Lack of attention

I definitely have a lot of stuff to answer. I will start at the top and work my way down.
Do you already have a plan on how to fill your time?
Tinwen, I am retiring from the military, but I will start a second career. Unless I get a great disability rating, my Army pension won't be enough for my family to live off of. So yes, I plan on working.

You are there now. What behaviors would she like from you?

Every time I ask, I get either, "I don't know," or a very general answer like, "I want more romantic stuff." If I ask what kind of romantic stuff I am told that I should just know.
Have you tried asking her directly?

I am not getting clear feedback from you lately. I feel disconnected. When I ask what is wrong, you do not tell me. So let me just ask straight up -- are your bored with this relationship? If so, would you prefer to end it peacefully, or try to revitalize it? Where are you at?

Actually move on to having the conversations you need to be having, rather than trying to read her mind, guess, sit in the dark...
I have asked her directly, and she either refuses, gets very sarcastic and patronizing, or it seems like she can't understand what I am asking for. I haven't asked in a while though, so I might reengage on this.
Perhaps it is one of the ways she distances herself from you.

I agree. I feel bad for making her feel that she needs to do this.

It doesn't sound like she's very satisfied with you on general terms, which I think is a little unfair on her part ...
Every day, something happens, or she says something that makes me feel like I am not good enough. Now that is my interpretation, but I believe it is not her intent. This is something I'm working on. But yeah, I feel that things are not fair. Fair, as I understand it, doesn't mean 50/50, but I do think it means a little more equitable than 100/0! If she would just tell me, specifically, why she isn't satisfied, I would fix it.
 
ItD, has anyone reminded you that the possibility that you may become drunk and abusive, even after a good weekend (I don't know about after bad times), could have something to do with why your wife may have gotten into the habit of distancing herself and being uncommunicative? It may take a good while, possibly years, for her to trust that that behavior is not going to recur. It depends on how many times it has happened over your relationship. It is good that you are getting counseling, as that could help you not to relapse, but trust will need to be rebuilt.
 
Did I miss something?

Have I missed a pattern of the OP being drunk and abusive on more than just the one occasion he recounted? It seems like he is getting pretty beat up all around.
 
His wife certainly has issues of her own. The attitude of: "You should know what I need/want without me having to tell you" is a huge problem, for instance. However, "Unfortunately, I decided to medicate myself with half a bottle of Scotch in an effort to 'relax and take my mind off things.' I was way too drunk and I think (I don't remember) that I ended up asking the question," has the sound of someone who uses alcohol to deal with emotions, and that is a huge problem, as well.
 
Is your wife depressed? Is she willing to go get a check-up?

Otherwise, you just have to decide where your limit of tolerance is. It doesn't sound great for you to be stuck in a marriage where your spouse does not participate in the marriage in healthy ways, and instead spends her time putting you down, ignoring you, etc.

I could be wrong, but you seem to be at the 4 horsemen place.

  • She criticizes.
  • She's defensive.
  • She down talks to you (contempt).
  • She stonewalls and doesn't give clear feedback or information.

You can read about it:

https://www.gottman.com/blog/the-fo...cism-contempt-defensiveness-and-stonewalling/

You can try to do something about it and ask if she's willing to go to marriage counseling together.

https://www.gottman.com/blog/the-four-horsemen-the-antidotes/

But if she's basically checked out, you might have to accept that your 100% effort is only 50% of the fuel required for a two-person marriage to run on. If she's not doing her fair share of tending to it, if she's not interested in participating and being present in this shared marriage, it isn't like you can do her side of it for her.

You may be looking at a split, with regrets on your part, because you seem to love her and want it to work. But you cannot be relating to a brick wall for the rest of your life.

I am so sorry you deal in this. :(

Galagirl
 
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Survived the weekend

Well, it was a pretty good weekend. There seemed to be a little more attention coming my way. That was nice. We also had a nice day with the kids on Sunday. I still feel like my days as a husband are limited, but at least we had a good couple of days as a family. I look forward to seeing what this week brings!
 
