Am I unreasonable?

[Magdlyn]

We also did a lot of detangling before this, and are also on the cusp of transitioning to living apart, for a host of reasons not related to sex or polyamory, and not related to problems in the relationship. Perhaps in some other thread I might go into those things.

This seems quite key, actually! You said you have a couple dozen animals, even ducks, which indicates a pond and an actual farm of some kind... Yet, you and Wife are not going to be living together? Who is staying at the farm and taking care of the livestock, you?

Will Wife be living far apart from you? Does her potential bf live close to both of you now? Will he still be close to one or the other of you when one or the other of you move?

If you and Wife are going to be living apart, and she has her own place, it might be possible there will be nights she is spending neither with you OR her bf, right? After all, most of us have work, family, friends, as well as activities we do that do not involve anyone at all besides ourselves.

A typical calendar for a poly person is, 2 nights with one partner, 2 nights with another partner, one "me night," one night for friends, and one night left open for unplanned-for happenings.

And if your wife is going to be living alone, and you are too, don't forget that there might even be a week where you don't want to see anyone! haha! Maybe you're sick, or tired, or deeply involved in writing a book, or studying for a big exam, or whatever the heck. Maybe you don't want to see any partners at all because you have an old friend in town for a week and you want to be just with them.

In my opinion, part of the joy of living alone is being your own boss, and not having to get anyone's feedback on how your spend your time, sometimes.

And part of the reality of poly is, one becomes more independent. Mono couples can be very codependent. Some do literally everything together, as if they were a unit, with neither person having their own will or ability to act alone.

Poly people make choices for themselves (after negotiating with their partners). And some day or nights, both of one's partners may be busy with others (lovers, platonic friends, family, on a trip, whatever) and we may left to our own devices entirely. We need to get OK with this.

 

[vinsanity0]

i mean, was it , is it unfair of me to place any restrictions going in that make me feel safer in the journey.
I know casual sex is not for her, i dont expect her to be, just a wish 'sigh' that it would be easier to handle for me!!
I had not thought about getting up to her speed. Interesting. I am working on jealousy issues and no i do not wish her to give up, just to be a a bit more controlled and willing to pace it at the start.

One concept we came accross that she used on me during our opening up phase was to take things at the slower persons pace, baby steps. Thats what we did, all the opening up was at her pace. All I am wishing for is the same for her poly life, just take it at my slower pace till i get warmed up and safe. This of course means i have to do work on myself the same as she did. But it takes time.

"Place restrictions" sounds like ownership, doesn't it? You realize it's hard for you to accept, but it's like you are trying to make her do your work for you. Yes, you should expect your partner to take your feelings into consideration. It sounds like she is working on doing that better.

My concern is what constitutes you feeling all safe and warm? That's not exactly quantifiable. Rules make you feel safe because you feel you are in control. Those rules don't make the other person feel safe at all. That makes them feel stifled and owned.

It sounds like the two of you are navigating through this. You've had some good advice here. Just be careful with making demands. If your wife was here I'd tell her to spend more effort to help you feel more secure.

 

[Amygdala]

My point wasn't that she should be free to do whatever she wants. My point was that the OP should ask for what he wants, not just make arbitrary rules thinking the rules will protect her from going crazy with NRE again. Imo, rules just don't work... they're breeding ground for resentments.... relationship traps that erode the relationship rather than protect it. And they usually don't even address what the person imposing the rule wants.

Honestly it doesn't even sound like the OP needs this one night rule....he just doesn't trust her not to become consumed with a new partner again. Really what he wants is that she take it slower, not jump in with both feet at the onset, and spend more of her time with him rather than new guy. And maybe be more present with him when they're together. That would be the healthier thing to ask for IMO. Asking for what we want encourages communication. Focusing on the rule rather than the need takes the focus off the need.... and it's the need you want to address.

