KT's Blog

[LovingRadiance]

One little thing I keep seeing the texts come up. All day it was reverberating in my mind.

Here's my personal thought-it may have no bearing-but I figure it's at least worth consideration since all of you seem to be coming from a different point of view-maybe a 4th or 5th would be the one you could agree on?

I have NO issue with Maca reading my diary with GG (yes GG and I keep a diary). He's free to read our diary, he's free to read our texts, he's free to read our emails, he's free to read our letters and cards as far as I'm concerned.

BUT-these are OUR conversations and he's NOT free to hold them against us. I won't edit what I write or ask GG to edit what he writes in our personal correspondence, for Maca's comfort.

The same works backwards. GG is free to read Maca and I's D/s journal, our emails, our cards/letters, texts. BUT these are OUR conversations and he's NOT free to hold them against us. I won't edit what I write or ask Maca to edit what he writes in our personal correspondence, for GG's comfort.

I OFTEN read through GG's emails, sent and recieved. We get very little time together and it gives me a chance to keep up on what's going on in his life. Sometimes I will inquire as to details.
Such as-recently a friend of his mentioned in their correspondence that his wife had issues with having company over, but he was trying to arrange for a June "dinner date" for us to visit.
I asked GG, "if she is so uncomfortable with it, and we're looking at June anyway, why not a picnic dinner at the park instead?"
My point is-that my comments/questions weren't judgmental, hurt, antagonistic etc. I used the information I gained by reading his personal correspondence (yes he knows full well I do this AND he's fine with it-but if you doubt please feel free to PM him) to help resolve discomfort for someone else HE cares about-not for personal gain.

I think that in a great relationship there shouldn't be a NEED for secrecy or privacy. But there also shouldn't be a NEED to sneak and pry into things either.

I don't think that there would be a big issue in reading the texts IF the reaction were different.

The problem arises when you "seek for" information you aren't REALLY ready to accept.
Don't ask what you aren't willing to hear the answer to, so to speak.

I've had this battle with Maca. He would read our diary (gg/mine) and then use the information against me. For example, at some point a long time ago i wrote something about really loving the way GG's you know what felt like inside of me.
Nice sort of thing to share with a lover.

BUT I never meant that to mean I DO NOT like Maca's you know what inside of me. I wasn't writing to MACA. However-when he read it-he read it as a statement against him and went on the defensive.
He wasn't ready to face what he might find when he opened the book-and yet he chose to read it. Bad move.
Haunted him for years.

A few weeks ago he said something to me about "you don't want me reading your book with GG". I corrected him-no, I don't give a SHIT if you read it or not. I'm TOTALLY ok with you knowing ALL about our relationship. But YOU ARE NOT OK with knowing ALL about our relationship-so YOU don't want YOU to read the book."

Completely different issue.

Now-all of that rambled on about-something I absolutely LOATHE is having someone looking over my shoulder while I write. I don't care who reads what I write-WHEN I AM DONE WRITING IT. But I HATE when people are peering over my shoulder while I try to write.....

 

[redpepper]

MG, Mono and Nerdist haven't accepted MY life choices. I actually take some offense to that. I feel as if I haven't been listened to if that is what you think. We haven't accepted anything! We have embraced each others life choices. I'm sorry, I am defensive. Really though, all of us have made the choice to accept our life choices. There is no imbalance in that. Its the only way it works.

 

[Morningglory629]

MG, Mono and Nerdist haven't accepted MY life choices. I actually take some offense to that. I feel as if I haven't been listened to if that is what you think. We haven't accepted anything! We have embraced each others life choices. I'm sorry, I am defensive. Really though, all of us have made the choice to accept our life choices. There is no imbalance in that. Its the only way it works.

Accept=embrace in my book...no offense meant.

 

[redpepper]

Thanks for the clarification MG. Accept = settling in my book and I certainly have seen myself as settling in Mono and my early days. I had to accept that he would never be okay with me taking another male lover. I have embraced that by creating relationships with men that are not sexually intimate but are very deep regardless. Its odd for me and I am wondering if that odd feeling will turn into odd settling or odd embracing.
Right now I am fine with it and can see that in the future I will be too. For me, life without Mono, in the way we are now, just isn't going to work for me. I require intimate closeness with him. I don't see that ever changing, but this is my issue to embrace and face if I am to be with him.

