Wife is going on cruise with her boyfriend

Pippa

Member
My wife Dawn has been with her new boyfriend about 8 weeks. We are all happy. Dawn and I live in our house. She sees Karl about twice a week. Usually he comes over on Tuesdays. I cook and he stays over. Then on Fridays she stays with him. I’m really happy with that and so are Dawn and Karl.

I’m slightly hurt, though, as last Tuesday he surprised us both. He had booked a 10 day cruise for himself and Dawn this July. At first I was happy and totally agreed with it, but now, as the holiday approaches, I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday. She’s buying all new sexy clothes and things. I’m actually getting jealous.

What do I do, sit on my hands and deal with it, or say I’m feeling left out?
 
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Hi Pip

That sounds quite enviable that they are off on such a big holiday, and so soon. Obviously as this is their relationship there's not really any benefit to say you're feeling left out of that particular activity, but you and Dawn could plan something of your own for a time that's convenient to the both of you and it will give you something to look forward to. This would be a proactive action rather than a reactive one, which I think is probably healthier all around in the long term.

Out of curiosity, are you and Karl becoming good friends? Since you cook on the nights he's at your place, is that so you are included in the quite literal "kitchen table poly" and was this also an intentional choice or has it been taken for granted? Does Dawn share the cooking with you the rest of the week? Does Karl bring anything to Tuesdays?

Do you and Dawn have deliberate date nights without Karl? What opportunities does she have to buy new stuff for being with you? What exciting things do you do together? If these have waned a little with the mundanity of everyday life, how could you address that positively rather than just telling her that you are envious of her and Karl's relationship?

They are obviously in the early stages of the relationship and everything is pretty new and exciting right now - remember that this is normal, eventually evens out (but can take a while), and you don't have to be witness to it all the time. You can let her know that you don't want to know so often about her planning and purchases. Suggest she uses one of her other friends for that outlet.
 
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I'm sorry you struggle.

at first I was happy and totally agreed with it but now as the holiday approaches I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday an she’s buying all new sexy clothes And things I’m actually getting jealous, what do I do sit on my hands and deal with it or say I’m feeling left out

I'm having trouble understanding this sentence because it's long and maybe not enough punctuation.

Are you saying something like...
  • At first, I was happy and totally agreed with it.
  • But now as the holiday approaches, I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday.
  • She's buying all new sexy clothes.
  • And thinks I'm actually getting jealous. (<-- Dawn thinks you are jealous? )
  • What do I do? Sit on my hands and deal with it? (<-- You want to say nothing and just deal with Dawn thinking you are jealous with silence?)
  • Or say I'm feeling left out? (<-- You want to explain what you actually feel to Dawn? Not feeling jealous. Feeling left out.)
Is it something like that?
 
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Hi, welcome to the group. I edited your post to add punctuation to make it more readable.

No, you do not have to sit on your hands and just suck up your feelings. That's not the best way to be open and intimate with Dawn. I see nothing wrong with saying, "Wow! I'm a bit envious of your big trip. You're going to look so pretty for Karl in all your new clothes." I'd expect to feel heard by my partner then, and work on solutions to make us both feel comfortable and secure.

Evie has offered the suggestion that you plan a trip for you and Dawn for later in the summer. That is one way to deal with your envy.

However, I have a question. How long have your two had an open or polyamorous relationship? I remember when I was new to poly with my current partner (back in 2009) even a long weekend with her new bf of just a few weeks seemed like a lot for me to handle. She also broke the news to me suddenly that he'd planned this weekend for them without having a prior discussion about how she (or I) would feel about it.

Many poly couples ease into taking longer trips with newer partners. Personally, we can't afford to take ten day trips very often. So if I do want to take a trip of that length, I'd prefer to take it with my long-term nesting partner. I assume your wife does not work outside the home, or she gets enough paid vacation time from her job to be able to take a ten day trip with Karl and also a ten day trip with you?

I am all about balance in my life. If my partner was taking a ten day trip with her bf, I'd be damn envious if we couldn't take a trip of a similar length, or at least two or three trips to add up to ten days.

