I need help

[fernie]

I've been married 26 years. As of the last two years, my wife decided that she wanted to practice polyamory. Before that, we've always had a very open-minded relationship, on and off, pretty much since we got married. We got married very young, plus we've been together since we were kids. We went to junior high together. She's a really good woman-- the best woman on the entire planet, as far as I'm concerned. I wouldn't even think about being with another woman. This is it for me.

I want her to be completely happy. When she told me about this, well, I just I had to understand and accept it. Later on, I'll write more details about how we got started and all, and who this boyfriend of hers is.

But really quickly, this is all my fault. I started this. This is my doing. I just got out of control. I'm actually crying right now as I'm writing this.

I am trying my best to understand. I know she loves me with all her heart. I know she does. But I'm telling her that things have changed and she is saying, "No, no nothing has changed."

But something happened today and it was the last straw. I just can't.

Today, she was going out on a date with her boyfriend. I was at work. He was just supposed to pick her up, but I came home and went to the back and what do I see? I see him and her and our kids sitting at the table having the lunch she cooked for the new happy family.

We have misunderstandings and issues every day because we try to talk about this every day. We try to resolve it, but the last three-four days it just hasn't been completely resolved. Every time pushes it a little bit more, a little bit more. We say that we want to have an open conversation and open dialogue, and then she just forgets that at the last minute and says, "Oh, I thought it was okay," or things like that.

I'm writing this as speech to text, so excuse my punctuation. I'm also driving. It is 12:49. I can't go to bed. I just can't go to bed.

 

[kdt26417]

Hello fernie,

I think you should read the article, Are You in Poly Hell, it will explain to you what you are feeling right now, and why. Basically, you are the struggling mono in a mono/poly marriage, you want to understand your wife and accept, but you just can't do it because poly is not who you are, and she keeps pushing the envelope further and further, without the open dialog she promised you. Tell her that you can't stand the poly any more, and that you need her to stop.

With sympathy,
Kevin T.

 

[GalaGirl]

I'm sorry you are struggling. I hope you were able to stop driving and get some much-needed rest. I can understand the need to journal in some fashion to get it off your chest, but please don't do it while driving, with speech to text, and don't drive at all when you are super upset. That can get dangerous for you and for others on the road.

Here is my take. I might get some things wrong, so please correct me.

You sound really scared/alone right now and like you want to talk in a safe anonymous space.

I want her to be completely happy and when she told me about this, well I just I have to understand and accept.

Gently... You can understand and accept that she wants polyamory now, and ALSO understand and accept that you don't want to do any of that, if you yourself prefer monogamy. Maybe doing a little special-occasion swinging, and being "mostly monogamish" the rest of the time is as far as you want to go.

Her happiness doesn't have to come out of your hide. You ALSO deserve to be happy, even if it means learning to be happy not married to each other anymore.

I'm telling her that things have changed and she's saying, "No, no, nothing has changed." But today something happened and it was the last straw. I just can't.

She's not hearing you. Things may not seem like they changed to HER, especially if you've been keeping things in and masking with a "happy smile," hoping to get okay with it over time. But things are changing on the inside for YOU. You've tried this out for her sake, but it kinda sounds like you are bumping into the fact that you are NOT into this. Could any of that be true?

We have misunderstandings and little issues every day, because we try to talk about this resolve it every day. But the last three-four days it just hasn't been completely resolved. Every time she pushes it a little bit more, a little bit more. We say that we want to have an open conversation/dialogue and then she just forgets that at the last minute and says, "Oh, I thought that it was okay," or things like that.

It might be time to talk with a couple's counselor experienced in non-monogamy. If you could talk and sort things out by yourselves you would have already. It's okay to need help and guidance for these hard conversations.

We got married very young. We've been together since we were kids. We went to junior high together.

I am concerned that you are bending into pretzels to avoid thinking about a break-up and what life might be like as a divorced coparenting family, because she's all you've ever known since you were a kid. You've never lived as an adult without her. Maybe you don't know who you are as an individual.

I am concerned you are going into paralysis, like you're drowning or stuck between rock and hard place. Is that true?

Maybe you'd like a few individual sessions with a counselor first to help you get your thoughts in order.

Reading this might help:

Should I Stay or Should I Go?

Feeling unhappy in or unsure about your relationship? Having problems you don’t know how to work through, or don’t even know if you should? We’ll talk you through making these choices, including how-to’s on conflict resolution and doing breakups better.

www.scarleteen.com

I imagine things feel scary right now. Maybe you don't want to ask her to dump her BF, and you also don't want to break up, but you don't want to be in this poly V thing either. It's like you're trapped, like everything is coming from all directions and your suffering is slowly becoming worse and worse, like you are gonna pop if something doesn't change soon.

