New relationship - feelings of insecurity

P

Pseudopoly

New member
Mixed feelings.
Hi all, hope my story in not completely old hat to you and that you can give me some advice.

I’m a 46 YO man in a (new-ish) relationship with a wonderful poly woman. She has me as a romantic and sexual partner/boyfriend, and another male lover. She has been together, not romantically, but sexually, with this man for a year. Earlier, she fell (deeply, I think) in love with him; he did not reciprocate, but wanted to continue their sexual relationship. While she was rather upset, she chose to continue and have casual affairs with other men and couples for a period. I have known about this start of affairs (sorry, that’s not meant to be a pun...) from the very beginning of our relationship, which – via bumpy roads – has evolved into great love and fantastic loving. I think one reason (not the only ) why she became attracted to me in the first place was that I unequivocally accepted that she had her lover, and that this was her special room. She also promptly informed him about me, so everything is clean and nice and consensual.

I have to add that we (referring to me and my girlfriend) are both switches with a tendency towards the submissive side. She can fully live out her submissive side with the other man; he is purely dominant.

I have lived in two poly relationships before; once as a true and completely happy “secondary” and once as a somewhat reluctant “undecided” (as seen from the woman’s point of view – she really couldn’t make up her mind so all involved parties accepted and waited...)

These experiences have not been purely bad for me – indeed, in the first case things were great - but they do leave me with a slight feeling of unease, because at least one of the involved in both of the previous relationships ended up unsatisfied and hurt.

Here’s the thing: I don’t doubt that she loves me, nor that she, in one sense of the word, at least, deeply loves her lover. I know how addictive and fantastic good Dominant/sub sex can be; and I genuinely want her to have her special room with her dominant lover. I can perform quite well as a Dominant; however, it is a performance, not something I truly identify with. I do enjoy it and find it fascinating, but it’s still a charade. I know he can give her something I can’t; and since I love her and want her to be fulfilled, in a sense it’s a perfect arrangement.

Still, I can’t keep that little devil jealousy wholly at bay. The way her eyes becomes distant and her voice deeper and softer, when she speaks of him. The affection runs very deep. In the end, I can’t help feeling that I am a bit of a second-best solution: since she cannot get his full attention (they do not seem very compatible in their ways outside the bedroom/Dungeon), she can get all the romantic love, care, support, good old fashioned vanilla sex in the morning, small presents and cute texts, and, well, the occasional opportunity to flex her inner Domina (thank God!) from me - and her dream Dominant to boot.

I don’t know if this is purely due to my insecurity (I *am* a bit fragile and sensitive) and that my misgivings will disappear over time. Rationally, and because I love her, I do not want her to cut off her connection and go mono with me.

So the job is on my shoulders. Any advice on how to cope and progress with such an issue?

PS: If you believe this should be put in the “BDsm”-thread, please go ahead and move it. I do believe that the issue is not one of BDSM, though – but I could be wrong.
 
Here, try this also:

It's about a 20-minute talk, very worth the while. You are (seeing yourself) in a vulnerable position, and I submit to you that you'll actually want to embrace your vulnerability.
 
It is an odd thing, in our current culture, the way we were trained/brainwashed from childhood on, by media, friends, family and everything, to imagine, or experience, being in a relationship of some romantic depth with someone who is also in a deep romantic relationship with someone else.

Why should this be so hard? We all have friends who bring different things to us. We don't insist our dearest friend chose to only have us as a friend, and no other friends. Why do we have this niggling insistence in our heads, when new to poly, that our romantic partner only have us, or that we are somehow inadequate when we know our partner is getting different things from us and her other lover(s)?

I suggest it is because the romantic, sexual r'ship is one of deep intimacy. When engaged in sex, huge drafts of oxytocin pouring into our bloodstream can give the illusion (or bring home the reality!) that there is no boundary between us, we are One. That's one of the addictive hits we love from good emotional sex. There is that feeling of intense bonding, closeness, security, comfort, entertainment, excitement and relaxation.

So, if our lover, our "other half," spends part of his or her time in that state of One-ness with another, but yet, their experience there is private, we do not share in it, I think it can feel like part of oneself is missing to oneself!

Does that make sense? Unless our partner shares every detail of his or her date with an important OSO with us, there is this ... blank area of their experience that is unavailable to us. And, of course our partner, and their OSO, have every right to keep their date private from their other partners including ourselves.

It can feel very unsettling.

I think it can feel even worse if the OSO is a similar person to oneself, rather than quite different (different gender, different age, different ethnicity, quite different interests)... If the OSO is quite similar to oneself, one can feel like, oh, if I was just MORE intensely myself, my SO wouldn't need the OSO, s/he would be redundant.

