Ignorance or Confusion

[SkeetScamp]

I have been divorced for 6 years after a 44 year marriage. I met someone who made me realize I was wasting my time with one person who I believed could do everything for me. He was ENM and told me up front about his relationships lifestyle which was described as Poly. I am no longer ignorant to that fact I am finding being ethically non-monogamous to be very easy but being poly is very confusing. I chose to be ok with not asking about his partner(s)
I am working through many challenges of dating or even meeting friends but then this someone told me he no longer could not talk about his (currently) one partner because she is a very big part of his life...just as he tells me I am. He said she asks about me all of the time and yet I never ask about her. I agreed that in order to make this relationship work I would introduce myself to her.
This is my dilemma...I just don't know how to start my intro to her. Any suggestions?

 

[kdt26417]

Greetings SkeetScamp,
Welcome to our forum. Please feel free to lurk, browse, etc.

No need to make it complicated, just tell her, "Hi, I am SkeetScamp, I am new to poly but I'm just learning more about it. I am glad to meet you, he speaks of you very highly." And it sounds like it is important to him that you ask about her? If you don't mind asking about her, perhaps that's what you should do. I know you are new to poly, and maybe you find certain aspects of it confusing. I hope you could tell us what parts of it are confusing to you, and we will try to help.

Sincerely,
Kevin T., "official greeter"

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[SkeetScamp]

Hey Kevin. Thanks. One thing I failed to mention is this other female is supposed to be a practicing Muslim. She risks much just dating him. They have known each 3 times longer than he has known me. And he is a self proclaimed adventure traveler and spend 6 months in my area and 6 months in her area. He thought we should all be able to travel together last year and I said no to that. I am really trying to rid myself of the conventional and traditional life information we were raised to believe our relationships should be. I feel like I am missing something. I guess I am not feeling the 'amory" part of Polyamory.
Thanks for listening. I get very, very emotional about this..so I will stop for now. It is great that I can unload and perhaps get another perspective.

SkeetScamp

 

[kdt26417]

I'm glad we could be of help. It sounds like you are questioning your relationship with this guy, like maybe you are not feeling the love like you would want. Let me ask, does he treat you right? Does he show his love with his actions? Does he want you as a primary partner, or are you a secondary partner to him? Is he considerate of your feelings, or does he just say the right words to take advantage of the situation? I do not mean to be judgmental towards him, but I have to ask these questions to play it safe.

 

[SkeetScamp]

I have always been one to verbalize the love both in and outta bedroom. But, I have also come to realize that many years with my ex-spouse were just going thru all of the motions doing this. This guy and I have talked much and agreed that while we know we are showing our love, he admits to never being a romantic to which he would have to whisper sweet nothings. I am ok with that. He does treat me fair with respect to letting me live my own life when and if I want to. I traveled with him for 4 weeks in Asia recently, got deathly ill and he was freaked out that he couldn't help me. He has always said he realizes he doesn't have that big of an ego to think he can fill any one person's wants/needs. He is willing to try just about anything with respect to my kinks. We are both pushing our boundaries there but we are in agreement to do that together. Regarding the primary and secondary partners...Now that is another topic. He says I am his primary whenever I am with him but I feel secondary so I know something is missing.

 

[kdt26417]

Ah, so he doesn't treat you right in every way. He says you are his primary, but he treats you like his secondary. I see that he is a great guy in most respects, but there's something lurking under the surface. Let me ask you this, what would you need him to do to help you feel like his primary?

 

[SkeetScamp]

I tend to be a jealous person and I really want to move past these feelings. That is why I chose to intro myself to his partner, as her suggested. I would like for him to show me I have no reason to be jealous and assist me to work thru those feelings since they are effecting 'our' relationship. And, I feel that he should be willing to make more definitive boundaries for himself. Does that make sense?

 

[Evie]

Getting sick in Asia must have been very scary for you. I hope you're all better now.

What do you mean by "And, I feel that he should be willing to make more definitive boundaries for himself."?

What behaviours does he do that result in your feeling secondary?

Personally, I think it's great that you are ready to introduce yourself to his other partner, you two should be able to co-exist with each other enough to at least be able to contact each other in case of emergency (if he gets deathly ill somewhere).

 

[SkeetScamp]

Hi Evie,
Thank you for your kind words. I am better since I returned from my vacation.

Secondary, when he is constantly checking his social media. I guess it could be anyone. I turn off my phone or other devices not to be distracted when we are together, nothing is as important as any time that I can spend with him.

By 'definitive boundaries' I mean I am still not completely sure what his likes and dislikes. While he is a good listener, I think he doesn't say as much as I would like him to. During his quietness, I have been probing him... "What are you thinking"?

 

[GalaGirl]

"Polyamory" means "many loves." So you can ethically date other people if you wanted to besides dating him.

I chose to be ok with not asking about his partner(s)

That's fine. Nothing wrong with a very separate V. You know they exist.

Hinge can talk about his other partner like brief mentions. You don't have to pretend they do not exist. But date time with you is date time with YOU. It is not the (you watching the (him + her) show.