Nerdist and I have been poly our whole relationship. We meet when I was married to my ex wife. He came into our relationship as my secondary at the time. That was 13 years ago. He doesn't chose to accept my lifestyle, he is my life style and I am his. We have understood each other this way all along. We have never understood monogamous lifestyles and now learn about them from Mono. In great detail I might add. I hope this helps make sense to our situation.

While I understand something of what you are going through, I don't understand how there is an imbalance in embracing each other for who you are and for what each others relationship is. I get that there are personalities at play, but its all taught cultural stuff that I hear from you all, not character stuff. Even if someone is mono I still think that the fact that someone they love is poly can be embraced and worked out without having to give up everything.

 

[MonoVCPHG]

Our relationship has been give and take by all involved. No one person has given up more than the other. We don't even focus on that view of things..we focus on what we bring to each other and what a beautiful and caring future we plan on having.

We embrace each other.

 

[redpepper]

I thought again after writing and wanted to add that we have made our own rules. Those boundaries, values, ways of being, whatever you want to call it, govern who we are and our relationship. WE made the, together. This is why Mono is worried about your husband I think MG, not that you have to do things our way, but just to explain. EVERYONE in our company is involved, communicating, or at least attempting to. We ALL are working on sustainablility, comfort and more loving relationships because of it.

Last night
Derby came over with her husband to hang out with us. It was important to her last night and therefore me that we all get to know each other better. We know each other well enough as friends but he has just come home from 6 months away and things are different now. Derby and I are together now. Nerdist bustled around excitedly getting drinks and Mono joked and chatted. It was a nice night. Short lived, as we were all tired at the end of the week, but a nice start to more time hanging out. Its just so important to us and part of the world we are creating for ourselves. Dictated by us using some of mainstream culture, but very unique and our own.

 

[KatTails]

Sorry it has taken me a while to respond - I needed time to think things over.

Originally posted by redpepper - Wow KT, its going down fast it seems. This boat that is your relationship. It sounds like you are not going to be ever be okay in this. Maybe its time to really go with what you gut is saying and either start bailing or abandon ship.

RP - yes, things got really bad for a couple of days. Neither 2rings nor I thought our marriage was going to last. We both want it to - without doubt - but the fighting, the crying, the pain - is just overwhelming us. He is an incredibly strong man - but he reached his breaking point and I have never seen him like this - it scared me. We were just not able to communicate. We were just going round and round repeating the same stuff again and again. I had issues with MG - he doesn't like when I question her honesty, integrity or motivation. But there were issues that needed to be talked about. I am not jumping ship - I struggle everyday - but I love my husband more than anything and need to have him in my life. I will do whatever I have to do to make myself happy so that I can make him happy.

Originally posted by Redpepper - I would like to suggest this has made you into someone you are not liking.

RP - very true! I hate all the crying, jealousy, drama, meltdowns, cattiness, anger, resentment - it is making me CRAZY!!!! I want to be happy. I want to stay married. I want to be a good wife. I want to be a good mother. I KNOW that I can be all these things - I WILL be all these things. It is going to take work - but I have to do this. Once I get all of those negative emotions under control - I will be a better, happier person. The journey to being a better, happier person, starts today!

Originally posted by Ygirl - If you like who you are when you are with the other person, it is PROBABLY a healthy relationship, and when you don't, it is probably NOT healthy.

Ygirl - when I am with my husband - I am happy, I feel loved, I feel gratitude that he is my husband. He is my best friend and I love him more than I can even find the words to describe. That is why I can't just give up. This is why I need to keep finding ways to accept MG in his life. He is a great husband, father, son, friend and more - he deserves to be happy and if he needs both of us to be so, then I need to make it happen.

