What is trust?

[Faerie Targaryen]

Hi, everyone.

I don't really know what to say about myself for now that isn't already in my profile, so I’m just jumping right in and hope someone will indulge me.

I'm in my first, solid, consistent relationship ever, let alone one in polyamorous practice — and it’s held strong for almost 2 years now. I take that as the main reason I’m only just getting around to really interrogating this concept with this sort of curiosity. A possible close second being youth and naivete.

I’ve found that both my partner and I have found ourselves asking the other “do you trust me?” over the course of this relationship, in that pensive way we get when our journey together arrives at another fork in the road. And “Of course.” or something along those lines isn’t the typical answer. The answer is more often contextual than not.

However, without the crisis context, I asked myself the question, and I realised I sincerely hope I am engaging in good practice of trust, but I’m not sure I know what that is in a raw relational way.

Of course, I’ll check out all the definitions and standard stuff, but I would like to hear what the people who have to practice it everyday have to say. How do you engage in that practice? When have you ever found yourself in a ‘trust’ situation? What were the best parts of such way of living? And, I’m sure, like any practice in reality, there’s some surprises along the way. I would love to hear some “maybe i shouldn't have trusted” situations. Pointers that the present moment’s gift of hindsight can offer.

I’ve enjoyed running to this site on occasion during difficult times. I'm looking forward to actually engaging.

Okay, I go now.

 

[GalaGirl]

For me, trust is built over time and experiences.

I’ve found that both my partner and I have found ourselves asking the other “do you trust me?” over the course of this relationship, in that pensive way we get when our journey together arrives at another fork in the road. And “Of course.” or something along those lines isn’t the typical answer. The answer is more often contextual than not.

That sounds about right to me, because contexts MATTER.

For instance, I might trust an elementary school child to watch the toddler for the 5 minutes it takes to flip the laundry, and trust them to call out if there are issues. I'm not far. I'm right down the hall. But I won't trust them to babysit for the night. As they grow older, I would trust them to babysit for the night. They'd have to take the Red Cross class and all that first.

I might trust a middle schooler to go get their backpack from the car trunk and remind them to lock it back up. But I don't trust them to drive the car until later. They'd have to learn HOW to drive and all that first.

In a relationship, it's the same kind of thing. People spend time together, get to know each other and build trust in small ways first. They show up on time for the date. They return the book you let them borrow. When you see they are a person of their word on the small things, you risk trusting them on medium things, and later, the bigger things.

Someone who does poor behaviors like lying, deceiving, stealing, cheating, etc., break trust with others. They don't always get the chance to rebuild it or get it back. The person they hurt might choose to just end the relationship rather than deal with them again. That person does NOT have to be willing to try again. It might be a dealbreaker for them.

Of course, I’ll check out all the definitions and standard stuff, but I would like to hear what the people who have to practice it everyday have to say. How do you engage in that practice?

I'm consistent in my word and actions. I practice speaking a joyful yes and a firm no. People who know me in real life appreciate that I'm solid. I'm not going to be mean about it, but if I'm not up for something I'm going to say "No, thanks." If I am up for something, I am going to say "Sure, I am up for that." And if I'm uncertain, I'm clear about that too. "I'm going to try to do this much, but this part I'm not sure on. I might or might not make it. It would be best to consider that part a "bonus," so you aren't disappointed if I can't get to it."

When have you ever found yourself in a ‘trust’ situation?

Many times, too many to list.

And, I’m sure, like any practice in reality, there’s some surprises along the way.

No surprises for me. Sometimes surprise for the other person, though.

On some things I'm "1 strike, you're out." That has surprised people in the past who've crossed a line with me, that I just cut them out without talking, without drama. I'm just out and done. I'm generally a kind person, but they mistook my kindness for "soft" or "pushover." I don't feel like getting into details, but I've had cases where people really didn't think I'd just up and leave and cut them out of my life, DESPITE their super poor behavior.

