Not Sure If I Want To Scream Or Cry

It does sound as though a few things are at work to escalate your emotional state. You said you were fine before.

But you moved and you are an introvert. You need to create a new social group-that is respectful of your need to disappear for personal time regularly.
That can be difficult and will require a concerted effort on your part.

You are an introvert and she's over several times a week-would I be correct that home is where you generally find your alone space? If so-that could be a HUGE problem.
This was a BIG topic for us because dh is an introvert. He NEEDS his home to be a place where he can get AWAY FROM PEOPLE. Not a place where people are always at. We had to work around that need and it IS A NEED, not a want. It's a need.

Also-so much effort to be nice that you aren't being honest and real and forthright about where you are and how you feel.
That's not healthy for any of you and it's a bad example for everyone too.
Please consider-sometimes what we say isn't what they want to hear, but if it's the truth, we need to say it. The key is in saying it KINDLY (there's a whole thread on here discussing exactly that somewhere on this board-search radical honesty). You don't have to be a jerk, or selfish or "radically callous" to be honest. You can be kindly honest.
But pretending to be kind by lying-not good.
 
Yes definitely last minute. After me telling him tonight that I wouldn't be disappointed if she didn't come over and later him telling me he'd be home early and we could cuddle, he shows up at 1 am with her in tow. I waited up for him. So now here I sit in the Walmart parking lot at 230 am typing this reply.

What on earth is he playing at?

It sounds like it's time to have that brutally (or kindly) honest talk. I have a feeling he isn't going to like it - not because I think he's a bad guy, but because it sounds like this may be one of the first times you truly and completely assert yourself with him. I really hope you do. I'm expecting resistance from him, because I have a feeling he's comfy right now.

Thumbs up to everything LR just said above me.

I think she's spot on with the introversion comments, personally. At least, I can relate to that as an introvert. God, there's no way I could handle someone in and out of my house like this. You've got a cuckquean/voyeuristic side though, so I understand that part. (I often wish I had that side, ha!)

How are you feeling now?
 
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;)
For some people, not having boundaries or "rules" and taking things as they come work. For others, those boundaries and rules are needed, and as long as everyone involved agrees to them, they aren't necessarily a sign that someone in the relationship is insecure or controlling. For some of us, having things clearly defined and set out is comforting and helpful.

Giving orders and ultimatums isn't helpful, but others have given you examples of how to phrase things as requests. Another useful tool is the "I feel...when...I would like..." statement. For example: "I feel disrespected and ignored when you promise me cuddle time but then come home late and bring your girlfriend. I would like you to follow through when you promise to spend time with me." That pattern puts the focus on *your* emotions in response to a specific action on his part, which makes it a little less likely he'll get defensive, and it also gives him an alternative course of action that will improve the situation.

Part of the problem is that he would like to just let things happen as they may and I do not operate well like that. I need to know the who/what/when/where for pretty much any scenario, not just his time with GF. For example, this evening he told me he would be going out to see her and gave a specified time and duration. Unfortunately, the time and duration changed and he didn't let me know. I left the room for 2 minutes and came back to find him gone, a full hour earlier than expected. He says he said goodbye to me, but I certainly didn't hear it. When stuff like this happens my reaction is to start asking a bunch of questions so I can get the who/what/when/where answered and this makes him feel like I am smothering him. It's a vicious circle.

Sleeping apart is going to happen when they are together, you'll just have to get used to it. Can your husband spend the night at her house instead of your spare room? I know you say you are mono but is it at all possible to find a partner for yourself so you don't have to sleep alone?

I would stop trying to be friends with her, you can be friendly without being her friend. It's his girlfriend not yours, you really don't have to do anything with her. I certainly wouldn't be planning their dates or helping him romance her.

She is getting a new place and I am guessing that they will spend the night there instead of our house when that happens. In fact when I asked him about what his intentions were when she moved, he said that they would probably stay there so he wouldn't have to worry about me "yelling" at him when he brought her home. That made me feel super great...NOT Plus, I would much rather him be home, even with her here. I hate being home alone more than I hate sleeping in bed alone. I like the sense of safety and security of having him here. I did ask him if he plans to leave some of his stuff there and he said absolutely not, his home is with me. He's going to have to prove that to me.

I actually at times have wished that I could go out and find another someone. I even created an OKC profile. That lasted about 10 minutes. I have zero interest in becoming intimate with any other man. I love being a one man girl and love being able to focus all of my attention on my man and my daughter. In addition, I think adding that dynamic into our relationship at this point would be just too much to handle.

It does sound as though a few things are at work to escalate your emotional state. You said you were fine before.

But you moved and you are an introvert. You need to create a new social group-that is respectful of your need to disappear for personal time regularly.
That can be difficult and will require a concerted effort on your part.