Originally posted by LovingRadiance - What caught my eye in Kats post wasn't the SPEED she wants to go-it's that she DOESN'T want to go there. If she really DOES NOT want to go there, then she is on the wrong road all together and speed isn't the issue at all. On the other hand, if she DOES want to go there, then the best gift she can give HERSELF (not her husband or MG) is to "just do it". Either way there will be good AND BAD things that happen. But focusing on the bad things in EITHER direction will only create more frustration and pain for HER. If on the other hand she makes her decision and then chooses to go with it 100%, it won't matter WHICH decision she chooses-it will go better for her.

LR - you are 100% right - some days, I DO NOT WANT THIS. Somedays, it is overwhelming and gut wrenchingly painful and it feels like I can't do this for one more second. When I think about divorce, picture what my life would be like without him as my husband, without him there helping me daily with raising our kids, without him in bed next to me every night -- those thoughts are much more painful. I need to accept this for ME - I need to find peace and acceptance with this. I need to embrace MG as a part of my husbands life. When I do, when I stop the negativity, when I stop the cattiness, when I stop the fighting and crying - then, and only then, can I be happy.

Originally posted by LR - have you two identified these restrictions as PERMANENT or as temporary? Because if they are temporary-they need to have a timeline for readdressing each of them. If they are permanent-then it seems OBVIOUS that this isn't going to work. Permanent rules in a relationship only work if both parties are agreeable to them. If he's feeling anger and resentment, he isn't agreeable to them.

LR - these restrictions that I have, are temporary. But I will not have a date set in stone. It is fluid, these emotions are up and down. I have tried to show 2rings and MG that I am working daily to find acceptance and understanding. I don't know if they believe me or not - but I know that I am trying. The restrictions that I have asked for - are simply to make me feel more comfortable with this situation. You're right - he is not agreeable to them and that is the main reason we were fighting the last few days.

Once again - my eyes keep closing - so I am going to log off and go to bed. I will finish responsing to peoples quotes tomorrow.

Kat

 

[NeonKaos]

Ygirl - when I am with my husband - I am happy, I feel loved, I feel gratitude that he is my husband. He is my best friend and I love him more than I can even find the words to describe. That is why I can't just give up. This is why I need to keep finding ways to accept MG in his life. He is a great husband, father, son, friend and more - he deserves to be happy and if he needs both of us to be so, then I need to make it happen.

That's just grooovy, but do you like how YOU are when you are with him, in particular, when you are with him in this polyamorous context? It's not about whether HE deserves to be happy, it's not about whether YOU love HIM. We (redpepper touched on this too) are asking, are YOU happy with YOURSELF. It doesn't count if "you" are happy "for" someone else's benefit - it only counts if you are happy for YOU. I'm not talking about "compersion". I am talking about "self-realization" (or "self-esteem" if you will forgive the corniness and predictability of that term).

I think this has touched upon the crux of your problem right here. Just from the way you answered me, I can tell that you do NOT like who you are in this situation. That is because I asked about YOU, and you went "my husband, my husband, my husband".

I am sorry if I offended you by saying these things, but I would be doing no one any favors by not saying them.

 

[KatTails]

I think this has touched upon the crux of your problem right here. Just from the way you answered me, I can tell that you do NOT like who you are in this situation. That is because I asked about YOU, and you went "my husband, my husband, my husband".

I am sorry if I offended you by saying these things, but I would be doing no one any favors by not saying them.

YGirl - you did not offend me in any way - you hit the nail on the head. Last night I started to answer how I felt about myself-but you are right - I started talking about my husband. My identity, my feelings of self-worth are wrapped up in my husband and my children. I am his wife and their Mom. Him and I are best friends - we were each others lives. That is why this has hurt me so bad - he now has a new part of his life and he fell in love with a woman who is the exact opposite of me in almost everyway. I have allowed myself to pick apart everything that she is that I am not - and I lost sight of who I am and why he is married to me, why he isn't leaving me, why he is committed to me for life. Since they fell in love - I have been more emotional, more jealous, more insecure, started hating myself, started feeling that I wasn't important, that I wasn't loved, that I was being replaced or pushed aside for something better, something more of what he needed. It has destroyed any self-respect or self-esteem that I did have - which probably wasn't alot to begin with. You and redpepper are right - I do not like who I am now. I KNOW THAT THIS IS THE PROBLEM! What I don't know is how to make me feel better about me. I got so caught up in being hurt by what he was doing that I allowed myself to wallow in those feelings of negativity. They are like a security blanket I can't let go of. If I keep saying that he is hurting me, that he is causing this pain, that he is breaking my heart, that MG is making me jealous, that MG is making me feel insecure, that MG is making me feel intimidated - - - then I don't have to stand up and fight the harder battle of taking control of my life, of making myself responsible for my happiness and my own sense of self-worth. I feel like I am just now starting to dig myself out of this hole of self-pity that I have dug myself into over the past year. This is hard for me - but I know I need to do it for ME and no one else but me.

