Sex Questions
- Thread starter apexcone
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vinsanity0
Active member
Depends on what you mean by safe. It's not frowned upon. It's fine to be candid. People do speak their mind though.
Please read our Guidelines on adult language, if you haven't already.
Hi apexcone,
It is okay to discuss intimate sexual questions here. Just be aware, Polyamory.com is searchable on Google. So whatever you post, may be discovered by someone who is not on the forum. If you're okay with that, I would say go ahead and ask your questions (and it is fine to use explicit language if you want to).
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
It is okay to discuss intimate sexual questions here. Just be aware, Polyamory.com is searchable on Google. So whatever you post, may be discovered by someone who is not on the forum. If you're okay with that, I would say go ahead and ask your questions (and it is fine to use explicit language if you want to).
Sincerely,
Kevin T.
Thanks
This question, is I guess directed towards the female members of our site, however I'm keen to hear from whoever feels they can offer a valid opinion, that also includes Gay man, who I feel have something important to contribute to my question.
One of the attractions of learning to be a Tantric man is being able to enjoy multiple full body orgasms over an extended period of time without ejaculating, it's pretty mind blowing. Yet for many seeing a man cum is a real turn on. I'm not trying to downplay the real turn on it is when we see an explosive ejaculation, but I'm wondering whether we miss out on something very intimate & spiritual when we place ejaculation/orgasm as the price in sexual play.
My question is related to a lady I have befriended. She's having real problems with me. Her incorrect assumption that I don't cum during our play time is being taken personally, as she assumes if I was sexually attracted to her I would get revved up and shortly after climax. She is real open with me about how she feels, but due to her own issues she is making this about her. I've suggested that we watch some Tantra videos, but she feels I'm just trying to control the outcome and on top of that she thinks I'm weird.
My question:
Why do we place orgasm as the price during sexual play, rather than bringing pleasure to each other.
One of the attractions of learning to be a Tantric man is being able to enjoy multiple full body orgasms over an extended period of time without ejaculating, it's pretty mind blowing. Yet for many seeing a man cum is a real turn on. I'm not trying to downplay the real turn on it is when we see an explosive ejaculation, but I'm wondering whether we miss out on something very intimate & spiritual when we place ejaculation/orgasm as the price in sexual play.
My question is related to a lady I have befriended. She's having real problems with me. Her incorrect assumption that I don't cum during our play time is being taken personally, as she assumes if I was sexually attracted to her I would get revved up and shortly after climax. She is real open with me about how she feels, but due to her own issues she is making this about her. I've suggested that we watch some Tantra videos, but she feels I'm just trying to control the outcome and on top of that she thinks I'm weird.
My question:
Why do we place orgasm as the price during sexual play, rather than bringing pleasure to each other.
I think that everyone is a unique individual and as such, what is most enjoyable/fulfilling for one person (in sexual encounters), is not what is most enjoyable/fulfilling for another person. Your new friend, whom you befriended, is assuming that because some men like to orgasm when they get sufficiently turned on, that that means that all men orgasm (or hold orgasm as their goal). You just want to bring pleasure to each other, and she does not understand that because she thinks you should be like other men. Thus she assumes that you must not be sexually attracted to her, and that you're weird.
I accept that we can't change anyone but ourselves. Seems to me that her assumptions are the global norm, so I feel that the deck is loaded against me before I get started.
Sounds like you're sexually incompatible because your practices are eating away at her self esteem. Please do right by her and stop having sex with her, she's not interested in learning about tantra and will continue to think you're weird.
As for prizing the money shot, that's a product of both sex education, likely early sexual experiences, and porn, although porn is a bit of a chicken/egg situation.
You've asked a leading question and I'm sure you know it. I'd actually posit it's misleading, because the most common understanding of sexual pleasure is that orgasm is the most pleasurable sensation that is experienced as a part of sex and thus the goal of many people. As you've said, you do orgasm, it's just not ejaculatory. Without that visual cue, it may be difficult for a partner to identify that you're experiencing pleasure, and they really are trying to create a pleasurable experience for you. They might even be hearing, "I don't need you to give me pleasure because I can do tantra" or "I'm better at sex than you".
