I'm in over my head
- Thread starter Freetime
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Carma and Butch, her boyfriend, are respectful of each other. He has told her from the start that he is not interested in being her husband. He has told her that he wants to eventually settle down, but not with her. He wants to remain a friend to us both. He "guards his heart."
But Carma and I are connected on many levels. I see her without makeup in her flannel pjs, still sexy to me. We raise our kids together. We have a plethora of experience that is unique to our relationship. We are very compatible on many levels. I don't want Butch to share that. Does that make me selfish? Okay.
Butch has a whole different family life that he wants to keep separate, too. He doesn't want to break up our family. He doesn't want to live in my house. He is struggling financially and has serious health issues, but he's his own man. He needs friends. He needs sex., too. I am a very good friend to him. He and I talk on deep levels that most men don't because of his sharing of my wife. But he is respectful of Carma and they have great sex. If he wasn't, I would deal with that accordingly. But Carma can take care of herself.
But Carma and I are connected on many levels. I see her without makeup in her flannel pjs, still sexy to me. We raise our kids together. We have a plethora of experience that is unique to our relationship. We are very compatible on many levels. I don't want Butch to share that. Does that make me selfish? Okay.
Butch has a whole different family life that he wants to keep separate, too. He doesn't want to break up our family. He doesn't want to live in my house. He is struggling financially and has serious health issues, but he's his own man. He needs friends. He needs sex., too. I am a very good friend to him. He and I talk on deep levels that most men don't because of his sharing of my wife. But he is respectful of Carma and they have great sex. If he wasn't, I would deal with that accordingly. But Carma can take care of herself.
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This sounds so much like the situation with Beodude and me. Carma posted in my thread that her situation was similar, and man, she wasn't kidding!
I haven't posted in this thread, as I don't feel I have anything additional of value to add, but I've been reading, and it's been a wealth of information for both Beodude and me.
garret9453
New member
I haven't posted in this thread, as I don't feel I have anything additional of value to add,
Quite the opposite is true, you have much to contribute and we hope you will.
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It could happen. He's a great guy, and she's a goddess. For me, I haven't planned what I'm wearing to work tomorrow, We are both shaggy dogs and will adjust, I believe.
My plan is to do what I'm doing now, establishing my own lovability. I am beginning to wonder if I might also have a capacity for poly love. Watch out, Carma. My old devil is rising, and he feels hot, young and virile.
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IndieSolo
Active member
Oh la la!
You do. I've held nothing back in this experience. My journey has been as you see it. After my initial post, I was given some pretty straightforward advice and a lot of encouragement to get honest with Tess and myself about what was/is really going on with us. This hasn't been easy, or much fun at times, but it has been and continues to be one of the best things I've ever done for myself.
Every day I find something new to look at, and every day I grow up just a little bit more.
Posting here has felt embarrassing at times. I'm not big on sharing my personal life, especially online. But at the time I had nothing to lose, so I went for it. Best thing I've done in years.
I've been treated with respect, kindness and gentleness by all who have taken the time to stop by and help out a complete stranger. And no matter how this works out, I'll always remember that, and those who cared.
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When Tess finds her guy, I hope he's just like this, and that I'm as strong and as accepting as you are, Sundance. Guess I'll find out when I get there.
Okay, this is freaking me out. Do I have to make plans for when Tess falls in love? Do I have to worry about her developing feelings beyond the FWB ideal we've discussed? Are we, am I being naive? Do I need to be heavily medicated after reading this?
i can tell you haven't done much reading on this forum, because it is VERY COMMON for people to start out swinging or having "just sex" and they end up falling in love with the person. Case in point: 2Rings and Morning Glory started out that way; I know there have been others. All I can say is you'd BETTER prepare for that because it's not about "if" it will happen, it's about "when" it will happen.
TruckerPete
New member
Yeah, we started open. We decided we wanted to seek out FWBs, because one-offs were too risky for us. We knew there was a chance we'd fall in love, but didn't really prepare for it.
Carma
New member
confidence is SEXY
RP, you really throw it out there, don't ya?
I always say poly is a "what if?" lifestyle. "I wonder, what if...?" So I think it is a very valid question to ask!
Well, I'd been crushing on my Butch Cassidy for about 5 years, and Sundance was completely freaked out with worry. He did everything he could to stop it. It kept progressing. He finally said, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" and we formed a V.
Since then, there were still the worries, that I would fall more deeply in love with Butch and leave Sundance. But a number of things have happened:
1. I loved Sundance all the more for doing this for me. For us. And he even did it for Butch Cassidy, who was hurt and in need of a friend and some emotional (and yes, sexual) healing.
2. Sundance knew I could fulfill that need for Butch. He thinks I am sexy and he knows he's got a hot wife! Which made me, well, an even hotter wife, knowing that both men think so!
3. Butch would never let me fall more deeply in love with him than with Sundance. He respects Sundance, and he knows Sundance loves me with a depth most men could hardly fathom.
