Unicorns & Unicorn Hunters - Merged Threads, General Discussion
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WhatHappened
Active member
WhatHappened
Active member
I seem to recall a glowing post here on this forum about the great success of the poster's triad. When asked, it was about 48-hours strong.
Natja
New member
Words...fail...me....
YouAreHere
Well-known member
Well, sure. On Earth.
In Narnia time, that's what... one year? Two?
("I'll bet they're closeted too...")
WhatHappened
Active member
Well, sure. On Earth.
In Narnia time, that's what... one year? Two?
("I'll bet they're closeted too...")
Wayyyy more than that. Didn't they spend years in Narnia and show up back on Earth seconds later? So 48 hours in Narnia time is like a century or two.
I suppose the only thing about that quote (in the OP) is that there were only two lines, so there wasn't enough space to talk about the complications, the discussions, the valuing of everyone's essential humanity (and human essence), the ups, the downs, the in-betweens, the not-that-great moments that are more or less the parcel of real life, and the doubts, fears, and other insecurities that we all carry around and (in some cases) see in each other (and in better cases, touch and interact with, safely).
If I think about how any of my poly relationships have come to be, my god, if only it were easy. It hasn't been easy. It's been worth it, but not easy.
But back to the quote: was this the whole quote? Is the only mention of the third person the word "her" and nothing else? Huh. Wow.
If I think about how any of my poly relationships have come to be, my god, if only it were easy. It hasn't been easy. It's been worth it, but not easy.
But back to the quote: was this the whole quote? Is the only mention of the third person the word "her" and nothing else? Huh. Wow.
Triads, Unicorns, Unicorn Hunters, sexual 3somes, etc.
Due to a closed thread... http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=59714
... I am starting a new one.
We get lots and lots of people here, couples looking for a unicorn, self-styled unicorns looking for couples. Sometimes it's two gay men looking for another guy, sometimes it's lesbians looking for another woman, but usually it's a bi woman/straight guy couple looking for a bi woman, or a bi woman looking for a couple consisting of a bi woman and straight guy.
Usually these unicorns and unicorn hunters want threeway sex. They think threeway sex is hot and they do not see its pitfalls. Maybe they've swung before and found threeway sex hot, and now want to add "feelings" to the mix.
So, they often jump into bed in short order, all three of them. Maybe the couple even thinks all the sex they have with their shared gf will be with just the three of them. Maybe, just maybe, eventually, they will allow one-on-one sex for their unicorn.
Then, when they start threads here, they get piled on with negative comments from other polyamorous folks who, solo or coupled, date and (usually) have sex one-on-one. Feelings get hurt.
Then they complain, mods get involved, threads get locked, infractions get handed out behind the scenes.
And the next day, another couple of unicorn hunters join the board and it all repeats. Or a unicorn posts about how her new couple won't do one-on-one sex, dates, even texts, and she's hurt, and can't bond with her partners individually, she ends up feeling like a toy to spice up their relationship. And she is commiserated with by former unicorns who had been in her shoes, by former unicorn hunters (like myself) who feel guilty for being stupid in the past and, basically, having used a woman as a sex toy in the past for their own benefit.
Due to a closed thread... http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?t=59714
... I am starting a new one.
We get lots and lots of people here, couples looking for a unicorn, self-styled unicorns looking for couples. Sometimes it's two gay men looking for another guy, sometimes it's lesbians looking for another woman, but usually it's a bi woman/straight guy couple looking for a bi woman, or a bi woman looking for a couple consisting of a bi woman and straight guy.
Usually these unicorns and unicorn hunters want threeway sex. They think threeway sex is hot and they do not see its pitfalls. Maybe they've swung before and found threeway sex hot, and now want to add "feelings" to the mix.
So, they often jump into bed in short order, all three of them. Maybe the couple even thinks all the sex they have with their shared gf will be with just the three of them. Maybe, just maybe, eventually, they will allow one-on-one sex for their unicorn.
Then, when they start threads here, they get piled on with negative comments from other polyamorous folks who, solo or coupled, date and (usually) have sex one-on-one. Feelings get hurt.
Then they complain, mods get involved, threads get locked, infractions get handed out behind the scenes.
And the next day, another couple of unicorn hunters join the board and it all repeats. Or a unicorn posts about how her new couple won't do one-on-one sex, dates, even texts, and she's hurt, and can't bond with her partners individually, she ends up feeling like a toy to spice up their relationship. And she is commiserated with by former unicorns who had been in her shoes, by former unicorn hunters (like myself) who feel guilty for being stupid in the past and, basically, having used a woman as a sex toy in the past for their own benefit.
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So the former post was my overview of the problem here. There are a couple regulars who always defend triads, and there is confusion about triads growing organically as opposed to being forced, as a prescribed "box" for a unicorn to fit in.
