. We entered poly so unprepared.

Besides the links GalaGirl gave, I recommend you both read Opening Up together and go over the common pitfalls and mistakes newly poly people encounter. It sounds like you're polyamorous and demi-sexual, and Ben just wants to have casual sex. This is a big disconnect.

I want to still hold on to Tony, not hurt Ben, and respect his feelings.

I don't agree you need to let Tony go completely. Crushes are fun and life-enhancing. But you and Ben need to get on the same page. Tony may not want to stick around while you and Ben do the work you need to do.

 

[Jadebluesyn]

I'm sorry you struggle.



Then partner doesn't want polyamory. That means sharing both love and maybe sex with other dating partners. Sounds like he was looking for casual sex threesomes or at most, a regular FWB person who'd be up for casual group sex.

Partner is also not being HONEST with you. How can you work with incomplete or erroneous data?



So be honest.

Could tell partner you don't want to do unicorn hunting or date together.




That's fine but why do you have to explore your bisexuality in a threesome context? Can't y'all fine your own partners to explore that with? Group sex is NOT a requirement in open or poly.



Could be honest about that. You initially agreed because you though eventually you could both date separate.


Jumping in blind without enough communication or preparation has led to this kind of mess.

You could tell spouse that you would like to start over and this time be super honest with each other and put all cards on the table plain. And actually do the work.




I suppose you could ask partner if he's willing to see a poly counselor, read some books and catch up the work you both skipped. He'd have to work on his insecure feelings. Like... what's gonna happen with you dating people on your own that could not happen before in monogamy? Cuz even in monogamy people grow apart and break up. So... what's going on here?

Anything from these articles hitting here?

The Most Skipped Step When Opening a Relationship

You’ve had hundreds of hours of discussions on what your open relationship will look like? Check!

medium.com

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for

www.kathylabriola.com

kathylabriola.com - UNMASKING THE GREEN-EYED MONSTER: MANAGING JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS

By Kathy Labriola, Counselor/Nurse JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS In my counseling practice, I work with many people who have chosen to have open relationships--to have more than one intimate sexual relationship. The biggest obstacle to creating successful and satisfying open relationships is

www.kathylabriola.com

I guess you could ask crush if they are willing to limit it to online dates or what. They might not want to. It's not their fault if you jumped the gun or jumped in blind with your marriage. They may prefer to tell you "Work out your stuff at home and look me up later if you actually become able to poly date."

I get that's disappointing, but you have to figure out what your priorities are.

I think you could drop the crush. And then tell husband that you will no longer agree to unicorn hunt or do nonmonogamy like "group project." You want to renegotiate terms. And then go from there.

Galagirl

Hello Gala Girl,
I understand your perspective. My partner is confused about the concept of polyamory, as he disagreed with my suggestion for solo connections now but is still willing to explore "unicorn hunting" or FWB together. I tried to explain that polyamory is not a black-and-white concept and that there is a spectrum to consider.

I am communicating with openness and honesty now while being mindful of his feelings. I don't want to come off as unsympathetic. He is having difficulty accepting that I want to go on solo dates with other people. I'm trying to give him time to process his emotions.

I have attempted to discuss some of the same points with him during our 10 days of discussion, but he perceives it as resistance to pursuing my crush.

I dont think he's in a place to hear me right now.

I spoke with my crush, and we decided to remain platonic friends. I have become tired of the rollercoaster of emotions and the unhealthy nature of conversations with my partner. Unfortunately, my husband was not comfortable with the idea of online dating solo especially with my crush.

Jade

 

[GalaGirl]

Thank you for more info.

I am communicating with openness and honesty now while being mindful of his feelings. I don't want to come off as unsympathetic. He is having difficulty accepting that I want to go on solo dates with other people. I'm trying to give him time to process his emotions.

Is he codependent? Really enmeshed? Are you able to have other relationships on your own? Like see family and friends on your own? Go to work on your own? Or does he only grudgingly "allow" that?

I have attempted to discuss some of the same points with him during our 10 days of discussion, but he perceives it as resistance to pursuing my crush.

I dont think he's in a place to hear me right now.

Could letting it go for now and maybe working with a couple counselor to help guide the conversations later help?

I spoke with my crush, and we decided to remain platonic friends. I have become tired of the rollercoaster of emotions and the unhealthy nature of conversations with my partner. Unfortunately, my husband was not comfortable with the idea of online dating solo especially with my crush.

I get that. Don't need to drag other people through couple weird.

Or keep you on this up and down thing.

I get reducing variables so you can get to the bottom of this with lesson your plate.

 

[kdt26417]

Hi Jade,

I'm sorry you had to downgrade your relationship with your crush (down to platonic friends). Doing so will probably help fix some problems, but it probably isn't the solution you had hoped for. I hope that in time, your husband will open his mind and heart a little more to more of the possibilities of poly.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.

 

[Jadebluesyn]

He's your husband, right? We usually recommend people use nicknames for partners, for clarity. Let's call him Ben.

