Steve's ENM journey

[Stevek]

Please find my original post here https://polyamory.com/threads/partner-encouraging-me-to-date-outside-our-marriage.157196/

I decided to create a new entry here and would like to journal my journey in ENM. The past few months have been great. We discussed endlessly about our relationship and what the next steps should be. We devoured a lot of poly resources and used Reddit, forwarding each other quite a few threads about ENM. I wanted to thank everyone who asked me to slow down and talk to Emma and communicate well with her.

The past few months also saw my kids turn a year older, I turned 38, and things have been amazing. Discussing ENM also seemed to have revved up our sex life initially, but now it is on a downward trend as my wife is putting in more hours at work.

So this is where we are: we will be in a Monodating-Poly relationship where Emma will have a monogamous relationship with me. I asked her multiple times if she is okay with this, and she is the one who is insisting on it. I am free to pursue other women. We are not dating as a couple. It will be more like a V. We have some ground rules:

• Safe sex always — this can be discussed in the future if the relationship is no longer casual.
• No mutual friends or anyone at my work or her work.
• Be honest with potential partners — inform them that I am married and have kids.
• Don’t let the kids know in the beginning.
• Don’t let family members know (siblings, parents).
• Honesty is the best policy. No lies ever.

I think one of the things we learned was that there will be unpleasant emotions and distressing things that can happen. Communicate if anything feels off and try to iterate on the approach.

we both understand that jealousy is natural, but it should be communicated (although my wife insists that she won’t feel jealous). We established a room (with no bed) as a safe space, and we are to communicate openly with the promise that it is a judgment-free zone.

Now, I am coming to the actual practicalities. After reading countless Reddit threads, it seems like it is not so easy for married men. I asked Amy yesterday for a date, and she told me that she is already dating two men in a V relationship and she doesn’t have the bandwidth to date any more men (so she is poly after all).

I have a couple of questions:

1. I am planning to use some of the dating apps, but I am absolutely clueless as I have never had to use them. Are there any good ones for guys in my situation?
2. How many dates should I wait before having sex?

 

[kdt26417]

Hi Steve,

OKCupid and Feeld are two prominent dating apps/sites, there may be others but those are the two that come to my mind. As for how many dates you should wait before having sex, that is totally an individual thing and up to you and the woman you are dating. Three dates? I don't know. Some people have sex on their first date, and that is okay as long as you adhere to any safe-sex guidelines you and Emma agreed to. Yes, it will probably take a while for you to find women who want to date you as a poly married man. Have patience.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.

 

[Magdlyn]

Please find my original post here https://polyamory.com/threads/partner-encouraging-me-to-date-outside-our-marriage.157196/\\

Welcome back, Steve!

I decided to create a new entry here and would like to journal my journey in ENM. The past few months have been great. We discussed endlessly about our relationship and what the next steps should be. We devoured a lot of poly resources and used Reddit, forwarding each other quite a few threads about ENM. I wanted to thank everyone who asked me to slow down and talk to Emma and communicate well with her.

I'm glad you two have been doing more research. Of course, I will remind you that most of us recommend at least a year of research, and technically you've only done about 4 or 5. But I guess you're still learning and not jumping into dating quite yet?

The past few months also saw my kids turn a year older, I turned 38, and things have been amazing. Discussing ENM also seemed to have revved up our sex life initially, but now it is on a downward trend as my wife is putting in more hours at work.

This seems to be a pattern. The more she works, the less energy she has for sex. I guess that's just what she prefers. How does that make you feel?

So this is where we are: we will be in a Monodating-Poly relationship where Emma will have a monogamous relationship with me.

I haven't heard it called a Monodating-Poly relationship before. Is that a Reddit term? I mostly hear it just called a mono/poly relationship, where the agreement is for just one of the partners to be poly-dating, while the other remains monogamous, out of their own preference.

I asked her multiple times if she is okay with this, and she is the one who is insisting on it. I am free to pursue other women.

We are not dating as a couple.

Thank god. That rarely ends well.