As for missing out on something intimate or spiritual, it's not one person's call about what another finds intimate. Maybe the woman you're talking about would find a facial the most intimate thing she's ever experienced, but you'll never know that if you only practice tantric sex with her. There's a million other maybes, too, that might be relevant to her experience of sexual pleasure or experience of intimacy. And as for the spiritual, again, you can't define that for someone else (I'm looking at you, organized religion) but if you're lucky, you'll find someone with a compatible spirituality that has a sexual expression aspect to it.
As for prizing the money shot, that's a product of both sex education, likely early sexual experiences, and porn, although porn is a bit of a chicken/egg situation.
You've asked a leading question and I'm sure you know it. I'd actually posit it's misleading, because the most common understanding of sexual pleasure is that orgasm is the most pleasurable sensation that is experienced as a part of sex and thus the goal of many people. As you've said, you do orgasm, it's just not ejaculatory. Without that visual cue, it may be difficult for a partner to identify that you're experiencing pleasure, and they really are trying to create a pleasurable experience for you. They might even be hearing, "I don't need you to give me pleasure because I can do tantra" or "I'm better at sex than you".
As for missing out on something intimate or spiritual, it's not one person's call about what another finds intimate. Maybe the woman you're talking about would find a facial the most intimate thing she's ever experienced, but you'll never know that if you only practice tantric sex with her. There's a million other maybes, too, that might be relevant to her experience of sexual pleasure or experience of intimacy. And as for the spiritual, again, you can't define that for someone else (I'm looking at you, organized religion) but if you're lucky, you'll find someone with a compatible spirituality that has a sexual expression aspect to it.
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FallenAngelina
Well-known member
Apexcone, we have discussed this topic quite a few times here, so perhaps some of the members can remember the threads and post the links.
I'm a huge fan of Tantric style sex - not necessarily based on the spiritual teachings, but based on my experience of the glorious intimacy. When the male ejaculation is willingly taken off the table, the whole sexual connection is enhanced because there is no finish line. People who haven't experienced this often imagine this to be frustrating, but for fans of this approach, the opposite is so. The sexual connection is deeply fulfilling. If a woman isn't hooked into needing to see liquid "evidence" of her appeal and her ability to satisfy, the sexual and emotional connection can be extraordinarily satisfying. Beyond suggesting and showing the Tantric approach to a woman, I don't know if there's much you can do to win her over if she isn't so inclined. Some women in this forum community love this style of sex, some are open to learning more, but some are turned off by the very thought of it. Tantric sex is like any other sexual proclivity - either a person is into it or she is not. You really can't educate someone into loving a style of sexuality that she simply does not love.
I'm a huge fan of Tantric style sex - not necessarily based on the spiritual teachings, but based on my experience of the glorious intimacy. When the male ejaculation is willingly taken off the table, the whole sexual connection is enhanced because there is no finish line. People who haven't experienced this often imagine this to be frustrating, but for fans of this approach, the opposite is so. The sexual connection is deeply fulfilling. If a woman isn't hooked into needing to see liquid "evidence" of her appeal and her ability to satisfy, the sexual and emotional connection can be extraordinarily satisfying. Beyond suggesting and showing the Tantric approach to a woman, I don't know if there's much you can do to win her over if she isn't so inclined. Some women in this forum community love this style of sex, some are open to learning more, but some are turned off by the very thought of it. Tantric sex is like any other sexual proclivity - either a person is into it or she is not. You really can't educate someone into loving a style of sexuality that she simply does not love.
And? The deck is stacked against everyone. It's rare to find a long term sexually and emotionally compatible partner. Don't impose limited thinking on yourself by imagining that everyone else has it so much easier just because your proclivity is in the minority. Ignore what the so-called majority wants and put up your antennae for women who want what you want. We are out there!!
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"global" is likely a stretch, let's say they are the cultural norm for your culture.
Yes, the deck is stacked against you as you are going against your cultural norm. But you chose this. Find compatible sexual partners, you can't teach everyone your enlightened ways...
Good points, I think you quite correct, there's no sexual compatibility, I think I know that but haven't been willing to admit it. There's a real powerful connection between us, I'm hoping we can work on it. I do ejaculate and she's had several facials, but it's not the same for me as its all over way to quickly.
