Jealousy, Envy, Insecurity, etc.: Merged Threads, General Discussion

I believe that what you are describing is actually envy. Jealousy is a resentment against a rival or enemy. Envy is wanting what someone else has.

I kind of think of it as jealousy is when I don't want someone else to have it, period. But envy is when I don't have it, and they do, and I want it too.

And so, to your thought, yes, I agree. I don't tend to be possessive or jealous by nature. However, I do find that it is harder when I want something, and someone else has it, but I can't have it.

On the other hand, if all of my needs are fulfilled, I can fully enjoy seeing them enjoy all sorts of things without any negative feelings erupting. :)
 
I think envy is definitely a better term for it. I wouldn't want to limit my husband to a relationship with me only, so envy fits it better. Thanks!
 
Yep, it's usually envy I tend to feel. Hubby works out of town, and when he takes advantage of non-monogamy, he does so when on the road, so I wouldn't be getting it anyway. But I can't help feeling some envy for the person who is. I don't let it stand in my way, and it goes away easily with a bit of rational thought, but the first reaction is that small pang of envy.

I was well loved and attended to as a child, so I have pretty high self-esteem. I don't tend to get jealous and insecure, and I usually recognize it as such pretty quickly and nip it in the bud. Usually it's just a matter of declaring that I feel so, and then deciding to manage it.
 
See, a few years ago, I had the worst insecurity. It took counselling and a lot of honest talks with hubby to really get it through my head that all the things I was afraid of, were not *my* issues, but my parents.' I had to come to terms and understand that what my parents did, does not dictate what *I* do. Now and then I am a bit envious, but it's not bad, and I can make myself see that the person I am in envy of is happy, and thar they deserve to be happy.
 
I generally feel envious when it comes to my SO drooling over the physicality of other women, specifically those whose body types I'd love to have. So I'll feel envious of said woman. Sometimes it's fleeting, sometimes it lingers for a little longer than that.
 
I get pangs when a guy I have feelings for, but am not in a relationship with, is close to a female, and I wonder if she's his girlfriend, or going to be, etc. I also get pangs if I don't know where my partner is, and figure he might be with his girlfriend and has not warned me.

In the first case, it's because the guy I'm not with could be monogamous, and therefore, if he has a girlfriend, or gets one, he won't be available anymore, and I'd actually "lose" something.

While if it's a current partner, I'm already with him, so why do I care? It's the not knowing part that makes me feel bad, and the idea that he might have gone to see someone else and left me in the dark. It makes me feel neglected and unappreciated. If I receive a text saying he's got a date tonight or something, then that's fine, because I was told. Although it's best if he first tells me, "I'm thinking of asking X to a date tonight," or, "X asked me to go on a date tonight," so I'm told before the decision is made, not told after the fact.
 
I experience the same feelings.

I have exactly zero jealousy for my wife, since I am absolutely secure in our relationship; I know that we feel the same way about polyamory in general, and our relationship in particular. Our feelings for other people, and our sex with other people, have no bearing on our relationship with each other. Our relationship isn't remotely in any danger when she has a date with someone else or goes to bed with them.

On the other hand, I have a big crush on a monogamous girl right now, and we do a lot of "platonic dating:" i.e., we spend all kinds of time together, and share a certain intimacy, without being in an official relationship beyond "friends." I know that some day she'll find the monogamous hunka burnin' love that she's looking for. When that day arrives, what she and I have now will be gone. And holy crap, do I get jealous about that, in advance! It's scary, because I know she is mono and our intimacy is ephemeral. It could end at any moment.

So that's jealousy, because it's fear of losing something I have. There's no one to be envious of now, although I'm sure I'll be quite envious when that lucky dude comes along.

I was actually thinking about this recently. Monogamous people get all jealously bent out of shape over sex. But I can't be jealous of sex with my crush, since we have none. Poly people get jealous over time.
 
Interesting thread!

Jealousy is a funny one for me. I'm not sure that I actually believe in it. I think jealousy is an umbrella term for whatever the root emotion is (insecurity, usually).

What R2F said about time was incredibly insightful, because time encompasses all those little things that can trigger the jealousy umbrella. A lack of time means that a person can feel unwanted, rejected, unimportant, envious, etc.

I have found that different things trigger different emotions.

Perhaps I am not yet evolved enough. I would love to be at a stage where I could say, "My partner and I are solid; therefore I have no insecurity." But for me, right now, this is not possible.

I trust in my partner, and certainly, when we feel strong and in love, my feelings of insecurity almost completely dwindle. However, I don't think that anything is certain in life. I don't think it's possible to say, "I will always love you and be with you." I think it's possible to say "At the moment, I truly believe that I will always love you and be with you." For me, there's a slight difference.

On to triggers for me...

Envy occurs the least for me. When it happens, it can be because my partner is having a great time dating other people, when I am not. How do I deal with that? Start hotting up my own dating life... ;) or simply let it pass, if I choose not to date others. Envy of time has also been rare for me. I experienced it for the first time a couple of months ago. I'd been living with my GF and her husband for 3 months in the US. I came back to England in May. She told me that she and husband had a date and had sex a couple of days after I left. I felt my very first moment of envy in over a year; wishing I that was still there, doing that. But I basically let it pass.

Insecurity is a more common feeling, when negative feelings do arise. These days, I am less fearful of my partner leaving me and more fearful of her *attention* leaving our relationship, so that I am stuck in an unhappy situation. This type of 'jealousy' can occur for me when she is in NRE - if she's talking about them a lot, spending a lot of time with them, tells me how hot they are, etc. I deal with it by talking to her. I always find that talking to her really helps it pass, especially if I precede it by joking, "I know this is ridiculous, but I'm feeling a bit of X. Can I get it off my chest?"

