Just confused

[Relssek]

I'm a 38 year old male who just broke up with a 28 year old female. I am in an open marriage and my ex and wife were aware of each other and the situation. Before I started dating Mollie (ex) she expressed to me that she would eventually want to settle down with someone and start a family. I told her I was totally ok with her wishes and told her that when the time came and she wanted to find someone permanent to tell me and I would back off without any arguments and that I wished we could still be friends. She agreed. So after being together nearly two years I come to find that she has been going behind my back and talking to guys on dating sites. I found this out because she received a message from some guy I didn't know one night she was at my place. I called her out on it and she vehemently denied that it was anyone but a friend. So, I called said friend and it turns out that they've been talking and exchanging messages for awhile. We got into an argument over it and she stormed out and I haven't heard from her since. That was November 30th. I've tried emailing her and messaging her but get no response from her. I got one response when I said I really needed someone to talk to with her response being what's wrong to which I replied, I hope your new guy treats you half as well as I did and does he know you cheated on me, I'm sure he'd love to know. Because I was upset. I haven't heard anything since. That was December 5th. It's killing me not hearing from her because I would like closure as to what the heck was she thinking and what the hell is going on. My question is, what do I do. I still love her and have feelings for her. I don't necessarily want to get back with her I'd just like some answers. Do I try to email her again? Do I just accept it's over and I'll never get answers? Please help.

 

[Magdlyn]

Hi Relssek, you posted this in the blog section, which is more for journaling, not for feedback so much. PM NYCindie, a mod, and she can move it to the Relationships section.

As for your ex, it sounds like she didn't understand the openness part of poly. People can be so brainwashed in our culture for monogamy, they can't deal with openness, and would rather cheat. Even if they don't have to! Odd but true, we see it here often.

As for what you can do, it sounds like it's over. You used sarcasm in your attempts to communicate.

I got one response when I said I really needed someone to talk to with her response being what's wrong to which I replied, I hope your new guy treats you half as well as I did and does he know you cheated on me, I'm sure he'd love to know.

That doesn't exactly encourage her to open up and let you into her heart.

I am sorry things didn't work out. She doesn't seem that interested in being poly, or dating a poly person. She's playing the field until she finds Mr Right, it sounds like.

 

[Relssek]

Thanks Mags for your response. Yes, unfortunately I did use sarcasm in my response only because I was hurting and angry. In hindsight I now see it wasn't the best way to respond. I feel she is gone as well. I just wish honesty wasn't such a hard thing to find. I guess I can chalk this one up as a lesson learned. Thanks again for your reply.

 

[Dagferi]

Mind your own business... She wants nothing to do with you.

To be honest you come across as controlling and pushy. You have a wife at home why shouldn't your now ex gf put herself out there. Heck maybe she was just casually dating this guy and did not see him as permanent.

You get to have two partners why can't you gf. If your wife wanted one can she or does she? Or are you a jerk who is just looking for a harem.?

Your ex doesn't owe you a damn thing. Find closure within yourself.

 

[LoveBunny]

So....ex is allowed to find a guy who will be the husband/father she's seeking, and you'll let her go, but she's not allowed to actually go out and look for him? Was she supposed to tell you before she goes on a dating site? Why should she need to discuss with you her intention to date? Isn't that a given?

I understand your wanting to know if she gets serious with someone, else but honestly, why does she need to clear it with you before she talks to another guy? You're being ridiculous. Let her go find what she's seeking for her life. You're standing in her way.

 

[Candiedlove]

So....ex is allowed to find a guy who will be the husband/father she's seeking, and you'll let her go, but she's not allowed to actually go out and look for him? Was she supposed to tell you before she goes on a dating site? Why should she need to discuss with you her intention to date? Isn't that a given?

I understand your wanting to know if she gets serious with someone, else but honestly, why does she need to clear it with you before she talks to another guy? You're being ridiculous. Let her go find what she's seeking for her life. You're standing in her way.

If it weren't cheating, why would she deny that anything was happening with the guy? I think both are at fault here.

