Torn between two partners

DarkSavant

New member
Hello everyone,

I am in a crossroads in my life and was hoping to get some insight from others with poly experience.

I will describe my two partners as Red and Blue, who are both male. The first part will describe my relationship with Red and give some background. The latter part will describe my current situation. There is a lot to unpack, so here’s a brief summary of my situation:

TLDR summary:

Blue believes I have been in an unhealthy relationship with Red, who has been brainwashing me for years, and wants me to leave that relationship. Red believes Blue is a toxic homewrecker, who has been brainwashing me. I have an 11 year history with Red, and my future career as well as shared dreams/life goals are closely tied to Red. (Red and I started a company together with some friends, and if we break up, I will most likely need to leave that company). I have dated Blue about 1.5 years, and feel a strong, healthy connection to him. I feel like Blue treats me really well. Red wants to be the only primary relationship, while Blue would also like to be treated as a primary. I am at the point where I have to pick between Red and Blue.

Part I : Red

I am a gay male who has been in a relationship with Red for about 11 years. Red was my first relationship. We met each other online, emailed each other for a few months, finally met in real life and hit it off. We became officially boyfriends after 2 weeks of meeting each other, and moved in together after about 5 months. We started out as an exclusive, monogamous couple, but maybe about 2-3 years into our relationship Red had cheated on me with one of his best friend’s boyfriends. (I will refer to the best friend as N.) This resulted in a falling out between N and Red for a while. Eventually N got over it and they are still friends with Red today. I probably should have been more angry at Red for what happened, but I also forgave him.

Once, Red and I went to a convention for gay gamers (video gamers). Anyone was welcome of course, but it was geared towards the LGBTQ community. A few days later, I took a train in order to attend a funeral for the father of one of my childhood friends. Red had called me while I was on the train and somehow our conversation led to him asking me if I found anyone cute or attractive at the convention. I said, “Yes,” and Red told me that he thought our relationship wouldn’t be able to work out and proceeded to break up with me. I don’t remember how much time passed but at some point later he took it back. I don’t remember if he apologized, but I would like to assume so.

For the first 6-7 years of my relationship with Red, somehow it was okay for him to sleep with / date other men, but it wasn’t for me. Some of his reasoning for this was that I was/am naive, and that getting involved with another man would change me and change our relationship. There would be several instances over these first 6-7 years of similarly themed variations of Red being unfair and wielding most of the power in the relationship (At least, I think most would agree on this.). I probably don’t have time to get into every instance, but I might add later if I have time. But the point is that there was an imbalance in the relationship.

About 7 years into the relationship (in 2015) Red introduced me to some people, and I ended up feeling very physically attracted to one of them. We’ll call him C. I think Red could tell that I was attracted to C, because he asked me if I was indeed attracted to C, and I told him “Yes.” Red responded with anger and jealousy. At some point I told Red that I wanted to have sex with C if he was open to it. Of course the answer was “No.” Red primary reasoning was that C was a bad person, that he was racist because he used the N-word. (C was Caucasian). My perspective on this was that C was only using the N-word in a joking manner with an “-a” and not a hard “-er”, not that it justifies it or is appropriate, but his intentions with using the word weren’t malicious in nature. I think C was one of those people who wanted to act like he was from the “hood” in order to be funny. In any case, Red did not approve, and when I asked C how he felt about me, he said he was also attracted to me, but that Red told him that I was not interested in C.

I thought this was strange, and I felt it was hypocritical of Red to not allow me the same privileges and freedoms that I had given him over the years. Eventually I decided to cheat on Red with C. I admitted to Red about the cheating on the same day it happened. The result was not pretty. One could only really describe it as seeing someone transform into a monster.

He told me it was the first time anyone had ever cheated on him. I cried and I felt a lot of guilt and shame over hurting Red. Red wanted to break up, kick me out, and stop supporting me in any financial way. (At this point I was financially dependent on Red because we had moved and I no longer was working full-time as I did before.) I tried to sleep in another room that night but the door had no lock. I did not feel safe, even though Red had never threatened me with physical violence before. Later that night, Red told me to perform oral sex on him while he recorded me with his phone. I complied and he said that if I ever fucked up again that he would put it on the internet.