Interesting thoughts, I do appreciate them.
We did away with a ton of traditional newbie rules as we progressed in our opening up journey because we are aware of the innate problems with them.

Perhaps you are correct about the one night 'rule' i mentioned being more about Really what he wants is that she take it slower, not jump in with both feet at the onset, and spend more of her time with him rather than new guy. And maybe be more present with him when they're together.

That all said, R is on board with the restriction as we might call it and likes the ideas presented here about a time frame to relax them.
Thankyou

 

[Amygdala]

OP are you definitely planning to transition to living separately? If so, when is that happening?

I'm also a proponent for asking for what you need instead of restricting interactions with others. If what you need is to feel like she's spending at least half or more of her time with you, then ask for that, and then realize that the time that you haven't asked for is time that she should be able to divvy up however she wants between friends, lovers, etc. And then figure out what calendaring looks like. If you ultimately decide that you're going to spend at least 4 days a week together (be that 1 on 1 time or going out with friends, or whatever), then calendar out those days. But also talk about what it would look like when another partner/date is in the picture and how you calendar with them. Is there priority over calendaring or are you both comfortable with easily swapping days (upon request, not demand) to try and accommodate people's schedules.

I think it's important to ultimately figure out a way to define "this is the level of interaction I need to feel good about the relationship" and then outside of that, what each of you do with your own time should be your own business. This will be especially noticeable if you live apart, because realistically you WILL have to actively plan your time together, and when you aren't planning to be in each other's spaces, well you won't actively see who is doing what with whom, so it will likely feel less jarring.

We are moving to L.A.T (living apart together i'm sure many here will be familiar) quite soon, in fact we applied for a second home rental today. This is for us the best time while no love interest is in R's life. One thing at a time! I am also sure this aspect of our story will come out soon enough as it deserves its own thread...(essay)

Yes I agree with asking rather than restricting. This has at the moment, taken the form of ''I need you to proceed slower next time please, if this person comes into your life. If you can agree to one day per week for a limited time so as to help me not get blindsided like last time that will help me process much better than i did before''. In the meantime I am doing work on myself in preparation for next time. Neither of us want our life to run on permissions. I like your questions for us to talk about regarding calendars. Thanks for them.

I see our situation as needing to find the balance point between me feeling safe and her gaining the freedom she deserves.

As for LAT I am glad nobody else is in the picture while we set it up as we can play a round with routines and scenario's. As we also work together running a business we will be needing to schedule how that works as she will also work remote much of the time.

 

[Amygdala]

It sounds like she is working on doing that better.

My concern is what constitutes you feeling all safe and warm? That's not exactly quantifiable. Rules make you feel safe because you feel you are in control. Those rules don't make the other person feel safe at all. That makes them feel stifled and owned.

It sounds like the two of you are navigating through this. You've had some good advice here. Just be careful with making demands. If your wife was here I'd tell her to spend more effort to help you feel more secure.

So much good feedback. It is awesome!

Exactly, She is working on that as I am working on my insecurities. Hopefully when the next person pops up we will both have a better handle on it. That last whirlwind was the first time.

I think my wife will sign up here soon. I have asked her to do more learning and research. In the past I have been the one doing most of the 'book learning' and trying to pass it on.

 

[dingedheart]

I need to be clearer on one point here I think. The ''3 or 4 nights'' situation was her ardently expressed desire, not her actions. In the midst of the whirlwind 100 mph NRE she certainly wanted it to be available and it is that that drove the instant fear in me. That and feeling like I just met my replacement. Jealousy as fear raised its head.

Thanks for that clarification. My point or counter point to pink pigs argument that your “ issues “ are yours to go off and solve on your own is pretty much the poly mantra but it’s completely devoid any kind of relationship ethics. And in this situation even an ardent request such as that could be considered the input action and your instant fear as the reaction. AND that’s OK if that’s her goal and desire but she does bear some of the responsibility for the turbulence.

