My intro because my wife suggested poly

[MrL]

Hi MrL. Welcome to the forum.

How many years has it been on the rocks? On the rocks means what, once a quarter, once a year, or sexless for years?

In those years, has there been any interest on her part in discovering the root cause, whether it be medical or psychological? Has she been treated for anything else, and this could be a side effect? Any childhood traumas that you've heard whispers of that are now bubbling to the surface?


I think that depends on the people involved. There are a lot of moving parts to look at.

It sounds like she’s given you years' worth of excuses/lies to not be sexually intimate, so trust has been eroded. Any chance she’s having an affair, emotional or physical, already? I know of a few cases here on the forum where poly was introduced to cover an ongoing affair.


Not sure about divorce, but the old marriage would be over and something new would be built in its place. The marriage would be dead and gone.


Did she give an example of how she thought that would happen? Once resources (time, energy, money) start being diverted away from her or the marriage/household, she might change her mind on that.

On the rocks for probably a good 7+ years. Sex still happens, I’d estimate on average 2-3 times per month.

Discovering the root cause? No, not even close. Usually when I bring up the subject it ends in an argument and nothing constructive happens. She feels like this is my only concern in life.

Affair? I’m almost certain no…..but you never know. I’m currently looking at asexuality as a strong possibility. If this turns out to be the way she now is, EVERYTHING would start to make a lot more sense.

 

[MrL]

In my personal experience, I had a lousy sex life with my partner. He was not interested in sex with me. We had it maybe twice per year. We researched polyamory and BOTH agreed it was what we wanted. I found out very quickly that getting sex from others did not magically take away my desire, my need, to have sex with my partner.

What did actually help me was for me to make a conscious decision to end our sexual relationship. I verbalized that it was over and that I would never want it again, would never ask again, and I mourned the loss of that part of the relationship. A weight was lifted off of me and him, and we got to focus on other parts of our relationship. Eventually it did end, but it had nothing to do with no sex. There were other problems in our relationship that had a magnifying glass held up to them once we started seeing others, and realized we were missing a lot more than sex in our relationship. We tried to work through it, but one person was ready for big growth, and the other wasn't, and the difference was suffocating. After another year of growing so far in different directions, we ended it. We're still best friends and still living together, but the romantic relationship is over.

I suggest doing a lot of reading and research. Poly might not be what you want. Maybe a weekly massage with a happy ending, or another professional that won't get emotionally involved, or a friend with benefits. But you and your wife need to really talk about what it would mean and the possibility of feelings developing. It happens. Swingers have certain rules to try to prevent that. Swinging is an option too. Sometimes swinging together wakes up the libido. It could be something you slowly explore together.

Sometimes a low libido is hormonal. (There are meds for that. Made a HUGE difference to me.) Sometimes it's boredom or even not getting the right stimulation from your partner. (Women are complicated. Many don't even understand their own bodies enough to teach their partners, or are too shy to speak up) There are so many reasons. Maybe you can work to find them out and work on them one by one.

Do I automatically think your marriage is over? Not in the traditional sense, but the WAY your marriage is now has to end if you want to change it into something new and better. It seems neither of you are happy with it now, so that change might just be what you need. You have nothing to lose to get super honest and try different things. After all, if you don't, it probably will be over.

Bobbi, thank you. A lot of what you wrote resonated with me. Maybe the thing most is about how the WAY my marriage is now has to end. I agree fully. The end is not necessarily divorce but if there is an end in the current state it could lead to a new beginning. A new beginning that would make us both happy. Right now we aren’t happy, maybe just content. And you’re right, I have nothing to lose. At this point divorce is on the table and has been thrown around in heated conversations. I’m getting more comfortable saying what’s truly on my mind and not worrying about the repercussions.

If you don’t mind elaborating on the meds that helped you I’d like to know more.

 

[MrL]

You story is relatable. During our 38th year of marriage we learned about asexuality. Asexuality is not a pathology, trauma, or choice. If this is the case, then there is nothing wrong with her.

Visit https://www.asexuality.org/en/forum/30-for-sexual-partners-friends-and-allies/ and see what you think.

Be aware that only she can make the determination.

TinCup you sent me down another rabbit hole of research. Asexuality seems to describe my wife in many ways.

Are you able to elaborate on how you navigated this in your life and relationship?

 

[MrL]

No, what she means is that she wants all the benefits and security of a marriage to you, without having to focus on being a fulfilling intimate partner. So she will use someone else to give you the bits she doesn't want to give you, but God forbid you and that other person ever actually develop the kind of holistic intimacy you lack with her.

This is about her keeping her husband/lifestyle, and you getting to "do sex" to someone. She sees your sex drive like she would see your desire to play tennis - it would be nice if you did it with your wife, but it's quite typical to have a tennis mate that you go and play with that isn't your spouse. Go and play a bit on a Saturday morning, and then come home and do your real husband duties which are basically chores, providing and/or childcare.

All aspects of my life, marriage and family are what Id always hoped for………expect for that one key thing. It’s amazing how much this one thing can negatively affect your mental and physical heath.

Asexuality may explain everything here.

