What does a mono husband do about his daughter's discovery of her mother's polyamory?

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dingedheart

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I guess I too would be considered a struggling mono, for now. I've posted some questions and made comments on other threads, so my story is around in here.

@sage, I'm not sure if you and I have directly communicated or not. Forgive me if we have. How long have you been in this type of relationship? How long before finding this site? Is your husband a member of this site? Do you have children with your husband? If so, how old? How much do they know?

My current problem is the horrible relationship dynamic that my wife and daughter currently have. It's becoming unbearable for me and my son. Last night at a restaurant, I told both of them to fix the problem or I would come up with a solution no one was going to like. If you need background you can check out "Primary status rejected" on the New To Poly page.

Thanks,
D
 
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Hi DH

I'm sorry. I've seen your thread, but because it didn't strike me as having a poly-mono component, and it was so long, I haven't read it. I tried to get the gist of what's going on for you, but even that's difficult from here.

Are your kids having difficulty with your polyamory?

My kids are not really kids at all, I suppose, 26 and 19, but they still have issues with polyamory. My 26-year old is very Christian and has had some strong opinions, but we are very close, so she is tying to understand. My 19-year old initially freaked out, but is also coming around. Neither live with us, so that makes things a bit easier.

Z's kids are younger and have only been introduced to his SO as a good friend.

The more I travel down the polyamorous path of my relationship, the more I realise that it is a kind of micro for the macro that is our life. Everything in it highlights an aspect of our life that is either working or not working well. With older kids, it tends to show the level of mutual understanding, connection and respect we have with them in all areas of our lives.
 
Thanks Sage

No reason to be sorry at all. Originally my problem was that her giving me time, attention, and "dates" was being done out of a sense of fairness or obligation. My natural reaction was thank you, but no thank you. After doing lots of reading and asking lots of questions this phenomenon is not that unusual, and its general cause is NRE.

I guess the reason for my thread was a reaction to my situation as someone that's not seeing the rainbow. I can see how you didn't see a poly-mono component.

My kids are younger. My daughter is 13, the older one, and going through her own changes. I personally think that her having to deal with her mother's sexuality or marriage concepts at this exact time is unfair and irresponsible.

How young are Z's children? What are their gender(s)? Do you think gender makes a difference? It sounds like you are divorced. Did the poly conversation with your kids happen as a result before, or as a matter of fact after?

Thanks,
D
 
dingedheart said:
Last night at restaurant, I told both of them to fix the problem or I would come up with a solution no one was going to like.
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Sorry to interrupt your conversation here with Sage, but seriously, dinged? Was this the best course of action? That sounds rather passive aggressive to me.

I can understand your being fed up, and having moments when you wish it were all tied up in a nice bow. But saying that would have been better, no? Now I would wonder if they were left feeling hopeless. Usually when someone says that to me (my mother did MANY times in my childhood) I felt hopeless, helpless and left stranded emotionally and disrespected. This isn't good communication, imo. No one can do stuff FOR YOU. You have to do it together.

It seems rather self-centred to me to think that people will just make it right when you snap your fingers. Think of when someone has said the same thing to you. It's a common way of raising children too, no? "Do as I say! No questions asked. Smarten up. What's your problem?" Usually this is what is said to boys, but in my house, and others I'm sure, it was directed at us, girls and boys, by our mum, when she had had enough. We learned nothing from it about how she felt, what we could do to help, as she never requested any help, and nothing about how to conduct ourselves in the future, just how to shut up and deal with our own hurt feelings at not getting our needs met. (Usually it was because we were hungry.)

They don't know how to make it right. Your wife does not know how to make it right, it seems. She does her own thing, I think, because there doesn't seem to be any communication about how to ask for what she needs. That is evident, if this is how you are communicating. It shuts her down. It tells her and your kids that you better do this, or there will be consequences. Ones that you won't like. That is threatening. They now think that they better smarten up or you will do something, yet have no idea how to. Yet you get to sit back and wait for them to sort it out. Nothing falls on you at all, except to dish out some punishment after? There are other ways, my friend.