I knew what was happening but at the time it didn't make it easier. I don't think our newbie experience was at all rare, we just don't want to repeat it and to be better equipped with good advice.

There have been lots of threads on NRE and they probably run the gambit from don’t worry it will pass and your spouse will return to you to set to you need to nip this in bud and set firmer boundaries. You might want to do a tag search on NRE. Also I’d recommend read the article on poly hell and I’d have her read that too.

I have hobbies Cant get to them at present unfortunately...as for pets... we do have 2 goats, 3 sheep, 4 chook's, 8 ducks and 3 cats, not sure I need more!!

I was being slightly sarcastic with that hobby remark. When I joined distraction via hobby or outside interest was the standard piece of advice.

We are committed to working out all this stuff before the second go round arrives.

That’s a good plan and realize it’s a work in progress as well.

Good luck to you both

 

[MeeraReed]

Just chiming in to say, I'm a "living together apart" person! My partner of 8 years and I would never be happy sharing a living space.

Although, in our case, we live a bit TOO far apart and it gets inconvenient.

 

[Vicki82]

So she should be free to do whatever she wants ??

We're all free to do whatever we want. That's the joy of being an autonomous, adult human being. We make our own choices. Taking ownership of someone else's choices is not a good thing. Assuming ownership of someone else's choices isn't, either.

I know you had a bad situation, dinged, but you're definitely coming off as possessive here. No one should be deciding what their partner can do with their own time. Sure, there's an adjustment period when things are new but the idea that you should be entitled to all your partner's time just because they're your partner? That sounds pretty unhealthy to me.

If OP's wife took a cooking class 3 nights a week, would that merit this level of insecurity? No. Because it's not really about the time at all, like PinkPig and breathesmusic said.

 

[Magdlyn]

Thanks for that clarification. My point, or counter point, to Pink Pig's argument that your “issues" are yours to go off and solve on your own, is pretty much the poly mantra, but it’s completely devoid any kind of relationship ethics.

dinged, you've been dinged. And you're coming from a dinged POV. And that is not the "poly mantra." There is no poly mantra. But we do all have to take responsibility for our own lives, experiences and choices. That is not unethical at all. It's called being responsible and being an adult. We all carry our own baggage. We shouldn't expect anyone to carry our baggage.

We can all speak up for ourselves, and define our needs and desires, and request any friends or lovers help us fulfill out desires. And our friends and lovers may or may not agree to do that. That is their right.

If I have an "issue," no one can solve it but me. I can request help, but I own the issue. I don't know why anyone would think that was "completely devoid of relationship ethics." If I have a disease, it's my disease. I can ask for help to heal me. But I have to be the one to call doctors, and take my meds, and seek a second opinion, schedule appointments with various specialists, etc.

I also don't know why people who aren't practicing poly, and don't understand poly, keep coming here just to spread misinformation around, year after year. What do you (and others like you) get out of that? You just come across as bitter and cranky and incapable of evolving.

There have been lots of threads on NRE and they probably run the gambit [gamut] from don’t worry, it will pass, and your spouse will return to you, to you need to nip this in bud and set firmer boundaries. You might want to do a tag search on NRE. Also I’d recommend read the article on poly hell and I’d have her read that too.


I was being slightly sarcastic with that hobby remark. When I joined distraction via hobby or outside interest was the standard piece of advice.

Sarcasm makes you sound bitter and foolish. We are a serious board here. Sarcasm can be misread and is not helpful. And having something to do besides looking for a partner to entertain you every second you're at home is actually a very good, mature idea.

 

[SEASONEDpolyAgain]

Lots of people have this terrible idea of using a person to alleviate their insecurities and anxiety. Some of what I say will be tangential.

There's this thing in relationships where one is advised to acknowledge their needs and then choose partners who don't mind meeting them. Sometimes people get that confused with basically forcing your partner by emotional manipulation to be your crutch. You'll hear things like "if you were good at poly, you'd do X which I need because I'm more stable when I know when people around me do X."