And just because I've been sexually assaulted several times, and made to feel uncomfortable in general around strange men all my life (fact of life as a woman), I am not sure I'd take a trip of that length with a guy I'd only known for two months! I'd probably keep trips with a partner of less than a year to a three-day long-weekend type of thing, at most.

So, that's my take on it, from the limited information you shared. Feel free to add more context. :)
 
I'm sorry you struggle.



I'm having trouble understanding this sentence because it's long and maybe not enough punctuation.

Are you saying something like...
  • At first, I was happy and totally agreed with it.
  • But now as the holiday approaches, I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday.
  • She's buying all new sexy clothes.
  • And thinks I'm actually getting jealous. (<-- Dawn thinks you are jealous? )
  • What do I do? Sit on my hands and deal with it? (<-- You want to say nothing and just deal with Dawn thinking you are jealous with silence?)
  • Or say I'm feeling left out? (<-- You want to explain what you actually feel to Dawn? Not feeling jealous. Feeling left out.)
Is it something like that?

I think he (she? they?) is saying she is buying new clothes and things like that and he (she/they?) is feeling jealous. This natural. When we see someone doing the work to please another partner, it can stir those feelings, especially when you are a long time partner who probably no longer gets that treatment. So, I think he (she/they) is wondering what to do.

I would say you should express your feelings. That doesn't mean Dawn has to change anything. But keeping it in is probably going to lead to resentment. It's OK to be jelous/envious. It's OK to say so. In fact, in many cases, this helps our partners to be aware and adjust to help us. Your wife might not know what she is doing is causing you this feeling, especially since you said you were happy about it at first. Have you told her how you feel now?

One of the common misperceptions about compersion is that it is opposed to jealousy. That's not true. When my wife does some things with other men, I can feel both. The compersion is usually (but not always!) stronger, but they can exist together. This can happen with other partners too. We just have feelings. How you act on them is what matters. Are you thinking about asking her not to go? Or do you just want her to tone down doing all this in front of you? Or maybe neither. Maybe you just want to know how to work through all these feels! There are many ways to do that and lots of resources on how to deal with envy/jealousy.

As for trips, that's a pretty long one to spring on someone only 8 weeks in, for sure! Of course, cruises often have a length of a week or so, and that's just part of how they work. There ARE shorter cruises, of course, but many people think if you are going to do something like that, may as well do it right! But I'm surprised they didn't start with a shorter trip. For example, my newest partner and I fell in love very quickly, and we are also going on a trip in July. But we started dating in March (three months ago) and our trip is only for a couple of nights. It's like a trial trip, almost. Also, my wife and I travel a lot. So, while she's a bit envious (as she would be if I went on ANY trip with someone else without her), but it's not a big deal. If I went on a 10 day cruise? She'd be envious for sure! I'm not saying she'd stop me, but she'd definitely be feeling envy, as would I if she did that. I think this is pretty normal as a feeling.

The sexy clothes/excitement is part of NRE, which is also normal, but I'm sorry you are struggling with it.
 
Hi Pip,

I think it is okay to say that you feel left out. Dawn is immersed in her NRE, and isn't thinking about your needs. You will have to speak up for yourself, if you want her to notice you. What are the chances you could go on a cruise with her (after this cruise with her boyfriend)?

I have some links for you, for tips on dealing with jealousy.
Hopefully this thread has been helpful to you so far.
Regards,
Kevin T.
 
My wife Dawn has been with her new boyfriend about 8 weeks. We are all happy. Dawn and I live in our house. She sees Karl about twice a week. Usually he comes over on Tuesdays. I cook and he stays over. Then on Fridays she stays with him. I’m really happy with that and so are Dawn and Karl.

I’m slightly hurt, though, as last Tuesday he surprised us both. He had booked a 10 day cruise for himself and Dawn this July. At first I was happy and totally agreed with it, but now, as the holiday approaches, I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday. She’s buying all new sexy clothes and things. I’m actually getting jealous.