Can you think of something she might like to do with you? Go away for the weekend to visit a spa, take the kids to a cabin overnight, or if you're close enough, a beach trip? It sounds like your family needs a vacation. If you want more pleasant interaction with her, then you're going to have to make yourself more attractive. Criticizing the way she spends her time isn't going to endear you to her.
 
I'm glad to hear the weekend went well.
 
Why is he the one being expected to do all the work? I have read all his posts, and he is quite clearly trying to do a great deal of accommodating to his wife's needs. The remark, "He needs to make himself for attractive to her" was rather cruel and unnecessary.
 
Why is he the one being expected to do all the work? I have read all his posts, and he is quite clearly trying to do a great deal of accommodating to his wife's needs. The remark, "He needs to make himself for attractive to her" was rather cruel and unnecessary.
powerpuffgrl, thank you! It is very nice to consider that there has been more good advice than bad on this forum. On every other poly forum or group I've been on, I have been told that I am basically wrong for having any negative emotions, and that I am evil because I am trying to enslave my wife. I have also gotten a bunch of "You're not doing enough," feedback. It certainly feels good to have someone stick up for me. I'm sure I'm not doing everything exactly the way I should, but I'm doing an awful damn lot. It really is gratifying to know that someone sees that! Again, thank you!
 
If she wants to be having concurrent relationships, she has to learn to manage her time with each partner. I hope this pleasant weekend helps her realize you are not being "demanding" when you want to know what time on the calendar is (you + her) time.

I still feel like my days as a husband are limited.

I am confused. Would you clarify what that means?

1) You still don't get the calendar time you need? The time is limited? Dates with her are few and far between, so you are mostly being "roomies" together most days, rather than "spouses?"

2) Or do you think any minute she's going to ask for a divorce?
 
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It certainly feels good to have some one stick up for me. I'm sure I'm not doing everything exactly the way I should, but I'm doing an awful damn lot. It really is gratifying to know that someone sees that! Again, thank you!
I earlier gave you the advice to ask for what you do want, rather than what you don't, and I sure hope you don't think you put me in the camp of thinking you're in the wrong. I'm feeling very sorry for you. I'm not sure why you want your wife. I think she sounds like she's already checked out. But if you still want her, I hope I'm wrong and that you can win her back. You sound like an incredibly patient man, and you have my best wishes, FWIW.

I'm ex-Aussie-military. :)
 
Aussiekate, I always loved working with you guys. I was also very jealous of your uniforms with shorts!

No, I don't lump you into that group I mentioned. Those people are quick to criticize if someone isn't doing this thing their way and they rarely offer good advice. The advice you gave me is solid and I'm implementing it slowly. Like on Sunday, I asked her to take us out to see where her new job was. It was a beautiful drive!
I'm not sure why you want your wife.
Sometimes I'm not so sure, either! LOL. She has been very good to me for 16 years and we are stronger together. I also worry about her and want to take care of her. She's a good woman at heart. She's just going through a confusing time in her life.

Thank you so much for your regards and your kind wishes!
 
I always loved working with you guys! I was also very jealous of your uniforms with shorts!
They abandoned that uniform in 2013, a most unpopular decision. :(
Inthedark said:
No I don't lump you into that group I mentioned. Those people are quick to criticize if someone isn't doing this thing their way and they rarely offer good advice. The advice you gave me is solid and I'm implementing it slowly. Like on Sunday, I asked her to take us out to see where her new job was. It was a beautiful drive!
I'm glad it was helpful. :)
 
Well it looks like things my be progressing as I have feared. Last night, for all intents and purposes, I lost my primary status. TMI ALERT!!!!

Yesterday morning, while she was getting ready for work, I decided to surprise my wife with a little bit of oral pleasure. It is one thing that I know she loves. I have been told I do it better than anyone she has ever been with. It seemed like she enjoyed it. So, we do that and then it's off to work for both of us. I sent her a message to let her know that I hoped she enjoyed the surprise and that I hoped it made her morning a little brighter.