Most of us on the site have broken social norms, seems that it's tough for the masses to step outside the box.
Most of us on the site have broken social norms, seems that it's tough for the masses to step outside the box.
Thanks Karen
I 100% agree Tantric sex has been a game changer for me. My wife & our long term girl friend who lives with us are all on the same page.
To say I'm not disappointed would be a lie, as I said there's a powerful energy between us. Watch this space I guess.
Other threads that might be helpful:
Yes, it is a common assumption that orgasm (ejaculation) is the end-all and be-all of every sexual encounter. But that is a fallacy, as you know. Your new friend has fallen victim to that assumption. You know better.
Yes, it is a common assumption that orgasm (ejaculation) is the end-all and be-all of every sexual encounter. But that is a fallacy, as you know. Your new friend has fallen victim to that assumption. You know better.
fuchka
Active member
It could also be just a preference, like what Evie said.
JaneQSmythe
Well-known member
Just to give a different perspective, this is how I would respond to your sexual preferences as they would or would not intersect with my own. (Personally, in no way speaking for other women!)
Congratulations on learning something that is great for you!
It's the "extended period of time" that would be the problem for me...(more later)
Nope, not a turn on, just a bodily function. With male partners for whom this signals "completion", it's useful to understand that about that partner.
I don't know about "spiritual", but it is not uncommon for my male partner(s) to view it as though he hasn't "performed" adequately until I have had an orgasm (or multiple orgasms) - which can be off-putting. I don't feel that this is a gender-specific viewpoint.
While I agree that there is likely a degree of cultural conditioning there (as has been addressed by others) - it is also up to her as to whether this is an "issue" that concerns her enough to address.
Perhaps she feels that if you cared enough for her sexual satisfaction, then you could show it to her in the language that she understands (sexual play culminating with ejaculation) rather than insist on engaging in "teaching" her in a moment/situation when people tend to be at their most vulnerable? Her "assumption" that if you were attracted to her you would climax quickly, may be a shorthand for "Why can't we do it the way that I enjoy?"
If you slant your conversations in the biased way that it comes through in this post, then I would not be surprised if she feels manipulated into participating in a type of practice that she has no affinity for. As for "weird" - that can be interpreted a number of different ways...does she mean "creepy, perverted, pushy" or "unusual, interesting, unique"?
Meh, false dichotomy - it doesn't have to be EITHER orgasm OR pleasure. And certain aspects can come to the forefront with different people during different encounters. (Or during the same encounter.)
Hear, hear!
Please do try actually listening to what she is saying to you with her own words.
This. Being condescended to is not a turn-on for many people...including me.
And THIS.
This deserves a re-read, coming from someone who is into Tantra.
As for me - Dude is into "extended period of time" sex sessions. He would probably enjoy Tantra. As it is, he likes to hold off on actual orgasm, coming to the brink multiple times, during extended sex play. He also recovers quickly and is ready for a second (or third) round. There is a reason I call him (among other things) the "Energizer Bunny". He also is very invested in giving me multiple orgasms - which is fine, to a point.
For me, personally, it can feel like every time I am interested in engaging in sex that, if I want him to be satisfied, I need to weigh whether I am willing to commit an entire afternoon to the endeavor (usually not). For me, the excitement of building to my own orgasm is necessary for me to continue to be invested and interested in whatever intimate or sexual acts we are engaged in. I need a certain degree of "momentum" otherwise I get distracted and my libido shuts down - and I don't want to be touched AT ALL.
In addition - after a good orgasm (or a few), I am literally DONE. If I don't actually immediately fall asleep (which I do quite often) then I just want to lay and bask in my own post-orgasmic glow (leading Dude to comment, "Why is my girlfriend such a dude?"
). I definitely don't want to engage in any more sexual play at that point - and any attempt to do so is either irritating or down-right painful. (We have negotiated ways that he can continue to touch and cuddle me and continue his own sexual experience without aggravating me - but it has taken much conversation and understanding!)
Congratulations on learning something that is great for you!