What do I do, sit on my hands and deal with it, or say I’m feeling left out?
Yeah I see what you mean, even though my wife and Karl have been having this sexual relationship for about 9 weeks they have known rack other for about 3 years, I’m really happy for them both and she is like a new woman and I suppose she’s now like the woman I married 25 years ago and I’m being silly I just need to man up and accept he makes her feel good
 
Hi Pip

That sounds quite enviable that they are off on such a big holiday, and so soon. Obviously as this is their relationship there's not really any benefit to say you're feeling left out of that particular activity, but you and Dawn could plan something of your own for a time that's convenient to the both of you and it will give you something to look forward to. This would be a proactive action rather than a reactive one, which I think is probably healthier all around in the long term.

Out of curiosity, are you and Karl becoming good friends? Since you cook on the nights he's at your place, is that so you are included in the quite literal "kitchen table poly" and was this also an intentional choice or has it been taken for granted? Does Dawn share the cooking with you the rest of the week? Does Karl bring anything to Tuesdays?

Do you and Dawn have deliberate date nights without Karl? What opportunities does she have to buy new stuff for being with you? What exciting things do you do together? If these have waned a little with the mundanity of everyday life, how could you address that positively rather than just telling her that you are envious of her and Karl's relationship?

They are obviously in the early stages of the relationship and everything is pretty new and exciting right now - remember that this is normal, eventually evens out (but can take a while), and you don't have to be witness to it all the time. You can let her know that you don't want to know so often about her planning and purchases. Suggest she uses one of her other friends for that outlet.
Thanks for your reply. I agree with what you say. Dawn is hopelessly in love with Karl and I’m just a little jealous, that’s all. She cuddles up to me 5 out of 7 nights a week and says she loves me, so that’s good enough for me. I stupidly suggested that she stay with him for 2 nights on the trot at the weekends, and she’s said she would like that, and Karl has agreed. So now she’s 3 nights in his bed and 4 in ours. I think, eventually, and this does frighten me, she will leave me for him.
 
I'm sorry you struggle.



I'm having trouble understanding this sentence because it's long and maybe not enough punctuation.

Are you saying something like...
  • At first, I was happy and totally agreed with it.
  • But now as the holiday approaches, I see how excited Dawn is about her holiday.
  • She's buying all new sexy clothes.
  • And thinks I'm actually getting jealous. (<-- Dawn thinks you are jealous? )
  • What do I do? Sit on my hands and deal with it? (<-- You want to say nothing and just deal with Dawn thinking you are jealous with silence?)
  • Or say I'm feeling left out? (<-- You want to explain what you actually feel to Dawn? Not feeling jealous. Feeling left out.)
Is it something like that?
Yeah I am jealous on how things are going. She is obsessed with him and i am too frightened to intervene. Not only the cruise, as that upset me (jealousy again), but she’s said they are going to a wedding together in September in York. I suppose it’s the fact I wasn’t consulted. I fear I’m losing her, even though she tells me every day everything is ok. xxx
 
A 10 day cruise after dating only 8 weeks is a lot. I'm with Mag on that.

Then this wedding in Sept?

Does she work? Is she using up all her vacation days on him? What about spending any of them with you?

Is her NRE (New Relationship Energy) kinda taking over everything? Is this poly hell stuff on top of feeling jealous?

https://www.kathylabriola.com/articles/are-you-in-poly-hell

Maybe you two can read that together?

Galagirl
 
I feel you.

I think we all go through this step. When my wife goes on these "honeymoon relationship" trips I rely on what rituals I have built for her. A honeymoon relationship is usually just NEW and exciting....

The rituals I have help me condition myself to enjoy the sexual longing for her. I have material, like sexy pictures and a little shrine to her. I visit it when I wake and when I goo to sleep. She'll call me and ask me if I thought about her, or if I looked at her sexy pictures so I know she is thinking of me too. I also repair or work on things for her, like I clean her car, clean and repair shoes (she has a shoe closet that I built for her that holds 60 pairs!) and repair things for her. I dust her shoe closet or work on her projects.

Think of her as your queen, and you are a knight. When she gets back, be extremely grateful and show her your happiness for her happiness. She will begin to believe in her role as your queen. It works with really confident Alpha females. I hope Dawn is not neurotic or lacking confidence because that is when I feel most of the trouble for the relationship will come from.
 
A 10 day cruise after dating only 8 weeks is a lot. I'm with Mag on that.