It is hard to deal with sometimes. Maybe it's like why moms cry when their child goes off to full day kindergarten. This young person, your little body buddy who sits on your lap, who you lie with as they fall asleep, breathing each others' exhalations, who eats out of your hand, and formerly ate from your breasts, is going off on this adventure you are not involved in, to become intimate with their teacher, the new friends, all in a new environment! Shit. You need to let go? After all those hours, days, months, years, feeling the One-ness a mother feels with her child? Does that create distance? Or can it be a healthy new stage where One-ness is still possible despite the time apart and unshared experiences?

You need to develop a new skill set to handle the new distance, physical and emotional, that is now forced on you (even if you chose it). But hell, if you didn't really love being a mother, you may look at the receding schoolbus with unalloyed joy. OTOH, if the bond is tight and rewarding, you may grieve and then need a lot of support from other parents who are also going through the same thing, or have recently.

But I think you need to get used to that "blank space," where your kindergartner, or poly lover, is out of reach, is doing things and talking about things you may never fully know about. Some couples new to poly, especially long time married ones, attempt to deal with this by unicorn hunting, looking for a lover to share, who will love each, and date and have sex with each, equally, always as a threesome. But that backfires because no new lover will love each of a couple in the exact same way. And each dyad in a triad needs that one on one space anyway. All 3 all the time is actually unhealthy.

So, dealing with your partner being intimate and having private time with their OSO, how best to deal with that feeling of distance, that lack of intimacy? Do you become hardened? Do you force yourself to not care? Do you do things to come back to One-ness as soon and as deeply as possible? That sounds healthy, but what if your SO is deep in NRE and can't or won't re-bond as much as you feel you need?

Shit. These kinds of issues are not easy to deal with. Each of us needs to find our own coping skills and ways to feel comfortable when our "other half" is gone, deep in intimacy with another.

Some of the posters here, or their partners, never find those comforting coping skills! Some people are more easy going and find a way to maintain the intimacy despite the distance. Which sounds like an oxymoron, but there it is. Some people are uncomfortable with sex and deep intimacy in the first place, so the partner getting sex and intimacy with another is actually a relief. Some people are introverts, and while loving their SO, experience the distance as a relief, and a healing space. Others are not so "lucky."
 
In the end, I can’t help feeling that I am a bit of a second-best solution: since she cannot get his full attention (they do not seem very compatible in their ways outside the bedroom/Dungeon), she can get all the romantic love, care, support, good old fashioned vanilla sex in the morning, small presents and cute texts, and, well, the occasional opportunity to flex her inner Domina (thank God!) from me - and her dream Dominant to boot.
Click to expand...

This is not a feeling. This is a THOUGHT. I think you might mean "In the end, I can't help thinking that.... etc."

So the job is on my shoulders. Any advice on how to cope and progress with such an issue?
Click to expand...

I think the first step could be acknowledging that you CAN help thinking that. Or at least correct it when you have "popcorn thoughts" that come up unbidden.

You are not your thoughts. You are the person doing the thinking. If the internal chatterbox is going on about something? You can ignore it, pay attention to it, correct it, etc. In short, you do not have to take it "as is."

If I wake up in the night and think there is a burglar in the corner? Then on second look I find it is a chair shadow? I am free to update my first popcorn thought of "Aaaaah! A burglar!" to "Whew! It was just a chair!"

Could remember you can always have second thoughts and update previous ones -- that's the nice thing about being able to change your mind. ;)

Why are you casting yourself as "second best solution?" Could just as easily be framed as "This combo is the BEST approach for all of us at this time -- she wants two people. We are it. Yay!"

That is one way to approach it -- determine what is and is not a "popcorn thought" and answer BACK to them should they arise. See if they die down over time.

In case these also help:

http://www.practicalpolyamory.com/images/Jealousy_Updated_10-6-10.pdf
http://www.kathylabriola.com/articles/jealousy-first-aid
http://www.kathylabriola.com/articl...nster-managing-jealousy-in-open-relationships

Galagirl
 
Last edited:
Not enough

We live in a paradigm of Not Enough.
So you were told, you are not enough.

And certainly having lost a love in the past, either because the oxytocin ran out, or a slightly better upgrade came along, we are inclined to buy heavily into the Whole not enough paradigm.

So you can make a meal out of appetizers, but it is never a nice juicy steak (vegans must substitute socially acceptable term here) and steak is never chocolate cake.

So the fact is you are not everything, while being everything and you are perfectly you and fill which ever part of the menu you fill.

