In what way is he attracted to me?

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powerpuffgrl1969

Active member
What I'm reading is reasons why you can't change your situation. There have been several suggestions about how you CAN change what is happening in your life, but you cut down every single one.

I get that you have mental health issues; I really do. I have bipolar disorder and would self-medicate by over drinking until I was well into my 30's. I had two kids by then, two failed marriages, and it was just ENOUGH. For the most part, I was able to hold down a job, though (not that that makes me superior by any means.)

My son inherited my bipolar, and was in and out of jail on drug charges through his late teens to early 20's. He was even living in his car for some period of time (he wouldn't tell me how long). We live in the States, where there is virtually NO social safety net. He's 28 now, has a steady job, and has been clean from drugs for a couple of years (knock on wood; I don't take it for granted). He is also engaged to the loveliest person I know.

Even if you HAD initiated a relationship with your boyfriend, what grown-ass 49-year-old man chooses an 18 year-old? I was one of "those" girls who didn't have many female friends because they were too much "drama" and older men thought I was so "mature." Yeah, ok; I felt like all that at the time, but I was really just too naive to see through their skeevy behavior. I'm 52 now, and see it for what it is.

I know that going back to your Mum seems impossible, but just how long do you think you can sustain your relationship with your boyfriend? I think he's not a particularly good person, but you are deceiving him, and continuing to participate in this farce really isn't helping you. No, your mom isn't emotionally available, but she is willing to hire people for you who can help you. That, it least, is something.
 

Elayne

New member
What I'm reading is reasons why you can't change your situation. There have been several suggestions about how you CAN change what is happening in your life, but you cut down every single one.

I get that you have mental health issues; I really do. I have bipolar disorder and would self-medicate by over drinking until I was well into my 30's. I had two kids by then, two failed marriages, and it was just ENOUGH. For the most part, I was able to hold down a job, though (not that that makes me superior by any means.)

My son inherited my bipolar, and was in and out of jail on drug charges through his late teens to early 20's. He was even living in his car for some period of time (he wouldn't tell me how long). We live in the States, where there is virtually NO social safety net. He's 28 now, has a steady job, and has been clean from drugs for a couple of years (knock on wood; I don't take it for granted). He is also engaged to the loveliest person I know.

Even if you HAD initiated a relationship with your boyfriend, what grown-ass 49-year-old man chooses an 18 year-old? I was one of "those" girls who didn't have many female friends because they were too much "drama" and older men thought I was so "mature." Yeah, ok; I felt like all that at the time, but I was really just too naive to see through their skeevy behavior. I'm 52 now, and see it for what it is.

I know that going back to your Mum seems impossible, but just how long do you think you can sustain your relationship with your boyfriend? I think he's not a particularly good person, but you are deceiving him, and continuing to participate in this farce really isn't helping you. No, your mom isn't emotionally available, but she is willing to hire people for you who can help you. That, it least, is something.
Thank you for telling me about your mental health journey, it has moved me to tears. It's truly amazing how much people can do just with willpower. At the same time I'm sorry you and your son had to go through this, I'm aware bipolar is a really tough thing to deal with.

Yes it's true, mum is willing to pay for people who can help me. But what is it worth when 10 weeks of therapy amount to nothing just because a stranger has insulted me online? I feel like I'm just not resilient enough for this world.
I understood all the suggestions people on here made and objectively I'd say they are very helpful. The problem is however that I'm too weak for all of that. I don't know where to start and how. I just don't have the strength that you have.

But let's get back to the topic. The reason I decided to post here was Jade and his behavior I can't quite make sense of, not my mental health :)
 

Elayne

New member
I agree It IS manipulative behavior to tell someone to be careful what they say at the risk of you hurting yourself. Calling out manipulation is not an insult, and i mean it to be constructive.

If you were raised in a manipulative household it’s not your fault that you developed manipulative behaviors. However it is your responsibility to unlearn that programming if you want better for yourself.