 

[sparklepop]

Hi Relssek,

I'm sorry to hear that you are struggling with finding someone who is as honest as you need them to be about their interactions. I can understand why you are upset about what happened.

I noticed that a similar situation happened in one of your earlier threads - from May last year? You dated a 26 year old who had been talking to someone else behind your back?

In both cases, I noticed that you said you saw or heard of a message from someone, which you then called your former-partners out on? I'll be the first to admit that I have made huge errors in the past in terms of violating my partners' privacy. In all cases, I found things that I didn't want to find. It's a shame that, at times, the only way to discover that someone is betraying you is to have one eye on their phone/email/IMs, etc.

I understand that you are extremely frustrated at not being able to find someone who is 100% honest with you. I struggle with this too. I don't think I've had a single partner who has been as upstanding and honest about absolutely everything. I don't think I've had a partner who is as open with me as I am with them. That is a very difficult situation to be in, I know.

However, for me personally, it has raised a few questions over the years.

I've asked myself the following questions, which I want to share with you for reflection:
- Am I choosing the right partners?
- Am I ignoring early warning signs of dishonesty?
- Am I guilty of being too controlling, possessive, paranoid, jealous, smothering, etc. and contributing to a self-fulfilling prophecy of them hiding things from me due to my own actions?
- Am I expecting too much?
- Am I putting up with a lack of honesty in the beginning, and allowing partners to walk all over me?
- Am I guilty of telling my partner how our relationship will go, rather than entering discourse on what they want out of our relationship?
- Have I asked my partner where they stand on white lies, privacy, sharing everything, etc., and determined whether we have the same ideals?

I'm not saying that this is your fault. Your former partner made a decision to get to know someone else over an extended period of time, and made a decision not to share this information with you. I understand your need for closure, and your need for answers.

I see that you can now understand that your sarcasm, whilst driven by understandable hurt, was not productive. In the future, if someone hurts you and you want to understand (rather than push them away or end the relationship), it is better to give the information time to sink in and then communicate clearly. Clear communication would be "I'm very hurt by this. I'd really like to understand why this happened. We may not have a future now, but I really would like to know the reasons for this."

I'm also curious about one thing. Why was it a mutual agreement that you and Mollie would only be friends when she found someone she could settle down with? Was this her wish? Was she mono before meeting you?

One thing that concerns me is how you have contacted Mollie since what happened. Would you say that you've been aggressive? Relentless, perhaps? You contacted her to tell her that you needed someone to talk to. This was the only time she replied. However, when she did reply, you lashed out. You essentially manipulated her by tugging on her need to be compassionate towards you, then smacked her in the face. That's very curious behaviour, and I'm trying to get you to understand what you hoped to achieve with this, so that you can behave more productively with your future partners.

If you want to contact Mollie one last time (and it really should be the last), I would approach this entirely differently. Regardless of what she did, you are responsible for your own actions and reactions. You get to decide how you treat people, and it's down to you to be the best person you can be. I'd start by apologising for your previous attempts. Be real with her - tell her that you are still hurt by what happened, and that you'd really like to find closure. Tell her that if you were not a good partner to her, you'd really like to hear why. You'd like to hear what pushed her away from you, so that you can learn from it. Respect her wishes and her time - don't grovel, but be respectful. Simply say that you would really appreciate ending things on a peaceful note, and ask her if she's willing to do that. If she's not, or she never replies, let it go. Reflect on your own actions, and find your own closure. You won't find this by blaming her - you have to look at how you may have contributed to the situation.

In terms of the future - you could explain to your next partner that you've been burned in the past by people that have looked for other partners without telling you. You could explain that absolute transparency is very important to you. You could make a specific agreement about what is and isn't ok in your relationship. However, this means listening to your future partner, too. It's not about saying "never lie to me". It's about saying "If you become involved with anyone, I'd really like to hear about that. Not because I want to control you, but because I'm genuinely interested in what's going on in your life. If I'm not aware of a huge chunk of it, we have no intimacy. What are your opinions on this?"

