new to group in a vanilla managamous relationship but...

CARTER

New member
Hi I've been married 10 years, others I dated in the past were manaogamish relationships fantasized about others while making love.
We dated a short time before marriage and at the time things had real potential sexually, I was happy not pushing things but slowly working toward something better. Sex everyday later after marriage and work stress for my partner reduced it to once a month. I greatly love my partner but my sex drive is a daily need so instead of cheating I turn to porn. I also turned to Fetlife as a way to read and educate myself. I feel I could easily have a separate play partner to fill in the void when my partner is not interested or too tired. I think it would be great to go to a sex club and just watch with an open mind but feel my vanilla partner would find this earth shattering to know I'm ok with swinging or into poly. I'd be ok if we both had play partners but again my partner is managamous, straight and I'm learning I'm really not monogamous, or so I believe. I'd be happy exploring and experiencing more and I'm getting older but not ready to toss in the towel and get by with ok sex that will never stretch our limits of excitement. There is so much yet to explore, learn and enjoy.
I think and masterbate daily, to group and threesomes. I need that release to get started with my day.
Communication has always been very good except our sex life and have stressed that is the part that makes me feel married and connected.
A delicate matter trying to consider my partners stress, lack of interest due to overweight and getting older. Trying to put it in a way without insulting or causing an apocalypse by mentioning poly or swinging.
We grow up loving two main people, mom and pop then have sisters and brothers and best friends so why not be Poly ?
I look at some friends that we come in contact with and think it would be nice to give the gift of pleasuring each other openly in a friendly fwb way and that we could both enjoy others.
I'm just wondering if there is a way to repair and inspire our intimacy and get to the next level ? or what others have to say?
 
Have you considered sex therapy (couples) or engagement of a sex worker? It sounds that either or both of these would be a better way to address what your actual issues are rather than developing another partnership, casual/fwb or otherwise.
 
Have you considered sex therapy (couples) or engagement of a sex worker? It sounds that either or both of these would be a better way to address what your actual issues are rather than developing another partnership, casual/fwb or otherwise.
Thanks
 
Hi, I've been married 10 years. Others I dated in the past were monogamish relationships. We fantasized about others while making love.

We dated a short time before marriage and at the time things had real potential sexually. I was happy not pushing things, but slowly working toward something better, sex everyday.
You wanted it to increase to every day? Or it was at first, and then became less frequent?
Later, after marriage, work stress for my partner reduced it to once a month. I greatly love my partner, but my sex drive is a daily need, so instead of cheating I turn to porn. I also turned to Fetlife as a way to read and educate myself.
It sounds like your married sex never lived up to its potential, in your eyes. How long have you been married? Why did you get married so quickly? How old are you both?
I feel I could easily have a separate play partner to fill in the void when my partner is not interested or too tired. I think it would be great to go to a sex club and just watch with an open mind, but feel my vanilla partner would find it earth shattering to know I'm ok with swinging or into poly.
We call it dropping the poly bomb because of its earth shattering consequences. But only you can decide if its worth it to bring up the topic. I say it is. Of course, marriages can have lulls in sexual activity, especially because of kids, illness or injury, demanding jobs, school, doing a lot of elder care, needing to go on a lot of trips due to work, etc. Every couple will make its own decision about what to do as far as mismatched sexual desire. The common way to deal is for someone to cheat. That is because our entire culture is meant to be monogamous, death til you part, type of thing. But this goes against human nature and actual reality. Few and far between are the perfectly matched entirely mono couples.
I'd be ok if we both had play partners. But again, my partner is monogamous, straight, and I'm learning I'm really not monogamous, or so I believe. I'd be happy exploring and experiencing more. I'm getting older, but not ready to toss in the towel and get by with ok sex that will never stretch our limits of excitement. There is so much yet to explore, learn and enjoy.
Yes.
I think and masturbate daily, to groups and threesomes. I need that release to get started with my day.
Many people, even those with active partnered sex lives, need a sexual release daily, especially younger men, because of the higher testosterone levels. But no partner is expected to perform and fulfill your every sexual need. Even if you had 2 or 3 partners you might not get the daily release, or even every other day. lol. But it does help, if you get lucky.
Communication has always been very good, except about our sex life. I have stressed that this is the part that makes me feel married and connected.
The old elephant in the room. This is so common. I believe it's best to be mature and honest and break the news if you're feeling really frustrated with all the masturbating and sex once a month or less. Indeed, some couples end up going years without sex. There are ways to increase the emotional intimacy that might lead to better sex and more of it, but that might take the advice and support of a couples therapist, once you do bring up the subject.
A delicate matter, trying to consider my partner's stress, and lack of interest due to being overweight and getting older. Trying to put it in a way without insulting or causing an apocalypse by mentioning poly or swinging.
So her sex drive is low because of her job, as you said previously, but also because she's gained weight and gotten older? Does she have low self esteem because of the weight gain? And that reduces her desire to have sex?