It will be more like a V. We have some ground rules:

• Safe sex always — this can be discussed in the future if the relationship is no longer casual.
• No mutual friends or anyone at my work or her work.
• Be honest with potential partners — inform them that I am married and have kids.
• Don’t let the kids know in the beginning.
• Don’t let family members know (siblings, parents).
• Honesty is the best policy. No lies ever.

I think one of the things we learned was that there will be unpleasant emotions and distressing things that can happen. Communicate if anything feels off and try to iterate on the approach.

Perfect!

we both understand that jealousy is natural, but it should be communicated (although my wife insists that she won’t feel jealous). We established a room (with no bed) as a safe space, and we are to communicate openly with the promise that it is a judgment-free zone.

This is a room for you and her to have conversations about polyamory? Not a room to host your new partners? Where do you plan to have sex with others? Is wife okay with you hosting them at your home, for dinner, dates, sex, overnights? Maybe not, since you want to keep the kids unaware of Dad's gfs, at least for now. So you'll need to find a gf who can host you, or for you (and/or her) to spring for hotel rooms. This will be a factor of being a married man with kids who wants to date others... You need to find a private space for sex. You need a "fun budget" for your out-of-home dates.

Now, I am coming to the actual practicalities.

The above things I listed are practicalities!

After reading countless Reddit threads, it seems like it is not so easy for married men. I asked Amy yesterday for a date, and she told me that she is already dating two men in a V relationship and she doesn’t have the bandwidth to date any more men (so she is poly after all).

Well, if you and she like each other, if there is attraction, maybe if/when one of her current partners doesn't work out, she'll be a prospect for you eventually. Keep her number.

I am planning to use some of the dating apps, but I am absolutely clueless, as I have never had to use them. Are there any good ones for guys in my situation?

My gf does well on Feeld (a dating site), but he and I met on Fetlife (a networking site for kinkster). Most of the women he has dated also have Fetlife profiles.

How many dates should I wait before having sex?

Entirely up to you, of course! How many dates did you and Emma have before doing the deed? What about other dating partners prior to her? Poly dates are no different than mono dates in that area.

 

[Magdlyn]

Oh, btw, journals here in the Life Stories and Blogs section are more for personal ramblings than asking and answering questions. Of course, with your permission, people will give feedback, but you might not get as much feedback in this forum as you would in the Poly Relationships Corner.

 

[Stevek]

This is a room for you and her to have conversations about polyamory? Not a room to host your new partners? Where do you plan to have sex with others? Is wife okay with you hosting them at your home, for dinner, dates, sex, overnights? Maybe not, since you want to keep the kids unaware of Dad's gfs, at least for now. So you'll need to find a gf who can host you, or for you (and/or her) to spring for hotel rooms. This will be a factor of being a married man with kids who wants to date others... You need to find a private space for sex. You need a "fun budget" for your out-of-home dates.

While my wife doesn't want to know every single detail, she does want to know some things, such as the actual date and time and when I will be back. If things do get sexual, it will only be at the potential girlfriend's place or a hotel. Emma suggested a hotel as we have more cash now that she is working full time. Emma told me that she is okay with overnights (once a week). I told my wife that it would be difficult to find a woman who would be okay with guys like me (married with kids), and she boosted my confidence by saying that I am a snack.

Entirely up to you, of course! How many dates did you and Emma have before doing the deed? What about other dating partners prior to her? Poly dates are no different than mono dates in that area.

Emma and I... I don't even remember, lol. Probably three or four. Before Emma, the fastest was like 30 minutes, and the slowest was, I think, 6 months. I think I asked this because now that I am married, I think jumping to sex right away might hurt Emma's feelings. She says that it doesn't bother her, but I would rather do everything possible to minimize Emma's discomfort.

I've gone down the OKCupid rabbit hole, and it's seriously addictive. I can't stop checking my notifications. Good thing I downloaded the app over a weekend.

 

[Tinwen]

The prospect of dating is seriously addictive!

So is New Relationship Energy, so plan on dealing with that.
Take care of yourself and Emma.