Finally, one book I'd strongly recommend if you are interested in connecting with partners more effectively and communicating well is Nonviolent Communication by Marshall Rosenberg. This YouTube video is a brilliant introduction, and certainly opened my eyes when I first watched it.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this, and I hope this helps.

 

[LoveBunny]

If it weren't cheating, why would she deny that anything was happening with the guy?

Because it's just talking. He didn't see any proof that she was sleeping with or even had actually met this guy in person. Who's to say that she wouldn't have told the OP if she decided to seriously date or sleep with the guy? I don't see why she should have to tell him "I'm talking to someone online. I might decide to date him." That isn't "cheating." That's exercising her right to get to know other people to possibly date or sleep with in a non-monogamous relationship. I personally would chafe if I had to tell my s.o. every time I flirted, talked to, had a crush on someone else. IMHO the OP should trust his lover to tell him what he needs to know, and not freak out because she's talking to another guy she met online dating.

 

[GalaGirl]

I am sorry are upset.

I agree with sparklepop.

I also wanted to add this:

Before I started dating Mollie (ex) she expressed to me that she would eventually want to settle down with someone and start a family. I was totally ok with her wishes and told her that when the time came and she wanted to find someone permanent to tell me and I would back off without any arguments and that I wished we could still be friends. She agreed.

What is she agreeing to there? Being friends post break up? I am not clear.

• Maybe you thought she was Closing for now. Tell you before opening again. Be friends post break up.
• Maybe she thought she was Open all along, just tell you if any turn out serious. Be friends post break up.

So after being together nearly two years I come to find that she has been going behind my back and talking to guys on dating sites.

Did you assume she was Closing? Did she promise to Close?

Here it sounds like you do not like finding out she's dating other people. When did she agree to stop dating?

Was that clear in the agreement made?

I found this out because she received a message from some guy I didn't know one night she was at my place.

Is she attached to her phone and not PRESENT when on dates with you? That could be annoying. But I don't see an agreement about limiting devices on dates in this post.

So, I called said friend and it turns out that they've been talking and exchanging messages for awhile. We got into an argument over it and she stormed out and I haven't heard from her since.

You called the dude to check up on her? Are you able to see how that is crossing lines?

I got one response when I said I really needed someone to talk to with her response being what's wrong to which I replied, I hope your new guy treats you half as well as I did and does he know you cheated on me, I'm sure he'd love to know. Because I was upset. I haven't heard anything since.

You call her wanting someone to talk to. And instead of telling her you are hurting and need comforting? Want help sorting out your thoughts?

You dump sarcasm/guilt trip/weird on her head to get digs in? What for? You are surprised she does not want to talk to you after receiving that load?

You were not listening to seek understanding at that time. You were calling to axe grind from the sound of it.

She is the wrong person to be calling. You comfort in, kvetch out. You do not call her to kvetch. You seek outside perspectives to help you before you go in with her to try to sort anything.

I think you could work on your emotional management in a healthier way than going on impulse because you hurt. That might be reason, but it is not excuse.

It's killing me not hearing from her because I would like closure as to what the heck was she thinking and what the hell is going on. My question is, what do I do. I still love her and have feelings for her. I don't necessarily want to get back with her I'd just like some answers. Do I try to email her again? Do I just accept it's over and I'll never get answers? Please help.

You do not get closure from other people. You gift it to yourself.

I think however it turns out in this relationship... you might want to think about how you make agreements with people.

Think about having the person repeat BACK to you whatever it is you are making agreements on. And the HOW of it. So you both are on the same page for expectation.

I think saying something like this at the beginning either out loud or in email...

"We both expect me to be dating other people. We both expect our relationships is Open and not Closed. We both expect me to tell you if one is getting serious/permanent and it is time for you to back off. We both expect that heads up to be (in person, over phone, over email). We both expect you to back off without any arguments. We both expect to try to be friends post break up."​

...could have prevented some of today's ugh. Right now if you promised her no drama, and you are choosing to behave this way? To me that is drama-isn and a turn off.

