Blowing open the poly closet... without warning anyone... to swing the relationship to poly from open?

https://polyamory.com/threads/the-u...ld-friend-suddenly-isnt-just-a-friend.153630/ (The source of all of this).

It's been 6 months since I posted that - 6 wonderful and amazing months full of dates and great times with Kayla, doubles with her husband Joe and his GF Samantha, and overall amazing times. We're still sticking with DADT for my wife May, but everything there is still stable and happy as well (and her BF and her are getting closer as well).

And then last week, Kayla dropped a bit of a bombshell on me. She's met a couple of new friends at her work (married couple, we'll call them J and H), and her and I have been hanging out with them a little bit at a local place where Kayla works. A week and change ago, she let me know out of the blue that she'd come out of the closet with them (all of us have been in the poly closet due to family reactions/potential work impacts/etc, which especially drives Samantha a bit nuts). She told them she was married, I was her boyfriend, she's in a poly relationship, etc. She needed someone to talk to that wasn't me about all of this, since we're all ~in~ the relationship - and all of her friends have either moved away or are not folks she could talk to about this.

My first reaction was of course being a little startled, but so far I really like J and H, so I'm ok with them knowing as friends - she seems to want to have some friends that know us as a "couple", instead of "Kayla and Rick are dating, but they're both married to someone different." All right, I can... understand that, although it feels weird at first - especially as she doesn't seem to want to introduce her husband or his GF to them (since they're now "our" friends). We start planning some things and some double dates - lots of shared interests there, so cool - we can totally hang. LOTS in common in fact.

The following week she dropped a second bombshell - she's very much attracted to both J and H, and if the opportunity arose, would very much like to sleep with both of them (although she did clarify that she thinks she's looking more for a fling than an additional relationship). This... was a startle even more to me. We've all been very happy with how the polycue has formed so far, and I'm not sure how anyone involved would take the idea of opening it up farther (especially Bryan, her husband). More so with the idea of flings or the like too, which wasn't quite what Bryan intended when he started all of this way back when.

I'm not sure how to take the first bombshell now - was that honestly seeking friends, or "setting up" the second thing? (She's a social butterfly, so she gloms hard onto new friends pretty hard for a bit).

Secondly, we have NO idea if J/H are even into non-monogamous relationships. Everything I've picked up is that they're liberal (as those things go), but really looking for some friends (they moved here in the middle of the pandemic - hard to find friends when you're locked up inside, and one of them even caught Covid). How... does one even ask about that, to figure out what they're thinking? Is it extremely weird to say at some point "Hey, we introduced ourselves as poly and together... just to avoid any embarrassing or awkward moments, are you all just looking for friends, or something potentially more?"

We had an amazingly good date yesterday where she brought up hanging out with them and everything, but also made it VERY clear that she was very much not planning on getting rid of me or moving on. Right now we're planning to meet up for some drinks in a few weeks, and then have a movie night planned a ways out after that - and I'm looking forward to hanging with them, but still a bit weirded out by the idea of things suddenly becoming a "her seeing both people at the same time" unexpectedly (when her husband+gf hang out with us, it's very much two couples - bryan/samantha and me/kayla).. So, is THAT more normal, or is a fully mixed "you're flirting/playing with both people at the same time" a bit more normal? IS there a normal?

How do I express that "hey, I don't necessarily have an issue with you dating J/H, if that's what happens and they're ok with that (and if Kayla's husband is ok with that), but... I may not be comfortable if every time we hang with them it's a date for you with them, and I'm just along for the ride" - or something like that.

Just feeling a bit... uncentered, I think - since this came up out of no where. We literally met these people 3 weeks ago, and this seems to be moving fast - although there's also no sign that it's anything other than FRIENDS too... more people are monogamous than not. Gah!
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
How do I express that "hey, I don't necessarily have an issue with you dating J/H, if that's what happens and they're ok with that (and if Kayla's husband is ok with that), but... I may not be comfortable if every time we hang with them it's a date for you with them, and I'm just along for the ride" - or something like that.