It's the "extended period of time" that would be the problem for me...(more later)
Nope, not a turn on, just a bodily function. With male partners for whom this signals "completion", it's useful to understand that about that partner.
I don't know about "spiritual", but it is not uncommon for my male partner(s) to view it as though he hasn't "performed" adequately until I have had an orgasm (or multiple orgasms) - which can be off-putting. I don't feel that this is a gender-specific viewpoint.
While I agree that there is likely a degree of cultural conditioning there (as has been addressed by others) - it is also up to her as to whether this is an "issue" that concerns her enough to address.
Perhaps she feels that if you cared enough for her sexual satisfaction, then you could show it to her in the language that she understands (sexual play culminating with ejaculation) rather than insist on engaging in "teaching" her in a moment/situation when people tend to be at their most vulnerable? Her "assumption" that if you were attracted to her you would climax quickly, may be a shorthand for "Why can't we do it the way that I enjoy?"
If you slant your conversations in the biased way that it comes through in this post, then I would not be surprised if she feels manipulated into participating in a type of practice that she has no affinity for. As for "weird" - that can be interpreted a number of different ways...does she mean "creepy, perverted, pushy" or "unusual, interesting, unique"?
Meh, false dichotomy - it doesn't have to be EITHER orgasm OR pleasure. And certain aspects can come to the forefront with different people during different encounters. (Or during the same encounter.)
Hear, hear!
Please do try actually listening to what she is saying to you with her own words.
This. Being condescended to is not a turn-on for many people...including me.
And THIS.
This deserves a re-read, coming from someone who is into Tantra.
As for me - Dude is into "extended period of time" sex sessions. He would probably enjoy Tantra. As it is, he likes to hold off on actual orgasm, coming to the brink multiple times, during extended sex play. He also recovers quickly and is ready for a second (or third) round. There is a reason I call him (among other things) the "Energizer Bunny". He also is very invested in giving me multiple orgasms - which is fine, to a point.
For me, personally, it can feel like every time I am interested in engaging in sex that, if I want him to be satisfied, I need to weigh whether I am willing to commit an entire afternoon to the endeavor (usually not). For me, the excitement of building to my own orgasm is necessary for me to continue to be invested and interested in whatever intimate or sexual acts we are engaged in. I need a certain degree of "momentum" otherwise I get distracted and my libido shuts down - and I don't want to be touched AT ALL.
In addition - after a good orgasm (or a few), I am literally DONE. If I don't actually immediately fall asleep (which I do quite often) then I just want to lay and bask in my own post-orgasmic glow (leading Dude to comment, "Why is my girlfriend such a dude?"
). I definitely don't want to engage in any more sexual play at that point - and any attempt to do so is either irritating or down-right painful. (We have negotiated ways that he can continue to touch and cuddle me and continue his own sexual experience without aggravating me - but it has taken much conversation and understanding!)
vinsanity0
Active member
Jane Q summed that up nicely. I literally laughed out loud at the "Why is my girlfriend such a dude?" part because that described Cat and I perfectly. She was a one and done type and when she was ready to orgasm, she was ready. I wasn't disappointed though. I was having sex with her because it was her, not just because I wanted to satisfy myself.
This whole conversation sort of juxtaposes over problems we had concerning BDSM. I was into it. She thought I was weird. As has been said, there was no teaching her to enjoy it. I did without until we started practicing poly. Even then, not every other woman I dated was into it either. I realized that who I was with was more important than the type of sex we had. That is one of the benefits of poly for me, having different partners who are different. It would be kind of boring to have several sexual partners who all did things the same way.
This whole conversation sort of juxtaposes over problems we had concerning BDSM. I was into it. She thought I was weird. As has been said, there was no teaching her to enjoy it. I did without until we started practicing poly. Even then, not every other woman I dated was into it either. I realized that who I was with was more important than the type of sex we had. That is one of the benefits of poly for me, having different partners who are different. It would be kind of boring to have several sexual partners who all did things the same way.
I sometimes wonder if neo-Tantra, that sex practice that is actually not what Tantra was originally all about, is partly a way for older men to enjoy sex in a way a younger man does not.
