Understanding the psychology of monoamory and polyamory

Lucidius

Lucidius

New member
Hey all. I'm new here. I have some questions and so forth.

I've been in a relationship for the last 9-10 months with a sweet little woman who is into a lot of the things I am. It's been great, sort of. I made it clear from the very beginning that polyamory was very important to me, and that I couldn't do monoamory. She said she was okay with that, and that she had been in a polyamorous relationship with a couple in the past, but wanted to build up our thing before we went there. Perfectly understandable.

The thing is, it's been quite a while, and she has basically done a 180. I've tried to talk to her about it, gotten a copy of The Ethical Slut, been patient, but I think it might be a lost cause. :(

She can't seem to get the concept of sharing as something which does not diminish love. She seems to think that if I had another lover, she'd become number 2 and wouldn't be as loved. She wants me all to herself, only her, no exceptions.

She has insulted numerous past lovers and friends of mine for being polyamorous, calling them unhealthy, psychologically-damaged sluts, who are incapable of love, when in fact, they're all pretty well-adjusted happy people.

She has told me she pities me because the first long-term relationship I was in, in my late teens, started out polyamorous, and was great, but apparently it messed up my perception of how a loving relationship works. :rolleyes: She has also spouted off about how "normal people" don't do polyamorous and kinky relationships. :eek:

She has suggested that "sluts" have a void they need filled. But I am a whole person. I am very happy with myself, and love to share myself with other people and brighten their day.

I am starting to think some people are monoamorous because they have a void, and selfishly need to imprison another person in it because they haven't found wholeness.

I've been as patient as can be, and tried to argue with reasonable dialogue.

I don't expect to change her, or force her to see things my way. I know it doesn't work like that. I just want to understand. I suppose I hope I can reassure her and help her work through her issues (she's had some bad exes, among other things), like she has suggested she wants to do. At this point, I just want to understand.

How is love a bad thing? How is building healthy relationships with friends and lovers, spreading joy and creative vibes, a bad thing? Why does one lover mean the exclusion of another? Why are people so insecure and selfish in love? :confused: Why do people think polyamory means having loads of meaningless sex with people who don't care about you, that you'll forget the next day?

The seeming lack of logic boggles me. Sorry for the for the giant rant, I just have a lot of points, some needing explaining, some just need ventilation.

Thanks in advance for any clarity, everyone.
 
Lucidius said:
How is love a bad thing? How is building healthy relationships with friends and lovers, spreading joy and creative vibes, a bad thing? Why does one lover mean the exclusion of another? Why are people so insecure and selfish in love? Why do people think polyamory means having loads of meaningless sex with people who don't care about you, that you'll forget the next day?
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I've dealt with plenty of monoamorous people that act like this.

Our time is finite, so time you spend with someone else other than her is taking time away from her. That is logical. isn't it? She could see you going on a date with this other person as time you could have spent going on a date with her instead. Is it her being selfish, or you being selfish? It's quite subjective, really. One could ask why you don't want to spend every minute you have with her, and your answer would be something along the lines of "That's who I am," as if that is a logical answer that would convince anyone of your lifestyle.

Most monoamorous women don't want to be in open relationships themselves, and hence they won't be spending their time romantically with others to balance the time you do. So if you want to convert them, your best chance is a closed poly relationship, and having them involved in it. More mono people are accepting of this, in my experience, though it's still quite low as a percentage, maybe 15-25%. Given her past, she would likely be one of them. You just have to frame it right and get her involved in the decisions. Good luck.
 
Psychology of security and shame

Fundamentally, I have huge problems with people who choose to shame you into behaving according to their wishes versus truly trying to understand what you're doing, and allowing you to the freedom to choose. People shame others not only because it is something they've learned from parents, teachers, religious figures, etc., but also because it works so effectively, particularly in the sexual and relationship arena.

I won't go into what seems to be obvious manipulation, at least as you tell it from your perspective.

Feeling secure once we have given into the emotional risks inherent in very close relationships can be surprisingly difficult. It might be easy to be agreeable to an unorthodox relationship up front, when the emotional risk is low, but once you feel like your sense of emotional health is on the line because of the depth of connection with someone, pulling every trick you can possibly think of to avoid the possibility of losing someone becomes "reasonable."

Unfortunately, too many people don't have the solid sense of self that can prevent such desperation in the face of these kinds of concerns. Being able to hurt and feel loss while always knowing where you are, and that you will continue to be, is a seemingly lost art.
 
She is in a different country for school at the moment, so it's not like we're losing time together anymore then we would be. I've suggested this too, to no avail, which I thought was hypocritical, given that she had been the "third party" in a poly thing with a couple. She went as far as to say she would hate the other woman and never be her friend.
 
MindfulAgony, I was worried it was manipulation. There is a pattern in the whole relationship which that fits. Maybe that's the difference. I know I'm always going to be with me. Now how do you impart that concept to someone without being preachy? lol
 
Lucidius said:
She is in a different country for school at the moment, so it's not like we're losing time together any more then we would be. I've suggested this too, to no avail, which I thought was hypocritical, given that she had been the "3rd party" in a poly thing with a couple. She went as far as to say she would hate the other woman and never be her friend.
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If she can't accept who you are, she isn't someone worth being with at all. Then she won't have you at all. How will that make her feel? But it'll be her own fault for not opening her mind to it and accepting the way you feel.