Why not say just that?

Galagirl
 
Why not say just that?

Galagirl
That ... is surprisingly logical, and I feel a bit silly for not thinking it myself. Also still likely to be putting the cart before the horse, since we don't have a clue that these folks are even into any form of ENM.

Any thoughts on any of the rest of it?
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
Also still likely to be putting the cart before the horse, since we don't have a clue that these folks are even into any form of ENM.

Doesn't really matter what the potential people are or are not into if the point is to let your partner know where YOU stand on things.

On the rest of it? I'm surprised your poly group didn't already talk about it.

I mean, what happens if you, Joe the husband, or his GF Samantha decides they want to date other people? Not just Kayla? Is this group open to that? Or is it a closed group and already at poly saturation? Or some have full plates and choose not to date more, but some could and do want to date more? IS her husband ok with her dating more? The other people in the group?

Like... what's the current deal here?

Talk all that out.

Galagirl
 
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icesong

Well-known member
So, is THAT more normal, or is a fully mixed "you're flirting/playing with both people at the same time" a bit more normal? IS there a normal?
There is no normal, seriously. For me it wildly depends on mood - most of the time if me/Knight/Artist/Joan are together it ends up as you describe, two couples. But I have been in situations where it was more, hmm, free for all, and if I have a big party and am slightly drunk, all bets are off, I’m kissing everyone. ;-)

But I agree that it’s at least reasonable to know, going into a hangout, what to expect, and reasonable (especially in a set of new relationships, which IIRC you can ) not to want to be the “odd one out”. (Truthfully that was the weirdest thing to get used to in a live-in V; realistically I _am_ gonna sometimes be the odd one out. )
 

Magdlyn

Well-known member
So it sounds like Kayla has some new friends, and you like them too. And now she's all horned up and feeling like she'd like to fuck them both. Well!

First of all, just because you have a crush does not mean you have to act on it.
2) Maybe this couple isn't open. No one knows yet. Kayla would need to ask them, one at a time or separately.
3) If you and Kayla go see this couple and they want to fuck her as much as she wants to fuck them, they can do that the next time. Kayla can go see them on her own for hanky panky.
4) Maybe only one of the couple wants to fuck her. Maybe they don't like to "share" one gf. Most poly couples date separately. Poly does not equal group sex.
5) Maybe, even if they are open, they aren't attracted to her. Poly people don't just fuck anyone that comes along.
6) Maybe one wants to fuck her and the other doesn't.
7) Maybe they are open, they both find Kayla attractive, but one or the other or both are not looking for lovers at this time, just friends.
8) Maybe the male would fuck Kayla and the female wants to fuck you!

These are just issues that pop out to me right off the bat.
 
Doesn't really matter what the potential people are or are not into if the point is to let your partner know where YOU stand on things.

On the rest of it? I'm surprised your poly group didn't already talk about it.

I mean, what happens if you, Joe the husband, or his GF Samantha decides they want to date other people? Not just Kayla? Is this group open to that? Or is it a closed group and already at poly saturation? Or some have full plates and choose not to date more, but some could and do want to date more? IS her husband ok with her dating more? The other people in the group?

Like... what's the current deal here?

Talk all that out.

Galagirl
We have a little bit - previously, at least. The expectation was that we were all effectively "in the closet" and not looking to expand at all, although it wasn't 'explicitly' said. The closet portion due to family/work concerns, as well as Samantha finishing her divorce, and the fact that we were all quite satisfied and saturated with what we had (two relationships for each of us, with them being full-on boyfriend/girlfriend or husband/wife is a lot to manage, especially with busy busy schedules).

Joe - I don't know if he would feel up to samantha dating someone else right now, although he might be ok with it. She's had a few casual dates here and there, but that's about it.
Samantha - doesn't want anything serious. She'll go out for drinks, but Joe is her primary effectively (and she's really become his), and they're very happy with how that has landed.
Kayla? We thought she was happy with the balance (husband, primary boyfriend)... but that's what we're trying to figure out now.