Kat

 

[NeonKaos]

Let me put this out there - I am not suggesting that you do this, but I want you to "fantasize" what it would be like:

I have a friend who lives with his son and the mother of their son. They never got legally married. The kid is 14 now, and when he was about 6, his mother decided she didn't want to be a romantic couple with my friend, but that she wanted them to continue living together as a family. This has been going on ever since, both parents have separate bedrooms and separate love-lives.

What if you and your husband tried doing the converse of that? You could have separate households but continue to be married in every other sense of the word. I realize that this may not be possible or desirable for a whole spectrum of reasons. Again, I'm not suggesting that you actually go and DO this. I'm suggesting it as a mental exercise for you to fantasize what it would be LIKE. And, I encourage you to explore all aspects of it, positive and negative. Write about it in a journal or a blog if you feel that would help. However, my personal feeling is that you should keep that journal or blog private, or share it only with your therapist, in the beginning at least.

See, I'm not really giving you ADVICE here. Wouldn't I make a good therapist? I would if I wasn't a misanthrope at heart. But everything I have said is free to you, so if it does not work, I will give you double your money back.

 

[LovingRadiance]

LR - these restrictions that I have, are temporary. But I will not have a date set in stone. It is fluid, these emotions are up and down. I have tried to show 2rings and MG that I am working daily to find acceptance and understanding. I don't know if they believe me or not - but I know that I am trying. The restrictions that I have asked for - are simply to make me feel more comfortable with this situation. You're right - he is not agreeable to them and that is the main reason we were fighting the last few days.

Let me clarify something. A date for re-addressing is NECESSARY.
But that does not mean it's a date to DROP a restriction. It's a date to RE-address the restriction.
It's a time to discuss how it is working, if ANY changes can or should be made and to create a new date.

For example-with a boundary list-it's good to set it (at least in the first year or two) to be re-addressed every month or two.Because everyone is doing so much growing that things really can change so quickly and boundaries could change internally just as quickly.

So I still advise that you NEED a re-address date. It will also serve the purpose of letting 2rings know that you understand this topic isn't going to just "stay" that way indefinitely and that you are working on it.

It's easy for others to think you aren't working on it-if it's just an open-ended topic. Then they will pester you-which in turn will put your defenses up and cause it to take LONGER for you to deal with it.

If you have a date to discuss it-then they can leave you alone in between re-address dates and you can more easily focus on dealing with the topic without the added defensiveness caused by their pushing.

 

[KatTails]

Please be patient - this is a long post!

Warning - warning - warning - this is a long post. But I wanted to answer everyone who posted a few days ago when things were going really bad between my husband, 2rings, and I. It has just taken me a few days to do it.
_________________________________________________________________
Thanks LR - what I meant was that I do not want to set a date that I have to give up all restrictions and be totally ok with this - which is what I think MG would like - but I don't want to put words in her mouth. I agree with you that that they do need to be re-evaluated every few months.