Eventually, Red slowly forgave me, citing that his primary reason for giving me another chance was because his parents had told him how lucky he was to have me. Red did some more sleeping around in the following months, perhaps to get back at me. When my younger brother came to visit me, Red made sexual advances towards my brother. They were both extremely inebriated and high from weed. Red immediately told me and apologized to both of us. I was angry, but I forgave Red. I ended up cheating on Red some more times with C until I got caught. This time Red’s reaction was rather tame in comparison. He was more disappointed than angry, and he didn’t make any threats. I think at this point Red may have decided that he wanted to work on his jealousy and treating me more fairly. This was when we started to think about becoming poly.
 

DarkSavant

New member
Part II : Blue

Red and I met Blue about 3 years ago. Red and Blue met first, and during their dinner date Red sprung the fact that he was poly, and that I existed, to Blue. (I didn’t know about that at the time). The three of us went on a dinner date and I felt immediate attraction to Blue. However, Red also met someone else around the same time, named M, and Red decided to date M over Blue without my input. On our second date together, we had an awkward dinner with Blue to tell him we were going to date M instead of him.

A year after that, we had been broken up with M for some months. The break-up was mainly between M and Red. Red did not feel comfortable with M and me talking to each other, so we stopped communicating. Eventually, Blue started talking to us again and we became a triad.
As a triad, we ran into a few bumps in the road. First, Red wanted to have other partners outside of the triad. Blue and I were okay with this as long as there was a discussion beforehand. At some point, Red dated another partner who Blue and I both approved, named Q. Q acted mature for his age, however at the time none of us knew that Q was just barely at the legal age of consent in our state. He was less than half of Red’s age. When Red and I first found out, I tried to be open-minded and supportive of Red. Blue immediately objected when he found out. Red and Blue debated over the morality, ethics, scientific, and psychological points of dating someone that young. In the end, Red had seemingly convinced Blue that it was okay. However, after Blue reflected and discussed the situation with some of his friends, he decided that he wasn’t really okay with it. At this point, I was in agreement with Blue and objected to Red dating Q. In one of our heated arguments, I implied that Red was a predator. Red cites this as a point in time when Blue manipulated/brainwashed me because of how radically I shifted my opinion on the matter. I think the main reason for my objection was to protect the triad from what I perceived to be a threat. Red continued to date Q despite our objections, and Blue broke up with us shortly thereafter, but not before suggesting that Red and I go to therapy.

A few weeks later, Red and Blue made up and we continued dating as a triad again. Red and Q broke up on their own shortly after that. Some months went by and things were mostly smooth, but then Red and Blue decided to mutually and amicably break up. This was around April of 2019. In the conversations following this break up, Red tells Blue that he would not be comfortable with Blue continuing to date me. Red cited that there was an agreement that Red and I were a packaged deal. At this point, Red and I were not really aware of some poly lingo such as “Unicorn” or “Primary vs Secondary.” I will admit that Red and I did not do a great job of researching and establishing concrete ground rules with everyone involved present. So this agreement was kind of a debatable point.

One of Red’s other partners, S, who was also poly, found out about the situation and was not pleased. S broke up with Red over other things, like Red cheating on him, but he tried to mediate the situation with me and Blue. S told Red that he should go to therapy if he ever hoped to salvage even a friendship with him.

Red, and I saw a therapist for the next month or so. Blue went to see the same therapist. Red had no knowledge that Blue did this, but I did. Red only went to two sessions with the therapist, while I continued for a few more sessions. In late May or mid June of 2019, Red forcibly took my phone to look through it, and found out that we were all seeing the same therapist. He immediately told me to break up with Blue on the phone in front of him. I did so reluctantly. Blue asked me why I kept giving Red chances, and where was his chance? I felt terrible, but I did not want to lose my relationship with Red.

Over the next few months, Blue and I kept in contact, since Red had never expressly forbidden it. Blue and I decided to see each other in secret, when Red was out of town. During that summer of 2019, Red decided to try to make up with Blue and start with a clean slate. Blue had told Red to not contact him unless it was about dating me. According to Blue, Red did not apologize for anything, and claimed that he(Red) was being mistreated. I had been out of town visiting family, and Blue that Red was basically taking him out on a date and that he enjoyed it, even though it felt weird. Blue claimed that towards the end of that day, Red gestured to Blue to come to his bed, to talk. Blue believes that Red was trying to sleep with him, but Red denied this and said he just wanted to talk to Blue. Blue claims that Red stated he would be okay with Blue and I dating once there was no animosity between them. Blue and I brought up the topic of dating each other to Red a few more times over the next several months, but Red always gave a reason not to, such as “Oh, we might not be poly anymore. We’ll need to discuss it on our own.”

