I apologize if I'm beating a dead horse but I'm trying to gain some understanding on what my husband wants and what my option are. Long story short, my husband met someone online as a potential play partner without any real discussion about the subject before hand. After a lot of hurt feelings, tears and discussions we are trying to work it out and are seeing a therapist. My husband has told me he wants someone he can inflict the amount of pain he fantasizes about but believes is past my limits. He is afraid of really hurting me and, therefore, failing as a dominant. He wants someone he can basically meet up with, use, and go back home without a relationship with this woman. On paper, his desires and plan makes sense. But emotionally it tears me apart. We are discussing testing my limits vs his fantasies to see if certain things are too much for me. But I do not understand why it is so important for him to be able to be with someone that meets his limits instead of respecting or compromising with mine. I see our BDSM relationship as a part of intimacy but he sees having one with another person not as intimacy but just acting out a kink. But the odds of him finding a woman that just wants to get beaten without reciprocation seems pretty rare. And since I chose monogamy why can't he? What if he thinks I'm hamburger if he went out and had steak?
Trying to gain understanding
- Thread starter jantjen91
- Start date
River
Well-known member
I cannot for the life of me understand why in the hell anyone would want to beat or be beaten in the context of an ostensible erotic encounter. Can anyone please help me to make sense of why anyone who is psychologically healthy would want to beat or be beaten as a "turn on"?
That said, very gentle playful spanking can be fun to give and receive, provided there is no actual "beating".
That said, very gentle playful spanking can be fun to give and receive, provided there is no actual "beating".
I'm trying to describe what he wants to do and I know subs that do like to get hit, canned, flogged, whipped, tied up to the point of bruises. My husband is also into breast torture that I can only half do (thanks, cancer) and he's afraid of hurting me. But it's not so much that he wants to dominate another person physically. He gets sexually aroused when he does this to me and has mentioned having sex with the other sub. It's the intimacy that bothers me. His fucking someone else, touching someone else, making another woman feel good and that woman making him feel good back. And what if that evolves into something more.
MoPoly
Active member
I’m sorry to hear how distressed you are. Your husband should have discussed this concept with you and got your input before meeting a play partner.
I hope this helps. You may also want to see a therapist on your own.
You set your limits, not him.
This is not polyamory. Polyamory is having multiple, consensual relationships.
How?
You don’t have to agree.
Whether you understand it or not, if you don’t feel respected you don’t have to agree to being steamrollered into this.
Sounds like a lot of one-sided ick about ‘what he wants’.
It’s not clear, but I presume he did offer monogamy when you got married, and now he wants to change the goalposts. However, for it to be polyamory, he needs your consent, and willing consent, not just being bullied into consent. But it doesn’t sound as if he even wants a polyamorous relationship, just to explore his own sexual fantasies and kinks in casual encounters.
If you want monogamy and he doesn’t, you can opt out. Yes, it’s difficult and sad when you love your husband and didn’t choose this situation, but you also need to look after yourself.
Hi jant,
Your husband should certainly be willing to compromise and stick to your BDSM limits, just as you are willing to compromise with him, and endure pain up to those limits. You chose monogamy, he should definitely be willing to do the same. I don't blame you for worrying that he is going to find you less desirable than his proposed play partner. If she is willing to endure more than you, why wouldn't he think she was steak instead of hamburger? Hopefully your therapist can help you work this out with him.
Regards,
Kevin T.
Your husband should certainly be willing to compromise and stick to your BDSM limits, just as you are willing to compromise with him, and endure pain up to those limits. You chose monogamy, he should definitely be willing to do the same. I don't blame you for worrying that he is going to find you less desirable than his proposed play partner. If she is willing to endure more than you, why wouldn't he think she was steak instead of hamburger? Hopefully your therapist can help you work this out with him.
Regards,
Kevin T.