Then this wedding in Sept?

Does she work? Is she using up all her vacation days on him? What about spending any of them with you?

Is her NRE (New Relationship Energy) kinda taking over everything? Is this poly hell stuff on top of feeling jealous?

https://www.kathylabriola.com/articles/are-you-in-poly-hell

Maybe you two can read that together?

Galagirl
I’m just being a silly old fool. She has 35 days of holiday a year. We are both gong for a week to France in August. As for the wedding, that’s only 2 nights away. It’s just I’m suffering from jealousy at the moment. Everything she does with him is better, especially sex. He’s apparently the only man that can make her climax through intercourse. He’s got a fitter body, he’s got a nicer car, he takes her to better places, he’s teetotal. He runs, he makes her laugh.

She loves him more than she loves me. She doesn’t say it. I know it. Our life is the same but hers and Karl’s is on a different level. She always has am excuse not to have sex with me. But when he comes over on a Tuesday they are at it all night. I like listening to her orgasm as I know she’s enjoying it and I know she deserves it. I would love a bit of the action.
 
I’m just being a silly old fool, she has 35 days holiday a year and we are both gong for a week in france in august and as for the wedding that’s only 2 nights away it’s just I’m suffering from jealousy at the moment, everything she does with him is better, especially sex he’s apparently the only man that can make her climax through intercourse he’s got a fitter body he’s got a nicer car he takes her to better places he’s T total he runs he makes her laugh and she loves him more than she loves me she doesn’t say it I know it our life is the same but hers and Karl’s is on a different level, she always has a excuse not to have sex with me but when he comes over on a Tuesday they are at it all night I like listening to her orgasm as I know she’s enjoying it and I know she deserves it, I would love a bit of the action
Work on the sex with her. You'll have to change it up, but good sex is a learned behavior, don't worry about the sex she has with others, feel out what she likes and have fun and have great sex with her.
 
I’m just being a silly old fool, she has 35 days holiday a year and we are both gong for a week in france in august and as for the wedding that’s only 2 nights away it’s just I’m suffering from jealousy at the moment, everything she does with him is better, especially sex he’s apparently the only man that can make her climax through intercourse he’s got a fitter body he’s got a nicer car he takes her to better places he’s T total he runs he makes her laugh and she loves him more than she loves me she doesn’t say it I know it our life is the same but hers and Karl’s is on a different level, she always has a excuse not to have sex with me but when he comes over on a Tuesday they are at it all night I like listening to her orgasm as I know she’s enjoying it and I know she deserves it, I would love a bit of the action

You aren't a fool. Jealousy/envy is normal. How we deal with it is what matters. You are feeling replaced a bit, and with NRE there can be a bit of that. But you also have a history with her that Karl doesn't have. That matters to most people, and she's still coming back to you. I think one of the challenges that I had to confront in order to embrace poly more fully was reminding myself of the ways in which I'm good for my partners. Polyamory allows us to meet different needs with different people. That's worth embracing! But society has taught us that it's only real love if one person can meet ALL your needs. It's bullshit. We don't do that with friends. Even if we have a 'best friend', we still have others, and it's very rare that our best friend satisfies ALL our friendship needs and desires. So, we have other friends, too...the ones we game with, the ones we workout with, or meet for lunch or invite on a trip...or whatever. We don't have to be everything to each of our partners. They stay with us because they love us, and loving ourselves is the best thing we can do to maintain that and give them the best chance of loving us.
 
