Polyamorists who have had near death experiences

Hmmmm, interesting. Jesus as a polyamorist. But does the Bible have any examples of a woman having more than one man?
This was a thought that plagued both my wife and I in our early initial polyamory research, ...that... as well as if marriage will be an afterlife item at all, period. The answer to both questions is "YES", but the answers to both are not in a way that you'd expect.

Initially we saw more instances of possible bi-sexual connections at first. Just remember, "any" kind of sexual behaviour, let alone sexually deviant behaviour is not blatantly obvious in scripture, but is usually often suggested but not openly mentioned and not a topic for discussion in civilized conversation. The same was true here, but we're more open to sexual discussions now than we were. We first had to put on a Hebrew Roots lens to see it. Also, I said in my previous post was that, that was a personal opinion. This would be considered as "private interpretation" by any old monog churchianity types.

Yet any old monog churchianity type would recognize a land called Beulah, and that all Christians are called to be ambassadors of Christ, but would not make the connection to both, ......so seeing they wouldn't necessarily see, and hearing they wouldn't necessarily understand, while someone like me who could put 2 and 2 together when the scales fell away and blinkers came off it was right there in my face. It was a Women's Rights issue and an Equal Rights issue ( and Human Rights issue), and Yeshua was the strongest activist for all three in his time. It's also the same reason why there were so many women in his camp and involved in his ministry since he was a champion for egalitarianism.

(The same damn issues are still being waged in Israel today with the Messianics [eg One for Israel] vs Orthodox Jewry predominantly on the issue of Tanakh vs Takkanot, because those guys can be really be arrogant, dismissive and abusive.)

And by the way, you've got it right. He was polyamorous, not polygynous, and what threw everyone off his scent is that he came as an asexual the last time around. (He's seen with 6 other males as well the 7 stars watching over the 7 churches. that's the reason why I would like to experiment with the 7m/7f configuration.)
 
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Only if they were a prostitute. :)
That was more of an idolatry issue with the Asherah and Baal cults of the Canaanites, and Mithraism, particularly the Tenth Legion Fretensis which were assigned to Holy Land regions of Yeshua's day. Both came out of the Babylon region and were popular in Mesopotamia. This is more pronounced in the Tamar/ Judah story where, Tamar, who dressed up as a cult prostitute came off more righteous than Judah did since he denied her her rights under the Tanakh covenant.
 
What about holy prostitutes, in the temple of the goddess, who offered sex as an act of worship? I can't remember if that is mentioned in the Bible.
 
Heh, or an otherwise adulterous woman.
Not really. You're still thinking by old programming of your culture. So when I confront churchianity types, I'll pose them with a question on their own level of understanding. The question concerns Mary the mother. She and Joseph were betrothed, (first step of a Jewish/ Israelite wedding) to Mary who saved Mary when she was found to be pregnant. Basically, they were considered married so the accusers left her alone when Joseph stepped in, and took the heat of the matter. The question still remained in my mind, and my question to clerics was, "Why did God knock up another man's wife and violate his own covenant law in the process?" I'll leave you with that thought to figure out since this is now getting off topic, and crossing your boundaries as an atheist.
 
What about holy prostitutes, in the temple of the goddess, who offered sex as an act of worship? I can't remember if that is mentioned in the Bible.
That's what I mean by idolatry. To a Hebrew under Tanakh law that is.
 
Ah, good point about Mary, she had both God and Joseph.
 
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That's always the Christian poly practitioner's stumbling block. It's the patriarchy, red in tooth and claw. Women are chattel and are kept under lock and key, and if they break out, they and their children, if any, are to be exiled or better yet, murdered.

The Hebrew Testament, the canonical Christian Testament, and all the further writings, the Talmud, the Church "fathers," etc., are all rampantly misogynistic. It's interesting how this corpus lays out, boldly and unashamedly, a great history of the violent subjugation of women and how men ripped from women all power and personal status.
You're basically correct but I see the Christian label being confused and entangled with what I and others saw in the loveingmore chat as churchianity. Forget 325 AD forward, I've seen it as early as Acts 5, with Peter no less, where Christianity started diverging and sliding into churchianity as soon as the Christ was out a the picture. We were wondering if we should drop the labeling of "Christian" altogether. I refused to do so since I do follow the Christ, but still take the heat as if I was a Churchian.
 