4. Sundance did some soul searching and started strengthening himself. He opened himself up to talking with other people, meeting new people, expanding his social circles and letting other people see how terrific he really is, which bolstered his own confidence and made him shine even brighter.
5. Sundance is starting to dazzle me.
There were times I never thought this is where it would lead, especially those times when Sunny was so despairing, his ego so wounded and his grief immeasurable. But he picked himself up, dusted himself off, and got his groove back on! Either way, he is going to come out on top, and since I love him, that is a good thing for me, too.
Dr. James Dobson (who has some views I am directly opposed to, yet does have a FEW decent ideas) wrote a book called "Love Must Be Tough." I read it about 15 years ago and I thought it was brilliant. There was lot about when someone is moving away from you, don't chase them (kind of reverse psychology). Do your own thing, move a little away from them, give them their space. Chances are better that with this approach, you will gradually get them curious enough about what YOU'RE doing, they'll come sniffing right back! I hate to say it, but in this instance, I think Dr. Dobson was right. (Ugh, but his views on gays, I could scream. But that's another thread...)
---------------------
There's a great scene in "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid" (sorry, but I'm obsessed!), where Butch Cassidy has just taken Etta (Sundance's love) on a long romantic bike ride. They return, and Sundance asks Butch, "What are you doing?"
Butch replies, "I'm stealin' your woman!"
Sundance stands there a moment, then scratches his butt, and says, "Take her."
Butch is SO CONFIDENT that Sundance won't shoot him, he takes Etta out and delights her with a bike ride and his silly antics.
Sundance is SO CONFIDENT that Butch wouldn't -- and/or couldn't -- steal Etta from him, he just lets him entertain her.
Etta is SO CONFIDENT in Sundance's love for her, and the respect these men have for one another, she is free to love them both.
Now THAT'S a love story!
RP, you really throw it out there, don't ya?
I always say poly is a "what if?" lifestyle. "I wonder, what if...?" So I think it is a very valid question to ask!
Well, I'd been crushing on my Butch Cassidy for about 5 years, and Sundance was completely freaked out with worry. He did everything he could to stop it. It kept progressing. He finally said, "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" and we formed a V.
Since then, there were still the worries, that I would fall more deeply in love with Butch and leave Sundance. But a number of things have happened:
1. I loved Sundance all the more for doing this for me. For us. And he even did it for Butch Cassidy, who was hurt and in need of a friend and some emotional (and yes, sexual) healing.
2. Sundance knew I could fulfill that need for Butch. He thinks I am sexy and he knows he's got a hot wife! Which made me, well, an even hotter wife, knowing that both men think so!
3. Butch would never let me fall more deeply in love with him than with Sundance. He respects Sundance, and he knows Sundance loves me with a depth most men could hardly fathom.
4. Sundance did some soul searching and started strengthening himself. He opened himself up to talking with other people, meeting new people, expanding his social circles and letting other people see how terrific he really is, which bolstered his own confidence and made him shine even brighter.
5. Sundance is starting to dazzle me.
There were times I never thought this is where it would lead, especially those times when Sunny was so despairing, his ego so wounded and his grief immeasurable. But he picked himself up, dusted himself off, and got his groove back on! Either way, he is going to come out on top, and since I love him, that is a good thing for me, too.
Dr. James Dobson (who has some views I am directly opposed to, yet does have a FEW
decent ideas) wrote a book called "Love Must Be Tough." I read it about 15 years ago and I thought it was brilliant. There was lot about when someone is moving away from you, don't chase them (kind of reverse psychology). Do your own thing, move a little away from them, give them their space. Chances are better that with this approach, you will gradually get them curious enough about what YOU'RE doing, they'll come sniffing right back! I hate to say it, but in this instance, I think Dr. Dobson was right. (Ugh, but his views on gays, I could scream. But that's another thread...)---------------------
There's a great scene in "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid" (sorry, but I'm obsessed!
), where Butch Cassidy has just taken Etta (Sundance's love) on a long romantic bike ride. They return, and Sundance asks Butch, "What are you doing?"Butch replies, "I'm stealin' your woman!"
Sundance stands there a moment, then scratches his butt, and says, "Take her."
Butch is SO CONFIDENT that Sundance won't shoot him, he takes Etta out and delights her with a bike ride and his silly antics.
Sundance is SO CONFIDENT that Butch wouldn't -- and/or couldn't -- steal Etta from him, he just lets him entertain her.
Etta is SO CONFIDENT in Sundance's love for her, and the respect these men have for one another, she is free to love them both.
Now THAT'S a love story!
Penny
New member
Yeah, what Carma said.
I never planned not to develop deep feelings for T-Rex. In fact, I knew it would happen.
I love my husband more than ever. Our relationship is stronger than ever. My feelings for T-Rex in no way take away from that.
I don't use the L-word here because T-Rex and I have not exchanged that declaration, though we've talked around it and understand each other. I am slow to make that declaration, and he's the same way. So, I could say it and mean the same thing, but won't until such time as it's been said... which we'll figure out on our own time.
Thumper knows. He's cool with it.