It is true that no request is inherently unfair but sometimes one has to step back and wonder if that level of co-dependency is healthy or is it suffocating?

Do you actually give your partners room to refuse or compromise or are your emotions so totally overwhelming that they oppress everyone else too?

I find a lot of people who think they're having "conversations" are actually just telling their partner what they need and giving them little to no room to say "I can't do that because it will make me rapidly unhappy".

I actually used to be that person. I wrote this about it some time ago to someone else on here:

you're extremely articulate and have a good comprehension of your own feelings. You're able to express them quite fluently. Generally speaking, I'd say women tend to be better at that than men. However, when one is very articulate, expressive and on top of that, opinionated, it can be easy to mistake offloading your thoughts, feelings and desires for an actual discussion.

How this would manifest for me is that I'd make some sort of proposal or give my view on a current situation. My partner would respond with their views, usually expressing some doubts about how my way will work for them and I'd "listen". I'd then basically "alleviate" their concerns by telling them why their doubts and concerns are unnecessary or illogical and keep going until they stopped expressing them. I would talk, email, write letters, send articles, anything. Emails and letters seemed particularly effective because I'd feel like I could say everything I wanted to without interruption. In fact it was a way of me controlling the flow of the conversation and stating "facts" or a premise to build off which might not be true for both parties. I was literally wearing them into submission. And when they did submit, I'd think they now see my perspective and agree when actually they just got tired of explaining that they completely understand what I'm saying, they see the logic, it just isn't what they want/need and actually my continual dismissal of their feelings on their matter is becoming toxic for them. Toxic because they'd start to feel wrong for feeling the way they do since I was so very sure my way was right and could be right for them if they'd give it a chance.

When it became toxic for them, they'd often display behaviors that I'd generally count as beneath them. Not in sync with the person I met. You know, dismissive, rude, aggressive, distant, cold... and I'd see them as the aggressor. As the mean one. In truth, how some of those people behaved towards me was cruel and unacceptable, but my behavior towards them was equally unhealthy and often preceeded the new personality traits they started to show. I was bringing out the worst in them.

Long story short, I wasn't listening to my partners. I'd come away thinking we just had a productive discussion when actually there wasn't a discussion, it was me telling them why my views, feelings and desires are of greater importance and righteousness than theirs. Changing this about myself has helped my relationships no end.

Sure, if you want to be with someone and you want that relationship to be healthy, you will need to understand their needs and help meet them. But leaving the relationship because you can't be who you need you to be AND be a good partner for that person is another equally valid choice. Sometimes one party feels they are OBVIOUSLY the better catch so everyone should adapt to accommodate them in their lives. They are dumbfounded when someone decides actually they'd have a better shot of long term contentment without that relationship.

Listening is so important.

 

[Amygdala]

This seems quite key, actually! You said you have a couple dozen animals, even ducks, which indicates a pond and an actual farm of some kind... Yet, you and Wife are not going to be living together? Who is staying at the farm and taking care of the livestock, you?

Will Wife be living far apart from you? Does her potential bf live close to both of you now? Will he still be close to one or the other of you when one or the other of you move?

If you and Wife are going to be living apart, and she has her own place, it might be possible there will be nights she is spending neither with you OR her bf, right? After all, most of us have work, family, friends, as well as activities we do that do not involve anyone at all besides ourselves.

A typical calendar for a poly person is, 2 nights with one partner, 2 nights with another partner, one "me night," one night for friends, and one night left open for unplanned-for happenings.

And if your wife is going to be living alone, and you are too, don't forget that there might even be a week where you don't want to see anyone! haha! Maybe you're sick, or tired, or deeply involved in writing a book, or studying for a big exam, or whatever the heck. Maybe you don't want to see any partners at all because you have an old friend in town for a week and you want to be just with them.