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(I feel my Matrix Oracle side bubbling up.<g>) Okay guys, this thread here has been incredibility serendipitous and fruitful for me thus far, way more than expected. I certainly hope you're enjoying this thread as much as I am. We've got a cool-ass vibe going. We're getting to "know" each other better.<g> (and do catch the significance of that intimacy/sexual remark and its connotation. and by the way, we're all polyamorists, and we all want to make our groupings to work.) (And hopefully trust each other a bit better.)

Gotta tell ya, I'm falling in love with this site. Thank you again for your service.

We've got one common interest here, we're all polyamorists on this site, (or are dealing with polyamorous related issues, as our resident St. Mark, Phoenix, our junger of the group, has pointed out.) (BTW Phoenix, yours, Al's and my commentary has yielded me more insights over the weekend.)

Thanks again, and thanks to all who have participated thus far, as the thread of Polyamory+NDE continues. However the nature of the study has now shifted gears from a 5th level looking for a beyond-death glimpse, since that would involve brain and stem death, and that's not possible; to a 2nd level-subconscious level look into what happens with a polyamorist experiencing a NDE, since it can't be anything else but a process of the mind and brain.

This thread makes us stronger as individuals, since we, without an intervention, all know we will die and die alone as an individual, and will experience our own traumas as individuals too, but yet we're stronger as a group since it adds fresh perspectives from multiple angles.

Kev is our Thomas, an atheist, so a Freudian-based perspective "delusion of the mind" is appropriate to his values, and particularly relevant to this level of consciousness, for sure. I am the observant John of the group (no connotation intended<g>,) who loves Yeshua, and sees him as more than just a man, playing the role of an agnostic 12-step/Jungian looking for patterns. Al, the "every day man" observer of the 1st century, who sees Yeshua as a man, yet is moved by his teachings, due to his interests with the period. Megs, the obvious Magdalene of the group, the women's rights activist viewpoint. Phoenix is the only one thus far that reported back with an 'out of body' NDE, dissociating himself from his body.

I'm a 12-step/Jungian non-professional support person for rape victims (both men and women) to support their recovery and help them move on and move forward. I noted that many report dissociation from their bodies as well. It looks like a trauma pattern to look for.

And just a heads up, Megs. There is a new Caveizel movie in the wind, "Sound of Freedom." You will want to look out for that. I previewed it on the Angel Studios site. I saw it and the stats it gave was just terrifying, 22 million new child pornography images in one year, a 5000% increase over 5 years. This tide has to be stopped if we ever hope to have a better world to live in.)

Okay....have I missed anyone? Please speak up. You know your observation perspectives as new NDEs come in.

Thanks,
Zay
 
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My name is not Megs, it's Magdlyn.

Thanks for the recommendation to look into child porn... (?). wth?

I tried to watch E2 of The Chosen and found it even more boring than the first one, so I'm done.
 
I think the point of this thread is to explore the possiblity of out-of-body experiences. I find most of it facile, and your resources rather shallow. If you really want to dig into the possibility of mystical travel to paradise (without dying), I recommend this YouTube adept highly. He has made a long deep study of esoteric philosophies from the ancient world, that are at the root of your christianity/non-churchianity.

Here is the latest example.

Esoterica

 
My name is not Megs, it's Magdlyn.

Thanks for the recommendation to look into child porn... (?). wth?

I tried to watch E2 of The Chosen and found it even more boring than the first one, so I'm done.
Sorry for the faux pas. I used an "e" instead of an "a." Mags, poly, non-binary, she/her, correct? Unless you prefer I use the longer form instead. (I aim to please where I can.)

(For me, it doesn't have to be much, it just has to be nice, why? Because whatever someone else does, doesn't define me as a person, regardless how others think of me, it only defines them.)

Also, it's not inappropriate to the thread, since trauma, emotional or otherwise, is a pattern to look for now and can be a vital experience, as Jung said and young Phoenix's story shows, that trauma can be a powerful force for change, when perceived as a gift. But trauma can affect people others ways too, and it's not only them that's affected, but everyone around them as well. Who knows what's going on in the life and mind of someone else?

I know from first hand experience in dealing with my poly spouse who was molested at a young age, I know she dragged that into our Covenant marriage and traumatized and affected both me .and then also my son, by her behaviour and attitudes, since this reverberates and affects everyone around her. I was that hurt, angry and confused, I sought help. After 6 months of therapy and under three weeks of observation, they couldn't find anything wrong with me before I told my shrink that she was molested at a young age. She blew up at me for not telling her sooner, (which certainty didn't help my anxiety and major trust issues much<g>), then recommended me to ACOA through Al-Anon.