I hope we can discuss this, use this space for venting for those of us who are tired of the same old issues with forced triads and unicorn hunting that we see day after day.
Triads, an established couple looking for a single woman for a poly-fidelitous threeway, we-all-share-sex-together thing, is NOT the only way to do polyamory. Why do so many people think that is THE way to do polyamory? It's odd, really.
I hope we can discuss this, use this space for venting for those of us who are tired of the same old issues with forced triads and unicorn hunting that we see day after day.
Triads, an established couple looking for a single woman for a poly-fidelitous threeway, we-all-share-sex-together thing, is NOT the only way to do polyamory. Why do so many people think that is THE way to do polyamory? It's odd, really.
YouAreHere
Well-known member
Although I don't really have anything to add to the real topic at hand, this is why I don't use the word "Poly" any more to describe my relationship with P. Without fail, I get the, "Oh, so that means you all..." with the "nudge nudge wink wink" look, and have to spend more time explaining what it's NOT than what it IS.
Bleh.
<Curmudgeon mode>
This is why I despise the Showtime/sensationalist stuff - it only reinforces this hawt3waysex stereotype. I personally don't want more of this type of "awareness". It just makes things more difficult when all I want is a damned relationship with the guy.
</Curmudgeon mode>
PolyinPractice
New member
Misconceptions
I have no problem with triads/quads/etc. Find them to be the most stable relationship structure, even more so than monogamy (I know four is supposed to be the "most" stable number, at least in numerology, not sure where it comes from, really). So a quad would be the most stable? Maybe? Not important.
I do think that so many couples do group relationships very poorly, which makes it all the more frustrating for those of us who very much consider the needs of all involved.
I have no problem with triads/quads/etc. Find them to be the most stable relationship structure, even more so than monogamy (I know four is supposed to be the "most" stable number, at least in numerology, not sure where it comes from, really). So a quad would be the most stable? Maybe? Not important.
I do think that so many couples do group relationships very poorly, which makes it all the more frustrating for those of us who very much consider the needs of all involved.
Dagferi
Well-known member
People assume triad is the only configuration for a polyamorus relationship because that is all that gets exposure in the media. The Showtime show has just reinforced that stereotype.
When people find out my true relationship status one of the first things people assume is we must all sleep together, and do everything together, and they are quite shocked that nothing of the sort happens. They assume my life is full of drama, etc. They seem disappointed when they find out otherwise. I have a rather boring life. I divide my life equally between two homes. I cook, clean, and make household decisions in both.
I don't have a problem with triads. I have a problem with people trying to force anyone into a box to meet their needs at the expense of the other person's needs. Couples looking for their "third" seem especially guilty.
When people find out my true relationship status one of the first things people assume is we must all sleep together, and do everything together, and they are quite shocked that nothing of the sort happens. They assume my life is full of drama, etc. They seem disappointed when they find out otherwise. I have a rather boring life. I divide my life equally between two homes. I cook, clean, and make household decisions in both.
I don't have a problem with triads. I have a problem with people trying to force anyone into a box to meet their needs at the expense of the other person's needs. Couples looking for their "third" seem especially guilty.
I am in something that's starting to look like a triad (three couples within a group of three people), and also part of what I call an N (a long-distance relationship with a married woman), I suppose I could talk about either side of this conversation.
So far, the replies here say "I have nothing against triads," which I believe. At the same time, in the contentious/closed threads, people who write in talking about their personal circumstances (say, starting as married, and perhaps opening things up in small steps, or enjoying being with couples because they like the dynamic of joining something established) and get pounced on with questions that others seem to not get asked. Have you thought of THIS? Have you considered THAT? And so on. Many of the questions imply that the member of the couple, or the person joining a couple is a dumb-ass, or self-centered, or rude to the others in the relationship, or lacking in the wisdom that is this forum. Which may be true. Yeah, people opening up don't know what people who have lived this way for a while know. But the pouncing is what looks different.
But I don't want to make too big a deal of it. Someone just posted about the distinction between family-style and hub-and-spoke style poly, and the critiques that both sides get. Maybe it's just that more family-style attempts at triad life are showing up here, and people don't typically write in or seek advice when they're looking for a V? Or Z/N/longer chain? I don't know.
Whatever the case may be, I know that it's been really helpful to have people's perspectives from when their relationships have worked - no matter what kinds of relationships they have. I come here to celebrate success and learn from it, and I don't care if that's about triads or not.
Don't know if this response helps, but those are my thoughts on the issue, for now.