The restrictions that I have asked for are/were for me to be able to better handle the emotions that I was having due to their relationship. The restrictions were: 1.) I asked them to not do one specific sex act, 2.) not to have sex in our house, 3.) that I didn't want her to meet our friends and family, and 4.) to be careful in and around our neighborhood so people we know don't see them. My husband is of the mind that it is better to just pull the bandaid off quickly, instead of slowly and painfully. I can see his point. The first one I have already told him, is off the table - - - I just don't want to know about it. This is the one that was making him the most angry and resentful - while it was important to me, it was causing too many arguments and problems between us. The second - I am not willing to negotiate right now. That doesn't mean never, it just means I will let them know when and if I change my mind and heart on that. He understands why I am not ok with him bringing her here for sex. The third one I agreed would be ok - but only as a friend of ours, not as a GF. He agrees - he is not ready to "come out" to anyone yet. The fourth one - he agrees with and is being careful about.

The first and third "rules" were the ones causing the most issues between us - so they were the ones that I am going to need to work through to understand and accept.

Originally posted by YGirl --- What if you and your husband tried doing the converse of that? You could have separate households but continue to be married in every other sense of the word. I realize that this may not be possible or desirable for a whole spectrum of reasons. Again, I'm not suggesting that you actually go and DO this. I'm suggesting it as a mental exercise for you to fantasize what it would be LIKE. And, I encourage you to explore all aspects of it, positive and negative. Write about it in a journal or a blog if you feel that would help. However, my personal feeling is that you should keep that journal or blog private, or share it only with your therapist, in the beginning at least.

I have mentally imagined this - but more in the context of us seperating or divorcing. It broke my heart just thinking about it. He is such a huge part of my life - that I can't imagine it without him. With that said - I will give your mental excercise a try and I will journal it and share it with my therapist. And I'll take you up on your "double my money back" guarantee! Ha ha! Thanks for the laugh - I needed it!

Originally posted by LovingRadiance - - - Again-NOT being catty here.
Kat-life is not fair. It never has been, it's not likely it ever will be. It's NOT fair that you should be told "my way or the highway" in life. BUT-it happens ALL of the time in our lives in millions of areas. It's part of living with other people.
If we want to entertwine our lives with others, then we aren't going to get to do things "our way" all of the time. Some things may go perfectly our way. Some things will go perfectly NOT our way. Some things will fall somewhere in between. You *general you here* can't choose what anyone else wants for their life or what they will do for their life. Nor can they choose for you. All you can do is decide if the path you are on is the one you WANT TO BE ON. There are pros and there are cons for each fork in the road. You are at a fork in the road. You can keep your husband AS HE IS (which means having his girlfriend too) or you can NOT keep your husband and choose a different path for your life that won't include dealing with his girlfriend.

If you look at it a little different-it is fair. (please just listen). We EACH get to choose our path. His choice is the same as yours. He can be true to himself-and possibly lose you or he can NOT be true to himself and possibly lose you. You can be true to yourself-and possibly lose him or you can NOT be true to yourself and possibly lose him. IF either of you chooses to not be true to yourself-you may lose one another, but you will DEFINITELY lose yourselves... Does that make sense?

LR - you are right - again! This is the conclusion that I have pretty much come to: I need to accept my husband for who he is. He is a man who loves two women. I accept (embrace) that. This acceptance of who my husband is - has caused me a great amount of pain. But losing him - would be worse. As he explained to me many times: I had 100% of him before. I can either be happy with the 90% I am getting now and not complain about the 10% I'm not getting or I can lose all of him. I can be happy that he loves me, wants to stay married to me for the rest of our lives, raise our children together, know he'll come home to me almost everynight, have my best friend around to help me make decisions, take vacations.... or I can divorce him, have to have visitation with my children, be alone, not have my best friend in my life, make all decisions myself, and eventually have to start dating (which I can't even imagine!!!) I have decided I would rather have the 90% anyday!!!

Originally posted by LR - - - There shouldn't be hidden hurt in a relationship anyway. The key is to find the PRODUCTIVE way to express it my friend. It's not healthy or productive to hide it. You have to express it-look at Maca's thread, the whole battle was about each of the guys keeping those hurts to themselves, which causes MORE problems and headache for me.
The meltdowns do need to stop. The catty attitude too. But not at the expense of honest and open expression. You need healthy alternatives!
You need to ask that counselor for some healthy methods to express hurt, anger, anxiety etc. THEN you need to practice them. SERIOUSLY-stand in a mirror and practice them EVERY DAY. Because unless you practice-they won't come to mind in the heat of the moment.