I consider myself something like a mental-illness success story. That is to say I was able to kick suicidal thoughts, and I was able to stop self-harm and drugs. I was able to reach a level of success greater than every person I can remember who told me I would not amount to anything in life. I understand you not wanting to work, I just hope to encourage you to believe in yourself should you choose to desire self-sufficiency.

I hope for you that therapy is a positive experience, and that you find your way to an ethical arrangement.

Good Luck
———————

I think if life exists
It's probably like this
I had a common goal
I caught a common cold
I said when I get healthy
I won't take it for granted
And I really thought I meant it but I knew when I got better that I'd probably forget it
Feeling fine wasn’t worth a mention
So I didn’t pay attention
And it seems that’s just the way
It’s all easier said than done
And it's not even easy to say
-Jeffrey Lewis
See, I just don't understand why in this world people never call out the aggressors and those who hurt people but instead choose to pick on people like me who are reaching out and seem like an easy target.
The first reply in this thread was outright degrading and I think said person wouldn't have the guts to say what they wrote to my face.
I just wanted to make this person aware that blurring out nasty stuff like that can have serious consequences, that's all.

But I'm glad you've manages to get your life together. Where did you start your healing journey? How did you muster up strength to even start anything?
 

SEASONEDpolyAgain

Active member
See, I just don't understand why in this world people never call out the aggressors and those who hurt people but instead choose to pick on people like me who are reaching out and seem like an easy target.
The first reply in this thread was outright degrading and I think said person wouldn't have the guts to say what they wrote to my face.
I just wanted to make this person aware that blurring out nasty stuff like that can have serious consequences, that's all.

But I'm glad you've manages to get your life together. Where did you start your healing journey? How did you muster up strength to even start anything?


Oh I'd certainly say it to your face.

You seem to be in a cycle where you think your own self-destructive behaviors are a punishment or "consequence" for others. They arent. You only hurt yourself and people you love.

Right now, this second, you could send a message to Jade and block him if you can't keep away. Delete his number. That would be a first step.

Then you could think about how you're going to gain independence. You could hash out some ideas with people on and offline. Make a plan. Start on the first goal.

Sometimes you just have to do the step(s), almost on autopilot, and hope everything else catches up.
 

Evie

Kaitiaki
Staff member
Okay, so you originally asked in what way is Jade attracted to you. Since none of the respondents are Jade, any answer is purely speculation based off a lot of combined experience.

The people who have answered you are experienced and knowledgeable in polyamory (and often in kink). We are not your peer group, trying to decipher life as it unfolds, rather we are offering insight because we've been there, done that in many different configurations.

We know the way through leaving first relationships, and second, and navigating mental health, sub optimal work, living and financial circumstances.

We know that if we are curious as to how someone is attracted to us, we ask that person, not share anecdotes and try to guess someone's motivations.

We understand the allure of New Relationship Energy (NRE) in a D/s context. We also understand that not everyone we are intimate with is going to become a girlfriend-boyfriend relationship even if both people are enjoying the hell out of learning each other.

And now I'll switch back to first person because i will again try again communicate my response.

I read and write on my phone and I can miss details in long posts, I see I missed earlier that your mum is manipulative and lacks boundaries, and literally compensates you with money.

I'm perplexed as to why you say you only sometimes contribute to groceries. There must be a culture mismatch between you and I. I understand what you say about wrapping your head around applying for welfare. I didn't like doing it when I was depressed at 22, but I was guided by those with more experience and I learned it wasn't "money for nothing" - it was money to help me regain my independence and mental equilibrium. I also lifted the financial burden from my parents (who I had to live with for a little while).

I know it's hard to change course when your life seems to be headed in a particular direction, even if that direction is mostly because of inertia. It seems like you are getting ready to make changes though, although are a little unconfident to make the big, necessary, ones.

Btw, hindsight is really the only way you'll have clarity on such things and the best way to gain hindsight is to move through the present and into the future.