By the end of that summer, I applied to and was accepted to a school in another city, (let’s call it S City). Blue encouraged me to move out to S City for school and wanted to move in with me. However, the program I was enrolled in was an online program, so I didn’t really need to move. I decided not to tell Red this, and said I wanted to move. At first he was against it, but then decided to be supportive of the move, saying he wanted me to have the best educational experience possible.

I remember feeling a lot of guilt and anxiety the last night before I had to move. Blue came to help me pack and load my things into his car. He “volunteered” to help me with the move. Blue and I stayed at a friend’s house for a few weeks. Blue wanted to move into a place together and at first, I was resistant. I wanted to live at my friend’s place while he had his own. He was a little pushy about moving in together, although it did make sense financially, since I could help him split rent on a place. We found a place and I felt the same deep sense of anxiety and guilt as I signed the 1 year lease. “What was I doing? How could I do this? Why?” These were questions I kept asking myself, yet I felt compelled to proceed.

I had several sleepless nights during the autumn quarter of school. It went mostly smoothly though. Blue pretended he was still living in the same city as Red (let’s call that P City). Blue would drive from S City to P City, which was maybe a 4.5 hour drive, on average. Sometimes he would make the drive just to hang out with Red when Red had some friends over. Blue sold his house and basically uprooted his entire life to move over to S City with me.

Eventually, Red brought up the idea that Blue and I could date again. Blue believes that Red only brought it up because Red wanted to date a new person, named H, and had to address me dating Blue in order to be fair. Red claims that he never needed to even bring up the idea of me dating Blue again, and that he was doing us a favor because he knew how much I liked Blue. A few weeks after Red and H started dating, H moved in with Red because H was kicked out of his home due to no fault of his own, according to Red and H.

As the autumn quarter drew to a close, I got more anxious and was tempted to just tell Red the entire truth. Instead of that, however, Blue and I decided to just tell Red that Blue wanted to move in with me. Blue and I drove to P City to tell Red this, but Red did not react favorably. Red was angry that we tried to make big decisions without talking to him first. Red said that he and I were the primaries, so there needs to be discussions between just the two of us prior to any big decisions. Red said that he would consider us all moving into a place together in the future, if it made sense.

Blue had wanted to take me to South America for Winter Break. I told Blue that Red would probably object and I was too scared to bring that up with Red right now and instead maybe we could do that for Spring break. When Winter break arrived, I went back to P City to visit Red. Blue decided he wanted to take me to Canada for a few days, so I told Red about this and also insisted that Blue move in with me for next quarter. Red said No to everything. I packed as much of my stuff that was still remaining at Red’s as possible into Blue’s car. I got into Blue’s car and was ready to leave for S City for good. Red pleaded with me to stay and talk, so I got out of Blue’s car and into Red’s car. Red took me to a restaurant and we talked and argued for hours. Blue was concerned for my safety so I told him where we were and he waited outside the entire time. Red and I left the restaurant and continued to argue in Red’s car. Blue waited for several more hours until he decided he couldn’t wait anymore and got into Red’s car. Blue said something like, “I know you think I’m an asshole, Red, so go ahead and beat me up.” Red told Blue that he is trespassing and to leave the car. Blue refused to leave the backseat and said that he was afraid Red would just drive off with me somewhere. I told Blue to just let me and Red finish our conversation, so he reluctantly left the car. Red then immediately starts the car up to drive away. Blue followed us in his own car.

I told Red that we should have a mediated conversation with a mutual friend of ours, J. Red and I both look up to J as a mentor. I told Blue that we were going to J’s place. Red, J, and I proceeded to have our mediated discussion for another few hours with Blue waiting in his car parked in front of Red’s. Finally, Red relented and told me Blue could move in with me, and that I could go to Canada with Blue.

(There’s more to unpack, but that’s all I could write for today. To be continued...)
 

Magdlyn

Moderator
Staff member
That is an extremely long detailed story. I am not sure many will read the whole thing.

It seems you are going to continue. I suggest asking a mod to move this to our blog section.

Generally, if you want advice on this whole saga so far, I think you have learned a few life lessons, relationship lessons. You feel tied to Red, despite him being your first relationship. It sounds like you've allowed him to control you, and perhaps sometimes emotionally abuse you, for over a decade.