Other times I'm more willing to give chances -- say, 3 strikes before I'm out. But I think it's fair to have a limit of tolerance, and if someone bumps into that, I'm out. I don't want to hang around with people who don't keep their word, or flimsy people. Life too short for that.

What were the best parts of such way of living?

Simplicity. Clarity. Honesty. Reliability.

If I just tell the truth and am honest, I don't have to remember which lie I told to whom. Saves work.

It also weeds out people who can't deal with radical honesty. The people who DO stick around appreciate this character trait and seek me out to tell them the truth because they know I will do it. Again, I'm not going to be MEAN about it, but if you ask me about X, I'm going to tell you honestly what I think. And that will include if I think you are making bad choices.

Galagirl

 

[kdt26417]

Greetings Faerie Targaryen,
Welcome to our forum. Please feel free to lurk, browse, etc.

I think trust is when you know you can count on the other person, you don't need them to prove it. You know you can count on them to keep their word. You know you can count on them to treat you right. Trust is very valuable, and it is so, so hard to get back once it has been lost. Since people tend to turn to Polyamory.com for help when things are off in their relationships, we often see situations where someone has lost their trust in their partner, or where their partner has lost trust in them. It is really hard to think of what advice to give in those situations, it is so hard to regain that trust.

I'm glad you could join us.
Sincerely,
Kevin T., "official greeter"

Notes:

There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!

Please read through the guidelines if you haven't already.

Note: You needn't read every reply to your posts, especially if someone posts in a disagreeable way. Given the size and scope of the site it's hard not to run into the occasional disagreeable person. Please contact the mods if you do (or if you see any spam), and you can block the person if you want.

If you have any questions about the board itself, please private-message a mod and they'll do their best to help.

Welcome aboard!

 

[Bobbi]

For me, trust is built over time and experiences.



That sounds about right to me, because contexts MATTERS.

For instance, I might trust an elementary school child to watch the toddler for the 5 minutes it takes to flip the laundry, and trust them to call out if there are issues. I'm not far. I'm right down the hall. But I won't trust them to babysit for the night. As they grow older, I would trust them to babysit for the night. They'd have to take the Red Cross class and all that first.

I might trust a middle schooler to go get their backpack from the car trunk and remind them to lock it back up. But I don't trust them to drive the car until later. They'd have to learn HOW to drive and all that first.

In a relationship, it's the same kind of thing. People spend time together, get to know each other and build trust in small ways first. They show up on time for the date. They return the book you let them borrow. When you see they are a person of their word on the small things, you risk trusting them on medium things, and later, the bigger things.

Someone who does poor behaviors like lying, deceiving, stealing, cheating, etc., if they break trust with others, they don't always get the chance to rebuild it or get it back. The person they hurt might choose to just end the relationship, rather than deal with them again. That person does NOT have to be willing to try again. It might be a dealbreaker for them.



I'm consistent in my word and actions. I practice speaking a joyful yes and a firm no. People who know me in real life appreciate that I'm solid. I'm not going to be mean about it, but if I'm not up for something I'm going to say "No, thanks." If I am up for something, I am going to say "Sure, I am up for that." And if I'm uncertain, I'm clear about that too. "I'm going to try to do this much, but this part I'm not sure on. I might or might not make it. It would be best to consider that part a "bonus," so you aren't disappointed if I can't get to it."




Many times, too many to list.


No surprises for me. Sometimes surprise for the other person, though.

On some things I'm "1 strike, you're out." That has surprised people in the past who've crossed a line with me, that I just cut them out without talking, without drama. I'm just out and done. I'm generally a kind person, but they mistook my kindness for "soft" or "pushover." I don't feel like getting into details, but I've had cases where people really didn't think I'd just up and leave and cut them out of my life, DESPITE their super poor behavior.

Other times I'm more willing to give chances -- say, 3 strikes before I'm out. But I think it's fair to have a limit of tolerance, and if someone bumps into that, I'm out. I don't want to hang around with people who don't keep their word, or flimsy people. Life too short for that.