It's time to really make some changes. Also, have a wee chat to your therapist about rejection sensitivity. They likely have some coping strategies you can learn.

And please try to reframe welfare in your mind. You'll pay it back with taxes once you can work.
 
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Evie

Kaitiaki
Staff member
The other thing that might be a possibility is teaching whatever art thing you did. It might involve more study first though.
Teaching or in some other way monetising.

There's a new fad around here where people paint and drink. A mid sized shop front, some paint, brushes and easels, an extremely casual lesson, and byo wine. Charge whatever you want as you're only going to be attracting clients with money to indulge themselves anyway.
 
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Evie

Kaitiaki
Staff member
Even if you HAD initiated a relationship with your boyfriend, what grown-ass 49-year-old man chooses an 18 year-old? I was one of "those" girls who didn't have many female friends because they were too much "drama" and older men thought I was so "mature." Yeah, ok; I felt like all that at the time, but I was really just too naive to see through their skeevy behavior. I'm 52 now, and see it for what it is.

Just going to second this, again as a hindsight perspective. I was that girl, too.
 

Marcus

Well-known member
So first off, of course I wish I had met and done things with Jade under different circumstances. While deep down I never understood what others think is so problematic about "cheating" I respect that the vast majority of people in the world does and I totally see that I overstepped boundaries in my current official relationship. And I never wanted to be that person.

I expect you probably do understand what others think is problematic about being deceptive, but I'll spell it out here just in case you actually don't get it.

Trust is just a word we use to express that we have a sense of where a person's values lie, and how they will likely behave given most reasonable circumstances. It's mainly just about predicting someone's behavior "I trust that they would respond in X manner, given situation Y".

So when someone demonstrates that they find deception to be a normal and acceptable part of relating, that person can't be trusted. In a cooperative society, not being trustworthy is seen as a negative trait.

Making an agreement with someone that you will be monogamous, and then doing the opposite, is deception and therefore suggests that you cannot (and should not) be trusted. In a cooperative society, this is not a good thing and is going to net you some struggle.

Jade has said he would definitely go on a date with me. Do these kind of people say that to anyone they find sympathetic and attractive?
I believe if a random person were to see us in a restaurant they would think we're a couple. But that's what makes it so confusing for me - I'm struggling to interpret those signs that would normally be interpreted as a strong desire for a relationship. I have no idea what I can legitimately hope for or expect from this, especially because he's keep calling me and checking how I'm doing from where he's now.

I don't think it qualifies as a comet relationship and he doesn't seem to wanna let go.
I meet with a friend of his from time to time and she says he's not an asshole and doesn't play with people's emotions. I think he does care about me, I just don't know how deeply.

Have this exact conversation with Jade. No one other than Jade can answer this question for you.

Use your words, be clear, be patient, and be graceful should you hear an answer you weren't hoping for.

I envy you people who can take action whenever they feel like it and are not at the mercy of their minds' debilitating powers.

We are having a discussion and offering advice and comment. Just because someone lists the obvious answers to your problem shouldn't be taken as a disregard for the struggles you might have in actually accomplishing those tasks.

We all have to navigate our own shortcomings and individual challenges; all of us.

So yeah, don't worry ya'll. I already feel like shit so please don't make me feel like shit that wants to kill itself, [redacted by mod], thanks.

That is some next level bullshit right there. Weaponizing your assertion of mental health issues, and going so far as to blame someone for your potential suicide, is way out of line.

I'm actually shocked that the mods are cool with this kind of behavior.
 
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Evie

Kaitiaki
Staff member
Mod Note: not cool with it, but opted not to escalate. Also reviewed third party's posts and they are blunt, but not flaming. No warning points currently given to anyone in this thread. If anyone would like to use PM to report a post for escalation, please do that as the site still appears to have technical issues with the report button (this has been flagged to admin some time ago.)
 