You want to stay married. But since her sex drive is so low and she's vanilla (as far as you know...) she might find the idea of ADDING new sex partners for herself the opposite of what she wants or needs. However, you could open just on your side, if she consents. Big "if," I know.

On the other hand, if there are emotional barriers between you two, a new partner for her, with the excitement of NRE, might increase her sex drive for him, leaving you further in the dust. This is an irony of an open relationship. If you both join a dating site, she'd get dozens of hits and you may not get any answers to your messages for months.
We grow up loving two main people, mom and pop. Then we have have sisters and brothers and best friends, so why not be poly?
Makes sense to me!
I look at some friends that we come in contact with and think it would be nice to give the gift of pleasuring each other openly in a friendly fwb way and that we could both enjoy others.
That's a fun fantasy when you're horny, but it's not a wonderful idea to have sex with friends, because if the romantic/sexual relationship ends, you might lose the friendship. (Also remember that all the porn you watch with group sex is just fantasy, porn. Few people have frequent group sex. Some swingers do. Few poly people do.)
I'm just wondering if there is a way to repair and inspire our intimacy and get to the next level, or what others have to say.
The only way to reestablish intimacy is to be emotionally honest and raw. And if you do tell her how frustrated and lonely you feel, she might pick up the pace for a short time, and then things could slack off again. Again, I recommend counseling. You could start alone, if she won't agree to it.

This problem is as old as time, and I'm sure there's plenty of advice out there about how to increase the frequency of married sex.
 
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Hello CARTER,

Perhaps the best way to put it is, "Honey, I am interested in polyamory, and perhaps swinging. Is there a way we can talk about that?" I feel that that's the best way to avoid being insulting: Make it short, sweet, and direct. You may also need to have a talk with your spouse about your sexual frustrations. Anyway those are my initial thoughts.

Regards,
Kevin T.
 
You wanted it to increase to every day? Or it was at first, and then became less frequent?

It sounds like your married sex never lived up to its potential, in your eyes. How long have you been married? Why did you get married so quickly? How old are you both?

We call it dropping the poly bomb because of its earth shattering consequences. But only you can decide if its worth it to bring up the topic. I say it is. Of course, marriages can have lulls in sexual activity, especially because of kids, illness or injury, demanding jobs, school, doing a lot of elder care, needing to go on a lot of trips due to work, etc. Every couple will make its own decision about what to do as far as mismatched sexual desire. The common way to deal is for someone to cheat. That is because our entire culture is meant to be monogamous, death til you part, type of thing. But this goes against human nature and actual reality. Few and far between are the perfectly matched entirely mono couples.

Yes.

Many people, even those with active partnered sex lives, need a sexual release daily, especially younger men, because of the higher testosterone levels. But no partner is expected to perform and fulfill your every sexual need. Even if you had 2 or 3 partners you might not get the daily release, or even every other day. lol. But it does help, if you get lucky.

The old elephant in the room. This is so common. I believe it's best to be mature and honest and break the news if you're feeling really frustrated with all the masturbating and sex once a month or less. Indeed, some couples end up going years without sex. There are ways to increase the emotional intimacy that might lead to better sex and more of it, but that might take the advice and support of a couples therapist, once you do bring up the subject.

So her sex drive is low because of her job, as you said previously, but also because she's gained weight and gotten older? Does she have low self esteem because of the weight gain? And that reduces her desire to have sex?

You want to stay married. But since her sex drive is so low and she's vanilla (as far as you know...) she might find the idea of ADDING new sex partners for herself the opposite of what she wants or needs. However, you could open just on your side, if she consents. Big "if," I know.

On the other hand, if there are emotional barriers between you two, a new partner for her, with the excitement of NRE, might increase her sex drive for him, leaving you further in the dust. This is an irony of an open relationship. If you both join a dating site, she'd get dozens of hits and you may not get any answers to your messages for months.

Makes sense to me!