 

[Tinwen]

Sex still happens, I’d estimate on average 2-3 times per month.

Omg, I don't think that's a terrible frequency for a long marriage.

 

[dingedheart]

On the rocks for probably a good 7+ years.

I’m guessing here, but from simple math, it looks like things changed after the last kid was born. I don’t know the pathology of asexuality, but I’ve not heard of it as being a degenerative condition…gradually happening over time and/or popping up one day.

So, the first half of your marriage you would rate your side for the sexual equation as good or better. What would you rate her side as being? How do you think she rated herself during that time, not in terms of her performance, but of her enjoyment and/or a relished activity?

Sex still happens, I’d estimate on average 2-3 times per month.

What was frequency before? How much heart and head are in it? Starfish? Please god, let him cum and get off me type thing?

Discovering the root cause? No, not even close. Usually when I bring up the subject it ends in an argument and nothing constructive happens. She feels like this is my only concern in life.

So, in other words she sees this as a you problem, and not a we problem or a her problem? You’re some sort of sex-crazed maniac wanting what you had in the first half of your marriage to continue throughout the marriage, and it’s way deeper than just physical release. You want the woman you love and passionately desire to have that same raw passion about you.

Outsourcing is the wrong fix. It’s like swapping out an engine to fix a flat tire.

Affair? I’m almost certain no… but you never know. I’m currently looking at asexuality as a strong possibility. If this turns out to be the way she now is, EVERYTHING would start to make a lot more sense.

My gut reaction to the brief history you’ve shared is, if it were me, I’d being looking at all the other possibilities in front of asexuality because I could see it being used as the lazy way out. Throw up hands and say this is how it is NOW, even though there’s a stark contrast to the first 7.5 yrs.

 

[Bobbi]

If you don’t mind elaborating on the meds that helped you I’d like to know more.

I got on HRT. Specifically the estrogen ring and a progesterone IUD. This way I didn't have to take oral medication (or think about it other than once quarterly) and I have a clotting disorder so getting the meds this way has way less side effects and risks. It's been NOTHING like being on birth control pills (in case she's ever had issues with those). A whole mess of symptoms, I had no idea were hormone related, magically went away.

 

[MrL]

Omg, I don't think that's a terrible frequency for a long marriage.

I’m not sure the frequency is the issue. That number is most likely on a good month. I guess the issue seems to be more how she looks at sex and how our current situation makes me feel.

 

[Magdlyn]

I got on HRT. Specifically the estrogen ring and a progesterone IUD. This way I didn't have to take oral medication (or think about it other than once quarterly). And I have a clotting disorder, so getting the meds this way has way less side effects and risks. It's been NOTHING like being on birth control pills (in case she's ever had issues with those). A whole mess of symptoms, I had no idea were hormone related, magically went away.

Off topic, but that's really interesting. I never heard of that hormonal treatment before. I have a clotting disorder too, Factor V Leiden, which makes me 7 times more likely to clot. I was on bc pills in my younger years (age 16-30), and went off for 10 yrs, from 30-40, had kids, then went back on the pill and then I ended up with DVT and PE. That's when I found out about my disorder. Grrr... Bc pills make you 7X more likely to clot, so I was walking around 49 times more likely to clot.

Also, bc pills reduced my sex drive enormously.

 

[Magdlyn]

I’m not sure the frequency is the issue. That number is most likely on a good month. I guess the issue seems to be more how she looks at sex and how our current situation makes me feel.

The desire for sex varies greatly. Some people, like me (now), want it several times a week. Some people are content with once a month, or 3 or 4 times a year! When I was younger (before peri-menopause) I wanted sex far less than I did after age 42. On the other hand, some women (like my sister) lose all drive after menopause. You never know!

And it's not just a male/female thing. Often we get women coming here saying that they want it more than their male partner(s).

 

[MrL]

I’m guessing here, but from simple math, it looks like things changed after the last kid was born. I don’t know the pathology of asexuality, but I’ve not heard of it as being a degenerative condition…gradually happening over time and/or popping up one day.

So, the first half of your marriage you would rate your side for the sexual equation as good or better. What would you rate her side as being? How do you think she rated herself during that time, not in terms of her performance, but of her enjoyment and/or a relished activity?


What was frequency before? How much heart and head are in it? Starfish? Please god, let him cum and get off me type thing?




So, in other words she sees this as a you problem, and not a we problem or a her problem? You’re some sort of sex-crazed maniac wanting what you had in the first half of your marriage to continue throughout the marriage, and it’s way deeper than just physical release. You want the woman you love and passionately desire to have that same raw passion about you.

Outsourcing is the wrong fix. It’s like swapping out an engine to fix a flat tire.



My gut reaction to the brief history you’ve shared is, if it were me, I’d being looking at all the other possibilities in front of asexuality because I could see it being used as the lazy way out. Throw up hands and say this is how it is NOW, even though there’s a stark contrast to the first 7.5 yrs.

I need to look into the possibility of people developing into asexuality later in life. From what I’ve read it seems like people can just go along with the cultural norms and not really know why they feel a certain way. At some point they put two and two together and realize they are in fact in some way different than those norms. If asexuality is not the case for her then I feel it would be an easier path forward. Fingers crossed!