As for her husband - while samantha is effectively his primary now (for various reasons), he would not be happy or ok (most likely) with Kayla dating more. As it is, they see each other rarely (schedules and other things), and that would mean seeing her even less. We have a balance with the two partners for her, but more would... skew that. Which might also be part of why I'm twitchy - I get to see her on average once a week, and would be giving up some of my time if she dated more, as she doesn't have any OTHER time to give up.

I think we all thought it was a closed group at saturation - schedules pretty well worked out for when we got to see secondaries, when we did things as groups, and when we were on our own or with our other partners.

And she hasn't really told Joe about this being a possibility either. Which is a separate, major potential issue.
 
There is no normal, seriously. For me it wildly depends on mood - most of the time if me/Knight/Artist/Joan are together it ends up as you describe, two couples. But I have been in situations where it was more, hmm, free for all, and if I have a big party and am slightly drunk, all bets are off, I’m kissing everyone. ;-)

But I agree that it’s at least reasonable to know, going into a hangout, what to expect, and reasonable (especially in a set of new relationships, which IIRC you can ) not to want to be the “odd one out”. (Truthfully that was the weirdest thing to get used to in a live-in V; realistically I _am_ gonna sometimes be the odd one out. )
I guess that's how almost all my experience has been - double couples when together, not mixing. And I really have no issue with the "PARTY! Make out times!" - that's happened :p A few times. Party play is play.

And yeah, sometimes the triad is together and I'm the odd man out - but I've known all of them for YEARS, and we've been doing this now for 6 months, so that part isn't weird, just a "cool, I'm the friend tonight. All good." But you're right - if we're going to expand, we have to figure out if this is a date or a hangout.
 

tdh

Member
@Rickmanger...you are not at all worried, mad, upset, relieved, violated, cautious, or any other feeling words about being outed without your consent? Just want to make sure because it seems to have been glossed over and could see this coming up a potential violation of trust later on after all the practical poly group discussion and the NRE ends.
 
So it sounds like Kayla has some new friends, and you like them too. And now she's all horned up and feeling like she'd like to fuck them both. Well!

First of all, just because you have a crush does not mean you have to act on it.
2) Maybe this couple isn't open. No one knows yet. Kayla would need to ask them, one at a time or separately.
3) If you and Kayla go see this couple and they want to fuck her as much as she wants to fuck them, they can do that the next time. Kayla can go see them on her own for hanky panky.
4) Maybe only one of the couple wants to fuck her. Maybe they don't like to "share" one gf. Most poly couples date separately. Poly does not equal group sex.
5) Maybe, even if they are open, they aren't attracted to her. Poly people don't just fuck anyone that comes along.
6) Maybe one wants to fuck her and the other doesn't.
7) Maybe they are open, they both find Kayla attractive, but one or the other or both are not looking for lovers at this time, just friends.
8) Maybe the male would fuck Kayla and the female wants to fuck you!

These are just issues that pop out to me right off the bat.
I always appreciate your responses on here...
1. Good point. And hell, it took her 6 months to work up to making it clear to me! (and me 6 months to make a move)
2. How do you go about doing that? We have a group chat and all, and I've been talking with them to. How do you even approach that without coming off weird?
3. True.
4. Also true. May also not want to share her with anyone else (which is a total non-starter for everyone on our side). Definitely knew the not=group sex part, but yeah.
5. True.
6. Also true. It's not like we wear flags that say what our status is.
7. Point... And very good point. Don't know if it matters much, but H+J haven't been married that long either...
8. I'd be ... not opposed, but only if we're planning this (and yes, the old saying of "best laid plans" comes into this) as a FWB type of thing. Not because I'm opposed to feelings (at all), but... we all have so little time as it is. Maintaining friends that you might sleep with is one level of effort. Maintaining relationships is a whole different level. I do not have the cycles for another relationship. Kayla certainly doesn't (even less time free than I have!). That would mean sacrificing something from what we have currently built, and I'm not sure how anyone (myself included) would take that - Joe and Samantha would definitely be uncomfortable (samantha has already said as much, and is vehemently opposed).