That's a fun fantasy when you're horny, but it's not a wonderful idea to have sex with friends, because if the romantic/sexual relationship ends, you might lose the friendship. (Also remember that all the porn you watch with group sex is just fantasy, porn. Few people have frequent group sex. Some swingers do. Few poly people do.)

The only way to reestablish intimacy is to be emotionally honest and raw. And if you do tell her how frustrated and lonely you feel, she might pick up the pace for a short time, and then things could slack off again. Again, I recommend counseling. You could start alone, if she won't agree to it.

This problem is as old as time, and I'm sure there's plenty of advice out there about how to increase the frequency of married sex.
Most of the women I've dated I got to hear their fantasies which included a 3rd which made our lovemaking exciting so I naturally thought I'd end up in a poly like relationship. It always felt so liberating talking with each other about what we liked in others and what we saw that turned us on and sharing all those thoughts openly, it felt like freedom and equality even though we never got around to bringing in a 3rd or dating others together.
When I met my spouse it was like no other mentally we clicked and still do but in life their are some challenges.
Yes in the early days we were at it everyday, she 44 and me 48. I am naive and thought things would continue to progress then work stress set in.
At one point she said she could survive not ever having sex, which totally rocked me. I've been sexual since a very young age and aways aware of women's beauty since kindergarten with crushes back then so hearing this totally rocked me. But she realizes how important it is to me as it is how I express love in our marriage. Confidence, not sure but when the time is right I can bring it up casually.
Thanks for the wise wisdom ! I'm all ears !!!
 
I can't tell if you want more sexual partners or more romantic (love) partners. At times, you seem to suggest you'd like both, but most of your specific goals/fantasies seem to involve sex. That's fine! But it's good to know what your goals are, as these are pretty different. Some non-monogamous people are just seeking sex, and may even have rules against more emotional attachments (which obviously can happen anyway, of course, but some people end any relationship that starts going down that road in order to protect their existing relationship). Others are open to, or even seeking, love (or at least emotional attachments of various levels).

If it's just sex, I will echo the above advice that sex workers or hookup apps are likely the way to go. But it sounds like your wife would be devastated if she found out about this. That's a tough situation for you. Is it possible this will change one day? Sometimes people shift on this issue. My spouse didn't think she would want an open relationship, but a few years later, she asked for it (knowing I was already open to that) and it's been great. But that doesn't mean everyone will shift like that.

If you want polyamory (more love), that might be trickier. It sounds like your wife wouldn't like that idea at all, but again, since you focus on the sexual component, maybe emotional attachments wouldn't bother her as much?

There's a lot of literature out there that you might share with her. Polysecure is great if you actually begin that journey. Opening Up is often recommended. I haven't read it personally. Designer Relationships has some good advice on the various ways you might approach relationships. Would your wife be open to reading any of those, or is that already going to make her feel threatened?
 
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Most of the women I've dated, I got to hear their fantasies, which included a 3rd, which made our lovemaking exciting. So I naturally thought I'd end up in a poly-like relationship. It always felt so liberating talking with each other about what we liked in others and what we saw that turned us on and sharing all those thoughts openly, it felt like freedom and equality, even though we never got around to bringing in a 3rd or dating others together.
It's great to share fantasies with your partner! It can definitely make things more exciting. And some people do manage to have threesomes in real life and overcome any problems they might have with it. I'd just recommend caution. Fantasies are something you have complete control over. Once you involve actual people with thoughts and feelings of their own, it's a whole different ballgame.

FMF fantasies are the most common ones for men, mono or not. Usually it's just that, a fantasy. Humans are designed to be promiscuous. Over the centuries, we have designed different ways to deal with this. There were even fertility-based holidays (such as May Day/Beltane) in earlier times, where people were religiously and legally allowed to go about the village and screw whoever was willing. (This helped with increasing the population, if, for example, a woman's husband was impotent or sterile, or vice versa.) There were also holy sex workers in temples, where people could go to honor the gods by taking part in ritual sex.

I find the saying "bringing in a third" to sound kind of disrespectful to the newer partner, myself. She's not entering into your existing relationship. She would have separate unique relationships with each person in your hypothetical dyad, one with you, one with your longer-term partner. Each dyad needs to be nurtured as its own separate unit. Unless, of course, she's just a good time girl, who comes in just for sex and then leaves, with no actual dating or texting involved, except something basic to set up the next sex romp. And in triads, there's always a chance she'll click with one of you, and not the other, or vice versa, one of you really likes her and the other finds her meh.

Anyway, just because you have fantasies about sex and share them with a partner does not mean you are automatically polyamorous. There are many practicalities involved.