Frequency and quality from what I remember were greater than now. Maybe that’s why I’ve held on hope that we can make it good again. However somewhere along the line interest and desire fell off a cliff for her. She’s never into it, describes is as a chore and and it’s the furthest thing on her mind. I’m the exact opposite.

Yes, this is a “me” problem in her mind. I’m not sex crazed, if I were I’d be gone or have cheated long ago. But yes I’d like a glimmer of what we once had. I’d also like her to feel about me that way I feel about her, wanted and sexually desirable.

I agree, in my mind outsourcing won’t fix the root cause.

 

[MrL]

Thanks for all the input up till now. This thread has seemed to morphed into many different topics. It’s all been helpful and I’m happy to read and respond. Hopefully its ok since isn’t not in the true nature of the site.

 

[kdt26417]

No problem, it is your thread and it is okay for you to follow wherever the thread leads. We just want to help you with the problems you are experiencing.

 

[Evie]

Have you guys ever explored sex? Like really explored the possibilities? https://www.omgyes.com could be one entry point, or looking into things like eye gazing or toys or female ejaculation.

 

[MrL]

Have you guys ever explored sex? Like really explored the possibilities? https://www.omgyes.com could be one entry point, or looking into things like eye gazing or toys or female ejaculation.

No. No exploring, nothing crazy. Which has been fine for me over the years. I would be completely ok getting a bit wild and adding some spice. Don’t think my SO would. Regular sex is something she never thinks about so all that other stuff seems so far out of reach.

 

[Evie]

Have you read anything about women's mental load?

 

[MrL]

Have you read anything about women's mental load?

No I haven’t, but thanks for bringing this up. I’ve always felt she’s constantly “stressed” and doesn’t know how to ease up or take a breath. Having a glass of wine or having a smoke at the end of the day to unwind never happens. This coupled with busy life schedules and commitments seems to always have us with the gas pedal down.

I always knew she had a big “mental load” but never knew there was a term for this. Thank you! I will go down this rabbit hole now……

 

[TinCup]

Are you able to elaborate on how you navigated this in your life and relationship?

My story and many like it is on AVEN.

I need to look into the possibility of people developing into asexuality later in life.

Develop into? No. That would be like suggesting a gay person developed into gay. Just as heterosexual is the opposite of homosexual, asexual is the opposite of bi/pan sexual.

There are many reasons a person may not be interested in sex and many are identified in this thread. Asexuality can only be claimed by the asexual person.

Asexuality isn't well known. In our case, we spent years trying to "rekindle the spark" in every way imaginable by pros and authors. Learning about asexuality improved our marriage 10 fold. (If you can measure marriages in folds )

Pathologizing the situation was damaging as it left my spouse believing they were broken.

people can just go along with the cultural norms and not really know why they feel a certain way

Many sexual demographics do and it's damaging. Especially if the reason is not understood.

If she feels broken and like she can't be a proper wife, and you feel sensitive to rejection and lonely lying next to her, I think exploring the possibility makes sense.

 

[Magdlyn]

Develop into [asexuality]? No. That would be like suggesting a gay person developed into gay. Just as heterosexual is the opposite of homosexual, asexual is the opposite of bi/pan sexual.

I beg to disagree... at least a bit. With hormonal changes at menopause (or "manopause"), some people do go from enjoying sex to not wanting it, and not missing it at all. My sister was like this. She got to a point where she just didn't think about it or want to be reminded of it. For a decade or so, she and her husband had a "sex schedule" for his needs, for which she got other things in return (like not cooking dinner most nights, just going out, or bringing in food, or her just having cereal while her husband made his own chicken or whatever).

There are many reasons a person may not be interested in sex and many are identified in this thread. Asexuality can only be claimed by the asexual person.

I don't claim to understand all the ins and outs (heh) of asexuality or greysexuality. However, I do think hormones, life stressors and a lack of emotional intimacy can contribute to a lack of libido. Dunno if that is "officially" asexuality.

I was nearly asexual after having 3 kids in 5 years (for several years while I was in the trenches). I was just too damn touched out and exhausted to have anything left for my husband.

Asexuality isn't well known. In our case, we spent years trying to "rekindle the spark" in every way imaginable by pros and authors. Learning about asexuality improved our marriage 10 fold (if you can measure marriages in folds ).

hehe

Pathologizing the situation was damaging as it left my spouse believing they were broken. If she feels broken and like she can't be a proper wife, and you feel sensitive to rejection and lonely lying next to her, I think exploring the possibility makes sense.

 

[TinCup]

I beg to disagree... at least a bit.

Nothing to disagree about because what you describe isn't asexuality. Asexual people can enjoy sex and have a libido, for example.

I do think hormones, life stressors and a lack of emotional intimacy can contribute to a lack of libido. Dunno if that is "officially" asexuality.

Sure can, and nope, that isn't asexuality.

"Officially", asexuality is like heterosexuality is like homosexuality is like bisexuality is like pansexuality. It is how a person is wired.

Here's an overview, check it out.