Thank you.
 
@Rickmanger...you are not at all worried, mad, upset, relieved, violated, cautious, or any other feeling words about being outed without your consent? Just want to make sure because it seems to have been glossed over and could see this coming up a potential violation of trust later on after all the practical poly group discussion and the NRE ends.
At first, I wasn't, because this was almost immediately a "ok, so now we have a group of friends that knows US (me + kayla) as US (me + kayla)." A big thing for us is that we are both well known in our area, so we have to either drive a good ways on dates to get out of the area, or we have to act like somewhat affectionate friends except in private. We share a LOT of interests with J+H - like 90%, so this could be an awesome friendship!

Alternatively, all of our other group of friends knows us as "they're dating, but Rick is attached and so is Kayla" - which isn't the same as having friends that just know you as a couple, if that makes sense? Friends that predate the polycue act differently than these two do - they've never met Bryan or Samantha, they just know "us".

Now? Now I feel a little... worried, and a tiny touch violated if there was an alternative motive involved... a bit concerned that this secret is going to come out in a way that gets unwanted attention... I guess I'm hurt that I wasn't asked first, if there WAS an alternative motive. If this was honestly her going "hell, we finally have friends that we don't have to act different around or hide from..." that's different?

That make sense? It's really unsettling in some ways, and really exciting in others. We aren't super openly affectionate around the other friends that know most of the time, just because we don't want the sudden "who's with who" to make them uncomfortable...
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
We have a little bit - previously, at least. The expectation was that we were all effectively "in the closet" and not looking to expand at all, although it wasn't 'explicitly' said.

I think we all thought it was a closed group at saturation - schedules pretty well worked out for when we got to see secondaries, when we did things as groups, and when we were on our own or with our other partners.

Maybe some of this stuff needs to be CLEAR AND EXPLICIT? Rather than "assuming we're on the same page about it?"

Since everyone is in the closet... Kayla outing herself/you doesn't technically break agreements because there was nothing explicit.

But it sounds like her going after new people would affect how much time she has to spend with existing partners. And being "outted" might bother some in the group.

A week and change ago, she let me know out of the blue that she'd come out of the closet with them

She might think she's outting herself. That doesn't impact just her though.

Cuz if Kayla is married to Joe and she outs herself and people know she's married to Joe? She's "automatically" outting him too. He might not appreciate that.

And the rest in the group -- you and Samantha -- might worry about your ability to stay in the closet now too. Because if people know you as "Kayla's BF" and she's out as poly? Then you are "automatically outted" too. You might not appreciate that.

You were put on the spot, and caught unawares here. So you might want to talk to Kayla about how you do/do not want to be outted and you do/do not want to put on the spot like that again. Newbie mistakes happen -- but you could talk so they lessen over time.

Galagirl
 
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tdh

Member
At first, I wasn't, because this was almost immediately a "ok, so now we have a group of friends that knows US (me + kayla) as US (me + kayla)." A big thing for us is that we are both well known in our area, so we have to either drive a good ways on dates to get out of the area, or we have to act like somewhat affectionate friends except in private. We share a LOT of interests with J+H - like 90%, so this could be an awesome friendship!

Alternatively, all of our other group of friends knows us as "they're dating, but Rick is attached and so is Kayla" - which isn't the same as having friends that just know you as a couple, if that makes sense? Friends that predate the polycue act differently than these two do - they've never met Bryan or Samantha, they just know "us".