Simplicity. Clarity. Honesty. Reliability.

If I just tell the truth and am honest, I don't have to remember which lie I told to whom. Saves work.

It also weeds out people who can't deal with radical honesty. The people who DO stick around appreciate this character trait and seek me out to tell them the truth because they know I will do it. Again, I'm not going to be MEAN about it, but if you ask me about X, I'm going to tell you honestly what I think. And that will include if I think you are making bad choices.

Galagirl

You really clearly covered all of my thoughts as well...so much it's not worth me giving my view because it's like you wrote it for me

 

[GalaGirl]

While I'm glad my writing resonates for you? You can always give your view, Bobbi. People have different life experiences and nuances.

GG

 

[Bobbi]

It is my view, all of it...almost shocking to read how I see it so clearly in someone else's words. Only thing I could add is it also depends on the situation. Some I trust with my life, others not so much. Some I trust with money, others nope. So yes, context is everything. Hell, in most situations if someone says "trust me" that's my number one red flag not to trust them. Someone worth trusting doesn't have to ask for it because they know they've earned it.

 

[Trying2]

Early in my poly journey when my anxious attachment was rearing its ugly head my GF said "You need to trust me". I was never sure what she actually meant. I think she meant "I love you and will never knowingly do anything to hurt you". She loved the thrill and NRE of dating and sex with new men, but always told me "I was her guy" and if she could have just one it would be me.

When she decided to date a man in our friend circle it was very triggering for me.

I was afraid she would find one of her other partners more attractive than me and eventually leave me.

The thing is nobody knows how they will feel in the future, while they may not ever want to hurt a partner, their love and priorities for others may hurt you. Sometimes a new lover will come into your relationship and your partner will find them more appealing, so while they still "love" you, they may seek to change your relationship maybe to just platonic friends. This was not their original intention, but things change and one should expect this in poly relationships.

Trust in NM relationships is a necessary emotional mechanism to attenuate the day-to-day fears that many experience when someone they love is involved sexually/romantically with others. In some ways it is like "faith" in religion - without it, you cannot believe and be involved.

The person asking for your trust often sincerely believes they have total control over their emotions and actions. They cannot imagine a change where they violate your trust because they do not want to hurt you. But often they will because - things change!

In the words of poly guru Jessica Fern - "Poly is an unstable relationship style".

Takeaway - to have any joy in a poly relationship, you must trust your partner's intention not to hurt you. The person asking you to trust them is saying "You are important to me and I will take our relationship into account in my other relationships". But things and feelings in life change and these changes may cause you pain and sorrow even though your partner does not want that to happen.

What has helped in my poly journey is to understand that to a truly polyamorous person, the freedom and autonomy to engage in sexual/romantic relationships as they wish is more important than any one relationship or person in their life. If you can understand this and are comfortable your poly journey will be relatively easy because your expectations will always be tempered by this knowledge.

 

[Trying2]

It is my view, all of it...almost shocking to read how I see it so clearly in someone else's words. Only thing I could add is it also depends on the situation. Some I trust with my life, others not so much. Some I trust with money, others nope. So yes, context is everything. Hell, in most situations if someone says "trust me" that's my number one red flag not to trust them. Someone worth trusting doesn't have to ask for it because they know they've earned it.

I agree with most of what you are saying. The thing with poly relationships is you cannot foresee the effect a new lover will have. While your partner may have earned your "trust" up till now, a new person in their life can change your relationship. Maybe you trusted you were your partner's "primary" or they would always share certain things with you, but the new lover may change that.

 

[Trying2]

For me, trust is built over time and experiences.



That sounds about right to me, because contexts MATTER.

For instance, I might trust an elementary school child to watch the toddler for the 5 minutes it takes to flip the laundry, and trust them to call out if there are issues. I'm not far. I'm right down the hall. But I won't trust them to babysit for the night. As they grow older, I would trust them to babysit for the night. They'd have to take the Red Cross class and all that first.