Maybe leave out the "brainwashing" aspect. It sounds like you are outgrowing being subordinate to a controlling dominant lover. You've cheated in a very dramatic way, by secretly moving in with Blue, for months.

What do you want out of all this? What are your goals for say, the next 5 years? Still scampering around and cheating, while Red does whatever he wants, and sees whomever he wants? Or something more stable and mature and equal with (maybe) Blue, and whoever else might come along and treat you with more respect?
 

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Staff member
Hello DarkSavant,

This is probably premature as you said you were going to continue your story, however I will give my opinion based on what you have posted so far. Two things. First, Blue seems to be the partner that treats you better, so if you really have to choose between Red and Blue, choose Blue. That's my vote anyway. Second, however, you don't really seem to want to choose between them, you want both of them. You have worked hard to save your relationship with Red; this hard work proves that you love Red very much. So I am inclined to suggest that you sit down with Red and Blue, and attempt to hammer out an arrangement where you can be with both of them. Of course, it's entirely possible that I would advise differently, based on your pending post with the rest of your story.

Regards,
Kevin T.
 

Evie

Mod
Your relationship with Red sounds more like Stockholm Syndrome. But I'm not a qualified person, so take that with a grain of salt if you wish.
 

fuchka

Member
Hmm... Just based on what you've written, I wouldn't want to date either of these people. Red sounds much worse than Blue, but neither seem great.

I think you could benefit from solo therapy regarding what has kept you with Red and what has attracted you to keeping these big secrets rather than breaking up with Red.
 

Jinxed

New member
Wow man...

Later that night, Red told me to perform oral sex on him while he recorded me with his phone. I complied and he said that if I ever fucked up again that he would put it on the internet.

Eventually, Red slowly forgave me,

Ok so your post isn’t done, but honestly this should have been the end of it. It seems like Blue has stumbled into a mess and is trying to save you, which is foolish on his part. It seems you’ve been trapped or willingly stayed in an abusive relationship for years, and not only have you suffered the abuse you have let Red convince you that it’s your fault. I agree with the other user this seems like Stockholm’s. He slowly forgave you? He sexually assaulted you!
This is so fucked up. Take your way out, and leave. If you don’t you will likely regret it down the line no matter how good this business you started with Red is.
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
You have a LOT going on. I hope you feel somewhat better for writing it out. You sound like you are realizing this situation is not healthy for you. Not with Red. Not with Blue.

To be honest? I think you could stick with therapy and work to get out and be on your own. Stop seeing either one of them.

I did not feel safe, even though Red had never threatened me with physical violence before. Later that night, Red told me to perform oral sex on him while he recorded me with his phone. I complied and he said that if I ever fucked up again that he would put it on the internet.

Get away from Red. You do not feel safe. Anything past that? From cheating on other partners, hitting on your brother, dating an almost underage kid, and

Red told Blue that he is trespassing and to leave the car. Blue refused to leave the backseat and said that he was afraid Red would just drive off with me somewhere. I told Blue to just let me and Red finish our conversation, so he reluctantly left the car. Red then immediately starts the car up to drive away. Blue followed us in his own car.

NONE of that sounds healthy or good. :(

I remember feeling a lot of guilt and anxiety the last night before I had to move. Blue came to help me pack and load my things into his car. He “volunteered” to help me with the move. Blue and I stayed at a friend’s house for a few weeks. Blue wanted to move into a place together and at first, I was resistant. I wanted to live at my friend’s place while he had his own. He was a little pushy about moving in together, although it did make sense financially, since I could help him split rent on a place.

Could tell Blue to back up some. Because while Blue treats you better than Red, what is that really? Trying to rope you off? Too much of a hurry to live together? It's kinda like he also treats you like a posession. Just not as mean as Red about it. But who wants to be treated like a THING rather than a person? :confused:

I know money can be hard. But you are gonna pay something somewhere. If not in money, then in mental health or emotional health or physical health. You mention a LOT of stressy things and poor sleep.

It's ok to SLOW DOWN.

Red saying Blue brainwashes you and Blue saying that Red does? I'm going to tell you it is ok for you to tell both of them to BACK UP.