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Inaniel

Active member
See, I just don't understand why in this world people never call out the aggressors and those who hurt people but instead choose to pick on people like me who are reaching out and seem like an easy target.
The first reply in this thread was outright degrading and I think said person wouldn't have the guts to say what they wrote to my face.
I just wanted to make this person aware that blurring out nasty stuff like that can have serious consequences, that's all.

People tend to attract those who re-affirm existing internal beliefs. We tend to surround ourselves with people that have similar ethics, behaviors, and interests to our own. It is no mystery to me how you have come to find yourself surrounded by two men who appear to have compromised ethics. Like attracts like and you reap what you sow.

When immersed in a reference group that has been carefully cultivated to maximize validation and comfort, it can be jarring to experience the communication styles of those outside of your reference group. And that is one of the neat things about the internet, you receive feedback from a group of people more diverse than a real-life friend group.

But I'm glad you've manages to get your life together. Where did you start your healing journey? How did you muster up strength to even start anything?

My friends were dying from ODs and suicides; girlfriends hated me because I was dishonest about being in multiple sexual relationships. It was more an act of desperation than strength. In hindsight, cutting ties with my reference group was probably the most beneficial thing I did. It may have even saved my life. But in the beginning it was baby steps. Mustering up the courage to look at myself in the mirror and tell myself that I was worth something, or that I liked myself. Accomplishing small goals, then standing on those achievements to tackle larger goals. It is an iterative process. It never really got easy for me, I just became accustom to constantly trying. Reaping the benefits those efforts (like making money, and experiencing more fulfilling relationships) became encouragement.
 

Evie

Kaitiaki
Staff member
How did you muster up strength to even start anything?
Just to point out, Elayne, you have mustered up the strength to get involved in kink and even have a fling. There isn't some different source of strength to build resilience and direct it towards the rest of your life, including finding work. You might not want to work as much as you want to be tied up and fucked, but you're capable of at least doing something part time.

At one point, I began with volunteering a day a week. At another point I began with taking one university paper, but since you've already got two degrees, you know you can commit to showing up and meeting deadlines. Ok, call centre wasn't a suitable job, it doesn't mean nothing will be. Go volunteer teaching art at a retirement home. Or with special needs people. Or volunteer to take oral histories from old people.

There's probably pandemic and especially Omicron issues going on right now, but make a plan for February/March and be ready to implement it when the surge is over.
 

Elayne

New member
Just to point out, Elayne, you have mustered up the strength to get involved in kink and even have a fling. There isn't some different source of strength to build resilience and direct it towards the rest of your life, including finding work. You might not want to work as much as you want to be tied up and fucked, but you're capable of at least doing something part time.

At one point, I began with volunteering a day a week. At another point I began with taking one university paper, but since you've already got two degrees, you know you can commit to showing up and meeting deadlines. Ok, call centre wasn't a suitable job, it doesn't mean nothing will be. Go volunteer teaching art at a retirement home. Or with special needs people. Or volunteer to take oral histories from old people.

There's probably pandemic and especially Omicron issues going on right now, but make a plan for February/March and be ready to implement it when the surge is over.
Thank you. Well I'm definitely not gonna call a hotline because they can't help me with this anyway. Usually I take two Xanax to knock myself out when the thoughts overwhelm me. So far it has worked.

As for the courage thing... You see I wake up everyday and feel like life is boring the hell out of me. I only feel alive when I do something that gets my happy hormones going. Meeting a stranger and having them tie me up and fuck me is definitely not the craziest thing I've done lol.
It has much less to do with courage than with simply being tired of life.

Also, I'm terrified of embarrassing myself in front of others but when someone else is in charge of my body then by default I can't make a mistake, right? I think that's just some of the many aspects I love about bondage.

Sure, I will look around and seriously consider doing sth easy next year. What holds me back however is my rejection sensitivity and my fear of embarrassing myself in front of others. The second someone has well-meant advice I feel like I have to cry. And yes, I am completely aware that you can't grow if you don't make mistakes. I just can't implement this idea. University was a completely different experience...
 