I might trust a middle schooler to go get their backpack from the car trunk and remind them to lock it back up. But I don't trust them to drive the car until later. They'd have to learn HOW to drive and all that first.

In a relationship, it's the same kind of thing. People spend time together, get to know each other and build trust in small ways first. They show up on time for the date. They return the book you let them borrow. When you see they are a person of their word on the small things, you risk trusting them on medium things, and later, the bigger things.

Someone who does poor behaviors like lying, deceiving, stealing, cheating, etc., break trust with others. They don't always get the chance to rebuild it or get it back. The person they hurt might choose to just end the relationship rather than deal with them again. That person does NOT have to be willing to try again. It might be a dealbreaker for them.



I'm consistent in my word and actions. I practice speaking a joyful yes and a firm no. People who know me in real life appreciate that I'm solid. I'm not going to be mean about it, but if I'm not up for something I'm going to say "No, thanks." If I am up for something, I am going to say "Sure, I am up for that." And if I'm uncertain, I'm clear about that too. "I'm going to try to do this much, but this part I'm not sure on. I might or might not make it. It would be best to consider that part a "bonus," so you aren't disappointed if I can't get to it."




Many times, too many to list.


No surprises for me. Sometimes surprise for the other person, though.

On some things I'm "1 strike, you're out." That has surprised people in the past who've crossed a line with me, that I just cut them out without talking, without drama. I'm just out and done. I'm generally a kind person, but they mistook my kindness for "soft" or "pushover." I don't feel like getting into details, but I've had cases where people really didn't think I'd just up and leave and cut them out of my life, DESPITE their super poor behavior.

Other times I'm more willing to give chances -- say, 3 strikes before I'm out. But I think it's fair to have a limit of tolerance, and if someone bumps into that, I'm out. I don't want to hang around with people who don't keep their word, or flimsy people. Life too short for that.



Simplicity. Clarity. Honesty. Reliability.

If I just tell the truth and am honest, I don't have to remember which lie I told to whom. Saves work.

It also weeds out people who can't deal with radical honesty. The people who DO stick around appreciate this character trait and seek me out to tell them the truth because they know I will do it. Again, I'm not going to be MEAN about it, but if you ask me about X, I'm going to tell you honestly what I think. And that will include if I think you are making bad choices.

Galagirl

Galagirl I am curious how trust factors in when your partner begins a romantic/sexual relationship with a new person? To me trusting a person to be there on time, or pay their half of the rent, etc is on an entirely different level than "emotional trust" if that makes sense?

 

[Ariakas]

I agree with most of what you are saying. The thing with poly relationships is you cannot foresee the effect a new lover will have. While your partner may have earned your "trust" up till now, a new person in their life can change your relationship. Maybe you trusted you were your partner's "primary" or they would always share certain things with you, but the new lover may change that.

This is actually why Jessica Fern gives the space to create your own needs as boundaries and rules to support yourself and relationship.

If you build out your heart and hearts (see Polysecure), and then discuss this with the partner and they agree, the focal point should be on the needs you have being met. You can check in periodically using the RADAR method.

If during the RADAR meeting you find needs changing, or needs not being met, you approach it from the perspective of compromise. In the end, if you can't find a compromise, then it's time to rejig or reevaluate the relationship.

Jessica Fern also talks about... I forget the words... ownership of "things." I will use a simple example. In BDSM, I am a top. I perform certain things for both partners that I treasure. However, they aren't unique to us. If they find other partners, I don't want to claim ownership of flogging (one of my favs) if they are going to a show. It would be incredibly difficult to lock down flogging, considering how common it is.

I see this pop up in myself with pictures. If someone sends me a sexy picture, I love this. If I then see it on Fetlife, was the picture for me, her or everyone? I can feel a little less special. My partners make sure I know things that are special for me. And I in turn do the same thing.

Nesting partners inevitably have more time, etc., which she also speaks to.

 

[Ariakas]

Galagirl I am curious how trust factors in when your partner begins a romantic/sexual relationship with a new person? To me trusting a person to be there on time, or pay their half of the rent, etc is on an entirely different level than "emotional trust" if that makes sense?