You are an introvert and she's over several times a week-would I be correct that home is where you generally find your alone space? If so-that could be a HUGE problem.
This was a BIG topic for us because dh is an introvert. He NEEDS his home to be a place where he can get AWAY FROM PEOPLE. Not a place where people are always at. We had to work around that need and it IS A NEED, not a want. It's a need.

Also-so much effort to be nice that you aren't being honest and real and forthright about where you are and how you feel.
That's not healthy for any of you and it's a bad example for everyone too.
Please consider-sometimes what we say isn't what they want to hear, but if it's the truth, we need to say it. The key is in saying it KINDLY (there's a whole thread on here discussing exactly that somewhere on this board-search radical honesty). You don't have to be a jerk, or selfish or "radically callous" to be honest. You can be kindly honest.
But pretending to be kind by lying-not good.

Things were fine before with his last GF of 8 years. Things have never been fine with his new GF. During the first 8 years of poly, his approach, and what he would constantly tell me, is that he didn't want to take time away from us but rather fill the time when I wasn't available. We have differing work schedules and I sometimes travel for work, so this is mostly when he would see his last GF. There were definitely times that they would go out when I was home, but it was maybe 2 to 3 times a month and it was normally just to a movie or something. There were also times we would go to movies, dinner all together. Very rarely would there be weekends away, maybe once a month or less. I could handle this, I understood his needs and supported him.

With the new GF, they see each other 5 to 6 days a week with 2 overnights a week. They work together so they see each other at work too. From my perspective, I am losing time with him. Spending 2 nights a week with her at our house is not what I would consider time with my hubby. I didn't sign up to be a part-time partner and had I known it was going to turn out this way, I would not have encouraged him to go after her. I feel like their relationship is always right in my face. Even when we are together just the two of us or with our daughter, they are constantly texting. The amount of time is overwhelming to me.

What on earth is he playing at?

It sounds like it's time to have that brutally (or kindly) honest talk. I have a feeling he isn't going to like it - not because I think he's a bad guy, but because it sounds like this may be one of the first times you truly and completely assert yourself with him. I really hope you do. I'm expecting resistance from him, because I have a feeling he's comfy right now.

Thumbs up to everything LR just said above me.

I think she's spot on with the introversion comments, personally. At least, I can relate to that as an introvert. God, there's no way I could handle someone in and out of my house like this. You've got a cuckquean/voyeuristic side though, so I understand that part. (I often wish I had that side, ha!)

How are you feeling now?

I wouldn't go so far to say that I was brutally honest, but I did have a discussion with him and told him I felt like I was losing a part of him and it scared me. I explained that this new situation was a lot to take and I asked him if he had any suggestions of how I could deal with it better. He did mention that he would be fine if I looked for another partner, to which I said I wasn't interested in. His main suggestion is one that people of this board have recommended and that is to find a hobby, friends, something other than him to occupy my time. I am going to try to commit to doing this, but it is going to take a lot of work on my part. I have never created social interactions for myself before without having exposure and a comfort level first. I don't have anything like that right now in our new area.

I was disappointed that he didn't ask me how he could make it easier for me. Normally this would have been a question he would ask. Maybe he was scared of my answer? He did say he understands how hard it must be for me. I know I need to have another conversation with him about some scheduling boundaries and will need to be more upfront with my needs. I'm just working up the courage. I was really thinking of writing it in an email to him. I can formulate my thoughts completely in writing where as the dynamics of conversation can sometimes derail me from my purpose. What do you all think? Is an email cowardly?
 
Show him this thread.

I'd definitely recommend some scheduling boundaries.

You see, you seem to want to pander to all your needs, but none of theirs, and you seem reluctant to lose anything that you like in order to create a more tolerable situation. For example, there seems to be some issue with stopping these relationships from "leaking" into each other and it seems like some fairly rigid boundaries are needed to ensure that they don't, but you are unwilling to give up the sexual detail sharing or letting him stay with her to try and get some emotional and physical separation between the two relationships.

Staying at yours isn't ideal for them, it seems, because as he said you "yell" at him when they do. Them spending their time (with the scheduling boundaries in place) will mean their relationship is less "in your face" and they'll also have the space and comfort to enjoy their time together. The time that he has with you and the kids will also be uninterrupted by her. I bet that they feel the quality of their time together is reduced by the current situation.

You need to ask them directly if they would ideally like for her to be a primary style partner too. IE, he would effectively be part of two households and they would have some practical entanglements. That might be what they want and if it is and it isn't something you want, you need to iron out that discrepancy now.

I think that you also have to accept that this relationship isnt the "fill in" for your absence that the last one seemed to be. I bet that wasn't really a "fill in" either but it just happened that all of your schedules merged in a way that meant they could see each other as much as they needed to without too many clashes, as it were. It isn't like that this time, and although thinking of it as a "fill in" may have been a comfort for you, it isn't stable enough for you to rely on as your main means of coping with having a poly partner.
 
