IndieSolo
Active member
I think it would be great to get that stuff out in the open.
Restless heart syndrome: cause or effect?
- Thread starter dingedheart
- Start date
I think it would be great to get that stuff out in the open.
SourGirl
Member
You read my mind again, lady. Be very careful. There isn`t a whole lot of material up there, you might run out of things to read.
If anyone wants to TRULY roll up their sleeves, and get real about the effects and consequences of their actions, then yes, a darker side of poly thread will enable the board to be much more objective. Like any other thread, if people don`t like it, they don't have to respond to it.
Or, we can all carry on like normal, having convos manipulating monogamists into our way of thinking, and talking about how everyone is actually really polyamorous, because bonobo monkeys do it on the Discovery Channel, and take all our cues from stories after the shit hits the fans.
I just want everyone to know that i was referring to OTHER people, not anyone here of course, and certainly not myself because i am perfect and do not make mistakes. I just can't prove it because how does one "prove" something doesn't exist? It's not as easy as proving something DOES exist. Like god, for example. Prove god DOESN'T exist. That's right - you can't, can you!
River
Well-known member
Carma
New member
I love the success stories, but I'm not a Pollyanna, either (haha, poly pun ). It's hard to hear the bitter side of it, but pretending it doesn't exist is not exactly realistic, is it?
It is easy to see from dingedheart's original post how polyamory can be interpreted by a mono partner. It helps to make me more sensitive to my husband's feelings.
I only have a minute to post, but one thing I did want to comment on was the "It's not you, it's me" concept, although you got the impression (and I guess the explicit message?) that it was you. Nonetheless, I think it's always some sort of mixture. Be the best you can be. What else can you do?
). It's hard to hear the bitter side of it, but pretending it doesn't exist is not exactly realistic, is it?It is easy to see from dingedheart's original post how polyamory can be interpreted by a mono partner. It helps to make me more sensitive to my husband's feelings.
I only have a minute to post, but one thing I did want to comment on was the "It's not you, it's me" concept, although you got the impression (and I guess the explicit message?) that it was you. Nonetheless, I think it's always some sort of mixture. Be the best you can be. What else can you do?
IndieSolo
Active member
I knew that!
River
Well-known member
redpepper
Active member
Sorry, I don't really get what you are saying here. You are asking me questions, but I don't really get what the hell you are talking about. lol.
As to my life? That has nothing to do with yours. So why bring it up? *confused*
I hear what you're saying, Neon, but "sucking it up" is the exact opposite of what is recommended. Being open and honest is the opposite of sucking things up.
This might be that thread. God knows my first foray into poly with my ex was rather a disaster, leading to me going on Zoloft for a year, and therapy for 3 years. But 10 years later, it's going fine (more or less), with a different primary and address!
Dinged has done that to NYCindie and me, as well-- made assumptions about our marriages/relationships. I guess he is looking for parallels to give him some sort of template to go on.
IndieSolo
Active member
Yes, and it seems that the whole fucking purpose of this thread is to say that polyamory causes so much pain and heartache, and aren't we all just a bunch of schmucks for going along with it when a partner wants it? When it's the people who do that to each other, not the fault of a structure for relationship.
If the OP is indeed saying that people are "schmucks" for going along with poly when a partner wants it, then by definition, the OP is also a "schmuck".
I agree that it does come across as if that is what the OP is saying.
But it doesn't go down with all of us that we're just going along with something to please our partners or doing something despite our partners' reservations.
So, again - it's a good idea for everyone to speak for themselves, not speak for others or rely on others to do their speaking for them.
MonoVCPHG
New member
Hi Love. dinged is merely repeating things that we have said in the past during times of struggle around mono/poly. We've stated and implied this several times.
We all know the issues around his wife's actions and the fallout of her carelessness. That was her main offence, for lack of a better term.
NeonKaos, I completely agree.
dinged, I have always felt multiple in my love and desires. Society forces us to choose monogamy, or pressures us to not enter into committed relationships if we refuse. Heteropatriarchal supremacy rules, still. Personally, I've rejected marriage, despite making commitments, because I didn't want that extra layer of expectations on me. I've never been in a mono/poly relationship as you describe, although there were periods where it may have looked or felt like "monoamory" but that was out of desire for it, not compulsion.