Can you expand on what aspect of emotional trust you mean?

Transactional trust is easy for the most part. As long as both folks are adults and responsible.

Are you asking about how a relationship can change into a loving relationship that may be equal to your love?

In my group we never put limits on how the other person would feel. And if one of my partners says "well this won't be love it's a FWB". I quickly remind them that love can't be controlled and it may happen. As long as my needs are met that love won't take away from anyone else's love

My partner A actually told me yesterday it's more like she has a full heart for everyone she loves and each love is unique. This doesn't mirror how mine works but I appreciated the visual. Haha

As per the other post my needs being met are what matter to me. So as long as those are met.. her love can expand as much as time allows. She has limited spoons so she self limits and she is hyper mature about nre (annoyingly so.. I love the wave and lust.. but her maturity likely stopped our relationship from exploding like other brw infused fuck fests I have had)

 

[Bobbi]

The thing with poly relationships is you cannot foresee the effect a new lover will have.

This is life though. Simply put, a new lover is change. All change has an effect on a relationship that you cannot foresee. A move to a new area, a new job, having a child (each one), family member dying. It really isn't the romantic aspect that is the problem, it's the change. Monogamous people think another lover could ruin what they have but it isn't actually that. The change is actually what did it.

In poly the act of falling in love or having sex with others isn't a direct cause. Being treated differently may show a person what they dislike about a relationship. How their partner treats their new lover or them may have an effect. Things may be brought to light that were previously shoved under the rug. These things can be illuminated by a new friend, therapy or other deep self reflection too. You don't need a new lover to experience this.

There is a perceived assumption that certain changes are less risky than others. It's a fallacy.

While your partner may have earned your "trust" up till now, a new person in their life can change your relationship

As many a plethora of other changes. To fear one thing over another might be natural, but it's misplaced.

Maybe you trusted you were your partner's "primary" or they would always share certain things with you, but the new lover may change that.

Again, anything could change that. Usually it's because the relationship isn't as good as you though it was. Relationships don't end because of poly. Poly might set a magnifying glass on your relationship issues, but I guarantee the problems would be there even if poly wasn't a factor.

 

[Faerie Targaryen]

Greetings Faerie Targaryen,
Welcome to our forum. Please feel free to lurk, browse, etc.

I think trust is when you know you can count on the other person, you don't need them to prove it. You know you can count on them to keep their word. You know you can count on them to treat you right. Trust is very valuable, and it is so, so hard to get back once it has been lost. Since people tend to turn to Polyamory.com for help when things are off in their relationships, we often see situations where someone has lost their trust in their partner, or where their partner has lost trust in them. It is really hard to think of what advice to give in those situations, it is so hard to regain that trust.

I'm glad you could join us.
Sincerely,
Kevin T., "official greeter"

Notes:

There's a *lot* of good info in Golden Nuggets. Have a look!

Please read through the guidelines if you haven't already.

Note: You needn't read every reply to your posts, especially if someone posts in a disagreeable way. Given the size and scope of the site it's hard not to run into the occasional disagreeable person. Please contact the mods if you do (or if you see any spam), and you can block the person if you want.

If you have any questions about the board itself, please private-message a mod and they'll do their best to help.

Welcome aboard!

Gracias, Kevin!

 

[Faerie Targaryen]

Hi, @Bobbi . Thank you to you and @GalaGirl for your contributions. I agree wholeheartedly with most of what I’ve read so far.

Hell, in most situations if someone says "trust me" that's my number one red flag not to trust them. Someone worth trusting doesn't have to ask for it because they know they've earned it.

I've also realised that being asked to trust a person has quite the opposite effect on me. I might not have been distrustful until I’m particularly told to exercise trust.

 

[Faerie Targaryen]

so while they still "love" you, they may seek to change your relationship maybe to just platonic friends. This was not their original intention, but things change and one should expect this in poly relationships.