You are your OWN person, you will make your OWN decisions. You will NOT do weird "tug-o-war" with them like you are a bone two dogs are fighting over. You don't have to fix anything. It's ok to let them END if that's the healthiest past FOR YOU. If their behavior stresses you out? You can step off this bus! You can say "No, thanks. I am not a bone for dogs to fight over. I am not going to be torn between to partners. I pick me -- so I'm stepping away from this crazy."

You seem stuck on Red even though Red treats you poorly just because Red was first real BF. And BECAUSE he was first real BF, that's the only yardstick you had for relationships for a long time. Now C and Blue and others and maybe just living life are waking you up to the fact that "Hey, I don't HAVE to be treated like this and accept it."

But because you sound like are used to someone else kinda being "the boss" don't latch on to Blue to just be a replacement Red, ok? Learn to be your own boss, learn to be in your own skin. Date whoever, but learn to live by yourself for a while. You have been through a lot. YKWIM?

Thinking about being on your own may be uncomfortable if all you have every really known is Red, and you are enmeshed with work as well. It's not like walking away is only affecting your dating life. It would affect your home life and your work life and... that can feel overwhelming.

So I'm going to encourage you to talk to a professional. Get your thoughts in order with them. Make a plan with them. Figure out what is healthy dating and what is NOT with them.

Maybe read some of

https://speakoutloud.net/articles

Or at least look at the wheels.

https://spokane.wsu.edu/extra/2017/04/04/signs-healthy-unhealthy-relationship/

It is OK to want to be treated better. You deserve to be treated well. It's ok to take up the space you do in the world and make YOUR OWN choices.

Galagirl
 
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DarkSavant

New member
Part II: Blue (continued.)

After that mediated conversation, I left with Blue to stay at a friend’s house for the night. Red called me that night to tell me he was hurt that I wanted to leave for Canada instead of spending more of my Winter break with him. I told Red that I would make it up to him by staying with him longer than I originally planned. I broke down the number of days I would spend with Red, and it was equal to the number of days I would spend with Blue and my parents combined. Red didn’t seem satisfied with that fact though. In addition, Red also told me that Blue was only going to live with me for maybe 2-3 months and then leave. This was not what we had agreed to in our conversation with J. We never specified a time period.

On our way to Canada, Blue told me that Red may have shown some small sign of growth, but he does not want to ever be vetoed again and that he does not want to be treated second to Red. During our trip in Canada, Red called me constantly, claiming he was bullied into agreeing to something he didn’t want to agree to, and that I had used an ultimatum to get what I wanted. Red demanded that Blue cancel his move. I told Red that it was too late, and that Blue had hired movers while we were in Canada. Red then broke up with me, only to call me back an hour later saying that he thinks there might be a way for things to work out if I told Blue that we would have to be on a break while he was living with me. Blue thought it was ridiculous, and he didn’t really care because he would be living with me and there was no way for Red to really enforce his stipulation. (I forgot to mention earlier that one of Red’s stipulations with me dating Blue again was that we could not have sex, because he was uncomfortable with the idea).

The next quarter of school arrived and it seemed to pass by in a flash. Although I felt less guilt since I didn’t have to hide the fact that I was living with Blue, there was always tension and anxiety present. Red insisted that only he and I could be the Primaries in the relationship in order to protect ourselves. When I resisted agreeing to this, Red threatened to break up with me, so I relented and agreed. Blue was unhappy about that, but he also understood that I didn’t want to lose my relationship with Red.

Spring break loomed ever closer, and Blue brought up the trip to Ecuador. I told him I needed to speak to Red about it. I brought up the idea with Red while in our couples counseling session, about a month before the planned trip. Red didn’t accept or reject the idea at the time. He was upset again that I was blindsiding him with new information, making plans without consulting him first. At the time, I was under the impression that the flight tickets hadn’t been purchased yet, but Blue bought them without confirming with me first, even though I had specifically asked him to hold off until I talked to Red about the trip. Blue apologized, and acknowledged that he was boxing me into a corner.

As the quarter continued, Red periodically asked whether or not I am abiding by the rules and staying on a break with Blue. I lied and told him yes. Eventually, Red told me he was uncomfortable with Blue living with me, and potentially influencing me. Red told me I needed to either move back to P City, or kick Blue out of my place, otherwise the relationship would be over. Red reminded me that if we were to break up, then he would not feel comfortable working with me at our company (which we started together with some friends about a year ago). I caved and told Blue I would be moving out. Blue pleaded with me not to leave. He reminded me about how much he had given up for me: He had sold his house and uprooted his life to be here. He had the chance to move to Ecuador over the summer but instead he stayed with me, and he stayed with me even though I agreed to Red’s One Primary-Multiple Secondaries poly structure.