In my opinion, part of the joy of living alone is being your own boss, and not having to get anyone's feedback on how your spend your time, sometimes.

And part of the reality of poly is, one becomes more independent. Mono couples can be very codependent. Some do literally everything together, as if they were a unit, with neither person having their own will or ability to act alone.

Poly people make choices for themselves (after negotiating with their partners). And some day or nights, both of one's partners may be busy with others (lovers, platonic friends, family, on a trip, whatever) and we may left to our own devices entirely. We need to get OK with this.

I will be staying on the hobby farm. It is 90 mins from the city area the new place will be. We do that kind of travel frequently as country folk do. So it's just a short trip

She will be closer to the previous lover. Again distance doesn't mean too much.

Because we also need to run a business together there will be cross over times when we see each other although she can do her part remote for the most part. I'm sure there will be nights alone for both of us.

I thought that there really was no typical calendar, more what the couple etc work out...this discussion is yet future but we know it is coming. She is not in a rush although we are also aware it could pop up anytime.

One next task is too make a print out of several good points made in this thread for us to have a chat about.

We are at present far too co dependant. We are together 24/7 and that is not healthy. It worked for a few years, it became such by neccessity but it is time to change that. Hence LAT.

 

[Magdlyn]

I will be staying on the hobby farm. It is 90 mins from the city area the new place will be. We do that kind of travel frequently as country folk do. So it's just a short trip

She will be closer to the previous lover. Again distance doesn't mean too much.

Because we also need to run a business together there will be cross over times when we see each other although she can do her part remote for the most part. I'm sure there will be nights alone for both of us.

I thought that there really was no typical calendar, more what the couple etc work out...this discussion is yet future but we know it is coming. She is not in a rush although we are also aware it could pop up anytime.

One next task is too make a print out of several good points made in this thread for us to have a chat about.

We are at present far too co-dependent. We are together 24/7 and that is not healthy. It worked for a few years, it became such by necessity, but it is time to change that. Hence LAT.

Hi. Would you please choose nicknames for your wife and her potential bf/ex person? It would make conversation much easier. I'll just pop a couple names in for now.

Thanks for the information. So you and Tina will be 90 minutes apart very soon, you both have jobs, and you have a farm with lots of animals as well.

She'll be in the city and close to Mack. You'll be in the country. You have a shared business (other than the farm, it seems) and she can work remotely on it, so you're not in actual meat space together as much.

And yet, you seem to think Tina will be spending at least 4 nights a week with you, despite jobs, despite a 3 hour round trip to get to you, or for you to get to her? I hardly see the point of living apart if it entails so much of a commute! Maybe you plan on long weekends together where she's at the farm with you? I just don't see how this will work. I'm very confused.

I mean, if she's in the city close to Mack, they could have overnights every night during the week (if there is a M-F work schedule) if they wanted, and then she could spend weekends with you. Then he'd be getting 5 dates and you'd get 2.

I don't see how you can "police" her evenings and overnights from your home 90 minutes away from her new home. Won't her days and nights in her own abode be her own to spend as she wishes? Isn't that one of the points of living apart?

As far as a typical schedule, that was just a general idea. I personally think it's healthy to leave days or evenings free for "me time," where we can do self care, or household chores, or see platonic friends, or go do a hobby club activity, etc., etc.

When you're in a codependent mono couple, you may think everything needs to be done together, and pressure each other to do this, and feel pressured or guilty if you want to do a video game night, and she wants a night out with the girls, or whatever. But doing things apart makes the planned quality time together all the sweeter and more meaningful.

My partner and I even take short vacations sometimes without the other, since we both have friends and family to visit. I can't stand her parents and brother, so I've stopped going to see them when she goes. And one of my bffs always wants to have visits without spouses, so I go alone to see her.

I am not saying "this is how things are done," just offering food for thought.

 

[kdt26417]

Re (from Amygdala):

"My fear is of being dumped and also of no longer being important to my wife. I accept that as *my* fear and mine to work on though. My only issues seem to relate to security/time devoted."