Last evening, after dinner, I was lying in bed reading a book. She came into the room, straddled my legs and then performed oral sex on me. She does not like giving head, and when it comes to oral sex, we have never had a quid-pro-quo relationship. I was in shock! She will barely kiss me lately, much less do anything of a sexual nature with me.

Well, after she was finished, she looked up with what I can only think of as contempt in her eyes and said, "Now, from now on, if you want anything else, you have to ask permission." Endorphins running high, I thought that maybe the contempt in her eyes was actually a dark playfulness. I thought that maybe she is telling me that she wants to be my Top or Domme. Both of us being interested in the BDSM lifestyle, this is an option that we have discussed and that would come sort of naturally to us.

So I asked, "Ask you [for permission]?"
She said, "No."
So I asked, "Ask him?" [Referring to her online Dom.]
"Yes."

There was a flash of anger and jealousy and pain, but I reigned it in. I got up, went for a smoke, and then I went to her and thanked her for the surprise. I asked her if that was really how she wanted things to be. She thought and then gave me an answer that wasn't really an answer.

"What if I said yes?"

I told her that I was committed to giving her everything that she wants. Later, I asked if she was only going to apply to me, or if it would apply to all of her paramours. Again she thought for a long time and reluctantly said, "To everyone." I have no reason to believe that she was sincere in that statement, but I also have no reason to doubt it.

A couple of weeks ago, I was asked not to try to contact the Dom. I asked how I would go about asking permission if I was not to contact him. My wife told me that I could contact him as long as I didn't go off on him and start an argument. To me it is funny that I am expected to show this man deference and respect when he has shown me none. However, if I do decide to contact him, I will take the moral high road and I will show him the respect that he and my wife are refusing to show me. I am after all, polyamorous.

All this said, I believe that this whole thing equates to the loss of my primary status. I am now reduced to being a roommate, a roommate that pays all the bills, provides food, shelter and transportation, cooks, cleans, packs lunches and irons her scrubs every morning before work. Is it wrong of me to expect, if she has transferred primary status to him, that he start providing for her? Am I wrong in wanting him to pay for her car and her food and her half of the mortgage? Shouldn't he put her on his health insurance? I've never not been the primary, so I'm not sure.

GalaGirl, to answer your question, all options in regards to saving this marriage have not yet been exhausted. Therefore, I will not quit. So, yes, I am waiting for her to make a move. Unfortunately, the specter of divorce has been hung over my head so many times in the last 16 years that it has become like the story of the boy who cried wolf. I can't believe it. Therefore, at some point I am going to get eaten up and no one is going to come to my rescue!

Kevin, yeah, it sucks.

Weeks ago she told me that she wanted me to be more romantic. I have been. Flowers, gifts, sweet love notes left as surprises, text messages and phone calls, tender touches and massages. I just can't compete.

Today, I think I am going to write [private info deleted] a letter. I don't know if I will send it, but I will give it to my wife to read. I want to tell him that, as I say, there are three sides to every story; my side, her side and what is really going on. I'd like to give him my side so that he might be able to determine what is really going on. Conversely, I'd like to hear his side. I'd like to let him know that I don't hate him (even though I probably should) and that he is not my enemy. I'd like to tell him that I don't wish to compete with him, that there is no need for a competition and that my wife has the capacity to love us both. But I fear that if I do send him a letter like this, it will fall on deaf ears.

All that being said, what do you think?
 
What do you think?

I think I'd flat-out ask her if she wants a divorce, because it sure doesn't sound like she wants a husband anymore! She seems intent on hurting you. Sometimes, in relationships, I think if we let resentments build without addressing them, it can reach a point where the relationship is not salvageable. At least, not in it's current form. I really think that may be where you are. I can't help wondering if her actions aren't motivated by resentment and anger, and a desire to 'even the score'.

My question to you is: do you want this to be the model your children use to determine what is a healthy, acceptable relationship? That's the question I had to ask myself before finally throwing in the towel on my marriage. It wasn't easy, but a few years out, I can honestly say we (me, exH, & the kids) are all better for it.
 
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