So far, the replies here say "I have nothing against triads," which I believe. At the same time, in the contentious/closed threads, people who write in talking about their personal circumstances (say, starting as married, and perhaps opening things up in small steps, or enjoying being with couples because they like the dynamic of joining something established) and get pounced on with questions that others seem to not get asked. Have you thought of THIS? Have you considered THAT? And so on. Many of the questions imply that the member of the couple, or the person joining a couple is a dumb-ass, or self-centered, or rude to the others in the relationship, or lacking in the wisdom that is this forum. Which may be true. Yeah, people opening up don't know what people who have lived this way for a while know. But the pouncing is what looks different.
But I don't want to make too big a deal of it. Someone just posted about the distinction between family-style and hub-and-spoke style poly, and the critiques that both sides get. Maybe it's just that more family-style attempts at triad life are showing up here, and people don't typically write in or seek advice when they're looking for a V? Or Z/N/longer chain? I don't know.
Whatever the case may be, I know that it's been really helpful to have people's perspectives from when their relationships have worked - no matter what kinds of relationships they have. I come here to celebrate success and learn from it, and I don't care if that's about triads or not.
Don't know if this response helps, but those are my thoughts on the issue, for now.
Natja
New member
And the terminology they use just bugs me, it all seems so very... objectifying.
"Looking for our third/our girl/our special Unicorn," "To share/enjoy/add to our relationship/marriage."
Sometimes it is cringeworthy. At least it is to me. And then I have to stand back and realise... wait... Most of these people have not been exposed to the same amount of stuff I have. To them it is entirely new, entirely reasonable and in some cases hot, sexy, or even romantic.
Like the couple who were "Looking for their other half." No need to mention the Math Fail there...
Or the handful or so of single men who turn up both here and other places looking for two bisexual women, specifically. It is so pervasive, because it is supposed to be so fulfilling, but most of those people have never done it.
And out of those who have, it is almost entirely the OR (original couple) who want to give it another go, because the first unicorn was "not right for us," but the next one will be perfect. Because, of course it just needs to be the "right people," and we know what we are doing, we have thought of all the variables, and we know it will be hard, but we are in no rush to find exactly what we want...
It is so repetitive.
I don't blame Showtime because, let's face it, this was a problem before that show came about. It is porn. The threesome in porn is such a staple, especially the FMF threesome, with all eyes focused on the penis money shot at the end. Why else are the single men looking for it, if not for this pornified ideal? It's not like they have a bisexual wife to satisfy.
"Looking for our third/our girl/our special Unicorn," "To share/enjoy/add to our relationship/marriage."
Sometimes it is cringeworthy. At least it is to me. And then I have to stand back and realise... wait... Most of these people have not been exposed to the same amount of stuff I have. To them it is entirely new, entirely reasonable and in some cases hot, sexy, or even romantic.
Like the couple who were "Looking for their other half." No need to mention the Math Fail there...
Or the handful or so of single men who turn up both here and other places looking for two bisexual women, specifically. It is so pervasive, because it is supposed to be so fulfilling, but most of those people have never done it.
And out of those who have, it is almost entirely the OR (original couple) who want to give it another go, because the first unicorn was "not right for us," but the next one will be perfect. Because, of course it just needs to be the "right people," and we know what we are doing, we have thought of all the variables, and we know it will be hard, but we are in no rush to find exactly what we want...
It is so repetitive.
I don't blame Showtime because, let's face it, this was a problem before that show came about. It is porn. The threesome in porn is such a staple, especially the FMF threesome, with all eyes focused on the penis money shot at the end. Why else are the single men looking for it, if not for this pornified ideal? It's not like they have a bisexual wife to satisfy.
I think the reason the male-female couple with a bisexual gf thing is the most, I don't know, socially acceptable (?) triad formation is because, sadly, the world is dominated by hetero men. In the gaze of the Old White Male, it's okay for a female to sleep with another female, but not another male; it's okay for a woman to be bi, but not a man.
Sometimes the FMF triad occurs organically, and sometimes, yes, people seek it out. A couple seeking a girlfriend is no less ridiculous than a single woman with kids seeking out a single man of a certain age and income bracket who will love her kids and has qualities like a good sense of humor and "must love dogs"... Will she get exactly that guy, and even if she does, will he be the right guy for her? Who knows? They say the universe gives us what we need, not what we want. Relationships take on a life of their own, and those FMF triads either fall apart or evolve, just like any relationship, monogamous or non-monogamous.
But why wouldn't people on this forum, especially those who have gone through it, on one side or the other, not want to help these people in this situation? No one gets frustrated dealing with the same issues over and over again, from mono partners dealing with jealousy for their poly partners, or people trying to move from cheating to polyamory. Why not show the couple/gf triads the same empathy and compassion? They're at a place in their journey.
As for the labels, they bug me. "Unicorn hunters" and "swingers" are looked down on. Who gets to decide this? I remember when I first came on the boards, I described the woman I was sleeping with outside of my marriage as my "mistress. " People on the board promptly "corrected" me. "She's your girlfriend." (Well, no, she wanted no responsibility or attachment.) "Call her your paramour." (What is this, Versailles circa 1809?)