• If you think you crossed wires in agreement making?
• If you want to reach out to her and let her know you reacted badly and want to apologize for that behavior?
• If on thinking about it see where misunderstanding in agreement making could have happened, and want own your part of the hooha making?

You could email her and tell her all that. You could choose to apologize for flying off the handle a bit, ask for forgiveness. Express that in future you plan to make better articulated agreements so things like this can be avoided. And then wish her well as promised, agree it is over, and with no further arguments.

I mean all this kindly. I see that you are upset, but I also see places where things could have been improved.

Hang in there!

Galagirl

 

[Relssek]

Thanks guys for all the constructive criticism/help. I would love to share the details of the whole relationship perhaps that would shed light on a lot of things for everyone who replied to my post. I did go ahead and email her and she showed me her true colors, which I knew were hiding somewhere beneath the surface, and let's just say I'm no longer missing her anymore. Thanks again folks. I love this site.

 

[sparklepop]

Thanks guys for all the constructive criticism/help. I would love to share the details of the whole relationship perhaps that would shed light on a lot of things for everyone who replied to my post. I did go ahead and email her and she showed me her true colors, which I knew were hiding somewhere beneath the surface, and let's just say I'm no longer missing her anymore. Thanks again folks. I love this site.

Hi Relssek,

I'd love to hear the details if you want to share them. I'd also be very interested to hear what happened when you emailed her?

 

[Relssek]

Ok, so i met her through my wife's bf at the time. When i started talking to her (she was mono) I made absolutely sure that she was ok with my situation,that she understood it, and that it didn't bother her in any way. This is before we even decided to meet each other. She said yes she understood everything and that she was 100 percent ok with it. She also told me that one day she'd like to find someone to settle down with and start a family with. Being that she was mono I made sure that she understood that that could never be me and that I was totally ok with that and when she wanted to start looking for someone permanent that I would back off and let her pursue her interests. So, with all that stuff out of the way and with both of us in agreement we started seeing each other which eventually turned into exclusive dating. I would not see anyone else and neither would she. So, everything was ok for a little while until I noticed her jealousy whenever she was at my place and my wife was around and I would show my wife any kind of affection. I addressed this issue with her and asked her if she was indeed ok with my situation and said if she wasn't and wanted to stop seeing each other it was ok, no hard feelings. she said an adamant no and that she was ok with it and that she loved me and wanted to keep seeing each other. It was just new for her and would take a little getting used to. Again, I asked her if she was absolutely positive and she said yes. I'd like to add I gave her multiple opportunities to back out. I never forced her to keep seeing me like some of you believe. I must add that she was living with her parents and still is. She hid the fact that I was married from her parents for awhile until she finally caved and told her mother that I was married. Her parents are very hateful people. They threatened to report me to the police for seeing her and threatened to get myself and my wife fired from our jobs because of our lifestyle. When she told her mother i was married they kicked her out. I let her live with us for about a month until I could help her find an apartment which i would help her with expenses. I treated her like my second wife. I took her on vacations, excursions, never let her pay for anything, protected her when her parents wanted to have her arrested, help her go to the police when her parents tried to repossess a car that was in her name, etc. You name it, I did it for her. I treated her like a princess and NEVER ever expected nor asked for anything in return. Her parents eventually begged her to come back home, which she did. I did not hold this against her because after all family comes first. We kept seeing each other but she hid it from her parents. Oh, while all this bullshit was going on with her parents I once again asked if things were getting too much for her and if she wanted to stop seeing each other and again she said no, I love you I want to be with you. yet again I asked if she was certain and she again said yes. Ok. life goes on. I would also occasionally ask if she would want to find someone permanent and she would say no. I guess what I'm trying to drive home here is that I was not forcing her to stay in the relationship if she didn't want to. She chose to stay in it. She would stay over my place a few nights a week and we would do things together like go to the movies or go to eat or whatever.
She was like one of the family, as close to a wife as one can be.
After awhile she started getting jealous again, asking if I was talking to any to other women or if I still loved her. I told her that I was not talking to anyone else and that I did love her. She would ask to see my phone to see who I was talking to and I would gladly hand it over because I had nothing to hide. I started to become suspicious that she was lying to me about something about 3 months ago. She would come over less and would not stay as long when she did come over. Again I asked if she was ok and if she still wanted to see each other and if she was talking to other guys and she said she still wanted to see each other and no she wasn't talking to anyone. I told her that if she was she needed to tell me and I would back off and let her continue to do so because that was our deal in the beginning. I wouldn't hold it against her because I would never hold her back from what she wanted. Well it turns out she was lying and talking to other guys for quite awhile which pissed me off because I was nothing but honest with her and I think any person would expect the same from their significant other. That is why I took her phone and found out she was lying. She didn't live up to her end of the bargain when I gave her multiple opportunities to leave. Instead she lied and went behind my back when she could have just been an adult and come to me and tell me she wanted to find a permanent mate. I would not have cared if she did that because that was our deal from the beginning. That is why i believe i deserve an explanation why she did what she did and why I think I deserve closure. All you haters can hate all you want but, are you as sincere and honest in your relationships as I was?? I gave this girl every opportunity to get out and was instead kicked in the teeth and treated like a pile of crap. If any clarification is needed I will gladly provide it.