What do you mean by a "third"? A play partner, or a sister wife, or something in between? Was it always a requirement that you do FF play with this hypothetical person? Or were you allowed to have your own feelings and attractions? Just because you're bisexual doesn't mean you and Ben will be attracted to the same woman, or that she will be equally attracted to both of you, for more than a few encounters, if that.

Either way, you are finding out that fantasy, no matter how many years you've fantasized, or how much it spiced up your sex life with Ben, does not equal reality.


Did Ben know this hope, or did you keep it to yourself?

And did you tell him your desires differed?

It would shut down? You mean Ben would just shut you down, and not respectfully honor your actual desire?

With, let's say, Tony.

That's pretty disrespectful. He's acting like you're a teenager and he's your dad? I ask that because of your age gap, and his words, as well.

Is Tony a woman or a guy?

Besides the links GalaGirl gave, I recommend you both read Opening Up together and go over the common pitfalls and mistakes newly poly people encounter. It sounds like you're polyamorous and demi-sexual, and Ben just wants to have casual sex. This is a big disconnect.

I don't agree you need to let Tony go completely. Crushes are fun and life-enhancing. But you and Ben need to get on the same page. Tony may not want to stick around while you and Ben do the work you need to do.

I'm still determining Ben's intentions, but he seems interested in a consistent FWB arrangement, or the most important thing is that we do this together as a team. We discussed the possibility of FF play during our conversations, but he clarified that it wasn't the only option. However, I explained to him that finding someone compatible with us could be challenging due to the limited pool of potential partners if we continued with this thought trend. Nevertheless, Ben remains optimistic that we will eventually find someone suitable.

At first, I didn't share my desires because Ben had clarified that he only wanted to date as a group and wasn't interested in solo dating. It often led to an argument whenever we tried to talk about it. I only hinted at my desires until I met Tony. He would say my desires are an open marriage, and he didn't want that. Tony is a man. I only wanted to hold on to Tony because, for once, I felt like this was my choice, and I didn't want to lose my choice. You are correct; Ben and I have so much to work out. I hurt Ben with this series of events. I hope we can work out our differences, but right now, I need to give Ben time to heal before we can even discuss polyamory again.

 

[Jadebluesyn]

Thank you for more info.



Is he codependent? Really enmeshed? Are you able to have other relationships on your own? Like see family and friends on your own? Go to work on your own? Or does he only grudgingly "allow" that?



Could letting it go for now and maybe working with a couple counselor to help guide the conversations later help?



I get that. Don't need to drag other people through couple weird.

Or keep you on this up and down thing.

I get reducing variables so you can get to the bottom of this with lesson your plate.

Yes, my partner is codependent. It's gotten better over the last couple of years. We are already in couple counseling, and my crush has set us back years. I struggle with independence in our marriage and not being heard. Given the circumstances in our marriage and his personality, I am happy he tried to understand, even if it only lasted briefly.

 

[GalaGirl]

Yes, my partner is codependent. It's gotten better over the last couple of years. We are already in couple counseling, and my crush has set us back years. I struggle with independence in our marriage and not being heard.

If spouse is super codependent, that explains why he only wants to think about doing this like a "group project." It's not a realistic or healthy attitude, though. It might work out like a casual sex, one time, group sex thing, cuz it's "one and done," and some people are up for that. Or... he might wig out if you look like you had too good a time there, or moaned differently than with him, or whatever.

In long term poly dating, you are gonna bump into unicorn hunter issues. In fact, he may go bonkers if the triad potential likes you more than him and wants to drop him and change to a poly V. THEN what?

Until you REALLY resolve that part in bold one way or another, even if codependent husband says he wants to do poly, I suggest you say NO, because it will likely end up with you "carrying" him, or having to deal with his upsets, or him wanting you to dump the new person again.

You might prefer to focus on getting to a healthy two-person marriage first, and possibly giving up on the nonmonogamy/poly idea. And if healthy marriage is not achievable here, you might have to rethink that whole thing too.

18 years of codependency... that's a loooong time. I don't know what that is doing to your mental health/well being.

 

[Magdlyn]

Yes, my partner is codependent. It's gotten better over the last couple of years. We are already in couple counseling, and my crush has set us back years. I struggle with independence in our marriage and not being heard. Given the circumstances in our marriage and his personality, I am happy he tried to understand, even if it only lasted briefly.

If a simple crush has supposedly set your marriage back years, it's probably doomed. He wants to get his strange pussy, but he doesn't respect that you might be attracted to someone that you like very much. Just because he can divorce his emotions from his genitals doesn't mean you should or can, too.

I hope your marriage counselor understands that billions of married people get crushes on someone other than their spouse, all the time. Don't let the counselor or your husband make you take the fall for this issue "setting you back years." It's not your fault. You've not the evil Jezebel. You trusted him to be mature enough to hear that you were demi-sexual and couldn't do ENM without having feelings first, sex later. He betrayed your trust and freaked out. That's on him.

You may have outgrown him. I know I outgrew my ex h, and our couple's counselor agreed. We split up in our early 50s, sunk cost fallacy be damned.