What sucks is, that there's no guarantee that those fears are strictly in your imagination. She *might* dump you. You *could* end up being unimportant to her. NRE can have that effect on people. Plus if you go down the poly road with her, you will certainly experience a reduction in time devoted to you. And she is going to need to devote a certain amount of energy to the new relationship.

Part of working on your fears is tackling their potential reality. Are You in Poly Hell?

 

[Amygdala]

Hi. Would you please choose nicknames for your wife and her potential bf/ex person? It would make conversation much easier. I'll just pop a couple names in for now.

Thanks for the information. So you and Tina will be 90 minutes apart very soon, you both have jobs, and you have a farm with lots of animals as well.

She'll be in the city and close to Mack. You'll be in the country. You have a shared business (other than the farm, it seems) and she can work remotely on it, so you're not in actual meat space together as much.

And yet, you seem to think Tina will be spending at least 4 nights a week with you, despite jobs, despite a 3 hour round trip to get to you, or for you to get to her? I hardly see the point of living apart if it entails so much of a commute! Maybe you plan on long weekends together where she's at the farm with you? I just don't see how this will work. I'm very confused.

I mean, if she's in the city close to Mack, they could have overnights every night during the week (if there is a M-F work schedule) if they wanted, and then she could spend weekends with you. Then he'd be getting 5 dates and you'd get 2.

I don't see how you can "police" her evenings and overnights from your home 90 minutes away from her new home. Won't her days and nights in her own abode be her own to spend as she wishes? Isn't that one of the points of living apart?

As far as a typical schedule, that was just a general idea. I personally think it's healthy to leave days or evenings free for "me time," where we can do self care, or household chores, or see platonic friends, or go do a hobby club activity, etc., etc.

When you're in a codependent mono couple, you may think everything needs to be done together, and pressure each other to do this, and feel pressured or guilty if you want to do a video game night, and she wants a night out with the girls, or whatever. But doing things apart makes the planned quality time together all the sweeter and more meaningful.

My partner and I even take short vacations sometimes without the other, since we both have friends and family to visit. I can't stand her parents and brother, so I've stopped going to see them when she goes. And one of my bffs always wants to have visits without spouses, so I go alone to see her.

I am not saying "this is how things are done," just offering food for thought.

I will try to use nicknames. It is not my usual writing style. I have not been able to find the relevant guidlelines about it to read. That said, without being difficult, I don't see how wife and lover or boyfriend is confusing. She is after my 'wife'. However I will do my best to follow suite. I'll call my wife 'Minx' and the most likely future BF 'Noodle'. Please forgive the occasional 'wife' as i tend to type as i speak and don't always remember to edit. Gee, I'm lucky if i remember to spell check and use good grammar!

Yes we will soon me 90 min apart. We generally work within 20 ft of each other 5 days a week doing our different roles. The 'plan' is that I will drive down on a friday after work and we would return in separate cars sunday night or monday morning. There is part of minx's job that is best suited to being in the workshop and office on a monday. Tuesday morning she is likely to either leave or remain till mid afternoon when she will go to see her mother then return to her own city home. I will remain on the farm doing my work again till friday. Rinse and repeat with occassional shuffles. (90 min up and down is nothing. We do it just to go to the movies or the shops.

So yes she will have free nights closer to Noodle. And to herself. Tonight she is in the city with her mother and sister... I do not know if she will return tonight or not. I'm fine either way.

We spoke today of trying to find a 'centre' or balance point we can agree on timewise and that if and when circumstances knock the routine out of whack we know that it will soon balance back to centre without either of us fearing it would be a permanent shift.

Some weekends I know Minxi will travel up to the farm to stay, she will miss the pet sheep and the cats very much. One reason I have opted to remain on the farm (and its not a working farm) IS precisely to keep the workshop and look after the sheep. If i don't she fears someone will eat them.