 

[Magdlyn]

But she wasn't dating anyone. She was merely talking. How is that cheating?

And you were so open and honest, yet despite her denials she was "looking for someone (else) permanent," you took her phone. Why was that OK? At least she asked to see yours.

 

[Relssek]

Seriously? You're splitting hairs. I did ask to see her phone. And she was seeing someone. If you want clarification, just ask. I didn't have time to write a novel that's why I put if you want clarification on anything .....ask.

 

[Magdlyn]

I did ask, dude.

I don't be hatin.'

OK, so we have established she was seeing someone. Was it serious or casual?

And you said you took her phone. That is quite different than asking to see it and being granted permission.

Not splitting hairs. Two different things, asking permission or taking, just like "talking to" and "seeing"/dating/fucking someone are two different things.

 

[Relssek]

You're Right I did say I took her phone. I did take her phone just like she would take my phone to check up on me. I mean it wasn't like I took it by force. I just asked, "Could I see your phone?" She would ask me the same thing and I always handed it over because I had nothing to hide. She could have said no. She didn't she handed it over and I found ongoing conversations with at least half a dozen other guys. I don't know if it was serious or casual but, that doesn't matter because like I said if she was upfront with me before she started talking to them I would have been fine with it. I don't own her. All I ever asked for was honesty not being sneaky and going behind my back. To elaborate on the serious casual thing. I didn't get a chance to find that out because she left my house before we could get that far. Now a couple days after I emailed her saying, I'm paraphrasing because I have since deleted the message and don't remember it exactly but it was:
I'm sorry things ended the way they did.
I do still love you have have feelings for you.
You will always be in my heart and I will always love you.
I do miss you and I wish we could still be friends but I doubt that will ever happen. If you ever need anyone to talk to I'm always here.
All my love,
D

To which she replied, again I'm paraphrasing:
I'm sorry they ended the way they did too. you will always be a part of me. you did so much for me, I'm a stronger person because of you and you were always there for me when my parents were being so cruel to me. I will never forget that. You will always be in my heart forever.
Love,
M


after that email I didn't hear anything until I sent the messages I mentioned in my original post. Then yesterday I sent and email saying:
I'm sorry I responded the way I did when I asked for your help. I hope you are doing well. Have a nice Holiday
D

Kind of a mea culpa.

To which she replied,
Why are you still messaging me?

What happened to always being in her heart?
Well, It is what it is I'm done, moving on and not looking back. It just pisses me off because I did so much for her and that's what I get. Like I said I never ever asked for nor expected anything from her in return.

 

[GalaGirl]

Thank you for clarifying.

It just pisses me off because I did so much for her and that's what I get. Like I said I never ever asked for nor expected anything from her in return

You expected her to behave in a certain way... you guys had become exclusive. You wanted a heads up if she wanted to Open again. That is not expecting nothing. She agreed, no misunderstandings. Just... she plain failed to deliver.