When I met my spouse it was like no other mentally. We clicked and still do but in life there are some challenges.
Yes, in the early days we were at it every day, she at 44 and me 48. I am naive and thought things would continue to progress, then work stress set in.
At one point she said she could survive not ever having sex, which totally rocked me. I've been sexual since a very young age, and aways aware of women's beauty since kindergarten with crushes back then. So hearing this totally rocked me. But she realizes how important it is to me as it is how I express love in our marriage. Confidence, not sure but when the time is right I can bring it up casually.
Thanks for the wise wisdom! I'm all ears!!!
This sometimes happens. Women's sex drives are more variable than men's. During our fertile era, often we are much more interested in sex during ovulation and kind of uninterested otherwise. And during our early 40s (usually), perimenopause starts to set in, where our hormones start to fire more erratically. This can make us become more or less horny overall. Often women's sex drives do increase in their 40s, when we are more in touch with ourselves, more confident in our bodies, more successful in our careers, and starting to have less worries about getting pregnant. This was the case for me. My sex drive increased dramatically! And it's still high now, even though I'm in my 60s.

However, some women's drives decrease, and may even stop altogether. It sounds like your wife had a brief NRE-based surge of desire when you two hit it off in middle age, but now she's settled into being nearly asexual (grey-sexual). I'd recommend being honest about your mismatched desires and needs. It sounds like you are, but haven't decided what to do about it yet!

My female partner Pixi has a much lower sex drive than me. One of my motivations for dating men has always been to find a partner who could fulfill me sexually. I get super cranky and feel almost ill if I don't have a lusty partner. Luckily our relationship has been open/poly from the start and so Pixi always cheered me on in finding a guy I liked. Since I am demi-sexual, I prefer to only have sex with people with whom I have a strong emotional bond. I am also sapiosexual, meaning I need to click intellectually with a person too, before pursuing a sexual/romantic relationship.

I hope you two can come to an agreement. It takes a lot of courage, but it could pay off.
 
I can't tell if you want more sexual partners or more romantic (love) partners. At times, you seem to suggest you'd like both, but most of your specific goals/fantasies seem to involve sex. That's fine! But it's good to know what your goals are, as these are pretty different. Some non-monogamous people are just seeking sex, and may even have rules against more emotional attachments (which obviously can happen anyway, of course, but some people end any relationship that starts going down that road in order to protect their existing relationship). Others are open to, or even seeking, love (or at least emotional attachments of various levels).

If it's just sex, I will echo the above advice that sex workers or hookup apps are likely the way to go. But it sounds like your wife would be devastated if she found out about this. That's a tough situation for you. Is it possible this will change one day? Sometimes people shift on this issue. My spouse didn't think she would want an open relationship, but a few years later, she asked for it (knowing I was already open to that) and it's been great. But that doesn't mean everyone will shift like that.

If you want polyamory (more love), that might be trickier. It sounds like your wife wouldn't like that idea at all, but again, since you focus on the sexual component, maybe emotional attachments wouldn't bother her as much?

There's a lot of literature out there that you might share with her. Polysecure is great if you actually begin that journey. Opening Up is often recommended. I haven't read it personally. Designer Relationships has some good advice on the various ways you might approach relationships. Would your wife be open to reading any of those, or is that already going to make her feel threatened?
Very good response that really helps me put things in perspective. I don't want to drop any bombs and ruin what I have but good communication with these things to think about should help any bombs from going off while ideas and discussions take place. I'll have to read up on your suggestions.
 
It's great to share fantasies with your partner! It can definitely make things more exciting. And some people do manage to have threesomes in real life and overcome any problems they might have with it. I'd just recommend caution. Fantasies are something you have complete control over. Once you involve actual people with thoughts and feelings of their own, it's a whole different ballgame.

FMF fantasies are the most common ones for men, mono or not. Usually it's just that, a fantasy. Humans are designed to be promiscuous. Over the centuries, we have designed different ways to deal with this. There were even fertility-based holidays (such as May Day/Beltane) in earlier times, where people were religiously and legally allowed to go about the village and screw whoever was willing. (This helped with increasing the population, if, for example, a woman's husband was impotent or sterile, or vice versa.) There were also holy sex workers in temples, where people could go to honor the gods by taking part in ritual sex.