Could focus on (you and him.)

If that boundaries conversation can happen in email -- get it done in email then. The thing is to communicate in some fashion that works so the communicating happens -- not stress out about the method of communication. (phone, oral, written, email, etc)
I was disappointed that he didn't ask me how he could make it easier for me. Normally this would have been a question he would ask.

Be assertive -- communication is a two way street. If he doesn't go there, you could go there to help meet your communication needs. You could ask "Could you be willing to...?" You are both responsible for communication between you. Don't NOT talk about it because the other one doesn't bring it up first.

How much time alone with him present and not distracted with cel do you need a week to feel ok? Is he willing to provide it? Is he willing to negotiate?

Cuz even if you have other friends and hobbies? If you need 3 days a week or whatever and do not get it, no amount of hobby time or friend time makes it up. "Hobbies and friends" are not "couple time alone with him." Even you guys on your own with children -- that's "family time" and not "couple time alone."

Time is a limited resource. Just 24 hrs in a day, 7 days a week.

If not willing to work with you? At that point you could accept it as the price of admission here or could move on because he no longer is willing / able to meet the couple time you need for the relationship to feel good together and he not up for negotiating.

Galagirl
 
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Inyourendo, maybe you didn't mean to be dismissive, but your advice here sounds either like, "I know you say yIih ne if she said she ou're mono, but maybe you aren't really!" or "Did it occur to you that you wouldn't be having this particular problem if you weren't mono?" I know that I find advice that boils down to "Maybe you haven't adequately thought about who you really are" or "Just stop being who you are, and your life will improve" frustrat

I meant it more like we were all mono until we discovered poly. i just think in her situation i would at that point give it a try. Its fine if she says she absolutely only is attracted to her husband but I thought it was valid advice on my part. I wasn't trying to be dismissive toward mono people.
 
I also recommend schedule boundaries. 2 overnights means they see each other 4 days a week right there. Do you and him have date nights away from your child?
 
;)
Spending 2 nights a week with her at our house is not what I would consider time with my hubby.

Even when we are together just the two of us or with our daughter, they are constantly texting.

The amount of time is overwhelming to me.

Is an email cowardly?
I wouldn't consider spending time together the three of you as being "time with the two of you" either. This goes back to the poly math tiers that galagirl is always linking to on the board.
EACH relationship requires it's OWN time and attention. You need time with him WITHOUT her involvement. Just as she needs time with him WITHOUT your involvement.

We created a rule about texting/phone/computer, around specified times (meals, bathing (we often shower together), dates, family time among others) where NO ONE is using the phone/computer/electronics.
Basically-being PRESENT in whatever existing moment, not exiting the moment to be present with someone who isn't there.
This is VERY VERY helpful.

Email-we OFTEN use email as a precursor to conversation. We write out all of our thoughts, then we send it so the other person can read it over. Then we print it and we set a time to sit and talk together over the topics brought up in the email. This was actually suggested by a marriage counselor we saw early on.
 
Do you and him have date nights away from your child?

SO CRITICAL!
This was a "make it or break it" point for our ability to manage a polydynamic.
It's important to remember that EACH relationship needs time alone. Not ONLY relationship where the partners don't live together.
It's very easy to brush over and say "well you live together, so you see each other all of the time". Yes-we do. But we don't have COUPLE time all of the time. We have a houseful of people we are taking care of.
We need alone time too.
 
SO CRITICAL!
This was a "make it or break it" point for our ability to manage a polydynamic.
It's important to remember that EACH relationship needs time alone. Not ONLY relationship where the partners don't live together.
It's very easy to brush over and say "well you live together, so you see each other all of the time". Yes-we do. But we don't have COUPLE time all of the time. We have a houseful of people we are taking care of.
We need alone time too.

What she said ^^^

Azorkane and I had that conversation last night - we were discussing him staying over at Amber's last night and I said I'd have a problem with it - not because he was staying there - but because she's the "vacation" place - she doesn't have to deal with the bills and the kids and the stress and the house - and I don't get a night with him, without kids. I want/need that time with him and our lives don't allow for his kids to go anywhere overnight - and mine are old enough to stay the heck away and give us space.

We need to date as well as they do. We need to nurture *us*

:p
 
Re (from LovelyLady):
"Even when we are together just the two of us or with our daughter, they are constantly texting."

Bzzzt! Douchebag move on his part.

Although I might have to backpedal if you and he text (a lot) when he's with her. Is that the case?

Re:
"What do you all think? Is an email cowardly?"

It is not (IMO). Email can be a lifesaver when your emotions are all over the map, YKWIM?