We all come here because we want relationship advice for the kind of relationships we likely didn't see growing up. We are all trying to figure out how to make this work for us, and have more love/sex/passion/companionship in our lives. Let's embrace the full spectrum of that.
Sometimes the FMF triad occurs organically, and sometimes, yes, people seek it out. A couple seeking a girlfriend is no less ridiculous than a single woman with kids seeking out a single man of a certain age and income bracket who will love her kids and has qualities like a good sense of humor and "must love dogs"... Will she get exactly that guy, and even if she does, will he be the right guy for her? Who knows? They say the universe gives us what we need, not what we want. Relationships take on a life of their own, and those FMF triads either fall apart or evolve, just like any relationship, monogamous or non-monogamous.
But why wouldn't people on this forum, especially those who have gone through it, on one side or the other, not want to help these people in this situation? No one gets frustrated dealing with the same issues over and over again, from mono partners dealing with jealousy for their poly partners, or people trying to move from cheating to polyamory. Why not show the couple/gf triads the same empathy and compassion? They're at a place in their journey.
As for the labels, they bug me. "Unicorn hunters" and "swingers" are looked down on. Who gets to decide this? I remember when I first came on the boards, I described the woman I was sleeping with outside of my marriage as my "mistress. " People on the board promptly "corrected" me. "She's your girlfriend." (Well, no, she wanted no responsibility or attachment.) "Call her your paramour." (What is this, Versailles circa 1809?)
We all come here because we want relationship advice for the kind of relationships we likely didn't see growing up. We are all trying to figure out how to make this work for us, and have more love/sex/passion/companionship in our lives. Let's embrace the full spectrum of that.
Dagferi
Well-known member
LoveBunny, people with all sorts of configurations get called on their shit all the time.
Gorgeouskitten got called on the the carpet for her jealousy at the prospect of her ND wanting to date someone else.
I have been called on the carpet about an issue with my husband Butch and his getting involved with a couple.
There are many many more, if you look.
I have a problem with anyone applying rules to someone else's relationships without the affected party getting a say. For example, a wife or husband saying "no overnights with the gf or bf," or "you can only spend x amount of time with so and so, because I say so." I call out these people on their issues too.
Gorgeouskitten got called on the the carpet for her jealousy at the prospect of her ND wanting to date someone else.
I have been called on the carpet about an issue with my husband Butch and his getting involved with a couple.
There are many many more, if you look.
I have a problem with anyone applying rules to someone else's relationships without the affected party getting a say. For example, a wife or husband saying "no overnights with the gf or bf," or "you can only spend x amount of time with so and so, because I say so." I call out these people on their issues too.
Dagferi
Well-known member
All to fulfill their husbands "dream."
I wonder how many triads we have lurking here on the boards are beyond the NEW point and still going strong?
YouAreHere
Well-known member
Good point, although if all Showtime is doing is following porn's lead, then I still see it as more of a titillator than a normalizer, and it still makes me work harder at undoing perceptions of my relationship, rather than letting me explain what it is. That's why I just say that my partner is "non-exclusive, with two committed long-term relationships," lotsa words, but pretty much to the point.
This is true. I came here, as someone who isn't polyamorous, simply because it was one of the only places I could talk about this stuff without immediately getting judged as a victim, or having my relationship be looked at as casual or disrespectful.
However, what I tend to see when the couples come on the board (usually) is first a gentle poke about "have you thought about this stuff?" and links to the unicorn-hunter or couple-privilege articles. It doesn't usually seem to get heated unless the original posters come back with, "Well, that's not us! Here's why it's not us!" [Lists several reasons that indicate that it is, in fact, them.] Or if someone else starts arguing in the thread on behalf of the OP, which tends to happen from time to time.
The self-proclaimed unicorns seem to regularly get flak for using the term. I, personally, have no feelings on it either way. If they realize it can be a pejorative term, and they still identify with what it represents, it's okay by me if they call themselves that. In the thread that was closed, the OP even stated that she fully expected couple privilege and didn't expect equality at all.
If the "unicorn" is fully informed and consents to all this, then I see this as no different than a negotiated D/s relationship. It's not for me, but I respect others' decisions to enjoy that in their relationships.
It's when the person is uninformed, or doesn't fully consent, that they run into trouble, in both cases.
Maybe the folks poking a bit hard at the "unicorns" are trying to make sure they're truly informed and understand all this, and I think that's a good thing. But at what point do you back off and say, "Okay, have at it then"?
No answers here, just questions. Thanks for creating a thread where we can discuss it without having to tie it to someone's particular situation, Mags.