I felt guilty, and I decided to tell Red I wasn’t moving out. I told Red about the tickets to Ecuador, and that they were purchased without my involvement. Red pushed the ultimatum on me again, but this time he bargained with me, saying that if I don’t take the trip to Ecuador, then I could stay in S City until the end of the school year.

Blue pushed back and said the Ecuador trip was non-negotiable. I tried to stand my ground with Red and told him I wanted to go to Ecuador. Red said that if I went on the trip, then I would need to move back to P City. And if I didn’t do that, then we would need to break up and I would need to leave my company. I held my ground as long as I could, but in the end I caved and told Blue I couldn’t go through with taking the trip. Blue reluctantly called the airline and rescheduled the trip to the summer (it took about 3 hours with the hold times).

On one of my sleepless nights, I wrote up a “relationship contract” with Red. It included items that should be implicit in a healthy relationship, (such as “No cheating,” or “No abuse of any form”), but I felt I needed to have these things in writing as a way of establishing boundaries so that I might have something to refer to in order to say, “Enough is enough.” Part of the contract included the agreement on my living situation. Since I was not going to Ecuador, I could stay in S City until the end of my school year. Red told me he was fine with signing the agreement, but he wanted me to spend Spring Break with him to work on our relationship and to refine the contract together in real life. Blue believes that Red waited until hearing that the trip was cancelled to tell me this.

As Spring Break approached, the COVID-19 pandemic grew worse. Red called me to tell me that he wanted me to just move back to P City because the cases in S City were much more numerous, and since my classes were going to be online only, there was no longer a reason to be in S City, ignoring the fact that I am still on a lease. Red kept telling me that I should be with family in times of crisis, and that we needed to stick together in order to plan things out better.

Blue believed that Red was just using the pandemic as an excuse to further change the agreement. I thought that Red’s concerns seemed legitimate and logical, but a part of me held some skepticism. I really didn’t know what to believe, but I agreed to go back to P City for the break to spend time with Red. Blue urged me to get Red to sign the agreement before picking me up, but Red insisted that we refine the agreement together (just Red and me) after we get back to P City.

The first day after I got back to P City, Red and I went over the agreement and he reiterated his reasons for having me stay in P City. I told him that it all sounded logical, but that I still wanted to go back to S City. Red told me he would not accept that, however if the pandemic conditions improved to the point where school resumed on-campus classes, then he would be okay with me returning. We just ended the conversation without signing anything, but Red was under the impression that I agreed to it. The next week of Spring break went by with relatively low stress, but then Red told me that I needed to make a decision because our company was basically frozen while waiting to hear what was going to happen between us.

I told Blue that I needed to make a choice soon, and that I didn’t know what I would do or what would happen. He asked me if I wanted him to be in P City in case I needed him and I told him “Yes.” The day came when I had to tell Red what my final decision was, and I told him that I wanted to go back to S City when Spring break was over, regardless of whether or not classes resumed on-campus. Red asked me if I was sure, and re-iterated what the decision would mean. I broke down sobbing, and felt the crushing guilt of throwing away the history I have with Red and the potential future we were trying to build together. Red told me the only way I could keep a relationship with Blue is to tell him that he must be treated as a Secondary partner. I called Blue to come over so I could talk to him. To summarize the rest of that night, it felt like Red and Blue were playing a match of ping-pong with my mind. I kept going back and forth on what to do, and while talking to either one of them, it felt like I was in a different reality and either one of them seemed logical and in the right. (Only Blue has ever suggested I take space and time away from both him and Red in order to figure things out without their influences. He suggested it multiple times, especially around last Spring/Summer right before I was forced to break up with Blue).

Red confronted Blue, who was waiting patiently in my driveway. Blue told Red the entire truth about the affair and how long he had really been living with me. Red calmly told both of us that he figured that was the case and that he forgave me for it all. At the very end, Red begged me to give our relationship another chance and that if he screwed up he would drive me back to S City. I told Blue I wanted to give Red a chance to prove himself, and he finally lost all patience, told me I kept buying into Red’s BS, and angrily drove off. Blue then sent a text to me and Red, threatening to tell our business partners and Red’s mother details of our nasty past. Red said this is further evidence of Blue being a dangerous, toxic individual. I understand that Blue sent the text because he was incredibly hurt. Blue knows I still love and care for Red, and I believe Blue still cares about me enough to not follow through with those threats.