His wanting a second submissive falls under ENM, does it not? Especially if he wants to have sex. In the BDSM community it is acceptable to find other partners to fulfill kinks that your primary partner cannot. Intellectually I can understand why he wants a second partner. But since he started to talk to someone without even breaching the subject with me first makes me doubt everything he tells me about what he really wants. The night he told me about her he mentioned her coming over the house or her even moving in. He mentioned our close friends that are poly and that he thought in the future that could be us. So for him to backtrack and say that it's just someone to go to for BDSM makes me wonder if either he is lying to me about what he really wants or he got a little too excited and realized that he isn't poly.
You are thinking of this backwards. Ish
It takes a heavy bottom (lots of damage) to enjoy a heavy top. It's a very cooperative experience with lots of talking.
My cousin is an incredibly heavy sadist and masochist. For him to get into sub space you pretty much need to beat the shit out him
The sub space is key. It's erotic, intimate, and touching. After care is a truly wonderful experience.
Lastly bottoms wear the bruises like a badge. Some bottoms are incredibly hard to bruise, so if they are brats it becomes a battle of will
I am a primal sadistic. I don't love constructed scenes and I require a hard fucking. So the pain is derived from my sheer strength, size and physicality. I can Throw my partners around and take on 2 at once. It's becomes scratching hair pulling with some lovely flogging. Neither partner loves sharp pain but loves a good thudding.
My one partner is a heavy bottom and loves the intimacy of a light touch with a heavy hand. That dycotomy is a turn on.
Both love sex during and while this occurs. Forced mutual play too. It's fun times. I am a kinkster so it happens intermittently. I am not interested in ful time play or heavily constructed scenes.
Basically I am trying to say you make it sound like the top is the one abusing.
The reality is, the bottom is the most important part to the relationship. They really are the boss, just don't tell them that.
I'm sorry you are dealing with a cheating husband who now wants all sorts of wacky. This sounds hard. 
It sounds like he stepped out and cheated on current agreements, rather than asking to renegotiate first. That's not going to make you excited to create NEW agreements with him. How would you know he'd even keep them? Or would he just cheat on those too?
That's just bananas. Him moving in some stranger without your consent? Fresh!
What's he doing? Kink harem building?
Nope. It's not any kind of ethical non-monogamy to me if it stems from a cheating start. It's not ethical if he's railroading you into it and doing like THIS. It is NOT joyful consent. There's nothing ethical about cheating and then wanting to move the cheating affair partner into the home.
How does this measure against YOUR personal ethics? Do you find all this ethical treatment of you? Loving and kind behavior from a spouse?
You know what? It's okay for you vote "no confidence" on any of it if he's behaving like THIS and is all over the place and you doubt his honesty. It's like he wants to skip ahead to whatever "goodies," without repairing broken trust and healing from the cheating part of it all. What kind of business is that?
It's okay to say, "No, thanks. I'm not up for any that. I'm not going to stop you from seeing X, but I do not consent to be in a kinky V thing. So before you go there, I want a separation. We can do a trial separation for a year's lease. You do your thing at your place, date whoever you want. I will do my thing at my place, date whoever I want. We can do counseling to see if we can reconcile or if it would be best to divorce. Then you can be free TO pursue whatever it is with X and I can remain free FROM all of it."
It's okay to say that in therapy. I suggest you do that rather than bend into pretzels trying to please him.
You are not obligated to try this out any more than you are obligated to try out swinging, polyamory, etc. Your consent to do things or not belongs to YOU.
If you don't want to be involved in a dynamic where husband wants to "convert" an online cheating thing into a V, with you as the spouse and a live-in kink play partner, you can say "NO!" He can go live with them, and you can live on your own without all that drama in your household.
There's a certain point where you have to be able to say, "I love you a lot. But NO, not even for you will I do stuff I don't really want, stuff that feels bad, or stuff that hurts me. That's asking too much of me. I have to look out for my own health and well-being."
If you wanted to be involved in a kinky V, you could do it with healthy people who don't start out by cheating on agreements like this, people who would treat you well. If you want to practice polyamory, you could do that too, during the trial separation. This husband doesn't have to be involved in either your kink network OR your poly network. You could be celibate for a year. You could date for monogamy and find a new monogamous partner instead of this one. You get to pick how you want to be living.