If you want to put a face to the name? You could do a quick video chat with your meta. It's fine to be "basic polite" so you aren't meeting for the first time if he goes to the ER or something. But you do not have to date her too or be best friends or travel together or anything like that.

There is nothing wrong with a very separate poly V. Not everything wants to hang out with their metas or do kitchen table poly.

Regarding the primary and secondary partners...Now that is another topic. He says I am his primary whenever I am with him but I feel secondary so I know something is missing.

Is that heirarchy even necessary? Could you bothbe his partners like "co-primary enough" and he splits his time between you?

I tend to be a jealous person and I really want to move past these feelings.

Could these help? Or getting the jealousy workbook?

Wayback Machine

kathylabriola.com - UNMASKING THE GREEN-EYED MONSTER: MANAGING JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS

By Kathy Labriola, Counselor/Nurse JEALOUSY IN OPEN RELATIONSHIPS In my counseling practice, I work with many people who have chosen to have open relationships--to have more than one intimate sexual relationship. The biggest obstacle to creating successful and satisfying open relationships is

www.kathylabriola.com

The Jealousy Workbook: Exercises and Insights for Managing Open Relationships: Labriola, Kathy: 9780937609637: Amazon.com: Books

The Jealousy Workbook: Exercises and Insights for Managing Open Relationships [Labriola, Kathy] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. The Jealousy Workbook: Exercises and Insights for Managing Open Relationships

www.amazon.com

Secondary, when he is constantly checking his social media. I guess it could be anyone. I turn off my phone or other devices not to be distracted when we are together, nothing is as important as any time that I can spend with him.

If you are on a date? You can ask him if he needs to check with anyone first and then BE PRESENT on the date and put his phone away.

Galagirl

 

[kdt26417]

Hello SkeetScamp,

It sounds like it's conceivable that he is giving the other partner preferential treatment, either by spending more time with her, or chatting with her on his phone when he is (supposed to be) with you. Let me know if this is not the case.

I think you need him to set some boundaries that protect his relationship with you. Right now you are in a rather vulnerable position. You are jealous because there is nothing to stop him from giving her preferential treatment. Am I on the right track?

Okay, I see that by boundaries you mean that he does not express what he wants, or what he is thinking, and that leaves you guessing which you shouldn't have to do. Also he is constantly checking his social media when he is with you. He should not be doing that. When he's with you, he should be 100% present with you.

Does he do any other troubling behaviors?
Regards,
Kevin T.

 

[Evie]

When he's with you, he should be 100% present with you.

I'd like to address this idea from personal experience. This is certainly a valid approach if it's a date for a fairly limited time, but if it's for whole days/nights and includes "hanging out" time, then both people should have the ability to check their phones and even engage with social media etc. If I'm spending a whole weekend with someone, or longer, then I expect us to both have "down time" where we aren't 100% focused on each other. For me, dividing my attention for a while recharges me. I wouldn't pull out my phone if we were at a restaurant or other location, but if we're hanging out at home, doing some of the "living together" stuff (chores, cooking, etc.) then I'm going to also take some time to check my socials, play a few chess puzzles, a game of wordle, and/or exchange a few messages with another partner, friend or family member. I had a partner, briefly, who would happily watch (his choice of) tv during hang out time, but if I got out my phone because I had no interest in watching xyz, he'd get huffy and walk away.

By 'definitive boundaries' I mean I am still not completely sure what his likes and dislikes. While he is a good listener, I think he doesn't say as much as I would like him to. During his quietness, I have been probing him... "What are you thinking"?

How about rather than this approach, you set aside some time and have some deliberate prompts to spark deeper conversations. Bluebird has recently mentioned an Intimacy card 'game' - and there are heaps of these kind of things out there. Or make some of your own (and invite him to do the same).

 

[Magdlyn]

I'd like to address this idea from personal experience. This is certainly a valid approach if it's a date for a fairly limited time, but if it's for whole days/nights and includes "hanging out" time, then both people should have the ability to check their phones and even engage with social media etc. If I'm spending a whole weekend with someone, or longer, then I expect us to both have "down time" where we aren't 100% focused on each other. For me, dividing my attention for a while recharges me. I wouldn't pull out my phone if we were at a restaurant or other location, but if we're hanging out at home, doing some of the "living together" stuff (chores, cooking, etc.) then I'm going to also take some time to check my socials, play a few chess puzzles, a game of wordle, and/or exchange a few messages with another partner, friend or family member.

This is of course, perfectly normal. And my partners and I will even pull our phones out to use briefly, like to take a pic of our food, of each other looking happy about the food, or to look up something that came up in conversation that we are curious about, or to make a future plan and look up a website about an event or venue.

But altho it's so common, it is, of course, rude to constantly be on the phone with others when you are supposed to be enjoying anyone's company in real life!

If a poly partner of mine were constantly checking their phone, I wouldn't feel secondary, I would think they were needing a reminder to pay attention to me and enjoy the moment.