I think you and he need to work out some compromises, but I'm sure that will be a tough and tedious process.
 
;)
What do you all think? Is an email cowardly?

No, email is not cowardly; it's a very reasonable approach to expressing difficult issues clearly and logically. Sometimes trying to do the same in person, we can derail ourselves with emotion.

And if you're concerned that he will see it as cowardly, just tell him that you are using emailing in order to lay your thoughts out clearly and to avoid becoming over-emotional.

I sometimes find that by writing things out I clarify things for myself as well.
 
I meant it more like we were all mono until we discovered poly...

Just for the record, this is, strictly speaking, not true in all cases (although it IS true for the vast majority of people who ID as poly...at least in the US).

Even before I was of an age where "romance" or "sexual attraction" was an issue, monogamy never made sense to me - just one more of those "silly rules" that people followed without any reason behind it that I could see.

Now, I was exposed to the concept of poly early on by the writings of Heinlein but I didn't know that it was an "actual" thing in the real world. I had resolved that I would never be in a "relationship" if it meant that someone else could control my behaviour...just saying. Of course, I have learned a lot since my 12 year old self made that resolution...but monogamy (in the traditional sense) was never an inherent part of my life.
 
Part of the problem is that he would like to just let things happen as they may and I do not operate well like that. I need to know the who/what/when/where for pretty much any scenario, not just his time with GF... When stuff like this happens my reaction is to start asking a bunch of questions so I can get the who/what/when/where answered and this makes him feel like I am smothering him. It's a vicious circle.

I totally understand this. I am a type-A "planner" - and Dude is NOT willing to accommodate this. Initially this caused strife. Then I decided that I loved him for who he IS - not just the convenient bits. So...I make my plans, and if he happens to take them into account then great, BUT I no longer plan my day based on where/when he says he will be...because, inevitably, he probably won't. (MrS and I think he might be on the "spectrum" - no sense of time, AT ALL.) So...we miss some opportunities to spend time together (i.e. IF he had informed me that he was at a place at a time THEN we could have had lunch together, BUT he didn't - so I had my own plans) - on the other hand, we have the rest of our lives to take advantage of the opportunities that DO arise.

I was disappointed that he didn't ask me how he could make it easier for me. Normally this would have been a question he would ask. Maybe he was scared of my answer?

...or so caught up in NRE that he doesn't want to to volunteer to give up any time with his "new shiny" relationship?

I know I need to have another conversation with him about some scheduling boundaries and will need to be more upfront with my needs. I'm just working up the courage. I was really thinking of writing it in an email to him. I can formulate my thoughts completely in writing where as the dynamics of conversation can sometimes derail me from my purpose. What do you all think? Is an email cowardly?

I, like the others, think this is perfectly valid. When I have to have a "serious" discussion with one or both of my boys I often type up a "position paper" or create an "agenda" that I have them read beforehand. I think it is wise to give some warning AND to give some time to digest what you said before the discussion takes place.

Something along the lines of - "Hey, I've been having some trouble and so I wrote you an email about 'x'. Could you read it and think on it and then, maybe, we could have a conversation on 'x'-day afternoon - I've hired a sitter for the kids."

JaneQ
 
Just for the record, this is, strictly speaking, not true in all cases (although it IS true for the vast majority of people who ID as poly...at least in the US).

Even before I was of an age where "romance" or "sexual attraction" was an issue, monogamy never made sense to me - just one more of those "silly rules" that people followed without any reason behind it that I could see.

Now, I was exposed to the concept of poly early on by the writings of Heinlein but I didn't know that it was an "actual" thing in the real world. I had resolved that I would never be in a "relationship" if it meant that someone else could control my behaviour...just saying. Of course, I have learned a lot since my 12 year old self made that resolution...but monogamy (in the traditional sense) was never an inherent part of my life.

Ah Heinlein, one of my favorite sci-fi authors
 
Just an update and a thank you! The situation has improved, it's not yet ideal but I know that takes time. I have taken the advice of many and have stepped back from being so involved in his relationship with gf. I ask the basic questions I need to be comfortable. If other information is shared or he asks me for input I oblige if I feel comfortable.

In addition, he listened to my need to have more gf free time at home and has made efforts to accommodate. He's also been proactive in checking in to see if my needs are being met.

We are also planning a getaway at the end of July for just the two of us. I can't remember the last time we've had more than an hour or two to ourselves. I've definitely been reminded of the benefits of being in a poly relationship this week and I'm hopeful for the future for the first time in quite a while.

Thank you to all who have taken time to give me advice, encouragement and even a kick in the pants!
 
Ahhh ... that sounds a lot better. Congrats! and here's to hoping for many further improvements in the future.

Thanks for the update (and I hope your keister's not too sore :)).
 
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