I think that possibilities like this play a big part in why I’m so anxious about polyamory practice. While I understand on a conceptual level, the reality of such an instance, even if I do my best to expect it, is a little harder than is simply being conveyed here. How do you navigate such a situation should it arise? Also, I believe I would feel like my trust has been violated should my relationship (status) be de-escalated like that, and I doubt I’ll be able to continue as platonic friends unless we both happen to want that at the same time. I'm still new at this practice, and I must confess, I’m a little averse to how probable this is, though I can understand it.

But often they will because - things change!

Reading this line, especially since it was already said in the earlier parts of this reply has opened my eyes to a possible trigger i might have around this phrase and practicing polyamory lol. But given how much it keeps coming back to me, well lol. It is well. Perhaps I don't deal very well with change. And it would seem that change is a fundamental of polyamory. I can't say I’m optimistic about this realisation that I have no choice but to acknowledge at this point.

the freedom and autonomy to engage in sexual/romantic relationships as they wish is more important than any one relationship or person in their life.

This is another interesting concept i might need to take a minute to engage with myself.

Thank you for your insight @Trying2

 

[Faerie Targaryen]

There is a perceived assumption that certain changes are less risky than others. It's a fallacy.

This perspective seems a little more…acceptable as it is a reality that the heights of monogamous relationships cannot save you from. Thank you, @Bobbi !

 

[GalaGirl]

Galagirl, I am curious how trust factors in when your partner begins a romantic/sexual relationship with a new person. To me, trusting a person to be there on time, or pay their half of the rent, etc., is on an entirely different level than "emotional trust," if that makes sense.

I think it's pretty much the same with emotional trust. Over time, I can choose to open up more, share more, be vulnerable, be authentic, etc. And in seeing that the partner doesn't wig out over the small stuff when sharing emotional intimacy or mental intimacy, that they are accepting and supportive, I can trust them with the medium-size things, then the bigger things, etc. I can feel emotionally safe with them.

I also know I'm in a privileged time/space. I'm older. My spouse and I have been together decades. We are pretty much done raising kids, so there aren't the worries of that anymore. We both have incomes, so there isn't the worry of being a dependent spouse. We've already done a lot of the "hard" stuff of life and come out the other side. So there aren't the worries of "Is my partner solid, or do they flake out when things get hard?"

We don't have each other or our relationship up on a pedestal. We each have our strengths and weaknesses. The strengths are good, the weaknesses are ok enough/livable/not dealbreakers.

We don't want to break up, but we've talked it out, because people DO change over time. So if one of us did want to break up, we know how to handle that and how we'd want to be as exes. It sounds counterintuitive, but I think couples who can calmly discuss how to break up have a better shot at staying together. They aren't afraid to have hard conversations or do healthy conflict resolution. And that is part of building that emotional trust. Showing up, being PRESENT and not being an emotional flake.

I'm generally a kind person, but I also don't put up with stupid. I have strong personal boundaries and I'm ok cutting people out of my life if they get wacky.

I'm not a young adult who is new or inexperienced who might get caught up in weird and the struggle to TRUST THEMSELVES. Like knowing they have to end it, but struggling with, "But I love them! And what if I never find someone else?" kind of thinking. Giving too many second chances or turning into a door mat.

I think sometimes trusting oneself is a problem. The person doesn't TRUST THEMSELVES to get themselves out of weird. Sort of like they're going around meek and mild, "Don't hurt me, please," or something. Putting themselves at the mercy of the partner and thinking that self sacrifice is somehow "showing love" or something.

Whereas, I move in the world like:

• "Are you worth the time/energy to start developing something with?"
• "Alright, I'm going to invest a bit here and see. But I'm not putting up with stupid. And I know I can get outta here if you do turn out stupid. I know how to cope."

DH doesn't think he wants to be with anyone else at this time, but if he changes his mind on that and wants to, I'm ok with it. What would be the worst that would happen? He prefers them to me? Alright. Then we'd break up peacefully and figure out the next chapter of life. Would I be upset? Sure. But it wouldn't kill me. We'd just do the emergency plan we've already sorted out. I'd trust him to be decent about it and he trusts me to be decent about it.