So why not be inviting with finding ways to do that? In one set of good communication skills (NVC, to be precise) there is a conflict resolution list that one can go through with another they are having a conflict with. It's on the communication thread in the stickies, or should be. Tell me if it isn't and I will add it. Maybe you should have a look.

Or look at non-violent communication online and see if you can get some new ways of asking for your needs to be met. It's part of a way of doing poly that sets solid foundations. It offers a way to speak to each other with respect and compassion. I hear none in the above quote. Really, it's just one good way of having relationship skills that work. I wonder how much would clear up if you and the wife went and got some new skills in the area of communicating.
 
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RP is a very wise woman and I'm coming in on this very late but I have managed to find your original post. I'm afraid I haven't got time to go back over everything else. I actually agree with RP on the children thing.

As an aside, Z's kids are 11 and 12 (girl and boy) and they don't live with us. He would not expose them to a multitude of different partners, even if he had them, which he doesn't. He does like them to think of his SO as a good friend.

But the real issue here is you and your wife. I'm ashamed to say that you remind me very much of me and my ex-husband.

Ironically, in my current relationship, I'm the monoamorous one. But when my marriage started falling apart it was I who wanted to be polyamorous (although I didn't know much about it). I sound very much like your wife, and you sound like my husband. He decided he didn't want polyamory for the exact reasons you've stated. He had all the responsibility and my "boyfriend" had all the fun. We split up over it.

But looking back, if I knew then what I know now, I think I could have made it work. We had a conversation very much like the one you described in your initial post, and I couldn't answer any better than your wife. That's why I let him or made him go. I felt I was being selfish and unfair to try to hold onto the marriage under those circumstances.

But what I was going through was just NRE fueled by a desperation to be loved for who I was, and to feel exciting romantic love again. I had started raising my husband's kids when I was 19. I had two of my own in my twenties, and then my husband's eldest daughter virtually deposited 4 grandchildren on my doorstep because she was so ill. By the time I was in my late forties I was totally burnt out. My husband had his own coping strategies and difficulties, but we just couldn't get it together.

I hear all the resentment, hurt, anger and disbelief in your posts that my husband had. It's affecting me, but I don't quite know what to tell you. My teenage daughter also hated me for probably a couple of years. She had lived through the worst of her parents' relationship, and she blamed me, because she saw me as the one who was upsetting the apple cart. We had counseling, which helped, but I had to "wear the hair shirt," as the counselor called it, because, as the "child" in the situation, she could only deal with her feelings and not be expected to understand mine while she was in such a state.

From my perspective, my ex made everything worse between us. But in hindsight, maybe she needed him to get through. It is very difficult for a mother to stand aside and acknowledge that in order to be true to herself she has to almost relinquish her relationship with her child.

I don't think we'll ever be close. I think she is her father's daughter, and my firstborn is closer to me. We are much better now. I think we are all happy. But it was a couple of years of hell.
 
All of my kids live with me.
19
14
13
11
3

To be honest, the honest and openness of our life in general, combined with our honesty and openness about what changed and why has been AMAZING.

None of them have had an issue, nor did my little sister (17). Also, all of their friends are ALWAYS hanging out here, and none of them did either. I really think that kids handle well what the adults handle well.

Dinged, the issue for the kiddos in your situation, imo, isn't "polyamory." It's shitty handling of adult behavior. I'm not pointing fingers at you, just the things you described, like your wife bailing on a family activity, which was uncool behavior for an adult.

(Anyway, I have lots to say, but gotta go back to the hospital to drop off some stuff for Spicy Pea. On a side note, everyone is doing much better today.)
 
Good morning RP, I just got done replying to you on another thread.

Passive aggressive? NO, aggressive aggressive. Nothing passive about it. This has been simmering for 3-4 weeks now. I have approached each of them numerous times to try to ascertain the problem. About a week ago, I even suggested they go see a therapist if they couldn't find a way to be civil to one another. Neither wanted to do that.