Neither of us wan't to police each others spare time. However, all these different scenarios need to be brought up and discussed in order to sift through what will work and what will not. And some things will no doubt need to be modified along the way.

I do not know your or others who are being very helpful story's as to your journey's to know if you speak from personal experience. Suffice to say that being together 24/7 for 14 years is not an easy thing to undo. The very thought of going from 7 down to 2 nights a week for example is a very very hard thing to deal with. Very different to my daughter who since her teens has never been in a mono relationship. For her that level of one or two date nights is all she knows really.

The last 3 years of transitioning from mono to open is what has made the current journey from where we are now to L.A.T and Poly much faster and without the opening up journey being done, her request to move to the city would never have been supported by me. I just would not have been able to wrap my head around it. So as hard as that opening up was, both of us can see the benefits of it. We both, and I in particular had to do a lot of letting go in that opening up period. The 6 weeks Minxi was with Noodle was an intense period of grief mixed with relaxing of rules and boundaries. I did find the more I relaxed the easier it was.

This is just the next stage. Just as we are now settled with 'open' and it is normal and no surprises, we hold on to the hope that when we are through this current readjustment time of hard honest scary talks and tears that it too will become the new normal. I have to believe that.

I must add, that going from mono to open is a very different trip than open to poly. One is asking for the allowance for sexual but not emotional encounters. The other is asking for an allowance to 'fall in love'' with another person. When one has the ability to separate sex from love (as we both do) it is not hard to see which one is the more dangerous to the status quo and thus which one also provokes the most fear.

Your food for thought is most welcome

 

[Amygdala]

Re (from Amygdala):


What sucks is, that there's no guarantee that those fears are strictly in your imagination. She *might* dump you. You *could* end up being unimportant to her. NRE can have that effect on people. Plus if you go down the poly road with her, you will certainly experience a reduction in time devoted to you. And she is going to need to devote a certain amount of energy to the new relationship.

Part of working on your fears is tackling their potential reality. Are You in Poly Hell?

yes I'm in poly hell

There are no guarentees, we both know that. To be honest Minxi could have walk four times in the last 6 years before all this. She left the city for a country life and it has not been all sunshine and lollipops!

I am working hard on being less the centre of attention, It is really important that I do this.

There are 3 fundamental reasons to do this Living Apart and poly journey that i have not touched on yet. They are not important to the scope of this thread and its leading question. However, either Minxi or myself will elaborate on those factors in a future post.

 

[Magdlyn]

Thanks for picking the nicknames. It was hard for me to constantly refer to Noodle as "your wife's ex/potential bf." That's just weird to type out. Now it's just 2 simple words, Minxi and Noodle.

So, it sounds like you and Minxi will be together usually from Friday night to Tuesday morning or afternoon. A few hours on Friday night, all of Sat, Sun and Monday, and a few hours on Tuesday. Both of you then have Tuesday afternoon/evening, Wed, Thursday and most of Friday to yourselves, to do as you please, to spend with whom you please.

And it seems you want to request that, on Tuesday, Wed, Thurs and Friday during the day, she only spend one of those days or evenings or overnights with Noodle (or any other guy?). For at least a few months? Otherwise, if she wants company, it needs to be family or friends only? But if her NRE resurges, she might spend time each evening texting or on the phone or Skype with Noodle, and you wouldn't need to know...

If she is out of sight, out of mind, so to speak, in the city, what would be bad about her seeing Noodle more often there? Do you want her to call or text you every day, more than once, or do you want a short good night text? What would help you to feel secure when you're apart?

 

[FallenAngelina]

I don't see how wife and lover or boyfriend is confusing.

It's not confusing to you, but it's confusing for us. We read several posts a day involving wives, lovers and boyfriends and it's impossible to remember all of the individuals (and therefore give helpful feedback) if members don't use nicknames. Read some of the other threads and you'll soon begin to appreciate the names and not "my wife," "my lover," etc.