Maybe sharing sex with others was okay, but you want to share love only with her, and she with you, so watching her share love with this BF feels more scary/threatening than swinging ever was. Swinging was something you did as a couple, while her dating this BF is something she's doing on the other side of the V, on her own.

Try to slow down. Breathe. Put your own oxygen mask on first.

Please take a time-out and consider talking to a counselor about what's going on with you. If you aren't sleeping well and are struggling with anxieties, a general medical check up might be good too. You could ask if a sleep aid would be appropriate for your case. One cannot function well or try to solve problems on poor sleep.

YMMV, but you could start looking here:

Polyamory-Friendly Professionals Directory

Polyamory-Friendly Professionals Directory

www.polyfriendly.org

I am not sure how all of this seems like your fault, based on your one post.

Try to take it in small baby steps. Calm yourself first, then tell Wife what is going on with you, with a counselor present. You could write your thoughts and feelings down and ask her to read the letter during the counseling session, if you are unsteady verbally.

However you do it, speak your truth. Have the conversations you need to be having, so you and Wife can figure out the next steps and see what can happen or be worked out.

Galagirl

 

[Tinwen]

Today as she went out on a date with her boyfriend, he came to the house to pick her up. I was at work he was just supposed to pick her up but come home and what do I see I went to the back and where do I see I see him and her and our kids sitting in the table having lunch she cooked for the new Happy family.

I understand how this can be triggering, although people having lunch together is also just an everyday event.

Was it the first time she invited him for lunch? Is this just something that overwhelmed you because unspoken expectations were broken, or did she also break any explicit agreement? Like, did you agree he wouldn't be introduced to the kids until later?

Like, I can totally see it from her point of view. She's cooking. It takes a bit longer then expected, maybe she was interrupted by one of the kids. Now's the time when her bf is supposed to pick her up, and they haven't eaten yet. Why not all have lunch then?

I can also see your point of view. It's a symbol of the life you wanted to have just for you now being shared... no, not shared in your view, just stolen. While a person who's fine with poly, and in an arrangement that has been going on for a while now, might just say hello and sit down to join lunch, you end up flooded with feelings. And, on top of getting flooded, you feel bad about getting flooded.

Do I understand it right?

 

[LoveBunny]

Even if you logically know you're not being replaced, I imagine it feels like an outsider is being invited into your marriage, into your family. I know when my now ex-boyfriend started getting serious with another woman, I felt resentment that this person I hadn't chosen now had her energy seeping into my relationship, and that she'd started entering into my partner's decision-making in ways that affected me.

Of course things are changing, your wife is trying to sugar-coat it.

You're allowed to have boundaries, don't forget that.

 

[fernie]

Been married 26 years as of the last 2 years my wife decided that she wanted to practice polyamory. Before that we've always had a very open-minded relationship on and off pretty much since we got married we got married very young plus we've been together since we were kids we went to Junior high together she's a really good woman the best woman in the entire planet as far as I'm concerned. I wouldn't even think about being with another woman, this is it for me.

I want her to be completely happy and when she told me about this, well I just I have to understand and accept.

I later on I'll write more details about how we got started and all and who this boyfriend of hers is.

But really quick this is all my fault. I started all this, this is my doing and I just got out of control and I'm actually crying right now as I'm writing this. I try my best to understand. I know she loves me with all her heart, I know she does, but I'm telling her that things have changed and she says no, no nothing has changed, but today something happened and it was the last straw I just can't.

Today as she went out on a date with her boyfriend, he came to the house to pick her up. I was at work he was just supposed to pick her up but come home and what do I see I went to the back and where do I see I see him and her and our kids sitting in the table having lunch she cooked for the new Happy family.

We have misunderstandings and it'll issues every day because we try to talk about this everyday and every day we try to resolve it but the last three four days it just hasn't been completely resolved she does things that every time she pushes it a little bit more a little bit more we say that we want to have an open conversation and open dialogue and then she just forgets that the last minute she says oh I thought that it was okay or things like that.

I'm writing this and I'm just speech to text so excuse my punctuation and I'm also driving it is 12:49 I can't go to bed because I just can't go to bed

Even if you logically know you're not being replaced, I imagine it feels like an outsider is being invited into your marriage, into your family. I know when my now ex-boyfriend started getting serious with another woman, I felt resentment that this person I hadn't chosen now had her energy seeping into my relationship, and that she'd started entering into my partner's decision-making in ways that affected me.

Of course things are changing, your wife is trying to sugar-coat it.