Elayne

New member
I expect you probably do understand what others think is problematic about being deceptive, but I'll spell it out here just in case you actually don't get it.

Trust is just a word we use to express that we have a sense of where a person's values lie, and how they will likely behave given most reasonable circumstances. It's mainly just about predicting someone's behavior "I trust that they would respond in X manner, given situation Y".

So when someone demonstrates that they find deception to be a normal and acceptable part of relating, that person can't be trusted. In a cooperative society, not being trustworthy is seen as a negative trait.

Making an agreement with someone that you will be monogamous, and then doing the opposite, is deception and therefore suggests that you cannot (and should not) be trusted. In a cooperative society, this is not a good thing and is going to net you some struggle.



Have this exact conversation with Jade. No one other than Jade can answer this question for you.

Use your words, be clear, be patient, and be graceful should you hear an answer you weren't hoping for.



We are having a discussion and offering advice and comment. Just because someone lists the obvious answers to your problem shouldn't be taken as a disregard for the struggles you might have in actually accomplishing those tasks.

We all have to navigate our own shortcomings and individual challenges; all of us.



That is some next level bullshit right there. Weaponizing your assertion of mental health issues, and going so far as to blame someone for your potential suicide, is way out of line.

I'm actually shocked that the mods are cool with this kind of behavior.
I have to admit that as an aspie it would make me feel at ease if everyone in social situations were to explain things this clearly. You did a great job spelling it out for me. But I did actually understand that much so far.
What does not come naturally to me is understanding why individuals don't let their partner be individuals. As I see it, it's none of my business who my partner has sex with because it's their body and their choices. I'd prefer if they trusted me so much that they don't mind telling me about it but in general I think what anyone does to satisfy their sexual needs is none of my business.
I remember I was 16 when I discovered that my mum has "cheated" on my dad. But I just couldn't get angry at her. It was not my natural reaction. Instead, I was happy for her that she experienced something nice for once. Her relationship with my dad was so disfunctional that I was glad that she had positive romantic and sexual experiences with someone else...
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
I was wondering if any of you know these kind of interesting auras that are super horny and yet angelic at the same time. How are their kind gestures to be interpreted? Do these kind of people smile and do nice things to anyone they like?

You could ask Jade directly how he'd like his gestures to be taken.

Jade has said he would definitely go on a date with me.

Great.

Do these kind of people say that to anyone they find sympathetic and attractive?

Well, IME, people don't date people they don't want to date. Who they find sympathetic/attractive will vary based on their personal preferences.

I'm struggling to interpret those signs that would normally be interpreted as a strong desire for a relationship.

Do you mean you want to learn more about body language, facial expression and other non-verbal communication cues? That sounds doable. I know things like that can be a challenge for people who are Autism/Asperger folks.

I have no idea what I can legitimately hope for or expect from this, especially because he's keep calling me and checking how I'm doing from where he's now.

Could enjoy it for what it is for now, and postpone creating expectations until he's actually back.

And yes, I know I have a lot going on, which is why I feel incapable of finding a job, let alone moving out.

Mental health can make just taking a shower or fixing somthing to eat hard.

So I get that bigger things like job hunting and moving out seem daunting. That said? You could pick your top 3 things to deal with right now. Or top 2 if you don't have the spoons. Do what you can today. Run the dishwasher twice if you have to.

https://forge.medium.com/run-the-dishwasher-twice-e24ff24def60

If you only have the energy for 1 thing? I would encourage the therapy. Because you have a lot going on, and you do not need a plan to address 1 thing. But a STRATEGY -- a collection of plans to address many things. And a professional could hep you make a realistic strategy.

Still, I really don't want to go back to my parents' because that place gives me anxiety. Plus my mum is still emotionally manipulative and abusive at times which is certainly not good for me so as I see it I have no choice but to stay at my bf's place for now.