We were in public, meeting another family for dinner, and I didn't want any of their bullshit spilling over into it. I'm really getting sick of this constant backbiting.

I'm use to the kids fighting or having disagreements. I pretty much stay out unless blood is drawn,or somebody's way over the line. This started out the the same way.

I had no specific plan in mind when I said I'd handle it, but I'm sure they both thought I was talking about the therapist. Either way, the bullshit stopped for an hour or so.

RP, I agree with most of what you are saying. However, the situation I see could be that the 13-yr old has been repeatedly lied to, and in addition, she may have discovered a "horrible" secret about her mother. The secret, if told, also would affect her dad and brother. This creates a communications log-jam.

Of course, this is speculation on my part. But from the timeline, and the bitterness of my daughter, her snooping around, the additional affection towards me from her, have pointed down this path.

Thanks for your comments.
 
Sage, thank you for the reply.

Interesting that you have been on both sides of this. You truly have a unique perspective. Thank you for your honesty.

Not familiar with the expression "wear the hair shirt." Sounds negative, though.

How did your ex make matters worse? Asking so I don't make similar mistakes.

Did you ever entertain the idea of using the time, energy and passion you divert to your bf into your relationship with your husband, if he would have been receptive to that?

Is Z the man you dated during your marriage?

LR, yes, I agree it's not pol. It's the secret or lies that have us jammed up. Thanks.
 
Yes, I think so, Dingedheart. (I just can't write DH because to my mind that's dear husband.)

It's rough on kids when their parents are lying. As the one who was lying, I feel safe in saying it's just fucked up to do that to your kids. My oldest figured out I was having an affair. She's not Maca's child. It impacted her relationship with him, because whether or not she thought it was wrong of me, I'm Mom, and she knew if we split, she would go with me. So she didn't want to open up and get close to him, because in her mind, he was already GOING to "abandon" her because of what I was doing.

I feel for your daughter. It's so easy to see what's going on around you at that age. Kids really aren't as naive as people like to believe. :(
 
dingedheart said:
This has been simmering for 3-4 weeks now. I have approached each of them numerous times. I suggested they go see a therapist. Neither wanted to do that. We were in public, meeting another family for dinner, and I didn't want any of their bullshit spilling over into it. I'm really getting sick of this constant backbiting.

I'm use to the kids fighting...

I had no specific plan in mind when I said I'd handle it, but I'm sure they both thought I was talking about the therapist. Either way, the bullshit stopped for an hour or so.

RP, I agree with most of what you are saying. Th 13-yr old has been repeatedly lied to... she may have discovered a "horrible" secret about her mother.

Of course, this is speculation on my part, but from the time line and bitterness of my daughter, snooping around, the additional affection towards me from her, have pointed down this path.
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I'm getting concerned for you, Dinged. I'm not feeling the love emanating from your neck of the woods. I feel for all of you.

I bolded this one bit because I am not sure I get it. Sorry for the hijack here, folks. Not really on topic, are we? Hopefully it will all relate in the end.
 
Just to quickly continue on the hijack topic, dinged, have you considered having you and your wife sit down with your daughter (as she is doing the snooping) and being upfront about what is happening? Surely the honesty and trust you guys show her, the respect and confidence you show in her as a person, would go a long way to helping her personally with everything. I realise this would open up another can of worms, but dealing with the truth is so much easier than dealing with the monsters our minds create. Our minds are so very good at creating monsters, particularly at that age.

Obviously, this would depend on her maturity and emotional state, overall. As her father, you would know whether this idea is a possibility. I'm just interested in whether this is an option, or whether everything is happening behind tightly-closed doors.
 
LovingRadiance, thanks for the input. Just use D. I do.

I agree with your take on things.