I'm new here. I don't know all the backstories and such, but here are some thoughts.
Relationships are work, they're joy, pain, security and risk. I've lived and worked through the full spectrum of amazingly wonderful to incredibly hurtful over the years.
From what you've said, it sounds like it's just not healthy for you to be in your relationship any longer. I'm struggling with that question myself, but not from a place of lashing out. What can get you to that place of peace with yourself to really think about what your needs are; of evaluating whether what you have is really right for you? It sounds like you're afraid -- of losing her, perhaps of not finding another. I don't know.
Honestly, I think you're wrong to blame polyamory or non-monoamorous relationships. And, "restless heart syndrome" -- the name implies that it's an illness. Multiple desires is not an illness. People grow and change. The issue is about you and your wife and what you have together. I would guess many of those issues would be there whether you were poly or mono.
I agree some of the lines she gave you sound like BS. I've never liked that kind of talk ("you can't meet all my needs" etc.). It doesn't seem honest. I'd rather hear, "I like this person and I still love you." From your side of it, she doesn't sound like she's taking you into consideration. That's not cool. Bottom line though, is you need to do things for yourself, and I don't mean that in a being selfish way, but in a what is important to your happiness way.
dingedheart
Well-known member
NYCndie, thank you for the explanation for your original post. I understand what you meant. I'd like to take a second and explain how I came to my response.
I asked a general question, and the first thing you commented on was the conversation. As I read your comments, I was thinking: no, my wife was very honestly telling me how she felt, and I was honestly listening to her new point of view. No other choice. As for connection, it's very hard to judge, even now. I would say I felt less connected as time went on.
Then you steered the focus to my relationship and wife. You wanted to have a conversation about that, when I was thinking in a more general sense.
As the day has worn on, the "fucking purpose" has come into question. As I said earlier, this was born out of a fireside chat on relationships. I didn't coin the phrase. There were several doctors there, so it could have been one of them. One guy is an actuarial consultant who we asked if he knew of the average shelf life of a typical suburban relationship with x y z parameters. I formulated the question from my own experience, no doubt. Plug in Freetime's early experience, or Carma's husband, or Vodkafan's story, if it helps.
RP, I was very surprised by your comments after the hundreds, perhaps thousands of personal stories that you've read, and all those you have counseled here on the forum. To have you stamp ditto on NYCindie's comment, and then add your judgement as to what you thought was my wife's biggest offense, seemed very dismissive. I think Sourgirl picked up on that, as well.
My comment about your relationship was an attempt to say wait, it's relevant, right in your own backyard, see? I'm glad Mono saw the connection, or at least the reason for my comment. Not an attack or parallel to my life at all. Sorry you took it as such.
NeonKaos, my original question and thought never had the "shmuck factor" in it. Now am I a shmuck, like to think not. Have I felt like a shmuck? Fuck, yes. But here again, that wouldn't be specific to poly. I'm there for my friends, relatives and employees. I generally will do what I can, day or night. People know this, and so have I been taken advantage of several times, especially by family members, but I always like to think the best of someone.
If I loan money, I do it not expect it back. I gave my sister $2800 so my nephew could continue at a private high school. I was told I'd be paid back in a month or 2. One year later, shmuck, well maybe. I never really thought I'd be paid back, so WTF. I've never mentioned it, and they haven't either.
Derby, thanks for the validation. I greatly appreciate it.
My situation has more or less resolved itself and so none of those things cause pain or resentment. However, I've been told that when I tell stories I'm very dramatic and animated, more or less relive the event or story. Maybe that's what happened here. Thanks for the insight.
I'm just thinking how I could one write those types of conversations any other way without deliberately trying to spin it.
Sourgirl, thanks for you for all your comments, insight and experience. I think you are a real asset to this forum. Love the Earnie Larson quote.
That's all I can think of. Hope you all have a great fun-packed weekend. Enjoy, D
I asked a general question, and the first thing you commented on was the conversation. As I read your comments, I was thinking: no, my wife was very honestly telling me how she felt, and I was honestly listening to her new point of view. No other choice. As for connection, it's very hard to judge, even now. I would say I felt less connected as time went on.
Then you steered the focus to my relationship and wife. You wanted to have a conversation about that, when I was thinking in a more general sense.