You're allowed to have boundaries, don't forget tha

I understand how this can be triggering, although people having lunch together is also just an everyday event.

Was it the first time she invited him for lunch? Is this just something that overwhelmed you because unspoken expectations were broken, or did she also break any explicit agreement? Like, did you agree he wouldn't be introduced to the kids until later?

Like, I can totally see it from her point of view. She's cooking. It takes a bit longer then expected, maybe she was interrupted by one of the kids. Now's the time when her bf is supposed to pick her up, and they haven't eaten yet. Why not all have lunch then?

I can also see your point of view. It's a symbol of the life you wanted to have just for you now being shared... no, not shared in your view, just stolen. While a person who's fine with poly, and in an arrangement that has been going on for a while now, might just say hello and sit down to join lunch, you end up flooded with feelings. And, on top of getting flooded, you feel bad about getting flooded.

Do I understand it right?

Yes.. you're right..

This is not the first time that he has eaten at the house. He's welcome at the house any time. He's had dinner with us many times. He's met the kids. Our daughter knows about everything; she's 21. The problem is, I wasn't notified. I do not feel like I'm first place like she said I was.

 

[fernie]

Even if you logically know you're not being replaced, I imagine it feels like an outsider is being invited into your marriage, into your family. I know when my now ex-boyfriend started getting serious with another woman, I felt resentment that this person I hadn't chosen now had her energy seeping into my relationship, and that she'd started entering into my partner's decision-making in ways that affected me.

Of course things are changing, your wife is trying to sugar-coat it.

You're allowed to have boundaries, don't forget that.

I'm know I know I'm not being replaced. She tells me she loves me all the time. She starts crying because she feels bad that I'm so much pain, but she keeps doing it over and over again. It's not the first time that this exact event happened, but little things have been happening for the last year and every time it becomes harder for me to accept or understand it.

 

[GalaGirl]

Thank you for more info. I'll offer more food for thought in case it helps with your reflection.

This is not the first time that he eats there at the house. he's welcomed at the house anytime. he's had dinner with us many times. He's met the kids. Our daughter knows about everything; she's 21. the problem is that I wasn't notified. I do not feel like I'm first place like she said I was

Would this "notify me first" thing be a stepping-stone agreement that would go away over time, or a permanent agreement where wife notifies you that her BF is coming to eat? HOW do you want to be notified? Verbally? Text? How far in advance? What does being notified ahead of time do for you? Is it that you don't like being caught by surprise when you get home, or something else?

Do you get notified anytime anyone else comes to eat? Is it not really the lunch, but that this lunch was the last straw? Like, maybe Wife is caught up in NRE (new relationship energy) and has him over ALL THE TIME, but you'd rather she go see him at his place sometimes?

Is it poly hell?

kathylabriola.com - ARE YOU IN POLY HELL?

COMMON PITFALLS IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS Many people who are in a primary relationship stumble into an outside relationship either by choice or by chance, and once involved, things can go beautifully or can go terribly awry. Here are some of the most common problems that develop and some ideas for

www.kathylabriola.com

I'm no I know I'm not being replaced. She tells me she loves me all the time. She starts crying because she feels bad that I'm so much pain but she keeps doing it over and over again. I mean it's not the first time that this exact event happened but little things have been happening for the last year and every time it becomes more and more hard for me to accept or understand it.

What is "it"? What are the "little things" that keep happening? I cannot tell from your writing. Can you give some examples, other than the lunch thing?

• What behaviors do you want her to start doing so you can feel like she is prioritizing your wellbeing?
• What behaviors do you want her to stop doing so you can feel like she stopped dinging your wellbeing?
• What behaviors do you want YOU to start doing so you can feel like she is prioritizing your wellbeing? Are you prioritizing your own health?
• What behaviors do you want YOU to stop doing so you can feel like she's stopped dinging your wellbeing? Are you dinging yourself in any way?

Are you able to articulate anything, or is it hard right now to get words out? It's okay if you still need to focus on getting more sleep or rest first.

Galagirl

 

[Tinwen]

Yes.. you're right..

This is not the first time that he eats there at the house he's welcomed at the house anytime he's had dinner with us many times he's met the kids our daughter knows about everything she's 21 the problem is that I wasn't notified I do not feel like I'm first place like she said I was

I'm sorry if what I write is tough.

You may very well be right, that you are not first place in many ways, although 26 years of history is absolutely not something you can throw away or replace. But my fantasy is that perhaps two years in your "V" is moving towards a more equal arrangement between you're wife's two relationships. Can you imagine accepting that? Like, perhaps it's two happy interconnected families now, you and her being a couple and parents, them also being a couple of their own - equally important - and him being a friend to your daughter?