What if you are expensive filet mignon and he's just left it in the car and not bothered to take care of it well and put it in the fridge?
I am concerned you are picking at yourself, being your own self bully, rather than holding him accountable for his cheating start.
I am concerned he's taking you for granted and/or steamrolling right over you, or maybe using your soft feelings for him to get his way when he's behaving poorly.
Sort this out with the counselor in therapy. You do NOT have to agree to this proposal. You can counter offer a trial separation or other ideas.
You can't force him to stick with the old deal of monogamy, but you don't have to sign up for a new deal. He can't force you, either.
Galagirl
It sounds like he stepped out and cheated on current agreements, rather than asking to renegotiate first. That's not going to make you excited to create NEW agreements with him. How would you know he'd even keep them? Or would he just cheat on those too?
That's just bananas. Him moving in some stranger without your consent? Fresh!
What's he doing? Kink harem building?
Nope. It's not any kind of ethical non-monogamy to me if it stems from a cheating start. It's not ethical if he's railroading you into it and doing like THIS. It is NOT joyful consent. There's nothing ethical about cheating and then wanting to move the cheating affair partner into the home.
How does this measure against YOUR personal ethics? Do you find all this ethical treatment of you? Loving and kind behavior from a spouse?
You know what? It's okay for you vote "no confidence" on any of it if he's behaving like THIS and is all over the place and you doubt his honesty. It's like he wants to skip ahead to whatever "goodies," without repairing broken trust and healing from the cheating part of it all. What kind of business is that?
It's okay to say, "No, thanks. I'm not up for any that. I'm not going to stop you from seeing X, but I do not consent to be in a kinky V thing. So before you go there, I want a separation. We can do a trial separation for a year's lease. You do your thing at your place, date whoever you want. I will do my thing at my place, date whoever I want. We can do counseling to see if we can reconcile or if it would be best to divorce. Then you can be free TO pursue whatever it is with X and I can remain free FROM all of it."
It's okay to say that in therapy. I suggest you do that rather than bend into pretzels trying to please him.
You are not obligated to try this out any more than you are obligated to try out swinging, polyamory, etc. Your consent to do things or not belongs to YOU.
If you don't want to be involved in a dynamic where husband wants to "convert" an online cheating thing into a V, with you as the spouse and a live-in kink play partner, you can say "NO!" He can go live with them, and you can live on your own without all that drama in your household.
There's a certain point where you have to be able to say, "I love you a lot. But NO, not even for you will I do stuff I don't really want, stuff that feels bad, or stuff that hurts me. That's asking too much of me. I have to look out for my own health and well-being."
If you wanted to be involved in a kinky V, you could do it with healthy people who don't start out by cheating on agreements like this, people who would treat you well. If you want to practice polyamory, you could do that too, during the trial separation. This husband doesn't have to be involved in either your kink network OR your poly network. You could be celibate for a year. You could date for monogamy and find a new monogamous partner instead of this one. You get to pick how you want to be living.
What if you are expensive filet mignon and he's just left it in the car and not bothered to take care of it well and put it in the fridge?
I am concerned you are picking at yourself, being your own self bully, rather than holding him accountable for his cheating start.
I am concerned he's taking you for granted and/or steamrolling right over you, or maybe using your soft feelings for him to get his way when he's behaving poorly.
Sort this out with the counselor in therapy. You do NOT have to agree to this proposal. You can counter offer a trial separation or other ideas.
You can't force him to stick with the old deal of monogamy, but you don't have to sign up for a new deal. He can't force you, either.
Galagirl
Last edited:
You are correct. BDSM is a power exchange and the bottom can have more power than the top. Which is why I am worried about what my husband says he wants and may encounter. There are a lot of subs that like to manipulate doms and my husband is a people pleaser.