Good tops are a dime a dozen. Great tops, ones that are emotionally available well, not enough.

So her top is a low rent burger. Yes made of cow. Have to do until that steak place across the street opens up.

Have you ever looked to another dom male for the two of you? I mean I know the burger is on the table, but I've heard rumors there are more than just one guy like I.

Just a thought
 
Again, thanks!

Hi all,

again, thanks for these wonderful and wise inputs.

Luckily, I am quite familiar with the techniques of cognitive (well, meta-cognitive) therapy (as it would be termed where I am from), so I *am* able to set thoughts aside and treat them as any other kind of more or less random signal.

Still, it is very good to rehearse these techniques and be reminded of them.

Hope you all live long, loving and loved. :eek:
 
Dickdomin said:
Have you ever looked to another dom male for the two of you? I mean I know the burger is on the table, but I've heard rumors there are more than just one guy like I.

Just a thought
Click to expand...

I have played with the thought of finding a Dominant couple or another Dominant of whatever sex. But it would really just be for the fun of it, and I don't thnk now's the time. We are too early in the relationship and need to biuld more trust. Or so I believe.
 
Pseudopoly said:
Still, I can’t keep that little devil jealousy wholly at bay. The way her eyes becomes distant and her voice deeper and softer, when she speaks of him. The affection runs very deep. In the end, I can’t help feeling that I am a bit of a second-best solution: since she cannot get his full attention (they do not seem very compatible in their ways outside the bedroom/Dungeon), she can get all the romantic love, care, support, good old fashioned vanilla sex in the morning, small presents and cute texts, and, well, the occasional opportunity to flex her inner Domina (thank God!) from me - and her dream Dominant to boot.
Click to expand...

Probably the best bit of advice I can give to anyone "new" to poly is that one really needs to view relationships as collaborations, not competitions. The urge toward competition is yet another wretched side effect of the mono mindset that really needs to be vanquished before one can relax and explore polyamory.

You feel that you're second best? From what you've written, it sounds like you're the "winner" when it comes to fulfilling this woman's romantic desires. The other chap may be numero uno when it comes to keeping her submissive side satisfied, but that shouldn't take away from what you bring to the relationship.

One of the many joys of polyamory is acknowledging the fundamental concept that no one person can be (or should be expected to) meet all of another person's needs and desires. You can't flip a pancake with a hammer, but that doesn't imply any kind of shame for the hammer. For driving nails, it's the right tool for the job and it excels at that function.

Take a page from her book. You're not getting everything you need from the relationship or you wouldn't be feeling as you do. Seeking out another partner that can bring you whatever it is you're not getting from your current arrangement might be a good course of action. Adding in a gal whose voice drops an octave or two when she speaks of you might be just the ticket for your self esteem.
 
"One of the many joys of polyamory is acknowledging the fundamental concept that no one person can be (or should be expected to) meet all of another person's needs and desires. You can't flip a pancake with a hammer, but that doesn't imply any kind of shame for the hammer. For driving nails, it's the right tool for the job and it excels at that function."

Haha - wonderful image - I'll keep that in mind!:D

"Take a page from her book. You're not getting everything you need from the relationship or you wouldn't be feeling as you do. Seeking out another partner that can bring you whatever it is you're not getting from your current arrangement might be a good course of action. Adding in a gal whose voice drops an octave or two when she speaks of you might be just the ticket for your self esteem."

Not too sure about this, though. I don't want to end up in some sort of arms race here. Sure, I expect my girlfriend to be as accepting as I have been *if* I happen to stumble upon someone that would love to play with me. However, I don't feel any urge nor do I think it would be strictly rational of me to pursue that option - at least not right now.

Oh, and btw, she has just booked us a surprise 4 day holiday (in a particularly nice and dirty city :cool: :p) more or less out of the blue... I do love that woman!
 
CosmoMcKinley said:
Probably the best bit of advice I can give to anyone "new" to poly is that one really needs to view relationships as collaborations, not competitions. The urge toward competition is yet another wretched side effect of the mono mindset that really needs to be vanquished before one can relax and explore polyamory.
Click to expand...

I've had 2 long term (5 1/2 and 2 1/2 years) concurrent relationships since starting to fully practice polyamory (as well as many shorter r'ships lasting up to 2 years, but more casual). The longest lasting r'ship, yes, I am happily and easily able to find that "collaboration" bit. The other one, which ended recently, never got to that place. I am the same person, but poly worked with my gf and not with my bf.

It takes two to tango. Why didn't it work with him? The things he was getting out of his OSOs, I didn't like the way they went about things. There was messiness exploding all around. Even immorality. Cheating. Sneaking. Unbridled NRE. Refusal to schedule dates with any thought to equality. He ignored my needs and took me for granted because he was so swept up in his others. He may have loved me but he didn't act loving.