Ok. Maybe it's enough (for today) to know this. That you don't want to move back in with parents. And you write it down.

Later down? You can explore options with therapist for this area of life. Maybe a roomie would be appropriate. But you know what? That's over THERE when you get to the place of making details in that area.

Maybe for now it's enough to know this IS a stone. The housing situation. And that's enough. Chapter title. Good enough. No need to write the whole chapter right this second.

I'm working on myself but it's hard and will require a lot of time. My therapist told me just today that she thinks I'll need 2 or 3 years of therapy :-/.

Ok. It is what it is. And the time's gonna pass anyway, so... could choose to invest in yourself.

You have to understand that despite being in my mid 20s I define success as "not having suicidal thoughts for a solid month" while others my age define success as having a steady 30h/week job and having their own place...

Ok. It is what it is. You don't have to be doing what your peers are doing.

Maybe the next baby step is to go 5 weeks without suicidal thoughts rather than 4 weeks. Or maybe try a new coping tool.

Talk to therapist about a realistic size, doable goal for where you are at TODAY.

One doesn't expect a person with a broken leg to sign up to run a marathon. But they might be able to sign up for some chair yoga as a realistic fitness today thing. Later on they can stepping stone along to other stuff.

Same with mental health. Do what is actually DOABLE for you TODAY. And if a whole day is too big still? This HOUR then. Bite size.

Also, perhaps he wouldn't freak out as much but I'm even scared to tell bf I don't want to have sex with him anymore. I know it sounds stupid but I also feel so bad now that I feel like I owe him that.

One never "owes" anyone sex.

If you took up with him at 18, and you are now mid 20s... is this BF the first adult relationship you have had to break up in? That can sometimes be challenging simply because it's the first one. If you are also not at a place to tell BF "full truth" due to mental health challenges like rejection sensitivity or fears of homelessness, don't just yet. Talk to therapist first to make the plan to arrive at "full truth." Like HOW to tell if you don't know how by yourself.

Tell BF the truth that you can tell -- you are having a thing, need to work with therapist, are overwhelmed and don't want to share sex right now.

It's doesn't have to be "all or nothing" truth like one big whoosh. Be ok taking baby steps towards it.

Then resolve not to do this anymore -- be truthful from the start in future relationships.

Well I'm definitely not gonna call a hotline because they can't help me with this anyway. Usually I take two Xanax to knock myself out when the thoughts overwhelm me. So far it has worked.

Doesn't hurt to have the numbers handy. Can always put on fridge and just not use.

Could talk to therapist about coping tools.

Cuz yah, I can bang with a screwdriver as a "make do" hammer on some things, but it's nice to have an actual hammer on other things. And maybe some scissors. And a ruler or tape measure. Different tools for different situations. Doesn't mean I'm gonna use them all every time. That's ok.

You see I wake up everyday and feel like life is boring the hell out of me. I only feel alive when I do something that gets my happy hormones going.

Some people's brains come differently. Could address this with therapist, consider appropriate meds as needed, and when ready... maybe consider one of the more exciting jobs like ER nurse, EMT, Firefighter, etc. And hobbies like ziplining, surging, horse riding, etc.

Not DOING anything just yet, but allowing yourself to dream a little. The chapter of "Job" might be enough to list. Just that. "Job." But if dreaming a little helps, it's ok to dream a little and list some things you might like under that one.

Also, I'm terrified of embarrassing myself in front of others but when someone else is in charge of my body then by default I can't make a mistake, right? I think that's just some of the many aspects I love about bondage.

When one thinks a lot, or over thinks , there's an appeal to "surrender" and not having to think. I get that.

Sure, I will look around and seriously consider doing sth easy next year. What holds me back however is my rejection sensitivity and my fear of embarrassing myself in front of others. The second someone has well-meant advice I feel like I have to cry. And yes, I am completely aware that you can't grow if you don't make mistakes. I just can't implement this idea.