By then, after 72 days of fasting, and investing a considerable amount my future financially to clearing up the mess, I was at the point that I had to open myself up with a crowbar, emotionally speaking. In that group was a mutual acquaintance/friend who knew both me and my spouse, and she gave me a hug. A hug, that's all. That one hug saved my life and turned everything around, where I can now see my spouse with eyes of compassion, turning my trauma into a gift.

That happened to a polyamorist. Me. And if happened to me, it could happen to anyone else who is a polyamorist. So it is entirely relevant to the thread.

Now imagine that story multiplied 5000% with the wreckage of relationships it will cause in future relationships. Our kids. I was fortunate. I'm polyamorous. I see myself, married to a planet of 8 billion souls, and to a God that loves both me and her. That group didn't exist until all this happened. We both discovered we were poly, and achieved a state of compersion before all this.

I was accused of much, and my reactions didn't help much either, and was left holding a bag of toxic shame and utterly confused, till someone, a stranger practically, loved me enough to give me a hug. That group loved me back to life. That's how powerful 12step/ Jungianism is.

We're polyamorists. Our environment treats us as outcasts. We're polyamorists. If we don't watch out for ourselves and health, who the heck will? We're attempting to do something that most of the world doesn't even see, thank god, and probably never will. I was fortunate, I was provided with a shield of anonymity, which I still enjoy today. I can slip in and out of 3 communities seamlessly without them ever even knowing I'm a polyamorist activist as I usually do, to listen, observe, question and take notes. Not because I'm being secretive, because I'm not, I'm just discreet and like my privacy.

Most people don't see me as I see them. I just treat everyone as a brother or sister anyway, unless if there is a mutual attraction, then I'll out myself, and we can take it from there. Anyone that wants to change me or is incompatible, I'll just distance myself to a point where I feel comfortably my own poly self.

Most polys are forging ahead into uncharted waters, with no cloak of invisibility, totally exposed to a hostile world, with no social safety net. To others, we are a minority and do not exist. You may not be inspired by what I and others write, but I figure I have a knack for it, I just figure I'll need a way to do so without becoming a target of abuse like JFK, or King or overwhelmed like, Ryam N., or Dave P. or the guys of the new tribe of Kerista that I contacted.

Gestalt, with rigid rules, rigid roles, with an outward facing focus on enforcing compliance to fit the group, fear-centric to hierarchical structuring naturally seems the way to go for some reason, till the system collapses. In a Jungian system, it is individually focused with a common group goal of self-help, no hierarchies except a trust in a source that put us here while maintaining our focus on own health, growth and accountability, inwardly focused to be the best version of ourselves regardless of others, it's attraction based, and love centric and is a much stronger base, because even if the system collapses, the individual remains an individual in tact anyway. I find it works for me, and if not for you, fine, count me invisible, I am not the droid you're looking for, move along, move along.

Tolkien was an artist, and an influence, and through one of his characters he said, and I paraphrase, "It's not great power I find, but simple gestures of love and kindness that keeps evil at bay." Opening a door or holding one for another human being, greeting someone with a smile, helping with a parcel, making an amend, since I'm human not god, telling a joke, or just giving a warm hug when appropriate with no agenda attached, doesn't cost me a thing, but gives me the ability to look in a mirror and not be repulsed by the image I see reflected back. And if I should close my eyes for the very last time as my life flashes before me, and nothing awaits for me beyond, or if I'm wrong and download into a chair, or if I'm right and a Higher Power with the ability to heal both me and her, with a key capable opening every door in the mansion, and welcomes me home with an open door, I'll be content with that thought and be at peace within myself.

You're a visual artist, so am I. The objective of an artist is to move his or her audience with his or her work. I don't just watch a movie, I notice everything, the content, the composition, the lighting, the cast, the music , etc.. There's a new way happening in the video arts that's crowd funded only, it bypasses big companies and their programming to what they want you to see. So I've attached the link for anyone else here to see, but only if they want to or not. I was moved, you may not , others may, I'll leave it up to them if they want to even see it or not.

 
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For the love of all that's holy, please put in paragraph breaks!
 