I never planned not to develop deep feelings for T-Rex. In fact, I knew it would happen.
I love my husband more than ever. Our relationship is stronger than ever. My feelings for T-Rex in no way take away from that.
I don't use the L-word here because T-Rex and I have not exchanged that declaration, though we've talked around it and understand each other. I am slow to make that declaration, and he's the same way. So, I could say it and mean the same thing, but won't until such time as it's been said... which we'll figure out on our own time.
Thumper knows. He's cool with it.
Carma
New member
I don't tell Butch "I love you," either. He would not be comfortable.
The first time we consummated our V, I was sparkling all over the place, and I said, "I am SO HAPPY!!!"
Butch looked at me very seriously and said, "Yes, and WHO can you thank for this?"
I knew then -- Butch gives Sundance his props.
I love my cowboys.
The first time we consummated our V, I was sparkling all over the place, and I said, "I am SO HAPPY!!!"
Butch looked at me very seriously and said, "Yes, and WHO can you thank for this?"
I knew then -- Butch gives Sundance his props.
I love my cowboys.
Dr. James Dobson (who has some views I am directly opposed to, yet does have a FEW
Ugh. He recommends beating kids, as well.
But this is good advice. I follow it with my gf sometimes when she needs to learn a lesson on her own... Actually, we both benefit from alone time frequently, even though when we are together we are tight tight tight, like, can't go 5 minutes without touching each other tight.
Accept it? No way, I was a wreck. They deceived and lied to me. Finally, i decided if you can't beat 'em, join em. Just don't exclude me. And they didn't.
But I spent too much time talking it out with Carma, ad nauseum. My insecurity was glaring. She was annoyed. I hated myself.
I read the book Obsessive Love and worked the notebook. Went to a counselor. She had me putting them on a shelf while I worked on myself. Eureka. I don't need Carma to feel lovable.
I started to give her space, quit smothering her, started down my own path, and lo and behold, I looked around a week or two ago and there was little Carma tagging along behind me. Imagine that.
Be patient. Give them space. Worry about yourself. There are lots of desirable women, or men, if that is what you like. Get your mojo back, my friend. Strut it out.
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redpepper
Active member
When I was in NRE over Mono, and PN was flailing, he too decided to use the time to better himself, for himself. It had such good results that he has now started a website. It's http://www.therealizedself.com/ He has a year's worth of writing to put on his site and continues to write every chance he gets. Not only that, he started working out and walking. He stopped the working out, but walks still, and began to meditate with a local group. He is going to a retreat this summer to meditate. This is something he NEVER would've done before Mono came into our lives.
He has BLOSSOMED! He is independent, confident and has lost most of his fear due to his decision to take his life up again and be a free man and do things for himself; no co-dependent husband duties to hold him back. He didn't have to feel obliged to be with me all the time, anymore.
I love hearing how others take life into their hands, however they do it. Makes me happy to hear this.
I asked about what would happen if love deepens, or your new found "happiness" finds someone else, Carma. Not to be snarky and rain on your parade. I'm happy for you that things are going so well, but (and you don't have to answer if you don't know), something was said by Sundance that this was temporary, and that you were not considered to be more than an in-between. At least, this was how I read it.
I don't know you. I am not you. But this would be a slippery slope for me. I would struggle with it. I guess maybe I'm not keen on "rules" about that kind of thing. I will love whom I love and expect the same. If someone told me I was an interim, I would worry about them using me, my becoming attached and them either feeling obliged to me in some way, or overly protective and acting like a partner. You sound sort of overly happy, somehow, for someone who has a tertiary. Are you thinking this is more than he thinks it is? Or have I got something wrong here?
He has BLOSSOMED! He is independent, confident and has lost most of his fear due to his decision to take his life up again and be a free man and do things for himself; no co-dependent husband duties to hold him back. He didn't have to feel obliged to be with me all the time, anymore.
I love hearing how others take life into their hands, however they do it.
Makes me happy to hear this.I asked about what would happen if love deepens, or your new found "happiness" finds someone else, Carma. Not to be snarky and rain on your parade. I'm happy for you that things are going so well, but (and you don't have to answer if you don't know), something was said by Sundance that this was temporary, and that you were not considered to be more than an in-between. At least, this was how I read it.
I don't know you. I am not you. But this would be a slippery slope for me. I would struggle with it. I guess maybe I'm not keen on "rules" about that kind of thing. I will love whom I love and expect the same. If someone told me I was an interim, I would worry about them using me, my becoming attached and them either feeling obliged to me in some way, or overly protective and acting like a partner. You sound sort of overly happy, somehow, for someone who has a tertiary. Are you thinking this is more than he thinks it is? Or have I got something wrong here?
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IndieSolo
Active member
Haha, I found this out during my years of dating before I was married. (No need for a book. LOL) I always called it the Yo-Yo factor: chase a guy, he runs. Pull away, he's back. Seen it time and time again. Gotta let them think they're the ones in pursuit. But we'll be lying in wait. Meoowwrrr!