You aren't a fool. Jealousy/envy is normal. How we deal with it is what matters. You are feeling replaced a bit, and with NRE there can be a bit of that. But you also have a history with her that Karl doesn't have. That matters to most people, and she's still coming back to you. I think one of the challenges that I had to confront in order to embrace poly more fully was reminding myself of the ways in which I'm good for my partners. Polyamory allows us to meet different needs with different people. That's worth embracing! But society has taught us that it's only real love if one person can meet ALL your needs. It's bullshit. We don't do that with friends. Even if we have a 'best friend', we still have others, and it's very rare that our best friend satisfies ALL our friendship needs and desires. So, we have other friends, too...the ones we game with, the ones we workout with, or meet for lunch or invite on a trip...or whatever. We don't have to be everything to each of our partners. They stay with us because they love us, and loving ourselves is the best thing we can do to maintain that and give them the best chance of loving us.
Thanks for that. It makes sense, as we do things as a couple they don’t, like walking the dog and going to the local for a pint. So I get it. It’s just that we never have sex anymore and if I get a hard on, it only lasts a minute. I know I disappoint her. But as you said, there’s more to life than sex. She’s just left to go to his for her Friday night of fun, as she calls it. She’s going to a BBQ of the couple whose wedding she’s going to in September. It’s about an hour drive away. She just said they are staying at the Holiday Inn near where the BBQ is. I didn’t show it, but I hate that they are acting more like a couple than we do. I thought she was just going over to his for a pizza. And this is the bit I don’t like: she already posted about the BBQ in Stratford tonight on Facebook.
 
Thanks for that, it makes sense as we do things as a couple they don’t like walking the dog and going to the local for a pint so I get it, it’s just we never have sex anymore and if I get a hard on it only lasts a minute I know I disappoint her but as you’ve said there’s more to life than sex, she’s just left to go to his for her Friday night of fun as she calls it, she’s going to a BBQ of the couple who’s wedding she’s going to in September it’s about a hours drive away and she just said they are staying at the holiday inn near where the BBQ is so I didn’t show it but I hate that they are acting more like a couple than we do, I thought she was just going over to his for a pizza,
And this is the bit I don’t like she’s already posted BBQ in Stratford tonight on face book
It’s the other people finding out I find hard I feel like a failure 😞
 
You aren't a fool. Jealousy/envy is normal. How we deal with it is what matters. You are feeling replaced a bit, and with NRE there can be a bit of that. But you also have a history with her that Karl doesn't have. That matters to most people, and she's still coming back to you. I think one of the challenges that I had to confront in order to embrace poly more fully was reminding myself of the ways in which I'm good for my partners. Polyamory allows us to meet different needs with different people. That's worth embracing! But society has taught us that it's only real love if one person can meet ALL your needs. It's bullshit. We don't do that with friends. Even if we have a 'best friend', we still have others, and it's very rare that our best friend satisfies ALL our friendship needs and desires. So, we have other friends, too...the ones we game with, the ones we workout with, or meet for lunch or invite on a trip...or whatever. We don't have to be everything to each of our partners. They stay with us because they love us, and loving ourselves is the best thing we can do to maintain that and give them the best chance of loving us.
That's the reality of polyamory in a nutshell. One person can't be all things to one other person. Even if it can seem like that during NRE, when your hormones are going wild and everything is heightened, the new person eventually becomes just another person in your life. Partner A provides the X factor, and Partner B provides the Y factor, whatever those particular attributes might be.

If Partner A (the first partner) feels left out, neglected, taken for granted, of course they should speak up. There are so many articles out there about NRE and how to handle it to avoid hurting or even losing your longer-term partner. But someone in NRE might forget to do those things. They are temporarily insane. There are things Partner A can do (as Craig Rudd suggested) and there are things the partner feeling NRE for someone else should also be doing. It's just downright rude to neglect your first partner for the new and shiny person.

In this case, I am not sure that Dawn has actually been neglecting Pip. But just the same, he is comparing himself to Karl. And Dawn is sharing TMI with Karl. He shouldn't have it thrown in his face that Karl can make her climax during intercourse, for example.

And if Pip is feeling that Karl is fitter than him, sometimes in poly our partner's other partner can inspire us to hit the gym. Yes, it's competitive, but men do tend to be competitive. And working out, getting healthier, is good for you. Pip might have been taking Dawn for granted and letting himself get into bad shape, neglect grooming, etc.

How often do we see the trope of getting that "revenge body" after being dumped by a long term partner? In this case, Pip is not being dumped, but he can work out and get in better shape anyway. That's one thing Pip can change.

I don't know if being a teetolaler is important, unless Pip is overly indulging in alcohol, which is making him less attractive socially, or helping to pack on a few unwanted pounds.