 

[Stevek]

Yesterday took an unexpected turn. After lunch, the children were playing, and I was browsing potential matches on OkCupid. Emma joined me on the couch, and, for some reason, I instinctively hid my phone from her. This was unusual, as she has my passcode and full access to my phone at any time. Curious, she asked to see the app. We looked through some profiles together, and the experience proved surprisingly arousing, leading us to the bedroom for sex. It was the first time she'd initiated intimacy in months, and I was amazed by the spark that a simple app ignited in our sex life. I can't even recall the last time we had afternoon sex.


Regarding the app itself, I'm getting a fair number of matches, but my initial messages often go unanswered. Even when I receive a response, follow-up messages rarely get a reply. I did have a meaningful conversation with one woman, but the attraction wasn't mutual. On the flip side, the app did lead to an unexpected and enjoyable afternoon with Emma.

 

[kdt26417]

Yeah, you are probably going to have to deal with a lot of ghosting/rejection on OKCupid, before anything sticks. My OKC experience was so frustrating that I deleted my account after a few months. I probably would have had to stick with it for at least a year or two, to have any success. Of course at the time I lived in a small remote town, so that was probably part of the problem. Anyway I'm glad you and Emma had a lovely afternoon together.

 

[Stevek]

I have a date tonight. After relentless rejections, I am both excited and a bit nervous. It has been about 14 years since I last went on a date. There were no apps back then. Wish your boy some luck.

 

[Magdlyn]

Please please don't get your hopes too high. Just plan to enjoy your night. I have been on so many first dates that didn't get a second, or maybe the interest fizzled after three dates. Hope springs eternal though! I hope you get lucky.

 

[Stevek]

I had an amazing first date with a stunning woman (Jess), and this took me back to the first time I met my wife. I am grinning like an idiot. Is it wrong that I am already planning a lot of things in the future (at least in my mind)? I am on cloud nine!

We just had coffee and took a walk around, and we spoke for almost three hours, but it felt like only fifteen minutes. Jess is cool with the fact that I am already married, and she showed genuine interest in my kids and my work. She told me that she is not polyamorous herself, but she doesn't mind the limited attention from me as she is busy with her career.

I learned from my previous date and decided not to pursue sex immediately. We just said our goodbyes, and I texted her that I wanted to see her again. I got a reply within five seconds, and she wants to see me too. We continued texting after we reached our respective homes.

I feel very silly, and I keep thinking about her. Emma picked up on my energy, and we again had amazing sex last night. I am not complaining, but the last few weeks have been the most sex I've had in a few years.

 

[Stevek]

Bouldering with my sons is always an amazing experience. I also don't feel too bad for getting them some fast food after a climbing session.

 

[Tinwen]

I had an amazing first date with a stunning woman (Jess), and this took me back to the first time I met my wife. I am grinning like an idiot. Is it wrong that I am already planning a lot of things in the future (at least in my mind)? I am on cloud nine!

We just had coffee and took a walk around, and we spoke for almost three hours, but it felt like only fifteen minutes. Jess is cool with the fact that I am already married, and she showed genuine interest in my kids and my work. She told me that she is not polyamorous herself, but she doesn't mind the limited attention from me as she is busy with her career.

I learned from my previous date and decided not to pursue sex immediately. We just said our goodbyes, and I texted her that I wanted to see her again. I got a reply within five seconds, and she wants to see me too. We continued texting after we reached our respective homes.

I feel very silly, and I keep thinking about her. Emma picked up on my energy, and we again had amazing sex last night. I am not complaining, but the last few weeks have been the most sex I've had in a few years.

Love at first date!

 

[Stevek]

Love at first date!

i don't wanna jinx it and my son almost busted me. He asked me whom are you texting so much. I lied an told him that I am on reddit.

 

[Stevek]

I am completely vexed by dating and I just wanna give up. What was turning out to be an amazing week just turned out to be a complete waste of time and effort.

Jess and I had an amazing week leading to our third date Yesterday. We texted incessantly and flirted nonstop. We met again on Wednesday and just had some dinner and walked around.

I decided to take things slow as I didn't want to fuck up anything with her. Our texts became sexier and we decided to meet yesterday at a hotel as both of us couldn't host.

Everything was perfect yesterday. The sex was phenomenal. We had PIV intercourse thrice throughout the night and I thought everything went perfectly.