I guess my point is, the mindset of collaboration as opposed to competition isn't the only factor in successful polyamory. Hence my mentioning coping skills. I've got the skill set to be completely compersive with my gf. She's got the skills to nurture me, reassure me, and I feel valued by her no matter whom she is chatting with or actually dating or doing D/s things with. The exbf just put me on a shelf while being swept up in his NRE with his new and shinys, trying to take me down briefly for sex or for me to care for him in some way, and it just wasn't enough, in fact it was humiliating.


One of the many joys of polyamory is acknowledging the fundamental concept that no one person can be (or should be expected to) meet all of another person's needs and desires. You can't flip a pancake with a hammer, but that doesn't imply any kind of shame for the hammer. For driving nails, it's the right tool for the job and it excels at that function.

Take a page from her book. You're not getting everything you need from the relationship or you wouldn't be feeling as you do. Seeking out another partner that can bring you whatever it is you're not getting from your current arrangement might be a good course of action. Adding in a gal whose voice drops an octave or two when she speaks of you might be just the ticket for your self esteem.
Click to expand...

While I agree it is nice to have each person in a dyad have an OSO, so the playing field is equal, seeking a new person out just to do a tit for tat isn't always so easily done. And it can take months or years to find another person who meets all (or most of) your criteria. So, there you are, dating and kissing frogs while your SO has you and her other, getting her buckets filled, while you struggle and experience rejection and disappointment.
 
Last edited:
Hammers and pancakes

CosmoMcKinley said:
You can't flip a pancake with a hammer, but that doesn't imply any kind of shame for the hammer. For driving nails, it's the right tool for the job and it excels at that function.
Click to expand...

Your using the wrong kind of hammer. And my hammer has been in therapy for years from the shame, well not involving pancakes, but that might take us off topic

Now the part of your quote about finding a girl who goes into lower octaves makes me feel we are dangerously close to mixing metaphors here and the next thing Kevin will be dragging out more cookie recipes.

Likely you are wearing the wrong kind of leisure suit or the wrong brand.
 
Quote

I'm not trying to dance better than everyone else, only better than myself.
 
http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Joeys-Peanut-Butter-Cookies/Detail.aspx?evt19=1

Joey's Peanut Butter Cookies

Ingredients

1 cup peanut butter
1/2 cup butter, softened
1/2 cup white sugar
1/2 cup packed brown sugar
1 egg
3 tablespoons milk
1 teaspoon vanilla extract (very important!)
1 1/4 cups all-purpose flour
3/4 teaspoon baking powder
1/4 teaspoon salt

Directions

1. Preheat oven to 375 degrees F (190 degrees C).

2. In a large bowl, cream together the peanut butter, butter, white sugar, and brown sugar until well blended. Beat in the egg, milk, and vanilla one at a time. Combine the flour, baking powder, and salt; stir into creamed mixture. Roll tablespoonfuls of dough into balls. Place cookies 2 inches apart onto ungreased cookie sheets. Press each ball once with fork tines.

3. Bake for 8 to 10 minutes in the preheated oven, or until edges are lightly browned.

Original recipe makes 3 dozen

---

D'oh crap! Now I've gone and done it again. Sorry everyone, sorry ... I get so carried away ... pay me no mind ...

Although I'll be those cookies are delicious ... and would make a nice distraction while your sweetheart is off with her other lover ...
 
I've got the skill set to be completely compersive with my gf. She's got the skills to nurture me, reassure me, and I feel valued by her no matter whom she is chatting with or actually dating or doing D/s things with. The exbf just put me on a shelf while being swept up in his NRE with his new and shinys, trying to take me down briefly for sex or for me to care for him in some way, and it just wasn't enough, in fact it was humiliating.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for this. I am in the middle of reading the new More Than Two Book, and I am finding the topics on insecurity and rules/boundaries/agreements helpful. This statement you made explains how I feel exactly. I know I have had compersion in the past, when my previous partners were with their partners, and I could handle any jealousy very well when it came up, because my partners were skilled in making me feel valued, reassured, nutured, etc, as you said. They were poly and they possessed a lot of strong skills in that regard. What worries me most about my mono boyfriend at the moment is that I am very uncertain that he has that ability - that I won't just be sitting on the shelf while he is out experiencing NRE, if he ever decides to stretch his wings and attempt to be poly. He never has, but we have had discussions about it. I encourage both my partners to do so, but he, more than my husband, worries me. This gives me something to discuss with him. Thank you!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top