LR - this is where I struggle the most. I don't know how to productively express how I am feeling. I have tried to be honest and open - but it still causes them to get angry at times. This is something that my therapist and I are going to start working on. If you, or anyone else, know of any books on this topic - I would appreciate the name. Knowing how to calmly and productively express my emotions would go a long way.

Originally quoted by Morningglory - - - KT-I hope cancelling my plans to see 2R this week helped you both work through some of these things especially last night

MG - I didn't know if our marriage was ending or not, and I don't think he did either. This was a breaking point for both of us and we have never been closer to divorcing than we were those few days - - - so I hope you see that it was extremely important for him to come home to me that night so that we could fight, talk and decide where our marriage was headed. I know you don't understand why he would want to come home knowing we are going to fight - but he knows how important it is that we do so. Not talking and ignoring the issue is not an option - especially when our marriage is on the line. So yes, cancelling your plans with him did help us work through our problems - since we were able to talk and decide that this marriage is worth working hard to save. I hope you understand that me being ok with you guys going out last night was because I too understand that you guys need your time and I truly do try to give that time to you without interruptions.

More to continue - sorry.....
Kat

 

[KatTails]

Continued....

Continued from above....

Originally posted by Morningglory - - - Mono/Nerdist do not seem to be as resistant to accepting your life choices as KT is, so it is a little tough to follow some of your advice because we are treading much more lightly, and going as slow as we possibly can and trying to be as careful and considerate as possible. This has been a tumultuous year to say the least.

MG - while this is true - the situation that RP/Nerdist/Mono are in - is A LOT different than our situation. RP has a husband, boyfriend and girlfriend, her girlfriend has a husband, Nerdist has a wife and girlfriend, Mono chooses to be mono. Each of them has someone else they love (with the exception of Mono - but by choice) 2rings has me and you, you have 2r and P - I have 2rings and no one else. If you have a problem - you have both 2r and P to lean on. If one is not available - you have the other one. If I have a problem - I only have 2r. If he is with you - I am alone. I never asked for this - in fact, this is exactly what I was worried about from the beginning. I made it clear this isn't what I wanted - but it happened anyways. So thank you for treading lightly and going slow - - - you guys are asking a lot of me - - - I think going slow and being careful and considerate while I learn to accept that my husband has a girlfriend who he loves - isn't too much to ask. I'm trying to accept that my marriage isn't what I wanted or planned for, P doesn't want to know what's going on, you are staying married, we are staying married - so what is the rush?

Originally posted by LR - - - I think that in a great relationship there shouldn't be a NEED for secrecy or privacy. But there also shouldn't be a NEED to sneak and pry into things either. I don't think that there would be a big issue in reading the texts IF the reaction were different. The problem arises when you "seek for" information you aren't REALLY ready to accept.
Don't ask what you aren't willing to hear the answer to, so to speak.

LR - this is what is so screwed up about what I am doing. I feel a compulsion to look at his texts or to look through his stuff. I never felt this compulsion before MG. I can't seem to stop myself from looking at his phone. BUT - when I do, my heart races, my hands shake, my ears ring - I actually have a physical reaction to what I'm doing. I NEVER find anything that makes me feel good. I have NEVER caught him in a lie. EVERYTHING I have seen on there hurts me, makes me jealous, makes me cry. SO WHY DO I CONTINUE TO DO IT???? It frustrates me just as much as it does them. I know it is a violation of their trust and their privacy. I do feel extreme guilt for doing it. I have not looked at his phone or looked through his truck in a few weeks. I have started to, I have picked up his phone, but I HAVE NOT LOOKED. I'm proud of that.

Originally posted by RedPepper - - - For me, life without Mono, in the way we are now, just isn't going to work for me. I require intimate closeness with him. I don't see that ever changing, but this is my issue to embrace and face if I am to be with him.

Nerdist and I have been poly our whole relationship. We meet when I was married to my ex wife. He came into our relationship as my secondary at the time. That was 13 years ago. He doesn't chose to accept my lifestyle, he is my life style and I am his. We have understood each other this way all along. We have never understood monogamous lifestyles and now learn about them from Mono. In great detail I might add. I hope this helps make sense to our situation.