I see you are disappointed/mad. It sounds like there could have been improvements on both sides in future if something like this comes up with new dating partners.... but I think letting this one go is the right thing to do.

Again, I am sorry.

Galagirl

 

[Candiedlove]

Because it's just talking. He didn't see any proof that she was sleeping with or even had actually met this guy in person. Who's to say that she wouldn't have told the OP if she decided to seriously date or sleep with the guy? I don't see why she should have to tell him "I'm talking to someone online. I might decide to date him." That isn't "cheating." That's exercising her right to get to know other people to possibly date or sleep with in a non-monogamous relationship. I personally would chafe if I had to tell my s.o. every time I flirted, talked to, had a crush on someone else. IMHO the OP should trust his lover to tell him what he needs to know, and not freak out because she's talking to another guy she met online dating.

I dunno. If my partner asked me about some guy I was messaging I'd say, Yeah he's pretty cool. Not sure what will happen but I'll let you know.

Not vehemently deny (as OP says happened, for now I'll take him at his word) and go, No, no, no! This isn't anything!

OP has a lot to learn but the other woman was feeding into the story the OP believed in. ...

 

[LoveBunny]

I dunno. If my partner asked me about some guy I was messaging I'd say, Yeah he's pretty cool. Not sure what will happen but I'll let you know.

Not vehemently deny (as OP says happened, for now I'll take him at his word) and go, No, no, no! This isn't anything!

True. I also would have told the truth. She was probably coming from a monogamous mindset hence the instinctual, vehement denial of flirting with another man. Also, she might have expected fireworks from the OP and that's why she denied. If he seemed like he was going to blow his top, or if they had an agreement that they were "closed" (which seems foolish to me, given he's married, and she wanted a husband and kids someday) she might have thought it better to just talk the situation down.

 

[Magdlyn]

Ok, so i met her through my wife's bf at the time. When i started talking to her (she was mono) I made absolutely sure that she was ok with my situation, that she understood it, and that it didn't bother her in any way. This is before we even decided to meet each other. She said yes she understood everything, and that she was 100 percent ok with it.

She also told me that one day she'd like to find someone to settle down with and start a family with. Being that she was mono, I made sure that she understood that that could never be me, and that I was totally ok with that, and when she wanted to start looking for someone permanent that I would back off and let her pursue her interests.

So, with all that stuff out of the way, and with both of us in agreement, we started seeing each other, which eventually turned into exclusive dating. I would not see anyone else and neither would she.

So, everything was ok for a little while, until I noticed her jealousy whenever she was at my place and my wife was around and I would show my wife any kind of affection. I addressed this issue with her and asked her if she was indeed ok with my situation, and said if she wasn't, and wanted to stop seeing each other, it was ok, no hard feelings. She said an adamant no, and that she was ok with it, and that she loved me and wanted to keep seeing each other. It was just new for her and would take a little getting used to.

Again, I asked her if she was absolutely positive and she said yes. I'd like to add I gave her multiple opportunities to back out. I never forced her to keep seeing me like some of you believe.

I must add that she was living with her parents and still is. She hid the fact that I was married from her parents for awhile until she finally caved and told her mother that I was married. Her parents are very hateful people. They threatened to report me to the police for seeing her and threatened to get myself and my wife fired from our jobs because of our lifestyle.

When she told her mother i was married they kicked her out. I let her live with us for about a month until I could help her find an apartment, [for] which i would help her with expenses.

I treated her like my second wife. I took her on vacations, excursions, never let her pay for anything, protected her when her parents wanted to have her arrested, help her go to the police when her parents tried to repossess a car that was in her name, etc. You name it, I did it for her. I treated her like a princess and NEVER ever expected nor asked for anything in return.

Her parents eventually begged her to come back home, which she did. I did not hold this against her because, after all, family comes first. We kept seeing each other, but she hid it from her parents.