She wouldn't have to be friends with your other partner. It would probably be healthier for her to open her mind to that, too, but it's not like you would force your ways on her like she wants to with you.

I'd tell her it's fine that she doesn't want to do the poly thing again, but that you will. If she can't accept it, leave.
 
I suppose I should mention that when she mentions being with another man or woman, usually in weaponized context to try and make me jealous, I am 100% ok with it. I've had lovers do that in the past and get extremely frustrated when I supported them.

Is it just an unbreachable psychological division?
 
Lucidius said:
MindfulAgony, I was worried it was manipulation. There is a pattern in the whole relationship which that fits. Maybe that's the difference. I know I'm always going to be with me. Now how do you impart that concept to someone without being preachy?
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You can't. This takes tons of self-reflection and guidance (therapist or the equivalent trained or insightful questioner), typically. My experience tells me that someone as you describe is getting too much of their own self-worth or self-esteem via the relationship, and, as a result, isn't going to respond effectively to your telling them that.
 
Lucidius said:
I suppose I should mention that when she mentions being with another man or woman, usually in weaponized context to try and make me jealous, I am 100% ok with it. I've had lovers do that in the past and get extremely frustrated when I supported them. Is it just an unbreachable psychological division?
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I've had the same thing. I mentioned to an ex that I felt I needed someone else, and explained as best I could as to why and what I felt. She didn't agree, and asked, "What if I got with other guys?" I said, "Yes, you should. It could help for you to understand, perhaps" Well, that relationship didn't last long. :confused:

Only one more relationship and split later (after explaining who I am again), I realised it was something I really needed to look into and learn more about myself. It seems like certainly an important thing to bring up before I go into any serious relationship again. I've told those I love and they seem supportive, but they don't exactly agree themselves.

It's unfortunate that people are brought up to think in these ways. I think poly is a lot about having an open mind as to what could happen. I may very well find one person I'm happy with forever, but I've not been in a relationship yet where something wasn't missing. Just so happens to be someone who could hold up the other side of my personality I need.
 
Sorry, this lady doesn't sound all that emotionally stable. The name calling and insults are a huge red flag for me. When others I'm talking to start doing this, I stop listening (usually political or religious discussions) and I tend to tune their opinion out from then on. This is not coming from a place of logic; it is purely emotional.

Just my personal opinion, from your description-- she said what you wanted to hear when you first started dating and is now trying to manipulate you to fit into her mold. The distance may be feeding her fears, or maybe this is just who she is. Either way, it doesn't sound like a healthy relationship. I suspect that if it weren't polyamory, it would be something else.
 
Lucidius said:
She said she was okay with that, and had been in a poly relationship with another couple in the past, but wanted to build up our thing before we went there. Perfectly understandable.
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Typical ignorance (in the true meaning). Exploring some multi-partner sex, or even open relationships, does not equal polyamory. You may be aware of this. She obviously isn't.

Lucidius said:
The thing is, its been quite a while, and she has basically done a 180. I've tried to talk to her about it, gotten a copy of The Ethical Slut, been patient, but I think it might be a lost cause. :(
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Yep, typical behavior and progression of immature relationships. Set the trap, tell 'em what you think they want to hear, collect your prize, then let it sit till it spoils, and discard it for something fresher.

If she actually believes what you quote her as saying, and you actually believe what you profess, the two of you are on opposite ends of the dating spectrum. There's no future here unless one or the other is willing to examine their belief system with an open mind and be prepared make changes where reality and facts conflict.
 
If this has been going on for some time, and there has been no attempt by her to accept, or better yet, understand, then I think you are wasting your time and there is no future with her. Why waste what precious time you have in this life on those that only think of you in a negative way? Find like-minded people in terms of the values you have. You won't go wrong, I think. That doesn't mean they have to be poly, but have similar tolerances and acceptance of others. Before you go though, tell her this is what you intend to do. Nothing like giving the gift of honesty. It sounds like she might need a wake-up call.
 
You guys are different. You have fundamentally different aproaches to how you love and need that love returned to you. There's no right or wrong here. Don't expect either of you to truly understand the other.

I don't understand how polyamory works internally; I don't think my partner Redpepper understands how monogamy works internally.

I'd say it's time to move on for both of you. You can't show her love the way she needs it and she can't show you love the way you need it. Short term pain, long term gain... Both of you will likely be a lot healthier.
 
You were clear with her from the outset of your relationship that you were poly-oriented and that you wanted a polyamorous relationship. She said she would agree with that, but her actions since then have not agreed with her words. Any time a person's word disagree with their actions, trust their actions.

Perhaps she experienced a sincere change of heart. Perhaps she is a cowgirl. Either way, she has not moved toward the relationship you've consistently been saying you want.

IMO, it's time for you to insist that your needs are as important as hers. You've been very clear that you wanted a polyamorous relationship. If she doesn't, the two of you are incompatible on this basic and vital point, and it's time for each of you to find partners who are better suited to you. Better to make the break now than to let even more time be wasted.

Good luck to you, whatever you decide to do.
 
Lucidius said:
She has insulted numerous past lovers and friends of mine for being poly, calling them unhealthy psychologically damaged sluts who are incapable of love, when in fact, their all pretty well-adjusted happy people.
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Wow. She has issues. I'd say she's not ready for *any* serious relationship. Walk on, I say.
 
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