As the day has worn on, the "fucking purpose" has come into question. As I said earlier, this was born out of a fireside chat on relationships. I didn't coin the phrase. There were several doctors there, so it could have been one of them. One guy is an actuarial consultant who we asked if he knew of the average shelf life of a typical suburban relationship with x y z parameters. I formulated the question from my own experience, no doubt. Plug in Freetime's early experience, or Carma's husband, or Vodkafan's story, if it helps.
RP, I was very surprised by your comments after the hundreds, perhaps thousands of personal stories that you've read, and all those you have counseled here on the forum. To have you stamp ditto on NYCindie's comment, and then add your judgement as to what you thought was my wife's biggest offense, seemed very dismissive. I think Sourgirl picked up on that, as well.
My comment about your relationship was an attempt to say wait, it's relevant, right in your own backyard, see? I'm glad Mono saw the connection, or at least the reason for my comment. Not an attack or parallel to my life at all. Sorry you took it as such.
NeonKaos, my original question and thought never had the "shmuck factor" in it. Now am I a shmuck, like to think not. Have I felt like a shmuck? Fuck, yes. But here again, that wouldn't be specific to poly. I'm there for my friends, relatives and employees. I generally will do what I can, day or night. People know this, and so have I been taken advantage of several times, especially by family members, but I always like to think the best of someone.
If I loan money, I do it not expect it back. I gave my sister $2800 so my nephew could continue at a private high school. I was told I'd be paid back in a month or 2. One year later, shmuck, well maybe. I never really thought I'd be paid back, so WTF. I've never mentioned it, and they haven't either.
Derby, thanks for the validation. I greatly appreciate it.
My situation has more or less resolved itself and so none of those things cause pain or resentment. However, I've been told that when I tell stories I'm very dramatic and animated, more or less relive the event or story. Maybe that's what happened here. Thanks for the insight.
I'm just thinking how I could one write those types of conversations any other way without deliberately trying to spin it.
Sourgirl, thanks for you for all your comments, insight and experience. I think you are a real asset to this forum. Love the Earnie Larson quote.
That's all I can think of. Hope you all have a great fun-packed weekend. Enjoy, D
IndieSolo
Active member
I didn't want any specific direction for the discussion. I simply gave my feedback, keeping your situation in mind, since it was you who started the thread and not anyone else.
I also really like what Chimera added to the thread. Good stuff, especially this:
I still don't know what "Restless Heart Syndrome" is supposed to be describing. Is it wanting polyamory, or to move on to a different relationship? It sounds like someone who wants to keep moving. What does it mean to you?
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SNeacail
New member
If I'm not mistaken, this was the original point of this thread. I am completely guilty of missing the point amongst all the examples that were in the original post.
I think it is very likely a combination of factors, and each person will probably have a different combination of answers.
redpepper
Active member
I'm sorry if you misunderstood, but I meant my original comment in terms of YOUR perspective, not mine. I believed from your other threads here that YOU believed her offence was the BDSM aspect of her other relationship life that you didn't know about at the time, specifically coming to light when your child found pictures/text she had on her computer. I believed that you had an issue with that, not so much the poly at that time. Poly and BDSM don't go hand-in-hand for everyone. I was trying to clarify with you so as to understand what you were asking.
You came here to begin with to understand and come to terms with her being poly and having a boyfriend. You were dealing with that as best you could. The BDSM seemed to put you over the edge. From what I gather, she didn't tell you about that stuff. What I was asking YOU (in my original post) is, do you think she didn't tell you because she knew you well enough that she figured you would lose it?
As to the question of "restless heart syndrome," I don't know what that is. Is it a medical term? Is it a diagnosis that can be found in the DSM? Is it an actual syndrome? You are asking a person who deals with a hell of a lot of "syndromes" in my line of work. "Down's syndrome" being the most well known, as an example. I'm just wondering if you have a link that would direct me to some knowledge about restless heart syndrome that would help me understand the question more.
I am familiar with narcissism, but again, I would have a hard time answering, as I am only familiar with it in terms of actual diagnosis and in terms of understanding my mother. If you are asking if I, or anyone else here, came into poly because we are narcissistic, then I would have to answer that for me the answer would be no. I don't have that diagnosis.