Oh, while all this bullshit was going on with her parents I once again asked if things were getting too much for her, and if she wanted to stop seeing each other, and again she said no, I love you I want to be with you. yet again I asked if she was certain and she again said yes.

Ok. life goes on. I would also occasionally ask if she would want to find someone permanent and she would say no. I guess what I'm trying to drive home here is that I was not forcing her to stay in the relationship if she didn't want to. She chose to stay in it. She would stay over my place a few nights a week and we would do things together like go to the movies or go to eat or whatever. She was like one of the family, as close to a wife as one can be.


After awhile she started getting jealous again, asking if I was talking to any to other women, or if I still loved her. I told her that I was not talking to anyone else and that I did love her. She would ask to see my phone to see who I was talking to, and I would gladly hand it over because I had nothing to hide.

I started to become suspicious that she was lying to me about something about 3 months ago. She would come over less and would not stay as long when she did come over. Again I asked if she was ok, and if she still wanted to see each other, and if she was talking to other guys, and she said she still wanted to see each other, and no, she wasn't talking to anyone. I told her that if she was, she needed to tell me, and I would back off and let her continue to do so, because that was our deal in the beginning. I wouldn't hold it against her, because I would never hold her back from what she wanted.

Well it turns out she was lying and talking to other guys for quite a while, which pissed me off, because I was nothing but honest with her. I think any person would expect the same from their significant other. That is why I took her phone and found out she was lying.

She didn't live up to her end of the bargain when I gave her multiple opportunities to leave. Instead she lied and went behind my back when she could have just been an adult, and come to me and tell me she wanted to find a permanent mate. I would not have cared if she did that because that was our deal from the beginning. That is why i believe i deserve an explanation why she did what she did, and why I think I deserve closure.


All you haters can hate all you want but, are you as sincere and honest in your relationships as I was?? I gave this girl every opportunity to get out and was instead kicked in the teeth and treated like a pile of crap. If any clarification is needed I will gladly provide it.

Relssek, I went ahead and put paragraph breaks and a few commas into your wall of text, which is hard to navigate.

I am still not seeing where she is seeing/dating/fucking one out of "at least a half dozen" guys she was chatting with. Even the guy you (rudely) called that night she got a text from him; is he the one she was actually dating?

I do see her feeling jealous that you had 2 women (her and your wife), and she was uncomfortable when you and your wife showed physical affection for each other in front of her. Did you offer her the option of showing less affection for your wife in front of her? All I see is you told her, "This is the way it will be (me kissing my wife in front of you.) If you don't like it, there's the door."

I see you "treated her as a wife" but told her she couldn't settle down and have kids with you. Why is that? Don't you want kids?

You offered her a wife-like position, but not the kids she wanted. At age 28-30, that can get to be a high priority for women whose eggs have an expiration date. Sometimes people think with the primitive parts of their brains in cases like this.

She must have had great internal conflict, since the only agreement you two reached was, she will be treated like a wife, cared for, fun dates, sex (I assume), have most of her expenses paid, as long as she was mono to you, and stopped thinking about kids. If she wanted kids and a true wife-like situation, she would lose you as a bf and only get you as "a friend." She must not have had the courage to give you up completely. Or to try and negotiate having kids with you, and keep you as a partner.

You offered her a relationship as long as she was exclusive to you. And you were exclusive to her-- and your wife! She probably wanted to keep the security of you (and let's face it, your money, since you spoiled her by paying for everything) around, even if she was ready to start looking for another guy. She may not ID as poly, but somehow was able to be in r'ship with you while chatting with several men, and (possibly?) casually dating one of them.

She was ready to move on, but not totally at peace with her decision. And she felt she couldn't discuss it with you. It seems she didn't have courage to negotiate a NEW deal with you, like, keeping you as a bf while dating others and seeking Mr Right to marry and have kids with. Which is what she was actually doing.

I hope I didn't step out of line in this post. You said you wanted and feel you "deserve" closure, but since you scared and annoyed her with your sarcasm, and she won't speak to you now, I am offering ideas that I feel may have been going through her head.