As for the 35 vacation days, I am sure all of us people from the US are entirely envious of that! But Karl and Dawn's 10 day cruise and 2 day wedding, that's 12 days, and Pip's only planning 7 days of vacation with Dawn. Maybe you should plan another 5-day trip as well, or even longer.

Pip seems to have low self esteem. Is that right, Pip? You assume Karl is better for Dawn in every way, and she'll start spending more and more time with him and eventually leave you? Was your relationship in trouble even before she and Karl started dating?
 
Thanks for that. It makes sense, as we do things as a couple they don’t, like walking the dog and going to the local for a pint. So I get it. It’s just that we never have sex anymore and if I get a hard on, it only lasts a minute. I know I disappoint her.

Oh! Is this one reason you guys opened your marriage? Because Dawn was disappointed and not being sexually satisfied because of your erectile disfunction? Have you seen a doctor for that?

How long have you been practicing polyamory anyway? You sound like newbies. You first said everyone was happy, but now I see you aren't happy at all. :(
But as you said, there’s more to life than sex. She’s just left to go to his for her Friday night of fun, as she calls it. She’s going to a BBQ of the couple whose wedding she’s going to in September. It’s about an hour drive away. She just said they are staying at the Holiday Inn near where the BBQ is. I didn’t show it, but I hate that they are acting more like a couple than we do. I thought she was just going over to his for a pizza. And this is the bit I don’t like: she already posted about the BBQ in Stratford tonight on Facebook.
So you guys are "out" to all her FB friends as being in an open or poly relationship, but you're not really comfortable with that? You need to speak up and tell her these things. Open communication is the most important thing.
 
Agreed. Being 'out' about poly is a choice you should both have made together. I would love to be open about all my relationships. My partners have reasons why they don't want that (mostly dealing with family relationships). I honor their wishes. Maybe that can change one day. That would be great! But that would be a MUTUAL decision.
 
That's the reality of polyamory in a nutshell. One person can't be all things to one other person. Even if it can seem like that during NRE, when your hormones are going wild and everything is heightened, the new person eventually becomes just another person in your life. Partner A provides the X factor, and Partner B provides the Y factor, whatever those particular attributes might be.

If Partner A (the first partner) feels left out, neglected, taken for granted, of course they should speak up. There are so many articles out there about NRE and how to handle it to avoid hurting or even losing your longer-term partner. But someone in NRE might forget to do those things. They are temporarily insane. There are things Partner A can do (as Craig Rudd suggested) and there are things the partner feeling NRE for someone else should also be doing. It's just downright rude to neglect your first partner for the new and shiny person.

In this case, I am not sure that Dawn has actually been neglecting Pip. But just the same, he is comparing himself to Karl. And Dawn is sharing TMI with Karl. He shouldn't have it thrown in his face that Karl can make her climax during intercourse, for example.

And if Pip is feeling that Karl is fitter than him, sometimes in poly our partner's other partner can inspire us to hit the gym. Yes, it's competitive, but men do tend to be competitive. And working out, getting healthier, is good for you. Pip might have been taking Dawn for granted and letting himself get into bad shape, neglect grooming, etc.

How often do we see the trope of getting that "revenge body" after being dumped by a long term partner? In this case, Pip is not being dumped, but he can work out and get in better shape anyway. That's one thing Pip can change.

I don't know if being a teetolaler is important, unless Pip is overly indulging in alcohol, which is making him less attractive socially, or helping to pack on a few unwanted pounds.

As for the 35 vacation days, I am sure all of us people from the US are entirely envious of that! But Karl and Dawn's 10 day cruise and 2 day wedding, that's 12 days, and Pip's only planning 7 days of vacation with Dawn. Maybe you should plan another 5-day trip as well, or even longer.

Pip seems to have low self esteem. Is that right, Pip? You assume Karl is better for Dawn in every way, and she'll start spending more and more time with him and eventually leave you? Was your relationship in trouble even before she and Karl started dating?
Our marriage was fine and still is. We have been like this since 2012. Dawn has had several lovers over the years and they've always been casual affairs. I think it’s me that’s being silly. Karl is madly in love with Dawn and it’s that I struggle with. Before they started dating they knew each other from work. She’s still with him in Stratford at the moment, but she will be back later and I’ll apologise for being jealous.
 
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