Possessiveness... my girlfriend jokes that she's possessive and I'm jealous (insecure). She says that her knee-jerk response to me kissing someone is "Hey, that's my sexy girlfriend!" whereas mine might be "I wonder if they kiss better than I do?"

I've noticed that I have started to feel more 'possessive' and less 'insecure' recently. She slept with her first person outside of our 1.5 yr relationship a couple of days ago and my main response was mild envious possessiveness. A feeling of "He gets to touch her and I don't."

The final one, which is actually the most predominant of all of the jealousy-umbrella emotions for me, is anger/unhappiness at being mistreated. I want to feel important to my partner. I want to feel considered. If she does something like making a date with a new person and merely informing me of it, instead of saying, "They've asked me out, would you feel ok if I went out with them?" I feel somewhat unimportant in the grander scheme of her life.

Whatever the root cause, yes, I do feel those pangs of the jealousy-umbrella. They can be quite strong, or very small, depending on the situation.

All of this being said, these emotions don't consume me or our relationship. I have them, but not every second of the day! ;)

Your cake analogy is very interesting! In terms of that, I'd say that as long as my slice of cake is what I consider to be satisfying enough, then I am happy to share the rest of the cake.
 
Ready2Fly said:
I know that some day she'll find the monogamous hunka burnin' love that she's looking for. When that day arrives, what she and I have now will be gone. And holy crap do I get jealous of her! It's scary, because I know she is monogamous and our intimacy is ephemeral. It could end at any moment.

And that's jealousy, because it's fear of losing something I have. There's no one to be envious of, although I'm sure I'll be quite envious when that lucky dude comes along.

I was actually thinking about this recently. Monogamous people get all jealously bent out of shape over sex. But I can't be jealous of sex with my crush, since we have none. Polyamorous people get jealous over time.
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Very interesting way of putting that! Now I understand why my bf feels the jealousy he does over me, his mono "secondary," yet he has trouble understanding when I feel that way sometimes.
 
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Ready2Fly said:
Monogamous people get all jealously bent out of shape over sex. But I can't be jealous of sex with my crush, since we have none. Poly people get jealous over time.
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I'm monogamous, but I feel the same way you do. I have zero problem with the physical intimacy between my partner and his OSO, but the time they spend together, or various activities they have time for, just fire up the old jealousy big-time... mainly because I don't have the opportunity to do the same, due to work/kids/etc.
 
LovingRadiance said:
Jealousy is a resentment against a rival or enemy. Envy is wanting what someone else has.
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The definition of those terms is irritatingly close. A friend once described the difference as:

Jealous = fear of losing something I have/want to someone else (the rival)

Envy = longing for something that someone else has.
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One is competition and fear of loss (jealousy) and the other is greed and desire to possess more (envy). Hell if I can come up with a better split between the two! Either way, these days I experience both-- the fear of losing my significant other to someone else, and greed from my desire to experience their joys for myself. Granted, my fear of loss is much lessened since my monogamous days, but to be honest, they still jump up periodically. I do find that I envy what my partners experience every once in a while. Fortunately, as one of the other posters stated, this feeling is short-lived and it morphs into my joy for their elation pretty quickly.
 
Green-eyed gremlins

There is a fine line between envy and jealousy. Feelings of envy seem like, "I wish I had what you have," whereas feelings of jealousy seem like, "I'm threatened by/insecure about what might be taken away from me."

My best example of an envy/jealousy trigger was from the last triad I was in. I fell in love with her, but she did not return that love. She fell deeply in love with my husband instead, and I was pretty envious of him being the sole recipient of that love. When he returned those feelings, it brought up jealousy for me. It was a pretty deadly cocktail, and I found myself in a real emotional shitstorm there.

For me, they are both challenging to deconstruct, but I think the main thing is to not give in to them. They are legitimate feelings, and bring up a lot of valid issues, but in the end they are just feelings, and for me, that was a pretty important realization. Taking those emotions and deciding to allow them to be the trigger for positive steps to manage them can be very empowering. Seeds of jealousy/envy can result in some pretty beautiful personal growth!
 
thenewgirl79 said:
I don't get jealous of physical touch, i.e., sex, I get jealous of emotional touch.
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That makes sense to me. I don't believe I'm the jealous type. I would not have entered into my relationship if I were. However, any fleeting moments of jealousy I do have are far too brief to matter. These moments have come about only recently, because my girl and her lover have allowed me to see them being intimate together, and I have seen with my own eyes how special their sexual chemistry and connection truly is. Also, they have their set nights together, and these nights have increased recently. I have now also given my consent for her lover to come to our house when the urge takes them, even if it's not one of their usual nights together. My girl also goes to his (and his wife's) place sometimes.

So I guess a tiny fleeting glimpse of jealousy comes when I see him giving my girl pleasure to a degree that I cannot. It is very brief though, and it is far outweighed by seeing the joy on her face, and to see her taken to a place that only he can take her to. What is most important to me is that she is 100% happy, and she is.

I have a great deal of confidence in the love we share, the emotional touch, as you call it. I think I would be jealous if I could see that she shared stronger bonds of affection with him. I don't see that, although I know that she loves him.

Could I cope if she did love him more?? Yes, I think I could.
 
Nathan, you're great lol. Honestly, every time I read your posts I'm like, "Yes! YES!"

Just wanted to let you know. :)
 
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