Are you in a place with a BDSM community? He could arrange to do a scene with a heavy bottom at a play party. There are such people who are happy to just do impact play with a service top (like you've indicated that he is) in that environment that isn't exactly intimate the same way playing privately is.
SEASONEDpolyAgain
Well-known member
The reality is that the majority of people who engage in the type of heavy play he wants to experience does so with people they know well. Sometimes only romantic partners.
For your husband to meet his need of regular play with someone who wants to play to that level, there is probably going to be some form of shared intimacy. At least enough to develop a firm friendship.
A lot of kinky people identify as monogamous but the fact remains that the type of interaction they share with other kinky people surpasses the boundaries of most monogamous relationships. That's why those kinky people often change how they interact with others when they are in a committed relationship. They'll only do spanking with others, for example.
For your husband to meet his need of regular play with someone who wants to play to that level, there is probably going to be some form of shared intimacy. At least enough to develop a firm friendship.
A lot of kinky people identify as monogamous but the fact remains that the type of interaction they share with other kinky people surpasses the boundaries of most monogamous relationships. That's why those kinky people often change how they interact with others when they are in a committed relationship. They'll only do spanking with others, for example.
Simply, the endorphins that are released during the pain turn the pain into pleasure. After the flogging (or whatever) ends, a sub experiences this sublime floaty space which can last for minutes, hours or days. A good Dom will provide "aftercare" for the sub in this state, giving them what they need, a blanket, water, cuddles, food, sex, etc. Between Tops/Doms and bottoms/subs who love each other or at least care about each other, this is quite a bonding experience.
The pain can be a beating, or from other activities, such as piercing, stapling, bondage, suspension, etc. BDSM has been popular for a long long time, but it's more publicly recognized now thanks to the internet allowing people to network. I suppose you've heard of Fetlife, but you've never gone there to educate yourself.
Just because you only like gentle playful spanking doesn't mean others don't enjoy more intensity.
The saying goes: Your kink is not my kink, and that's okay.
We live in a smaller city that has a small BDSM community with a lot of drama. He mentioned playing at a party with someone when this whole thing blew up but hasn't talked about it since. I would prefer if he had a more casual play partner but I think he wants a formal slave that he can meet with. Right now the thought of him with anyone bothers me because I see BDSM between us as intimate and watching him with someone else would not end well for me.
Late to this thread, but echoing this - my relationship with my Artist _is_ deeply kinky, and the reality for me is that there is a vast gulf of difference between what I’ll call “hedonistic pain” and _actual_ pain. Like, I’m a wuss. I burn myself cooking and then I complain all evening kind of just not good at dealing with that sort of thing.
(I've also been lightly set on fire once in a kink setting and that was glorious, but I digress).
But if the pain is in a sexual setting, it’s literally more pain leads absolutely and directly to more pleasure, it’s as simple as that.
I somewhat compare it to people who enjoy Carolina Reaper peppers and the like, although I suspect a lot of pepper heads would _hate_ that comparison.
... interesting. As an ex pepper head (cute) I didn't derive pleasure from the eating of the pepper or the pain. But my resiliance and pain tolerance. More like a competition against myself an others.
But interesting analogy
Considering heavy bottoms (I love my brats) derive the same pleasure in competing against the top (and losing) its an appropriate analogy in some cases.You are a person. Don't you count?
What about all this pleases you?
If he's cheating on agreements and pressuring you into doing things you don't really want, it's not a kindness.
Why the drama? Poor organization/leadership? "Missing stair" people?
The missing stair.
Flickr user BadSwan Have you ever been in a house that had something just egregiously wrong with it? Something massively unsafe and unc...
pervocracy.blogspot.com
If he's going to start cheating on agreements and hanging around in poor company, and just wanting to move in strangers from the sky, you are going to start looking at him differently, maybe even losing love/respect for him.
If he wants to jump in blind into heavy BDSM stuff, undereducated, or easy to take advantage of because he's a people pleaser or whatever, and you see it coming from a mile away, it's okay for you to step back and get out of the splash zone.