Now? Now I feel a little... worried, and a tiny touch violated if there was an alternative motive involved... a bit concerned that this secret is going to come out in a way that gets unwanted attention... I guess I'm hurt that I wasn't asked first, if there WAS an alternative motive. If this was honestly her going "hell, we finally have friends that we don't have to act different around or hide from..." that's different?

That make sense? It's really unsettling in some ways, and really exciting in others. We aren't super openly affectionate around the other friends that know most of the time, just because we don't want the sudden "who's with who" to make them uncomfortable...
That is good. Make sure you share those feelings with Kayla, Joe and Samantha (hopefully I didn't miss anyone). If you sit on them there is always a chance for them to morphe, unknowing to you even, into something.

I can personally get the relief of having people know, not judging, and being able to talk openly to some. But I have also gotten to control what I say and how I say it. If someone took that away from me or did not ask me first, I could see my range of emotion from mad, curious, worried and excited. Try to express thoses the best you can to your partners if you can.
 
That is good. Make sure you share those feelings with Kayla, Joe and Samantha (hopefully I didn't miss anyone). If you sit on them there is always a chance for them to morphe, unknowing to you even, into something.

I can personally get the relief of having people know, not judging, and being able to talk openly to some. But I have also gotten to control what I say and how I say it. If someone took that away from me or did not ask me first, I could see my range of emotion from mad, curious, worried and excited. Try to express thoses the best you can to your partners if you can.
That's an accurate list of feelings. Curiosity and excitement at first being dominant, because here's finally a group of friends that we get to act normal with (some of our outings farther out of town, she's told me "I'm really glad we got to act like a couple...")... and they want to actually do double dates, which is something that Joe/Samantha aren't as in to as well. Less on the mad and more on the confused, "what's the motivation?" side of it. We had our first overnight only last month, which was wonderful - because no one knew us out there.

When she told J+H, I found out after as we were leaving (that's when she let me know that she'd said "so, he's my boyfriend...") - next time we sat down with them I apologized for still pretending to just be the "friend" - and they laughed and said "hey, are you happy? Yes? That's all we care about." They've chatted with her some about it - about who's attached to who, how it works, etc - probably also a sign that they're not "in" the community right now, at least - but curiosity and making sure she's happy too.
 
Maybe some of this stuff needs to be CLEAR AND EXPLICIT? Rather than "assuming we're on the same page about it?"

Since everyone is in the closet... Kayla outing herself/you doesn't technically break agreements because there was nothing explicit.

But it sounds like her going after new people would affect how much time she has to spend with existing partners. And being "outted" might bother some in the group.
Yes. Yes it should be. But somehow, we didn't think to talk about it ahead of time - we all seemed to be looking for the same thing, as I know that Joe/Samantha have had that chat, and I've had that chat with them... we just don't seem to have had it with Kayla, which was a mistake. The only frustration was how Kayla/Me started, since we didn't give Joe any warning on that (from the original thread, it wasn't planned - it was a few drinks and then it happened).

As for the second, yes - I know samantha is a little uncomfortable being potentially outed now, especially in the small neighborhood they live and work in. I'm not sure Joe actually knows yet (he and I haven't had a chance to talk, and I'm not sure Kayla told him other than "Rick and I have a new group of friends we're going to hang out with")...

And yes, her seeing someone else would drastically affect the little bit of time she has for people right now. Her schedule is extremely awkward in some ways - we hang as a group one late evening of the week, and she and I have a standing date night or lunch, and she has one day for Joe/Samantha. The rest of the week she's busy every day until extremely late or even early into the morning.
She might think she's outting herself. That doesn't impact just her though.

Cuz if Kayla is married to Joe and she outs herself and people know she's married to Joe? She's "automatically" outting him too. He might not appreciate that.

And the rest in the group -- you and Samantha -- might worry about your ability to stay in the closet now too. Because if people know you as "Kayla's BF" and she's out as poly? Then you are "automatically outted" too. You might not appreciate that.