 

[LoveBunny]

I'm sorry if what I write is tough.

You may very well be right, that you are not first place in many ways, although 26 years of history is absolutely not something you can throw away or replace. But my fantasy is that perhaps two years in your "V" is moving towards a more equal arrangement between you're wife's two relationships. Can you imagine accepting that? Like, perhaps it's two happy interconnected families now, you and her being a couple and parents, them also being a couple of their own - equally important - and him being a friend to your daughter?

But...does the OP want that? His wife reaps all the benefits of having two attentive partners.....Fernie, what are you getting out of this arrangement? Does it bring you any joy? Or is it all just displacement, demotion and intrusion?

If you're mono-minded, you might not be so stoked to have more time on your hands where your partner used to be, and freedom to pursue partners of your own isn't appealing when you only *really* want your person.

It's kind of a rare bird, I think, who can feel content being the dead-end of a "V." I know I can't. You've got to be extremely undemanding, independent and not prone to jealousy or envy. Otherwise, it's easy to feel like you only have a part-time/half a relationship. Or like you're hungry while your partner gets two meals. The dynamic *can* create a power imbalance.

I speak from experience when I say it sucks to be poly-under-duress. I can also speak from experience that it sucks to be in the wife's position, hinge to a poly-under-duress husband. I know she feels terrible hurting you and even worse at the thought of losing you. Unfortunately, she probably is not able or willing to reel back her behavior in regards to her boyfriend, their relationship is on it's own trajectory. 2 years is a long time.

Take care of yourself right now. Look hard at what you're feeling and thinking. What do you need to be happy? Do you need out of this situation? And be honest with your wife. If this isn't working for you, it isn't working. You and your wife both have my empathy.

 

[Tinwen]

But...does the OP want that?

Unfortunately, she probably is not able or willing to reel back her behavior in regards to her boyfriend, their relationship is on it's own trajectory. 2 years is a long time.

I don't know if the OP wants to stay despite poly

I'm just naming the dynamics that seems (to me) to be present, and (from the second quote) I think you agree.

Btw., I'm a mostly monogamous person in a poly V - although on the "easier" side of being the newer (no longer new) partner.

 

[dingedheart]

Hey Fernie,

Welcome to the forum.

Married 26 yrs. How long were you and your wife swinging, hotwifing or cuckolding?

You said in your opening post "she decided“ to try poly. Did Covid play a part in that?

Did you know what her going poly was going to actually mean? Did you educate yourself about these changes?

How long has she been dating or seeing this specific guy (call him LG, Lunch Guy)? Have there been others?

Has there been a huge shift in behavior?

 

[Magdlyn]

Fernie, it's been a while. Can you update us?

I just noticed your avatar says stag and vixen. So this seems to be a case of hotwifing turning into polyamory, and you weren't expecting that.

 

[Midnight_Shaman]

Something I think is very important here is to identify what you are afraid of. Underlying jealousy, there is usually fear and insecurity. The best way to deal with the situation to minimize hurt for all involved is often hard to see until you do that deep dig into what exactly you are afraid of.

Once you understand what exactly you are afraid of, then it’s easier to take each fear separately and consider it. Sometimes naming those fears is enough to rob them of some of their power. it becomes easier to sort out whether those fears are realistic or if they aren’t. Sometimes those fears tap into bad experiences from the past that are causing more anxiety about the future.

Sometimes once you know what that fear is, you realize that particular fear is part of yourself you dislike and doesn’t fit with your morality/etc. Like if you realize that the fear is coming from some child abandonment trauma, maybe it would help to work through that trauma in therapy to keep it from sabotaging your current relationship. Sometimes those fears and insecurities are ones where you and your partner may need to put a rule in place to prevent upset feelings and hurt. Like sometimes people want to keep a certain restaurant as exclusive to their spouse because of the memories of that place and wanting to keep that special. Sometimes the fears are ones that can’t be worked through or worked around, but indicate something you truly need in your relationship to feel happy in your relationship, and those may come down to making the choice to end the poly or end the relationship. It’s really hard to say which way is the path you need to take until you understand your fears.

Although I am poly, my husband is too, and i still had quite a bit of fears and insecurities to sort through the first time we were in a V with him as the hinge. The book _Opening up_ has some great exercises to help sort out feelings and figure out what you can live with and what you can’t.

I could understand being caught up in NRE enough that she may deny changes, but if you come to her saying “I am afraid of this” then she can’t really deny that you are experiencing feelings, so it can make it easier to bridge into a discussion about those feelings and options for how to deal w those feelings.