It’s been a little over a week since that night, and I still don’t know if this is what I really want. I miss Blue dearly and feel extremely guilty about leading him on and leaving him in the dust, but I don’t want to jeopardize what I have with Red and my future with our company. I have never in my life felt so torn about anything. I long for the days of normalcy and a good night’s sleep.
 
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GalaGirl

Well-known member
Again, I hope you feel better airing that out.

Again, you have a lot going on.

Again... I think you may want to just stop. Stop participating in all this. Get away from both of them for a time. None of what you write about is healthy sounding. :(

I think you know that. :(

I encourage you to talk to a professional. You really have a lot on your plate.

Only Blue has ever suggested I take space and time away from both him and Red in order to figure things out without their influences. He suggested it multiple times, especially around last Spring/Summer right before I was forced to break up with Blue).

So take that suggestion. Take the time away on your own.

It’s been a little over a week since that night, and I still don’t know if this is what I really want.

You have endured a LOT of abuse and poor behavior. You aren't gonna heal from it in a week! It's ok to still be healing from all that drama and not know what you want. Rest.

I miss Blue dearly and feel extremely guilty about leading him on and leaving him in the dust,

Well, can apologize later. Right now? Rest. Take care of YOU.

but I don’t want to jeopardize what I have with Red

I get you might have fond memories from the past. But what do you have with Red today other than a long string of abuse and drama? Just reading your stuff is awful. I can only imagine what it was like living through it. :(

You keep going around on the abuse cycle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycle_of_abuse

It is not you that jeopardized a future together. It's Red's poor behavior and poor treatment of you. According to your relationship contract, when IS enough enough to you? You sound like you know it's crossed a line and are now struggling with grief. Like you know where this is gonna end -- a break up. And you are sad thinking it has to come to that. It is ok to be sad. This is not what you dreamed or hoped for with Red.

It is not ok to keep you in the line of fire so you keep on being other people's punching bag though. After so many years together, you KNOW Red's habits and his character. If he was gonna change? He would have already. If you are gonna go by his recent track record? It's just more trips round and round on the same merry-go-round. Same ol' song. Different day. :(

and my future with our company.

Just cuz you and Red started it doesn't mean you have to stay there. Esp if Red is not healthy for you to be around.

It's ok to change your mind about work. It's ok to pick a different future and NOT stick with this company. It's ok to choose work doing something else.

I have never in my life felt so torn about anything. I long for the days of normalcy and a good night’s sleep.

Well, taking a break from both of them might be a small step back toward normalcy and good night sleep. Do something different.

Cuz keeping on with same ol' song is same ol' song. :(

You seem to recognize that how you have been living is unhealthy and unsustainable. And it's really coming out of your hide. And you probably don't want to keep on living like this -- all run down and beat up and exhausted. Love isn't supposed to be like this or this hard. :(

You sound like you know what you want.

The day came when I had to tell Red what my final decision was, and I told him that I wanted to go back to S City when Spring break was over, regardless of whether or not classes resumed on-campus. Red asked me if I was sure, and re-iterated what the decision would mean. I broke down sobbing, and felt the crushing guilt of throwing away the history I have with Red and the potential future we were trying to build together.

You want to go back to S city when Spring Break is over and be on your own there. So go be on your own there. And heal from your break up with Red on your own so neither one is influencing you and you can make your OWN choices.

Let the wacky STOP. Save yourself.

Galagirl
 
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breathemusic

Active member
I read your post on Reddit first, but now have seen it here too. Honestly, all 3 of you have been bad partners to each other and haven't acted ethically. I personally think that you should consider being single for a while and getting into therapy to figure out what you want and need in a healthy relationship, but also how to behave yourself in a healthy relationship. Red flags all around and the whole thing is a huge mess that needs to end.

If I HAD to pick between red and blue then I'd say that Red has been the most unhealthy and has in fact been abusive (not that you or Blue have been great either). But again, personally I think you should be focusing less on them and more on getting your own house in order.
 