While I understand something of what you are going through, I don't understand how there is an imbalance in embracing each other for who you are and for what each others relationship is. I get that there are personalities at play, but its all taught cultural stuff that I hear from you all, not character stuff. Even if someone is mono I still think that the fact that someone they love is poly can be embraced and worked out without having to give up everything.

RP - I agree with you - it's finding out how to embrace this that is the most difficult. Just like if I decided to have a boyfriend - I know for a fact, that my husband would have a very hard time accepting it. And your explanation of the progression of your relationships with Nerdist and Mono - explain what I said above to MG. While our situations are different - I am learning so much from all of you (you, Nerdist, Mono, Derby and Roly)!!!!! Your openness and honesty is amazing! Thank you to all of you!

Originally posted by Mono - - - Our relationship has been give and take by all involved. No one person has given up more than the other. We don't even focus on that view of things..we focus on what we bring to each other and what a beautiful and caring future we plan on having.

Mono - I hope we can get to this way of thinking. It isn't there right now - but I hope it will be eventually. MG - I know you agree with this too. Let's find a way to make it work - together. I think we are starting to work on it more.

Phew!!! Sorry this was sooooooo long - but I was trying to answer all of the posts from the other day. I finally did it!

Good night - Kat

 

[Morningglory629]

MG - while this is true - the situation that RP/Nerdist/Mono are in - is A LOT different than our situation. RP has a husband, boyfriend and girlfriend, her girlfriend has a husband, Nerdist has a wife and girlfriend, Mono chooses to be mono. Each of them has someone else they love (with the exception of Mono - but by choice) 2rings has me and you, you have 2r and P - I have 2rings and no one else. If you have a problem - you have both 2r and P to lean on. If one is not available - you have the other one. If I have a problem - I only have 2r. If he is with you - I am alone. I never asked for this - in fact, this is exactly what I was worried about from the beginning. I made it clear this isn't what I wanted - but it happened anyways. So thank you for treading lightly and going slow - - - you guys are asking a lot of me - - - I think going slow and being careful and considerate while I learn to accept that my husband has a girlfriend who he loves - isn't too much to ask. I'm trying to accept that my marriage isn't what I wanted or planned for, P doesn't want to know what's going on, you are staying married, we are staying married - so what is the rush?

Good night - Kat

No rush...as a matter of fact pulling back on the reigns of moving forward on some of those things because as LR had mentioned maybe they are insignificant to the relationship. Pulling back in my opinion that is, maybe you have a different opinion. KT- Just want a gameplan so to speak. I am just not good with open-ended, indefinites. Over a year in the making is not really rushing it and I am happy you are in a good place, so am I.

Last edited by KatTails; Today at 09:08 AM. Reason: Deleted something that could be mistaken for cattiness.No problem...although I am glad you did! 2r didn't tell ya I was working until 7 am huh?!LOL!

 

[LovingRadiance]

Kat-
I created a page on my blog of books I suggest. Just in case you wanted to dig around in there.
I'll be adding more-but I feel like crud, so here in a few I'm going to go take another hot shower, see if I can break up some of the congestion in my chest and head!

Take care!!

 

[Morningglory629]

2rings has me and you, you have 2r and P - I have 2rings and no one else. If you have a problem - you have both 2r and P to lean on. If one is not available - you have the other one. If I have a problem - I only have 2r. If he is with you - I am alone.

If you are having a problem...you have me too!

 

[ak2381]

If you are having a problem...you have me too!

MG, this is a wonderful offer but I think I get where KT is coming from on this. While she has you as a friend and might feel she can come to you with a problem it just isn't quite the same as leaning on the shoulder of a man you are in love with. What I think she is tryinng to say is you are in love with two men, 2R is in love with two women. You both know that no matter what, someone you are in love with to turn to in a time of need. One way or another you will be curled into the arms of some that you are in love with and who is in love with you.
For me I deepply care about J and I know I can turn to her. But I get jealous sometimes becauuse she has both DH and her husband. DH has both her and me. Her husbandhas had her and another. Its a matter of feeling like you might be lonely one day and not have that person you are in love with to hold you.
Did I get that right KT?