You were put on the spot, and caught unawares here. So you might want to talk to Kayla about how you do/do not want to be outted and you do/do not want to put on the spot like that again. Newbie mistakes happen -- but you could talk so they lessen over time.

Galagirl
Bingo. I think she really wanted someone to talk to about this too - and J+H are easy to talk to. She doesn't have any friends that aren't "inside" the bubble or heavily involved in some of what went down last year, and her only individual friends either moved away, or just got married and are starting their own lives... so she's not had a friend for herself either. I'm actually grateful that she's including me in that group too as her boyfriend. I get where she was coming from. And I REALLY get the "here's a friend group that is just ours" - as weird as that sounds, it makes sense for her, I think.

But you're right. She just outed Joe, effectively, or at least spread the circle of who knows and is asked to keep quiet wider - and the more people that know, the more chances something goes wrong. And yes, people definitely know she's married to Joe. Samantha is new to this group - everyone thinks they just have a roommate now. Samantha partially wants to be open, but also understands that there would be ... issues there and is ok with the closet because "don't blow up the families" is pretty much top-3 in the priority lists... and Joe has the same concerns. If J+H say something to the wrong person, things can now go in weird directions.

I'll try to have a conversation with her about it. I told her I was ok with J+H knowing, because yeah - I'd like to hang with them too, but you're dead on - there are a lot of implications of being open that I don't think were fully considered, and the other two aren't even fully aware that this is open with ~anyone~ outside the bubble yet.
 
Also, since talking with them is clearly a way to get a bit of clarity (no pun intended) - if someone introduced themselves to you as "hey, this is my significant other, we're in a poly relationship and both married to other people..." - does it come across as rude or weird to ask (appropriately) effectively "Hey, since we introduced ourselves this way, and you all have expressed a significant desire to hang out and be friends with us, can we clarify a bit on what you're looking for, to avoid any potential awkwardness?" Or is that asking someone to out themselves...?
 

kdt26417

Official Greeter
Hi Rickmanger,

One thing that occurs to me, is that at first Kayla wanted someone (i.e. you) to talk to about poly, someone who knew about the poly, but who wasn't *in* the poly bubble. Then you joined the bubble, so then Kayla couldn't vent to you or get advice about the poly situation because you were now *in* the situation. Part of the situation. Well, that problem was solved by J+H showing up, as they're not part of the situation, and could thus be talked to about the situation. They're on the outside, so to speak, yet are not judging you. Well, now (seeing as they're not judging you), Kayla wants to get romantically involved with them ... which is all well and good per se, but it does mean there'll be another "just a friend" that can't be talked to (for feedback and advice) about the poly situation, because they'll be *in* the poly situation, and can no longer be an outside party giving objective advice.

Suppose J+H agree to get involved. Then a new (empty) spot will open in the "need someone we can talk to" area, as J+H no longer qualify, and as you could no longer qualify before that. Now let's suppose that someone else comes along whom Kayla can talk to about the poly situation. Once that someone else knows about the poly situation, will they also qualify to become romantically entwined with Kayla? and suppose Kayla then propositions the new person/s (and they accept)? Then Kayla will have quite a few poly partners (you, Joe, J, H, and the new person/s), but still no outside perspectives she can tap into. See where I'm going? I'm not saying that's an inevitable sequence of events, but Kayla does seem to have a tendency to get involved with the people she outs herself to, creating a neverending need for new outsiders she can talk to. I wonder if she has considered that aspect of the situation? If the cycle continues, I suppose she'll run out of time?

Just an observation.
Regards,
Kevin T.
 

GalaGirl

Well-known member
I think Kayla has to figure out what she wants here.

If the main goal was to seek people to talk to outside the poly dating group to talk to about poly? I'd suggest online forums or finding poly groups with discussion group to participate in. Like... shop at the right store.

Just meeting some people at work doesn't mean they are automatically great at baseball, cooking, and talking about poly things. It's just some new people she met at work. They might be. They might not be. Time will tell.