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Staff member
Hi DarkSavant,

Now that I have read your third post, I am more inclined to tell you to choose Red. Due to how much you have invested in your relationship with him. And in your business with him. Also, Blue is your secondary partner at this point. When choosing between a secondary partner and a primary partner, you would always choose the primary partner, by definition. So choose Red. Break up with Blue.

On the other hand, I still think you don't *really* want to break up with either. You need to sit down with Red and Blue and hammer this out. Figure out a way to be with both of them. Maybe this would involve alternating weeks, like you stay with Red in P City for one week, then stay with Blue in S City for one week, rinse and repeat. But you must get them both to agree with that. So sit down with both of them, and hammer out a way to be with both of them. Explain to them that you have thought about it, and that your final decision is that you don't want to break up with either of them, and that you need their mutual help in making that happen.

The ideal solution, of course, would be if they would cooperate with each other. Barring that, you at least need them to compromise with each other to a minimal extent. When you sit down with them, perhaps it would help if J were also there, acting as a mediator. You need to be able to talk to them in a way that doesn't turn into a big fight. So that is my advice based on your posts so far.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.
 

Jinxed

New member
Hi DarkSavant,

Now that I have read your third post, I am more inclined to tell you to choose Red. Due to how much you have invested in your relationship with him. And in your business with him. Also, Blue is your secondary partner at this point. When choosing between a secondary partner and a primary partner, you would always choose the primary partner, by definition. So choose Red. Break up with Blue.

I mean, did you catch the part where Red forced them to breakup, forced OP to agree to primary secondary culture, not to mention the sexual assault and blackmail?
Having read the third iteration, I agree with others, dump both and work on self. Or dump Red for the continued abuse.
 

Magdlyn

Moderator
Staff member
Hi DarkSavant,

Now that I have read your third post, I am more inclined to tell you to choose Red. Due to how much you have invested in your relationship with him. And in your business with him. Also, Blue is your secondary partner at this point. When choosing between a secondary partner and a primary partner, you would always choose the primary partner, by definition.

This is not true.

So choose Red. Break up with Blue.

On the other hand, I still think you don't *really* want to break up with either. You need to sit down with Red and Blue and hammer this out. Figure out a way to be with both of them. Maybe this would involve alternating weeks, like you stay with Red in P City for one week, then stay with Blue in S City for one week, rinse and repeat. But you must get them both to agree with that. So sit down with both of them, and hammer out a way to be with both of them. Explain to them that you have thought about it, and that your final decision is that you don't want to break up with either of them, and that you need their mutual help in making that happen.

The ideal solution, of course, would be if they would cooperate with each other. Barring that, you at least need them to compromise with each other to a minimal extent. When you sit down with them, perhaps it would help if J were also there, acting as a mediator. You need to be able to talk to them in a way that doesn't turn into a big fight. So that is my advice based on your posts so far.

Sincerely,
Kevin T.

No. no no no. No.

Red has been abusing Savant for a decade. Primary schmimary! Good grief.

There is no way Red and Blue are gonna make nice and work out a peachy keen solution for Savant like this. This isn't a magical fairy tale kingdom here. It's 2 real men pulling another one back and forth like 2 dogs with a bone. And the bone is just going any way the wind blows, as if he has no mind of his own.
 

DarkSavant

New member
Thank you all for the feedback, I know my posts were super long so I really appreciate anyone who made it through the whole thing.

So much has happened and there are details I just felt were important to share. I will try to keep these responses in mind moving forward.

I have gone to my parents' in order to take some time and space away from everything as much as possible. I have been seeing a couples counselor (with Red) and my own counselor for the past few months, and will continue to do that as much as I can. I plan to go limited / no contact with Red and Blue while refocusing on my schoolwork and figuring stuff out...
 

Evie

Mod
I hope your parents are as supportive as mine were when I moved home to get away from an abusive ex. That's said genuinely, my parents seriously rock.
 

Magdlyn

Moderator
Staff member
Thank you all for the feedback, I know my posts were super long so I really appreciate anyone who made it through the whole thing.

So much has happened and there are details I just felt were important to share. I will try to keep these responses in mind moving forward.

I have gone to my parents' in order to take some time and space away from everything as much as possible. I have been seeing a couples counselor (with Red) and my own counselor for the past few months, and will continue to do that as much as I can. I plan to go limited / no contact with Red and Blue while refocusing on my schoolwork and figuring stuff out...

Thanks for the update. It sounds like you made a wise choice.

And I hope everyone you come in contact with is disease-free.
 
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