"Boredom," "self entitlement," hmm... interesting. It was a long time ago, and I don't believe that I was bored with my wife at the time I understood who I was. I have always had the ability to love more than one person. I just didn't realize that it was okay to show that, and that people actually identify as being non-monogamous, rather than monogamous. To me it was like saying, "I'm bi-sexual." It just is.
I find it very confusing and bizarre to think of my loving more than one person, and creating a life with them, and everyone else I am in a relationship with, in terms of entitlement and boredom. It would be like asking you if you you were bored of feeling entitled when you met and fell in love with your wife back in the day. I would hazard a guess that the answer would be no, and would also be equally confusing.
redpepper
Active member
Hi there, love. You're going to have to school me on what these statements are, because I'm not getting it from what you have written here. What are the posts and what have I implied?
Sorry for the hijack, dinged. Mono can talk to me about it some other time, unless it's of utmost importance in terms of the questions you have, in which case, I will wait for his response.
dingedheart
Well-known member
RP, I always thought I was very clear on what my wife's biggest offense was-- judgement or lack thereof, or stupidity, for the record, once again.
No, restless heart syndrome is not an actual medical condition, along with the other colorful euphemisms, like seven year itch, wandering pee pee, etc. It was someone's invention to explain what happens to marriages after (x) years. I'll try to find out which one of the drunken idiots came up with it, and where they heard it. I'm sure it wasn't coined by them, either.
I'm not surprised at all that you and others don't understand what I was trying to get across, because your relationships were based from the beginning on a non-monogamous model. So this question or questions don't apply. You have to agree we got here from opposite directions.
As I said before, this came out of a fireside chat that centered around a male friend of ours who repeatedly had affairs on his wife, which created a considerable amount of damage in his family, and others in his life, and practice, as well. But he really doesn't seem to care enough to stop hurting those people.
There were a couple doctors present. Narcissism and self-entitlement were thrown up as possible reasons for such blatant disregard. I'm convinced my wife could have elements of narcissism, boredom, and self-entitlement. Those discussions we had were centered around what she wanted, what she needed, or rather, her needs not being met. Her being free to choose how to meet those needs, her not belonging to me as a possession, her relationship with someone else doesn't effect her feelings for me. All very self-centered conversations. Lots of sentences that started with "I." I'm not saying that was necessarily bad or wrong, more as a fact, the way she chose to make her thoughts known.
In your last paragraph, you asked if I felt bored or entitled when I fell in love with my wife, correct? The thing that you might be missing here is I signed up for one thing, then the rules of the game were being changed. Before long, it's not the same game anymore. You and yours knew the rules up front, agreed to the the rules before the game started. Lots different, don't you think? "I" want to change the rules now-- self-entitlement, maybe? Maybe not?
No, restless heart syndrome is not an actual medical condition, along with the other colorful euphemisms, like seven year itch, wandering pee pee, etc. It was someone's invention to explain what happens to marriages after (x) years. I'll try to find out which one of the drunken idiots came up with it, and where they heard it. I'm sure it wasn't coined by them, either.
I'm not surprised at all that you and others don't understand what I was trying to get across, because your relationships were based from the beginning on a non-monogamous model. So this question or questions don't apply. You have to agree we got here from opposite directions.
As I said before, this came out of a fireside chat that centered around a male friend of ours who repeatedly had affairs on his wife, which created a considerable amount of damage in his family, and others in his life, and practice, as well. But he really doesn't seem to care enough to stop hurting those people.
There were a couple doctors present. Narcissism and self-entitlement were thrown up as possible reasons for such blatant disregard. I'm convinced my wife could have elements of narcissism, boredom, and self-entitlement. Those discussions we had were centered around what she wanted, what she needed, or rather, her needs not being met. Her being free to choose how to meet those needs, her not belonging to me as a possession, her relationship with someone else doesn't effect her feelings for me. All very self-centered conversations. Lots of sentences that started with "I." I'm not saying that was necessarily bad or wrong, more as a fact, the way she chose to make her thoughts known.
In your last paragraph, you asked if I felt bored or entitled when I fell in love with my wife, correct? The thing that you might be missing here is I signed up for one thing, then the rules of the game were being changed. Before long, it's not the same game anymore. You and yours knew the rules up front, agreed to the the rules before the game started. Lots different, don't you think? "I" want to change the rules now-- self-entitlement, maybe? Maybe not?