 

[kdt26417]

Re (from Amygdala):

"I will try to use nicknames. It is not my usual writing style. I have not been able to find the relevant guidelines about it to read."

The guidelines you seek are located at http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?p=335337

It is important to be familiar with the guidelines. Even if you've read them previously, it's a good idea to review them from time to time. It should be noted that the current guidelines are not the same as the older set of guidelines we used to have. The current guidelines are much more concise, and as such, are easier to go through.

 

[icesong]

I do not know your or others who are being very helpful story's as to your journey's to know if you speak from personal experience. Suffice to say that being together 24/7 for 14 years is not an easy thing to undo. The very thought of going from 7 down to 2 nights a week for example is a very very hard thing to deal with. Very different to my daughter who since her teens has never been in a mono relationship. For her that level of one or two date nights is all she knows really.

The last 3 years of transitioning from mono to open is what has made the current journey from where we are now to L.A.T and Poly much faster and without the opening up journey being done, her request to move to the city would never have been supported by me. I just would not have been able to wrap my head around it. So as hard as that opening up was, both of us can see the benefits of it. We both, and I in particular had to do a lot of letting go in that opening up period. The 6 weeks Minxi was with Noodle was an intense period of grief mixed with relaxing of rules and boundaries. I did find the more I relaxed the easier it was.

This is just the next stage. Just as we are now settled with 'open' and it is normal and no surprises, we hold on to the hope that when we are through this current readjustment time of hard honest scary talks and tears that it too will become the new normal. I have to believe that.

I must add, that going from mono to open is a very different trip than open to poly. One is asking for the allowance for sexual but not emotional encounters. The other is asking for an allowance to 'fall in love'' with another person. When one has the ability to separate sex from love (as we both do) it is not hard to see which one is the more dangerous to the status quo and thus which one also provokes the most fear.

Your food for thought is most welcome

I think in some ways my journey may be very similar to that, although Knight and I still live together (I'm still not sure whether that's a permanent thing although some days I hope so and some days I'm curious about living by myself for a bit once MiniMe is grown and out of the house.) We met at 16, went to the same residential high school and same college, and then both worked at the same company for a decade and had shared hobbies/friends groups that more or less had the effect of being together 24/7 if not literally so. Like, adjacent cubes at work, plus or minus the parts where Knight was out of the office for customers. And we went through swinging / shared partners for a while to test the separation between sex and love, and because we didn't want to be each other's only partner ever - and thought we had no interest in deeper emotional relationships. Oops.

Falling in love with someone else though? dating independently? Yes that was utterly scary and hard and almost broke us - if you read my blog alllllll the way back to HipsterBoy I talk about that a lot, although I didn't discover this board until I was at the end of that first relationship.

And yes, the more you can relax the better off you'll be. It sounds like you already have a plan for dedicated time together - at that point, my biggest advice is to let go of anything other than hoping Minxi is happy during your scheduled time apart.

 

[Magdlyn]

Re (from Amygdala):


The guidelines you seek are located at http://www.polyamory.com/forum/showthread.php?p=335337

It is important to be familiar with the guidelines. Even if you've read them previously, it's a good idea to review them from time to time. It should be noted that the current guidelines are not the same as the older set of guidelines we used to have. The current guidelines are much more concise, and as such, are easier to go through.

I owe Amygdala (and other new members) an apology. I reread the Guidelines this morning and I did NOT see a request for nicknames for spouses, partners or metamours! I only saw a suggestion to make sure you, yourself, were anonymously named. I am sure that also means protecting the anonymity of your partners, but just saying "wife" or "lover" would do that.

I could have sworn I did read the recommendation for nicknames for all parties at one point. I PMed AutumnalTone to ask that it be added to the Guidelines, since it doesn't seem to be there now!

Kevin, would look into that too, in the mod lounge?