Also, since talking with them is clearly a way to get a bit of clarity (no pun intended) - if someone introduced themselves to you as "hey, this is my significant other, we're in a poly relationship and both married to other people..." - does it come across as rude or weird to ask (appropriately) effectively "Hey, since we introduced ourselves this way, and you all have expressed a significant desire to hang out and be friends with us, can we clarify a bit on what you're looking for, to avoid any potential awkwardness?" Or is that asking someone to out themselves...?

I kinda wonder why YOU are the one asking this stuff. Rather than Kayla? She's the one wanting to be friends with them initially. Isn't it her problem?

If they ALREADY told her they are looking for friends? Why would they be "looking for" anything past friends anyway? No need to ask.

I wouldn't do it that way. I might be more "Tell me about you." And let them choose what to reveal about themselves at this time.

If Kayla is coming at them like you wrote? That feels awkward to me. And kinda like she is on the hunt for fresh meat and "friends" is just a way of getting the foot in the door.

And Kayla just met them at work? Then what? Make the coworker situation totally weird if she bungles this?

IMHO? Kayla may need to slow her roll some there. At this stage? It's just lust or initial attraction anyway on Kayla's end. Just because one feels something doesn't mean one HAS to pursue.

She doesn't have to go at it like "kid in a candy store" or something.

Esp when there's things to sort out with the poly group at home anyway with how much people wanted to be outted or not? And time management issues.

She could not get ahead or herself.

On your end?

Those may all be concerns you choose to bring up with her. Or you choose to say nothing and just step back and let her deal with her own stuff. Maybe she has to have it blow up before she realize she could think ahead more. People learn in different ways.

How you want to respond or react to your partner trying to make friends, date, etc. is on you. In that sense? You are still getting to know HER and her way of going.

It's not really your job to be her poly coach or the group "diplomat" making sure everyone gets the memo about her stuff.

I think you could expect the people to communicate their own things to the other people.

And you could communicate where YOU stand. Every person holding their own bag. Then you figure out what lines up or not.

Galagirl
 
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Hi Rickmanger,

One thing that occurs to me, is that at first Kayla wanted someone (i.e. you) to talk to about poly, someone who knew about the poly, but who wasn't *in* the poly bubble. Then you joined the bubble, so then Kayla couldn't vent to you or get advice about the poly situation because you were now *in* the situation. Part of the situation. Well, that problem was solved by J+H showing up, as they're not part of the situation, and could thus be talked to about the situation. They're on the outside, so to speak, yet are not judging you. Well, now (seeing as they're not judging you), Kayla wants to get romantically involved with them ... which is all well and good per se, but it does mean there'll be another "just a friend" that can't be talked to (for feedback and advice) about the poly situation, because they'll be *in* the poly situation, and can no longer be an outside party giving objective advice.

Suppose J+H agree to get involved. Then a new (empty) spot will open in the "need someone we can talk to" area, as J+H no longer qualify, and as you could no longer qualify before that. Now let's suppose that someone else comes along whom Kayla can talk to about the poly situation. Once that someone else knows about the poly situation, will they also qualify to become romantically entwined with Kayla? and suppose Kayla then propositions the new person/s (and they accept)? Then Kayla will have quite a few poly partners (you, Joe, J, H, and the new person/s), but still no outside perspectives she can tap into. See where I'm going? I'm not saying that's an inevitable sequence of events, but Kayla does seem to have a tendency to get involved with the people she outs herself to, creating a neverending need for new outsiders she can talk to. I wonder if she has considered that aspect of the situation? If the cycle continues, I suppose she'll run out of time?

Just an observation.
Regards,
Kevin T.
She's pretty much already out of time as it is! There's not a hell of a lot of it there to spread around with her schedule - early on Joe complained about "when do I get to see my wife...?", which we managed to find a balance (carefully) for... She would either have to cut down on the one half day she spends with me, the half day she spends with all of us, or the one day she spends with her family... and that's all there is free.
 
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