I find the saying "bringing in a third" to sound kind of disrespectful to the newer partner, myself. She's not entering into your existing relationship. She would have separate unique relationships with each person in your hypothetical dyad, one with you, one with your longer-term partner. Each dyad needs to be nurtured as its own separate unit. Unless, of course, she's just a good time girl, who comes in just for sex and then leaves, with no actual dating or texting involved, except something basic to set up the next sex romp. And in triads, there's always a chance she'll click with one of you, and not the other, or vice versa, one of you really likes her and the other finds her meh.

Anyway, just because you have fantasies about sex and share them with a partner does not mean you are automatically polyamorous. There are many practicalities involved.



This sometimes happens. Women's sex drives are more variable than men's. During our fertile era, often we are much more interested in sex during ovulation and kind of uninterested otherwise. And during our early 40s (usually), perimenopause starts to set in, where our hormones start to fire more erratically. This can make us become more or less horny overall. Often women's sex drives do increase in their 40s, when we are more in touch with ourselves, more confident in our bodies, more successful in our careers, and starting to have less worries about getting pregnant. This was the case for me. My sex drive increased dramatically! And it's still high now, even though I'm in my 60s.

However, some women's drives decrease, and may even stop altogether. It sounds like your wife had a brief NRE-based surge of desire when you two hit it off in middle age, but now she's settled into being nearly asexual (grey-sexual). I'd recommend being honest about your mismatched desires and needs. It sounds like you are, but haven't decided what to do about it yet!

My female partner Pixi has a much lower sex drive than me. One of my motivations for dating men has always been to find a partner who could fulfill me sexually. I get super cranky and feel almost ill if I don't have a lusty partner. Luckily our relationship has been open/poly from the start and so Pixi always cheered me on in finding a guy I liked. Since I am demi-sexual, I prefer to only have sex with people with whom I have a strong emotional bond. I am also sapiosexual, meaning I need to click intellectually with a person too, before pursuing a sexual/romantic relationship.

I hope you two can come to an agreement. It takes a lot of courage, but it could pay off.
'' I get super cranky and feel almost ill if I don't have a lusty partner'' I'm not at the ill state but your comment certainly strikes a cord with me ! So good you have a great sex drive. My wife and I are sapiosexual, we click with each other and being sexual with someone without that connection would be like making love to a hooker, just not doable. I'm enjoying the replies and learning. Thanks
 
[I am sapiosexual] and being sexual with someone without that connection would be like making love to a hooker, just not doable.

That's good information for our members to know. Many have suggested going to a sex worker, or just having quick hookups. I see that would not interest you. It sounds like you are actually polyamorous and not just wanting recreational sex with anyone willing.
 
Definitely something to mention. Changes my advice completely. In that case, ignore the sex worker/rec sex advice. Focus on lovingly and openly talking to your partner. I also need an emotional connection to my partners and a purely sexual relationship is not interesting to me. However, I would recommend dropping the word 'hooker' from your vocab. You probably don't mean to do so, but it's demeaning to sex workers in general.

A lot of couples start with sharing (basically being in the same room, often not even touching the other people). That might be hard if your partner isn't feeling sexual, but for some couples, this provides a safe starting point. I did not go this route, but one of my partners did and it worked well for her as a transition to solo dating.
 
I, too, was going to suggest an arrangement with a sex worker to assuage your need for "daily release" (of course assuming that you worked this out with your wife) until I read your response in Post#12 - but I suppose that is the same reason why masturbation and porn are not sufficient. That being said, I am concerned what your wife, knowing as you have stated that sex is "how you express love" in your marriage is going to feel about your desire to seek that out with other people, AND on a more frequent basis. (Not only the concept of poly but - IF sex=love THEN does more sex = more love? - i.e. Would she then think that you would love her less if you had sex with others more?) It appears that Physical Touch is your top Love Language. What is your wife's?

My husband and I also have a mis-matched sex drive. He is grey-ace - he has no particular desire for sex for himself but is not opposed to engaging in sexual activities to pleasure others. (When we were first together (late teens/early 20s) he DID have a bit of sex drive, so this wasn't quite as apparent...) HIS main love language is Giving of Gifts and MY main love language is Acts of Service - so on the rare occassions when we DO interact sexually with each other the running joke is that he is giving me the gift of "servicing me" ;) .

For me, sex and love are two different things that are not mutually exclusive. I can enjoy one, the other, or both in any given relationship to whatever degree is appropriate to that relationship. This is not the case with everyone. Some people need to experience (some degree of) love in order to enjoy sex. Some people need to engage in (some amount of) sex in order to express love.

Perhaps discussing sex, love, and love languages with your wife would be informative?
 
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