 

[KatTails]

MG - thanks! I really appreciate the support.

AK - you took the thought out of my head and the feelings out of my heart. This is exactly right.

Last week 2r and I were in a big fight and I wasn't sure if our marriage was going to last. We were both very emotional that day - and fighting through texts is impossible. 2r told me that he cancelled plans with MG, who was having some problems and wanted to talk to him about it, so he could come home after work and try to work on our marriage with me. He felt bad that he had to do that again to her. My feeling is - I thought we were done. I thought he had finally had enough of my meltdowns that he was leaving me. She had her husband to talk to about her problems and the only person that I could talk to about my marriage was my husband. Coming home to me to decide what we were going to do should not have even been a question.

If he would have gone out that night with her, I would have been left at home crying and worrying about my marriage ending.

MG and I are definitely working on our friendship. And I do appreciate her reaching out and letting me know she's there for me. In fact, the three of us are having lunch today. But more than not, I need to lean on my husband when I have problems.

​

 

[LovingRadiance]

I understand that point Kat.

I have GG and Maca.

BUT I tell everyone (not just them) my primary priority is my kids.
With the rest it's a matter of level of importance.

IF Maca and I are having an "end of relationship possible" issue-that comes first.
IF GG and I are having that issue-that comes first.

One person's moodiness isn't more important than another person's crisis.

When my sisters health was on the line-I was GONE and both men left to follow or be alone, because her life was more important than any "date" I may have had.

That said-we all try very hard to be respectful of each others special moments.

For example, I would never plan a date with GG the first two weeks in July. I am going to find out when Maca is available for our anniversary (which is the 9th but if he has to work, we may have to celebrate another day) and what he wants to do, a dinner, a night at a hotel, a weekend getaway, a week long vacation?

Likewise-I don't plan a date with Maca on April 9th or 13th. That's GG and I's anniversary and his birthday. We don't get an overnight, weekend getaway or week long vacation-but the gist is the same.

I also don't make concrete plans for Nov. 7th with EITHER of them-cause that's my sisters bday and if she is available-I prefer to spend it with her!

It's not just a "lovers" thing-it's a situation of recognizing importance of circumstance AND relationship.

This came up in the thread I started about GG and I. Because he didn't choose to take time off to be iwth me when I went in for surgery.
Maca was as upset as I was and GG was baffled. Midnightsun posted it pretty succinctly on there.. something about she'd have slept in the car, but no one was stopping her from being where her friend MIGHT need her in such a life-threatening time.

Here's a link in case you are interested-her post is damn near to the LAST. In fact, I think it's the last couple. But the whole thread talks about responsibilities in these situations.
http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2446

It looks at it from my perspective-which wouldn't be yours Kat, but more like 2rings-but I think you may find it interesting anyway.

 

[Morningglory629]

All good points. Just to clarify I wasn't meeting 2R for a date. I had and am going through a HUGE family crisis. That night was the first that I had heard about this particular problem and though I was stuck at work I had to make some quick decisions which were pretty hard and family dynamic altering, and it hit me like a ton of bricks. 2R is especially well-versed on the subject matter and I sought his support and counseling. When he told me about Kat's insecurities and fragile state, I understood and told him to go without incident. No problem.
What I mean for Kat when I said, I am here for her too is that we are building a relationship that is more like a sisterly bond not just a friendship. That is our goal anyway. I get that she will need her husband, and she has him whenever she needs him. He is avery supportive and attentive husband to her, and a fabulously active dad to the kids. Like Maca he is a very manly man and prides himself on being the pillar. So I totally get that that is what Kat needed right then and there. So it was a no brainer when she was that upset for him to go to her. I could see they both needed that night and a good majority of the rest of the weekend. Compersion right?
We had a very nice lunch and I was glad 2R came up with the idea of us meeting today when we both asked for his time. It was a relief to just meet and not have too much stress involved. Hopefully there will be more of that in the coming months. LR, I am checking that link next.