Is that why you just don't ask Jade up front if he wants to date?

The rejection sensitivity? That could be another area that the therapist could help you address in your patient management strategy.

For today I invite you to consider one small change. The word "Yet."

Just tack it on. That's all.

"I just can't implement this idea. Yet."

Galagirl
 
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Elayne

New member
Just going to second this, again as a hindsight perspective. I was that girl, too.
As for the old bf thing-I've had 10 sessions with my therapist so far but she has never pointed out anything negative about my boyfriend as a person. What's been bothering her is not him or the age gap but rather the relationship with my mum. I never thought I was particularly mature or anything btw. Things just happened and I was willing to give it a go.

My degrees are in theater, film and media and Japanese Studies. I don't paint or draw stuff because I'm not good at it. I'm pretty decent at singing but other than that I have no idea what abilities of mine I could monetize. As I said, there's not much I could even theoretically monetize.
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
What does not come naturally to me is understanding why individuals don't let their partner be individuals. As I see it, it's none of my business who my partner has sex with because it's their body and their choices.

Same as you recognize what they do with their BODIES is their biz? Could apply same. Not really your business why people think whatever it is they think with their MINDS , including why certain people don't want to let their partners be individuals.

I'd prefer if they trusted me so much that they don't mind telling me about it but in general I think what anyone does to satisfy their sexual needs is none of my business.

All you can do is tell future partners this is where you stand. And ask them where they stand. And if you are compatible and can see eye to eye? Great. Date. If not? Skip it with them because they are not compatible with your views.


My degrees are in theater, film and media and Japanese Studies. I don't paint or draw stuff because I'm not good at it. I'm pretty decent at singing but other than that I have no idea what abilities of mine I could monetize. As I said, there's not much I could even theoretically monetize.

Depending on your skill set with film? Schools and churches come to mind -- pandemic pushing them into digital areas they may not normally have done before so needing people to film or record content, edit it, livestream it, etc. And sometimes it's just "job" and doesn't have to be like "career."

A friend of mine did registration for colleges/schools over computer. She didn't want to be that for "career" but she liked it as "job" to do from home on a computer with flexible hours that paid her bills while she was going through a rough patch.

Again don't have to solve it this minute. But if you have some words to add under the "Job" chapter, add some. Even non-examples. Like "I don't know what I want to do, but I def don't want to work with little kids" or whatever.

I have so many allergies... I would not want an outdoorsy job where the pollen would get me!

Galagirl
 
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Marcus

Well-known member
What does not come naturally to me is understanding why individuals don't let their partner be individuals. As I see it, it's none of my business who my partner has sex with because it's their body and their choices. I'd prefer if they trusted me so much that they don't mind telling me about it but in general I think what anyone does to satisfy their sexual needs is none of my business.

On this I would tend to agree, however the problem is that you are using deception to handle this issue, instead of integrity.

  • You saying "I agree to live monogamously", then not being monogamous in secret, is deception. The fact that you don't agree with the concept of monogamy is just your excuse for being deceptive.
  • You saying "I know that we initially agreed to be monogamous, but I have come to understand that is just not who I am. I will no longer participate in an exclusivity agreement" is behaving with integrity. You have not used your lack of agreement with monogamy as an excuse to deceive people who you claim to care for.
Integrity builds trust because people know where we stand, they know we will be honest if we change in a way that could impact them, and they know that we will take our own values seriously. It implies that we are empathetic about where they stand, that we will not harm them should their stance change, and that we will take their values and boundaries seriously.

Deception gives us the opposite of all of that. People don't trust us because we are not trustworthy. The don't depend on us because we are not dependable. They do not find us to be admirable because... well why would they?

It may well be that you don't value any of these things, which is fine, but it's still cruel to let someone function in our orbit under the misunderstanding that we do value those things. The humane thing to do is to let these people off the hook so that they can go associate with someone who values the same things they do.
 
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