I had to leave early as I was spending the day with my boys and left at around 07:00 am. As soon as I reached home, my wife wanted to have sex but I just had sex like 2 hours ago and I was too exhausted. We cuddled for sometime and I promised her that we will have sex tonight. I texted Jess a couple of hours later only to realize that she blocked me everywhere.

I am lost as I thought everything went perfectly. It's like she completely disappeared. I am very frustrated!

 

[Evie]

I'm sorry you got ghosted. Maybe this just Jess' M.O. and you're her latest "notch" - which sucks and I know it will sour the memories, but after the shock wears off perhaps you can just remember the good bits and realise that you can have phenomenal sex with new people. Go find the next person yourself

I know, I know, you need to process the "wtf" bit of being ghosted but welcome to dating, this shit happens these days. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it's part of the modern environment. There's no point asking why, speculation about relationship dynamics is for teenagers. Just write it off as a wonderful night but just one. And go find the next person a little older and a little wiser.

 

[Stevek]

I'm sorry you got ghosted. Maybe this just Jess' M.O. and you're her latest "notch" - which sucks and I know it will sour the memories, but after the shock wears off perhaps you can just remember the good bits and realise that you can have phenomenal sex with new people. Go find the next person yourself

I know, I know, you need to process the "wtf" bit of being ghosted but welcome to dating, this shit happens these days. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it's part of the modern environment. There's no point asking why, speculation about relationship dynamics is for teenagers. Just write it off as a wonderful night but just one. And go find the next person a little older and a little wiser.

Thanks Evie,

I know this sounds childish but I was falling in love. I was glued to my phone anticipating her texts. We had amazing chemistry and our texting was super playful and fun. She initiated lot of conversations. It felt like this was going somewhere.

My son asked if everything was okay as he saw me being distant and distracted yesterday. My wife is pretty supportive and she is happy that I put myself out there but yeah... this whole thing stings.

 

[Magdlyn]

Oh no, that's a huge turnaround. I've been ghosted before, and after good sex too, and after promises of future dates. For example, one guy even told me what kind of wine he'd bring to our next date. Then he ghosted and blocked me, and I saw him flirting and trying to set up dates with others, on their public profiles on Fetlife, the day after our date.

But your case is extra dramatic, after all the "incessant" texting, etc.

I tell you, I went through this kind of shit for years back in my OK Cupid era. I ended up getting so jaded. But I did get several LTRs out of the process. I'm sorry for your pain.

I hope your wife doesn't mind your "incessant" texting and inability to have sex with her. Some couples agree to limit the texting with other partners. Obviously you were really enjoying that NRE!

 

[Stevek]

Oh no, that's a huge turnaround. I've been ghosted before, and after good sex too, and after promises of future dates. For example, one guy even told me what kind of wine he'd bring to our next date. Then he ghosted and blocked me, and I saw him flirting and trying to set up dates with others, on their public profiles on Fetlife, the day after our date.

But your case is extra dramatic, after all the "incessant" texting, etc.

I tell you, I went through this kind of shit for years back in my OK Cupid era. I ended up getting so jaded. But I did get several LTRs out of the process. I'm sorry for your pain.

I hope your wife doesn't mind your "incessant" texting and inability to have sex with her. Some couples agree to limit the texting with other partners. Obviously you were really enjoying that NRE!

That bastard! What a shitty thing to do.

This whole past week feels so strange.

Now that I am looking back, there were some cracks. She never mentioned where she worked, while I gave her my business card on the first date. She never told me exactly where she lived and always gave vague information about her past. I also feel very awkward as I showed her pictures of my family. Was she always planning to disappear? I would have at least appreciated a simple text saying that she didn't want to see me anymore.

She actually knows where I live, she knows where I work, knows my wife's and kids' names and how they look. I feel like I failed at protecting my family's privacy. She just seemed like she wanted something long lasting.

My wife is fine with the texting. She teases me about it, but we have been very sexually active the past few weeks. We have never been happier.

 

[Stevek]

I am taking a break from dating. The usual apps are dry and I want to take a break before moving on to feeld.