For the love of all that's holy, please put in paragraph breaks!
OIP.CbGA9uc-T2oqztJQkqw8uAHaGa
 
I fixed it, again. lol

You're driving everyone with a love of writing crazy, Zay.
 
Zay - thanks for sharing your thoughts with us - and while I can appreciate your stream of consciousness approach - let me agree with those above and suggest throwing in some paragraph breaks. :)

Also - echoing what Magdlyn said earlier - if you really want to pursue a deeper understanding of what lies on the other side of physical death, do consider moving beyond the limitations of the Bible.

Just a couple of thoughts.

Al
 
I fixed it, again. lol

You're driving everyone with a love of writing crazy, Zay.
Thank you. It helps me write to stay focused without breaking stride from my thoughts, context and content without disruption, since I can easily be distracted and sidetracked. I figure I'll still need an editor some point down the road. (It's nice of you to do such a thing though. It hasn't gone unnoticed.)<g>I'll try to do better. Thanks again. (I think we're getting to "know"<g> each other a little better, so I'll try not piss you off so much.)(Also think that you and I could have some terrific conversations in subsequent threads. <g>)( btw, I'm also a goddess lover too.)
 
Thank you. It helps me write to stay focused without breaking stride from my thoughts, context and content without disruption, since I can easily be distracted and sidetracked. I figure I'll still need an editor some point down the road. (It's nice of you to do such a thing though. It hasn't gone unnoticed.)<g>I'll try to do better. Thanks again. (I think we're getting to "know"<g> each other a little better, so I'll try not piss you off so much.)(Also think that you and I could have some terrific conversations in subsequent threads. <g>)( btw, I'm also a goddess lover too.)
It's OK to do a flow of consciousness, of course. I just recommend a quick reread before submitting to do paragraph breaks. That's not hard. You really seem to want to share your experiences and thoughts and no one is going to read them if you don't have a readable format.

As for spelling, etc., I charge by the word... ;)
 
Zay - thanks for sharing your thoughts with us - and while I can appreciate your stream of consciousness approach - let me agree with those above and suggest throwing in some paragraph breaks. :)

Also - echoing what Magdlyn said earlier - if you really want to pursue a deeper understanding of what lies on the other side of physical death, do consider moving beyond the limitations of the Bible.

Just a couple of thoughts.

Al
Although it certainly would be of interest to me to get that glimpse beyond the veil, it wouldn't be the only thing that interests me for sure. Bible? Actually think I've already told you that I found both the Bible and the bardo minefields. You'd need different lenses as I have demonstrated, but it took it off topic, as would goddess talk, obe's , or my last post on art, or me as an historian, or would any other topic that's not Polyamory+NDE's related. Sure I find the Bible a treasure and valuable historical book and sure it wasn't around till after 325 AD, but the individual bits and pieces that composed were though. Contrast and compare is a tool for a historian, but you can't live your life out of a book. ( I drive the local priest ...........and my doctor nuts<g>)( Authority figures ....pah! They're only human like anyone else.) Just tell me it can't be done or 'it's a mystery' ...then get out of my way and watch me do it, or solve it. I'm a poly, and no one other than a poly can meet me on my level....er....levels.<g>

I'm a Sigma type. My stuff is original, seminal....and lot of it is poly related. Did you ever read a book like that? Giving Peter power like he had was like giving a loaded gun to a kid, or to John, or to me, due to the lack of self-control we would have to use it without harming others. All of them were human, only one wasn't from my perspective. All good conversations for sure, but everything mentioned is totally irrelevant to the thread. I love this site, but I'm neglecting my chores with a busy week ahead. If we can keep our conversations civil with each other, regardless of our differing view points, I'll definitely want to be a regular here. So if you like all the sidetracked thought you've seen thus far on this post, I think you'll want me around.
 
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I recommended Dr Richard Carrier, and the Esoterica YouTube channel, since your dependence on Strobel is alarming. He's nothing but a facile Christian apologist. It's embarrassing, really.

Richard Carrier is polyamorous.

Do you read the work of biblical critics with PhDs at all? It's rude to blow off our recommendations by showing off and then asserting you won't look into more alternative ideas about biblical history by saying you won't live "out of a book."

Other good YouTube channels with this kind of material are Mythvision, Religion for Breakfast and Gnostic Informant.

You ignored my recommendations. You're not as open-minded or curious as you could be. Maybe that's because you risk finding out your thoughts are not as original as you think.
 
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