On the flip side, it's been a while, and few and far between, but I never promised him monogamy. He's seen me as a hinge. He's fine with it. Again, benefit of age and being together this long. We know each other well.

With a NEW person, how I'd feel about them dating someone else after me, like an untried hinge, well, I'd get to see, wouldn't I? I'd get to learn about this side of them.

They either handle themselves well and are a balanced, healthy hinge, or they handle themselves poorly and are a messy hinge.

In response, I can ask for changes. I can keep dating them or break up with them. I have agency, autonomy. I can make choices.

Galagirl

 

[Trying2]

Thanks for your reply. It sounds like, in the end, trusting yourself to extricate from relationships that don't work well for you is what you are advocating. You trust a partner to treat you well and not "do stupid," and if they can't do this, you leave.

I have anxious attachment issues (my problem, I know). My GF (we don't live together) enjoys new men in her life frequently, which was not a huge problem for me, although anxious attachment is difficult when there are frequent partner additions, especially since she was my only partner, and finding new partners for me is extremely difficult (cis/het married).

When she decided to date a mutual friend from our circle, in addition to it being very triggering (comparison), it was incredibly awkward. I think this would be an example of "doing stupid." There are so many other men who she could easily date. She should have turned this one down. When I expressed how difficult was for me to have her dating a close friend, she said "I needed to trust her."

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Ariakas]

I would examine why you are concerned with her dating in your circle, figure out what about it bothers you and work through the reality of that situation

In "poly" in general.. the circles are very closed loops. It's almost impossible to find folks who aren't with ex's, current friends, ex friends etc. So her behaviors isn't particularly toxic or out of whack.

 

[Magdlyn]

When she decided to date a mutual friend from our circle, in addition to it being very triggering (comparison)...

You'd compare yourself more to a friend as a dating potential person than you would to a stranger? Interesting. Why, do you think?

... it was incredibly awkward. I think this would be an example of "doing stupid." There are so many other men who she could easily date. She should have turned this one down. When I expressed how difficult was for me to have her dating a close friend, she said "I needed to trust her."

What are your thoughts on this?

I don't know why she'd make it be about "trust." Many of us would prefer our partners not try to date our close friends. The risk is if they break up acrimoniously, we might feel forced to choose sides, and lose the gf or the friend!

I would examine why you are concerned with her dating in your circle, figure out what about it bothers you and work through the reality of that situation.

See above.

In "poly," in general, the circles are very closed loops. It's almost impossible to find folks who aren't with ex's, current friends, ex friends etc. So her behaviors isn't particularly toxic or out of whack.

That's your experience, Ari! Your poly circle is a very self-conscious group of people who ID as poly/swingers/kinksters. I guess I am not a joiner. I don't even know if there is a "poly community" in my area with people who go around dating each other. I just date who I like.

I guess I've run into groups when I was living part time with Pixi in Boston... You could, if you want, go to munches with poly/kinky people.

And now, my bf Aries is in a small FB group with some ENM types (in that uncomfortable place between poly and swingers...), which is linked to a larger New England group. It sounds very gossipy and awful to me. This particular small group has just had a "predator" type going around dating/fucking several women in the group, somehow secretly (for a while). One of them even got engaged to him! Once they all found out, they all got mad at each other, and some quit the group, instead of just blaming this player/fuckboi guy. Poor Aries is on the sidelines just watching the trainwreck. Some even wondered if he were a predator when he joined, just because they'd had issues with this other guy!

Miss me with that kind of silliness! I'll just live my quiet life with my N-shaped network. Aries is new to poly, so he's openminded to this group. That's his right, but it sounds almost incestuous to me. Of course, I consent to him learning what he can from it all.

I guess I "trust" him. haha

Anyway, I would prefer my partners don't date my closest friends or my family members. That would just feel weird.