Being a woman of a certain age, and poly, I have dated a lot of men over the years, both before and after my mono marriage. As a teen with other teens, and as an adult, with men from their early 20s up to their mid 60s.
Young men of course, at least most of them, are able to have multiple ejaculations/orgasms in a session. As testosterone wanes, the ejaculation and even the orgasm become more elusive.
Of course, many women find just the opposite thing happening with them. Me, for instance. As my estrogen waned during peri menopause, my testosterone seemed to come to the fore, enabling me to orgasm a couple dozen times, in a session, as well as frequently ejaculate. I love sex, I love non-orgasmic pleasure, I love orgasms, and I love the orgasms that cause me to ejaculate. It's all good. I cum super easy. Most recently, my partner just gently bit down on my thumb knuckle for a couple minutes and I came lol
But I have had sex with many men over 40. Some can get hard, cum, and recover and cum again. One superman of 45 I had a couple sessions with didn't even have a refractory period after an orgasm. He came, went to half mast, and 5 minutes later was fully erect, and came again. Then he stayed completely hard and wanted to keep fucking. We got interrupted by a phone call, so I don't know what would have happened next lol. He had to go back to work.
But he was an exception. My ex husband was 54 when we split and he still wanted sex every day and loved an hour long session, and had no problem ejaculating in my vagina when I was satisfied. Once in a while he was good for 2 orgasms in one day.
But I've been with a few older guys who couldn't get hard, or stay hard due to blood pressure meds or just age. One could still cum and ejaculate with a flaccid penis. One could get hard but only occasionally came. One guy could get hard and loved sex (oral and PIV) but he never once came with me.
They all enjoyed sex with me, and kink. But no one was interested in neo-Tantra. However, they might have gotten satisfaction from it. I doubt I would have, since I get extremely frustrated with orgasm denial. Or I get bored. Or both.
Maybe this new (ex?) partner of yours just gets bored or frustrated by non-orgasmic sex.
Being a woman of a certain age, and poly, I have dated a lot of men over the years, both before and after my mono marriage. As a teen with other teens, and as an adult, with men from their early 20s up to their mid 60s.
Young men of course, at least most of them, are able to have multiple ejaculations/orgasms in a session. As testosterone wanes, the ejaculation and even the orgasm become more elusive.
Of course, many women find just the opposite thing happening with them. Me, for instance. As my estrogen waned during peri menopause, my testosterone seemed to come to the fore, enabling me to orgasm a couple dozen times, in a session, as well as frequently ejaculate. I love sex, I love non-orgasmic pleasure, I love orgasms, and I love the orgasms that cause me to ejaculate. It's all good. I cum super easy. Most recently, my partner just gently bit down on my thumb knuckle for a couple minutes and I came lol
But I have had sex with many men over 40. Some can get hard, cum, and recover and cum again. One superman of 45 I had a couple sessions with didn't even have a refractory period after an orgasm. He came, went to half mast, and 5 minutes later was fully erect, and came again. Then he stayed completely hard and wanted to keep fucking. We got interrupted by a phone call, so I don't know what would have happened next lol. He had to go back to work.
But he was an exception. My ex husband was 54 when we split and he still wanted sex every day and loved an hour long session, and had no problem ejaculating in my vagina when I was satisfied. Once in a while he was good for 2 orgasms in one day.
But I've been with a few older guys who couldn't get hard, or stay hard due to blood pressure meds or just age. One could still cum and ejaculate with a flaccid penis. One could get hard but only occasionally came. One guy could get hard and loved sex (oral and PIV) but he never once came with me.
They all enjoyed sex with me, and kink. But no one was interested in neo-Tantra. However, they might have gotten satisfaction from it. I doubt I would have, since I get extremely frustrated with orgasm denial. Or I get bored. Or both.
Maybe this new (ex?) partner of yours just gets bored or frustrated by non-orgasmic sex.
AlwaysGrowing
Well-known member
I'm similar to mags. Non orgasmic sex frustrates me. Also if stimulated too long without a climax, my body gets painfully sensitive to the point that no one can touch me for a while.
Boy often orgasms without ejaculating if he has cum more than 2-3 times in 24-48 hours. I have no trouble recognizing the orgasm either way.