(Congratulations to you all.:))
 
RP, thanks. To clear up the part you are unsure of, I have asked each of them numerous times what the problem was. Got lots of stupid or non-answers. As of yet, they have not told me directly this is the case. So I'm speculating that my daughter has started to figure out she has been mislead.

The Hijack. I did read some of the postings in the children/poly thread and I understand their perspective. I was looking for the mono perspective that had an adolescent girl. I actually PMed Mono a week or so ago on this very topic. Sorry. Move it, if it seems necessary. No problem.

I can outline all the other struggles just as easily. This just happens to be the current one.
 
Flamekat,

First they or she would have to come clean as to the problem. But yes, I have thought about all sorts of possible tacks. The hypotheticals are staggering. Not sure I trust my wife's judgment on a lot of topics anymore, with her NRE and all.
 
dingedheart said:
LovingRadiance, thanks for the input. Just use D. I do.

I agree with your take on things.

Congratulations to you all. :)
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D works for me.

There is a book, "All About S.E.X.: The Scarletten Book" by Heather Corinna. In it, obviously they talk about sex, staying safe, etc. But the other thing they make a huge point about is RELATIONSHIPS, specifically healthy relationships, including healthy polyamorous and non-monogomous relationships. You might check it out, see if it's something you'd be willing to go through with your daughter.

I homeschool. I had my little sister last year. She's got learning disabilities and functions at about a 12-13 year old maturity (at 16). We went through the book for health. It was one part of her health class (obviously the sex/STD part). But what I found was that she really got interested in the relationship section, and figured out that boys who were pressing her for how she dressed were not "good enough" for her. She really got a lot out of the relationship information, including feeling comfortable now telling other people that I'm polyamorous, what that means, and why it's okay with her (as a young practicing Christian).

They have a website too, but I find it way too "teen-friendly" (bright colors, alternating fonts, makes my eyes hurt).
www.scarleteen.com

Thanks for the congrats. We pick Baby and Mommy up today and bring 'em home. :)
 
LR, thank you very much for the resource material. I think it could be very useful.

The good thing about this whole situation is that it has forced a very long and detailed conversation with my wife.
 
dingedheart said:
The good thing about this whole situation is it has forced a very long and detailed conversation with my wife.
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How did that conversation go? Will there be another such discussion with your daughter (not necessarily about the poly, but to deal with the issues there)?

I'm glad to hear you guys are talking in depth.
 
I'm glad you're having a serious conversation. Looking forward to hearing how it went.

Someone else shared that link on here months ago, and it was SO useful over the last few months with the myriad teens in my life. I'm glad you found it helpful too.
 
The meltdown happened Thursday evening while I was driving my daughter home from an optometrist appointment. I asked what was bothering her. She started crying, sobbing, then screaming, "She's disgusting and sick!" After several minutes of that, she finally hands me a zip drive and says we can't go home. She never wants to see or speak to her mother again. She and I go to my office to see what's on the zip.

I find 300 emails and photos. A large percentage have heavy SM kink component and all photos are of an X-rated nature. I lost a few hours after that, don't really remember everything I did, haven't slept much since, so I may not make lot of sense right now.

I called my wife, told her what had happened, told her I thought she should grab some clothes and stuff, spend the night somewhere else till I could get an assessment of the damage. Friday morning, I called therapist to get direction on who my daughter could see. Got to someone at 1:30 that day.

Got a call from wife's sister saying she was very worried about my wife, who was saying she was going to kill herself. We thought she should go to her house for at least the weekend. Wife can't function enough to drive to end of the driveway, let alone 2 hrs. Can we trust her to not try and kill herself on the way there?

I got one of my team to take my truck, put her car on one of the trailers. Had him drive her and her car to her sister's.

Got a call from her other sister, who lives thousands of miles away. She was extremely supportive and completely in the dark as to what had happened.

Apparently she's in a ball crying, or catatonic.

I'm planning to send her mother some or all of the photos, so she can grasp what her granddaughter is going through. In fact, maybe the whole family should see this.

Got to go meet someone about this right now... More later.
 
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