But if I am having several days in a row with a partner, we might both be on our phones catching up on our games, or Instagram, or memes, or whatever it may be, from time to time. Not to mention my one partner and I need to get on our computers to actually work from home.

How about rather than this approach, you set aside some time and have some deliberate prompts to spark deeper conversations. Bluebird has recently mentioned an Intimacy card 'game' - and there are heaps of these kind of things out there. Or make some of your own (and invite him to do the same).

 

[Magdlyn]

I have always been one to verbalize the love both in and outta bedroom. But, I have also come to realize that many years with my ex-spouse were just going thru all of the motions doing this. This guy and I have talked much and agreed that while we know we are showing our love, he admits to never being a romantic to which he would have to whisper sweet nothings. I am ok with that. He does treat me fair with respect to letting me live my own life when and if I want to. I traveled with him for 4 weeks in Asia recently, got deathly ill and he was freaked out that he couldn't help me.

Doesn't a person near death need help? Driving to the doctor, or getting your meds at the pharmacy, or bringing you water, a change of clothes if you're sweating with a fever?

He has always said he realizes he doesn't have that big of an ego to think he can fill any one person's wants/needs. He is willing to try just about anything with respect to my kinks. We are both pushing our boundaries there but we are in agreement to do that together. Regarding the primary and secondary partners...Now that is another topic. He says I am his primary whenever I am with him, but I feel secondary, so I know something is missing.

We have been getting a lot of people here just lately all het up about whether they are a primary or a secondary. I think, if your needs are being met, the label doesn't matter. There was one woman here recently who was extremely insulted to feel secondary when she was with her bf of a few months, and he had a wife of a decade. I think co-primary status has to be earned. It's not an insult, it's just a matter of time, commitment, investment, gradual increase of intimacy, etc.

 

[SkeetScamp]

I'm glad we could be of help. It sounds like you are questioning your relationship with this guy, like maybe you are not feeling the love like you would want. Let me ask, does he treat you right? Does he show his love with his actions? Does he want you as a primary partner, or are you a secondary partner to him? Is he considerate of your feelings, or does he just say the right words to take advantage of the situation? I do not mean to be judgmental towards him, but I have to ask these questions to play it safe.

UPDATE: Well, I did make contact several times with my partners other partner. I finally got berated (or bullied, if you will) and told how she wants to be communicated with; setting down ground rules for such texts. This was my decision to reach out to her in the 1st place and now it is my decision to tell this person to......!

 

[kdt26417]

Thanks for updating us. I'm unclear on a few points. Was it your partner, or your partner's partner (your metamour), who berated/bullied you? I'm guessing it was your partner who did that, but I'm not completely sure. And are you now considering the idea of breaking up with your partner (due to how he treated you)? or is it your metamour with whom you are angry? It seems like your partner is the problem here, but I could easily be wrong about that.

 

[GalaGirl]

I'm sorry meta bullied you. What behavior did they do?

told how she wants to be communicated with; setting down ground rules for such texts. This was my decision to reach out to her in the 1st place

If you reached out to her first, how was that done? Text or something?

If she wants some personal boundaries for the metas talking to each other? Hopefully she wasn't rude about it.

But I think it is ok for both of you to have some personal boundaries around that and what method. (Text, phone, email, etc).

GG

 

[Openbook23]

We have been getting a lot of people here just lately all het up about whether they are a primary or a secondary. I think, if your needs are being met, the label doesn't matter. There was one woman here recently who was extremely insulted to feel secondary when she was with her bf of a few months, and he had a wife of a decade. I think co-primary status has to be earned. It's not an insult, it's just a matter of time, commitment, investment, gradual increase of intimacy, etc.

Thanks for this. These labels were bothering me a bit lately, and after talking to my newer partner about it she presented a very similar perspective. She pointed out that of course my spouse will have a certain priority, since I've been with her for ten years. That doesn't mean other partners don't get a voice (or a seat at the table...or whatever metaphor you want to use). But you can't compare the intimacy and commitment of long-standing relationships to newer ones. People shouldn't feel neglected; they should be respected and heard. Every relationship should be dealt as a separate one, but at the same time we can't simply disregard our social histories.

All that said, I do think people who are poly need to try to avoid making unilateral decisions about what can/can't happen in other relationships without the people IN those relationships all having a voice. But that's a separate issue.

 

[SkeetScamp]

Thanks for everyone's input here. Let me explain...I currently choose to not have other partners. My current relationship is 5 yo. Prior, it was a 50 year marriage with a narcissistic bully. I recognize that bullying now. The difference is I won't tolerate that anymore. My relationship is with my partner, period! Since communication (disconnect) has now escalated further to being berated and setting demands on me when she and he are together...she has now involved MY partner. I have and will continue to address this with my partner..! Someone once told me polyamory is ok...until it isn't! Well, I have too much value in myself to put forth more energy in this than deserved...!

 

[kdt26417]

I don't blame you for being upset, she has involved your partner in this bullying, and that is one step over the line. I take it she is the one who is bullying you, or are they both doing that now?