I'm in favor of healthy kink. I'm not into drama or weird/wonky stuff.
GG
Back to the topic at hand... While we obviously have kinky people here, and you're welcome to carry on, there are probably thousands of threads over on Fetlife around this kind of idea, ethical non-monogamous BDSM relationships, having a vanilla nesting partner and kinky play partners, or a kinky nesting partner/spouse, but also preferring to play in a certain kind of way in less emotionally-involved relationships. There are even general forums called "Ask a sub," and "Ask a Dom," where you can ask anything with no fear of judgement, and lots of experienced people will chime in.
I get that you feel somewhat rejected. Also, your pride as a sub/bottom is hurt because your Dom husband wants to protect you from "too much" pain that he thinks you can't handle, or wouldn't be healthy for you. Can you let him know you feel hurt and would like to discuss this?
Then add on the usual fears of loss that people new to ENM get, the questions about not being enough, being compared to others and found lacking, etc. The point of polyamory is NOT to find a "better" partner, though. The point is to just find more love and romance, and remain partnered with your original partner, whom you love and appreciate dearly and have no desire to leave.
Both things can be true...
A. Your husband is engaging ethically in a BDSM relationship with another partner who fulfills his fantasies / desires in a way that you likely will not be able to.
B. Your husband is being quite insensitive given that you have have engaged in similar play, and you have not bought into why he wants to do this, which makes it NOT ENM for the time being and he needs to stop.
In kink as many have stated, it is accepted that you may have different play partners that fulfill different (sometimes subtly) different roles/needs.
However, it feels like he has gone for a ride and left you behind.
A few suggestions moving forward:
1) Ask him to allow you to watch a session with his sub. If it is truly BDSM only and nothing else, this is a pretty common practice in kink. How can you learn unless you watch? His answer will be interesting. (Note ask even if you don't want to watch, we just want to know his answer).
2) Go to the local dungeon (every big city has one) with him and explore - they often have theme nights so you could pick one that's a little tamer, stay away from the knife play/staple guns. Maybe a rope play night. See if he will take you. Again, let's see what he says.
3) Read up on BDSM / Kink stuff. It's all over the internet - read about Dom/Sub/pain/subspace and see what he's getting at, and talk to him about it - why? I want to see what he says. If he waxes philosophical on edging his sub and how he pulls her along and uses pain to send her deeper until she is a blissed out orgasmic mess.... its legit. If he doesn't or can't.... I suspect this is just a chick who he likes to fuck and lets him beat her sometimes. VERY different from pursuing a kink the way he describes it.
A. Your husband is engaging ethically in a BDSM relationship with another partner who fulfills his fantasies / desires in a way that you likely will not be able to.
B. Your husband is being quite insensitive given that you have have engaged in similar play, and you have not bought into why he wants to do this, which makes it NOT ENM for the time being and he needs to stop.
In kink as many have stated, it is accepted that you may have different play partners that fulfill different (sometimes subtly) different roles/needs.
However, it feels like he has gone for a ride and left you behind.
A few suggestions moving forward:
1) Ask him to allow you to watch a session with his sub. If it is truly BDSM only and nothing else, this is a pretty common practice in kink. How can you learn unless you watch? His answer will be interesting. (Note ask even if you don't want to watch, we just want to know his answer).
2) Go to the local dungeon (every big city has one) with him and explore - they often have theme nights so you could pick one that's a little tamer, stay away from the knife play/staple guns. Maybe a rope play night. See if he will take you. Again, let's see what he says.
3) Read up on BDSM / Kink stuff. It's all over the internet - read about Dom/Sub/pain/subspace and see what he's getting at, and talk to him about it - why? I want to see what he says. If he waxes philosophical on edging his sub and how he pulls her along and uses pain to send her deeper until she is a blissed out orgasmic mess.... its legit. If he doesn't or can't.... I suspect this is just a chick who he likes to fuck and lets him beat her sometimes. VERY different from pursuing a kink the way he describes it.